AMD encouraging retailer price gouging

[Misanthrope]

Encouraging GPU Price Gouging: $100 Upcharge Now A 'Sale'

 

 

It seems like AMD posted the controversial tweet above directing customers to their partner Best Buy to buy a 570 GPU at the low low price of USD $279 on a card with a launch MSRP of USD $179.

 

Quote

$280 – that’s a full $100 over the original launch target of the RX 470, and roughly $100 over available RX 570s just months ago. Best Buy has so generously reduced the cost-to-consumer of the product by a full $20 – about 10% -- and benevolently gifts us a “free” game, not to speak of said game’s retail price. Or the fact that Best Buy calls it a PS3 code, not a PC code. You’d think the extra charge on the card begets proofreading. Best Buy deserves ire for its price inflation, but it’s also difficult to determine how much of the pricing “adjustment” falls squarely on Best Buy – it’s fully possible that distributors, AIB partners, or all in the chain have adjusted for mining 

But worry not because you'll get a game! Well...an early access game (Because we're apparently at that point)...and also just premium content since this game will be free to play at launch:

As Mr. Burke points out AMD was recently stating how pricing is not under their control and in fairness to them, it probably isn't. But to actually promote price gauging as a "good deal" seems to descend to a level of cynicism and disdain for customers that's just not acceptable for any of their GPU products which I would strongly recommend anyone against buying if it's to support this.

 

Clearly both AMD and Nvidia have been hit hard by mining but Nvidia is starting to get some of their products back in stock at reasonable prices (Notable exception being the 1070s) but AMD is just not only unable and uninterested in addressing this situation but now actively encouraging it because well, they love money short term and apparently crashing their already poor GPU business into the ground is no big deal vs appeasing miners right now while they can.

 

But after my thorough poisoning of the well, what are your thoughts?

 

Source: http://www.gamersnexus.net/industry/3050-encouraging-gpu-price-gouging

 

If you want it in video form:

 

Spoiler

 

 

 

[suicidalfranco]

The drama Queen in this thread is real

[Zodiark1593]

And at MSRP, it will disappear before many gamers can actually buy them.

 

Leveraging supply and demand is not a crime, it's simply business.

[Enderman]

Very old news...

 

[Misanthrope]

4 minutes ago, Zodiark1593 said:

And at MSRP, it will disappear before many gamers can actually buy them.

 

Leveraging supply and demand is not a crime, it's simply business.

The beef is more specific than that: AMD dodged the critic of them being unable to address supply by implying vendors are just free to price gouge (basically not accepting that they are the ones unable to produce proper supply and that vendors are just scum, again implied)

 

But now this is a full 180. AMD simply needs to accept that they're fucking up: They can't keep up with demand. Demand from mining is not going away and mining on their cards remains popular and isn't going to let down they need to just ramp up production even if it costs them due to an Etherum crash. They are no longer interested in addressing mining problems they just want to pass down their supply problems to the consumer.

[Misanthrope]

4 minutes ago, Enderman said:

Very old news...

 

This is more of a continuation of that conversation (check dates) but if it's deemed an old topic well apologies I guess it can be locked or merged.

[RadiatingLight]

3 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

The beef is more specific than that: AMD dodged the critic of them being unable to address supply by implying vendors are just free to price gouge (basically not accepting that they are the ones unable to produce proper supply and that vendors are just scum, again implied)

 

But now this is a full 180. AMD simply needs to accept that they're fucking up: They can't keep up with demand. Demand from mining is not going away and mining on their cards remains popular and isn't going to let down they need to just ramp up production even if it costs them due to an Etherum crash. They are no longer interested in addressing mining problems they just want to pass down their supply problems to the consumer.

TBH, playing it safe is best for AMD.

they really can't afford any monetary loss beyond what they're already losing each quarter.

[Zodiark1593]

1 minute ago, Misanthrope said:

The beef is more specific than that: AMD dodged the critic of them being unable to address supply by implying vendors are just free to price gouge (basically not accepting that they are the ones unable to produce proper supply and that vendors are just scum, again implied)

 

But now this is a full 180. AMD simply needs to accept that they're fucking up: They can't keep up with demand. Demand is not going away and mining on their cards remains popular and isn't going to let down. They are no longer interested in addressing mining problems they just want to pass down their supply problems to the consumer.

In what way can AMD address the mining problem that isn't anti consumer? Keep the price at msrp, cards are still going to be eaten. Supply problems still exist. Upping production of the actual chips isn't an easy process, particularly if the fabs involved are already operating at maximum capacity.

[Misanthrope]

Just now, RadiatingLight said:

TBH, playing it safe is best for AMD.

they really can't afford any monetary loss beyond what they're already losing each quarter.

That's true but that shouldn't be a concern for their customers: ultimately directing them to a card 100 over MSRP means that instead of just looking bad by attempting to deal with the issue on silence they're stoking the fire.

 

Bottom line is that for 280 you can actually buy a 1060 6gb right now that beats this card on all games. That's what customers need to be buying not this "deal". Yes even if it kills them as a company they shouldn't be supported at this point.

[Misanthrope]

3 minutes ago, Zodiark1593 said:

In what way can AMD address the mining problem that isn't anti consumer?

Invest money in ramping up production. Yes it's expensive and risky (and probably too late it should have been done 2 or 3 months ago) but it needs to be done at this point: they need to take the risk instead of playing dumb.

[RadiatingLight]

Just now, Misanthrope said:

That's true but that shouldn't be a concern for their customers: ultimately directing them to a card 100 over MSRP means that instead of just looking bad by attempting to deal with the issue on silence they're stoking the fire.

 

Bottom line is that for 280 you can actually buy a 1060 6gb right now that beats this card on all games. That's what customers need to be buying not this "deal". Yes even if it kills them as a company they shouldn't be supported at this point.

True sadly...

[RadiatingLight]

Just now, Misanthrope said:

Invest money in ramping up production. Yes it's expensive and risky but it needs to be done at this point: they need to take the risk instead of playing dumb.

I mean no offence, but I'm sure that AMD's marketing and financial team has thought about this before, and they have more info than you do.

 

also, is there a reliable source that AMD isn't producing at max capacity?

[Zodiark1593]

11 minutes ago, RadiatingLight said:

I mean no offence, but I'm sure that AMD's marketing and financial team has thought about this before, and they have more info than you do.

 

also, is there a reliable source that AMD isn't producing at max capacity?

 

12 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

Invest money in ramping up production. Yes it's expensive and risky (and probably too late it should have been done 2 or 3 months ago) but it needs to be done at this point: they need to take the risk instead of playing dumb.

AMD doesn't do the fabbing themselves. Its contracted out. If the third party faBs are already at max capacity, there is nothing AMD can do for supply issues as the fabs are out of their control.

[bbqsauce]

so they are expected to just say don't buy our stuff because of increased prices?
obviously they cannot control what retailer sells at.
being a business they undoubtedly want to maximize profits and high demand with limited supply offers huge returns.
management and shareholders probably can't give 2 shits about whats happening as long as they see the products fly off the production line as soon as they are ready and that is what exactly is happening.
What benefit is it to a company like AMD to bump up production to keep up with the inflated supply. what happens if the crypto market collapses? AMD will suffer due to investing in upping production to unsustainable levels. It literally makes AMD take in all the risk
you imagine yourself as a shareholder of said company and their CEO tells you during a meeting that they lost millions due to investing in increased production because of people qq-ing about retailer price gouging and then the demand fizzled out. So who is responsible then.
i'm pretty sure they have proper financial teams that have gone over the potential short-term gains over the risks involved and deemed it not wise to ramp up production to unsustainable levels. 

[Misanthrope]

Just now, Zodiark1593 said:

AMD doesn't do the fabbing themselves. Its contracted out. If the third party favs are already at max capacity, there is nothing AMD can do for supply issues as the fabs are out of their control.

They can offer more money or negotiate expanding production which again, can be done if they pay more than other competitors trying to use the same fabs. Don't tell me there's just nothing that they can do, of course there is. There's just solutions that actually involve a larger commitment on their part and they're betting at just hoping Ethereum crashes instead of putting some money down already.

[Misanthrope]

1 minute ago, bbqsauce said:

so they are expected to just say don't buy our stuff because of increased prices?
obviously they cannot control what retailer sells at.
being a business they undoubtedly want to maximize profits and high demand with limited supply offers huge returns.
management and shareholders probably can't give 2 shits about whats happening as long as they see the products fly off the production line as soon as they are ready and that is what exactly is happening.
What benefit is it to a company like AMD to bump up production to keep up with the inflated supply. what happens if the crypto market collapses? AMD will suffer due to investing in upping production to unsustainable levels. It literally makes AMD take in all the risk
you imagine yourself as a shareholder of said company and their CEO tells you during a meeting that they lost millions due to investing in increased production because of people qq-ing about retailer price gouging and then the demand fizzled out. So who is responsible then.
i'm pretty sure they have proper financial teams that have gone over the potential short-term gains over the risks involved and deemed it not wise to ramp up production to unsustainable levels. 

I wouldn't go as far but I would expect them to at least STFU about those kinds of "deals" publicly. 

[Misanthrope]

10 minutes ago, RadiatingLight said:

I mean no offence, but I'm sure that AMD's marketing and financial team has thought about this before, and they have more info than you do.

 

also, is there a reliable source that AMD isn't producing at max capacity?

Well as I said it might mean they're just unable to compete. They almost didn't make it long enough to release Zen and I'm honestly concerned they might fail at both sides of their businesses if they continue to allow themselves to be drag down by their GPU division.

 

No company can survive getting out of a what, 6 year funk on half of their products only to dive deep into another one now on the opposite division. Yes I am being too tough of them but it's time to do or die, or at the very least they might be getting to that point: Can you imagine a repeat of Vega? 

[Zodiark1593]

23 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

They can offer more money or negotiate expanding production which again, can be done if they pay more than other competitors trying to use the same fabs. Don't tell me there's just nothing that they can do, of course there is. There's just solutions that actually involve a larger commitment on their part and they're betting at just hoping Ethereum crashes instead of putting some money down already.

Almost as though you expect these other competitors to lie down and simply allow AMD to take some of their fab capacity without fighting for their share too (one of these competitors being Nvidia, who also needs more capacity themselves due to supply), not to mention that AMDs CPU segment also requires it's own share of capacity, especially as the lucrative Threadripper and Epyc CPUs ramp up (meaning AMD won't divert capacity away from the CPU segment).

 

As it stands, AMD relies on GloFlo for its small GPU, APU and CPU segments, while TSMC takes on the big GPUs. The only other option might be Samsung, though along with the vast time and financial investment (that may be better spent on future products to compete with Nvidia), they're now taking on competition for capacity from the likes of Apple, Qualcomm, and Sammy themselves, potentially steepening the financial investment (as all three have much greater financial resources than AMD).

 

 

[ARikozuM]

This is a major concern to me. The shelves of my local Best Buy usually suck, but this kind of pricing is terrible as some employees are paid with comission. AMD should put an effort to curb the issue by placing a maximum retail price on their products. Not that AMD would actually care enough.

[Zodiark1593]

Just now, ARikozuM said:

This is a major concern to me. The shelves of my local Best Buy usually suck, but this kind of pricing is terrible as some employees are paid with comission. AMD should put an effort to curb the issue by placing a maximum retail price on their products. Not that AMD would actually care enough.

Can any company actually enforce a maximum retail price, unless some contract were written with that in mind?

[Misanthrope]

7 minutes ago, Zodiark1593 said:

Almost as though you expect these other competitors to lie down and simply allow AMD to take some of their fab capacity without fighting for their share too (one of these competitors being Nvidia, who also needs more capacity themselves due to supply), not to mention that AMDs CPU segment also requires it's own share of capacity, especially as the lucrative Threadripper and Epyc CPUs ramp up (meaning AMD won't divert capacity away from the CPU segment).

 

As it stands, AMD relies on GloFlo for its small GPU, APU and CPU segments, while TSMC takes on the big GPUs. The only other option might be Samsung, though along with the vast time and financial investment (that may be better spent on future products to compete with Nvidia), they're now taking on competition for capacity from the likes of Apple, Qualcomm, and Sammy themselves, potentially steepening the financial investment (as all three have much greater financial resources than AMD).

 

 

Granted, but that just means they're over extending by trying to compete in so many different segments. Gotta be more calculating about it and maybe give up gpus for example. 

[ARikozuM]

4 minutes ago, Zodiark1593 said:

Can any company actually enforce a maximum retail price, unless some contract were written with that in mind?

No idea. I know that [pet] food companies like Nutrisource and Canidae have stepped in and removed products from online retailers that have put prices below MSRP. 

 

Edit: AMD is Purina in this case.

[Drak3]

10 minutes ago, ARikozuM said:

Not that AMD would actually care enough

AMD cares somewhat. What price BB or any other reseller sells at doesn't affect AMD's earnings, but going for a tad lower on the pricing from them helps image.

It's that AMD knows that every single reseller can easily drop AMD product.

[Lawliet93]

Screw you guys!!!! AMD is doing (if they have any saying in this situation) the only logical thing. They are milking their fanbase, as does NVIDIA (for fucks sake... NV is selling a midrange GPU for a high-end price since the Kepler generation and you are ok with it). Even if they had a much better architecture (like they did in the past) they would not sell them... Go watch those new videos by AdoredTV, in which he analyses Nvidias and AMDs generations.

[RadiatingLight]

59 minutes ago, Lawliet93 said:

for fucks sake... NV is selling a midrange GPU for a high-end price since the Kepler generation and you are ok with it

not really...

also,

if it performs the same as the other team's high-end GPU, it automatically becomes a high-end GPU. doesn't matter what number the die has, or what size it is.