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Case Fans: Lying About Performance?

Imbellis
By Imbellis
in Cooling
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I was looking through a spreadsheet and I saw a bunch of fans that come from brands (some that are known to be bad) claiming very good performance.  The "statistics" posted are unreasonable - beating out Noctua, bequiet!, and a few other reputable companies.

Do you guys think that the manufacturers are lying?

Though - this spreadsheet was a real pain to setup... really... why do they sometimes use a range for dbA or CFM?

 

Edit: There are multiple pages on the spreadsheet

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A range and dBA and cfm can be used to describe performance at different rpm.

The reason why it's unreliable to compare specs from different manufacturers is that there's little to no regulation on how the noise is measured. 20dBA at a distance of 10mm is a lot more impressive than 20dBA at 10m.

Stick to tests with variables controlled across different fans instead.

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Can you give examples?  A sort of tl:Dr on what fans are supposedly better versus the noctua etc?

Want to custom loop?  Ask me more if you are curious

 

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Examples of 10 db are a leaf falling, a pin dropping, and calm breathing - yet a fan (link) claims to be 8.

1 minute ago, WoodenMarker said:

A range and dBA and cfm can be used to describe performance at different rpm.

The reason why it's unreliable to compare specs from different manufacturers is that there's little to no regulation on how the noise is measured. 20dBA at a distance of 10mm is a lot more impressive than 20dBA at 10m.

Truly, I understand why - it just made what I was doing a real pain.

Fan Comparisons          F@H          PCPartPicker         Analysis of Market Trends (Coming soon? Never? Who knows!)

Designing a mITX case. Working on aluminum prototypes.

Open for intern / part-time. Good at maths, CAD and airflow stuff. Dabbled with Python.

Please fill out this form! It helps a ton! https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/841400-the-poll-to-end-all-polls-poll/

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2 minutes ago, Imbellis said:

Do you guys think that the manufacturers are lying?

Yes.

There isn't the best standardisation on how measurements are taken, or whether or not the measurements are even performed with calibrated test tools, and there is no accreditation authority for this.

A range of dBA and CFM is typically used on PWM fans, where they are designed to have the fan speed controlled.

In my experience the Corsair fans that I have used have all been around 10-20dB louder than the manufacturer claim (possibly they had tested at 10m rather than 1m).

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Just now, Imbellis said:

Examples of 10 db are a leaf falling, a pin dropping, and calm breathing - yet a fan (link) claims to be 8.

But at what distance and in what environment? The result changes depending on these factors. 

If you ever need help with a build, read the following before posting: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/3061-build-plan-thread-recommendations-please-read-before-posting/
Also, make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

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Just now, Damascus said:

Can you give examples?  A sort of tl:Dr on what fans are supposedly better versus the noctua etc?

An example of 10db a pin dropping, leaves falling, and calm breathing. The NB M12 claims to be 8.

Fan Comparisons          F@H          PCPartPicker         Analysis of Market Trends (Coming soon? Never? Who knows!)

Designing a mITX case. Working on aluminum prototypes.

Open for intern / part-time. Good at maths, CAD and airflow stuff. Dabbled with Python.

Please fill out this form! It helps a ton! https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/841400-the-poll-to-end-all-polls-poll/

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1 minute ago, WoodenMarker said:

But at what distance and in what environment? The result changes depending on these factors. 

The standard testing is at a 10m distance.

Basically inaudible.

Perceivable - perhaps.

Fan Comparisons          F@H          PCPartPicker         Analysis of Market Trends (Coming soon? Never? Who knows!)

Designing a mITX case. Working on aluminum prototypes.

Open for intern / part-time. Good at maths, CAD and airflow stuff. Dabbled with Python.

Please fill out this form! It helps a ton! https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/841400-the-poll-to-end-all-polls-poll/

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Just now, Imbellis said:

An example of 10db a pin dropping, leaves falling, and calm breathing. The NB M12 claims to be 8.

Yeah, noise blocker is supposedly better than noctua and Be Quiet! for noise by enough to make Luke prefer them, does not surprise me

Want to custom loop?  Ask me more if you are curious

 

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Just now, Damascus said:

Yeah, noise blocker is supposedly better than noctua and Be Quiet! for noise by enough to make Luke prefer them, does not surprise me

Really? Okay. I had never heard of them before.

 

However; I still wish for there to be actual standardization. I know that many of these fans don't move the advertised air or are much louder.

Mentioning that - how do they test how much air a fan can move? Seems difficult to not interfere.

Fan Comparisons          F@H          PCPartPicker         Analysis of Market Trends (Coming soon? Never? Who knows!)

Designing a mITX case. Working on aluminum prototypes.

Open for intern / part-time. Good at maths, CAD and airflow stuff. Dabbled with Python.

Please fill out this form! It helps a ton! https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/841400-the-poll-to-end-all-polls-poll/

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Just now, Imbellis said:

Really? Okay. I had never heard of them before.

Yeah, Luke prosletizes them to linus every time fans come up.  

 

I mean DAYUM check out these sexy beasts!nb-multiframe.jpg.551baaad7582870e1ca22467120bfcfb.jpg59a6356366cdc_download(9).jpg.9300295563f0d1e03d28e7ad772db061.jpg

Want to custom loop?  Ask me more if you are curious

 

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Just now, Damascus said:

Yeah, Luke prosletizes them to linus every time fans come up.  

 

I mean DAYUM check out these sexy beasts!nb-multiframe.jpg.551baaad7582870e1ca22467120bfcfb.jpg59a6356366cdc_download(9).jpg.9300295563f0d1e03d28e7ad772db061.jpg

Well - nice. I thought they were going to be one of those brands that claim to run well through false achievements. I'm happy that I was wrong - means that the market is slightly better than I thought.

Fan Comparisons          F@H          PCPartPicker         Analysis of Market Trends (Coming soon? Never? Who knows!)

Designing a mITX case. Working on aluminum prototypes.

Open for intern / part-time. Good at maths, CAD and airflow stuff. Dabbled with Python.

Please fill out this form! It helps a ton! https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/841400-the-poll-to-end-all-polls-poll/

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1 minute ago, Imbellis said:

Well - nice. I thought they were going to be one of those brands that claim to run well through false achievements. I'm happy that I was wrong - means that the market is slightly better than I thought.

Sadly you can't get em in canada :(

Want to custom loop?  Ask me more if you are curious

 

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@Damascus Since that problem is solved - are there any ways that you think I could improve the spreadsheet? I may be referencing it quite often (it's easier to compare "scores" of fans than to say 'ooooh I like this one more').

Fan Comparisons          F@H          PCPartPicker         Analysis of Market Trends (Coming soon? Never? Who knows!)

Designing a mITX case. Working on aluminum prototypes.

Open for intern / part-time. Good at maths, CAD and airflow stuff. Dabbled with Python.

Please fill out this form! It helps a ton! https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/841400-the-poll-to-end-all-polls-poll/

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2 minutes ago, Damascus said:

Sadly you can't get em in canada :(

Why not? Shipping problem?

Fan Comparisons          F@H          PCPartPicker         Analysis of Market Trends (Coming soon? Never? Who knows!)

Designing a mITX case. Working on aluminum prototypes.

Open for intern / part-time. Good at maths, CAD and airflow stuff. Dabbled with Python.

Please fill out this form! It helps a ton! https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/841400-the-poll-to-end-all-polls-poll/

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13 minutes ago, Imbellis said:

The standard testing is at a 10m distance.

Basically inaudible.

Perceivable - perhaps.

Where'd you get that info? I thought it was measured from the assumed listening distance which can vary depending on the product. 

4 minutes ago, Imbellis said:

@Damascus Since that problem is solved - are there any ways that you think I could improve the spreadsheet? I may be referencing it quite often (it's easier to compare "scores" of fans than to say 'ooooh I like this one more').

Look at in-depth reviews and benchmarks instead of comparing specs straight off the manufacturer's page. Airflow stated in specs is only relative to static pressure anyway and how well that performs depends on where the fan is used.

People who care about noise probably aren't going to run their fans at 100% rpm. It would make more sense to look at relative performance to noise level in a certain usage case such as how SPCR displays their results. http://www.silentpcreview.com/article1480-page5.html

If you ever need help with a build, read the following before posting: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/3061-build-plan-thread-recommendations-please-read-before-posting/
Also, make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

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4 minutes ago, WoodenMarker said:

Where'd you get that info? I thought it was measured from the assumed listening distance which can vary depending on the product.

 

I thought I remembered the definition of 1db as being defined something like "statistically the quietest thing a person can hear at a distance of 10m".

After quickly looking for the definition - I don't know what it is, but I can tell that I was wrong.

 

I know as in the case of using a fan I should look at reviews, but wouldn't looking at the statistics be best for a general comparison (I guess airflow, standard case fan)?

Fan Comparisons          F@H          PCPartPicker         Analysis of Market Trends (Coming soon? Never? Who knows!)

Designing a mITX case. Working on aluminum prototypes.

Open for intern / part-time. Good at maths, CAD and airflow stuff. Dabbled with Python.

Please fill out this form! It helps a ton! https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/841400-the-poll-to-end-all-polls-poll/

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5 minutes ago, Imbellis said:

Why not? Shipping problem?

More or less, they don't sell via Canadian retailers so when I factor in another 20+ bucks in shipping I may as well get noctua or be quiet fans for significantly less. 

 

They are also THICC AF (I think 39mm?) So they won't fit in me case.

6 minutes ago, Imbellis said:

@Damascus Since that problem is solved - are there any ways that you think I could improve the spreadsheet? I may be referencing it quite often (it's easier to compare "scores" of fans than to say 'ooooh I like this one more').

Tbh I have yet to buy a case fan (other than some AF12s I got when I didn't know better) but picked em up alongside cases, WC gear bulk packages etc. 

Want to custom loop?  Ask me more if you are curious

 

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Oh yeah to finish my last sentiment on buying fans I now check reviews for fans I like the aesthetic of and if they pass the bar I go with em.

Want to custom loop?  Ask me more if you are curious

 

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2 minutes ago, Damascus said:

They are also THICC AF (I think 39mm?) So they won't fit in me case.

It's 38mm. Why are you looking at their industrial fans though? Noiseblocker has plenty of 25mm thick fans.

If you ever need help with a build, read the following before posting: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/3061-build-plan-thread-recommendations-please-read-before-posting/
Also, make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

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Holy Crap...! 177m3? That's bloody 6250 CFM!

Fan Comparisons          F@H          PCPartPicker         Analysis of Market Trends (Coming soon? Never? Who knows!)

Designing a mITX case. Working on aluminum prototypes.

Open for intern / part-time. Good at maths, CAD and airflow stuff. Dabbled with Python.

Please fill out this form! It helps a ton! https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/841400-the-poll-to-end-all-polls-poll/

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3 minutes ago, WoodenMarker said:

It's 38mm. Why are you looking at their industrial fans though? Noiseblocker has plenty of 25mm thick fans.

:P I like em.  I'll be getting noctua industrials if I go that route, just like the "this. Will. Never. Die. On. You" attitude.

Want to custom loop?  Ask me more if you are curious

 

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Just now, Damascus said:

:P I like em.  I'll be getting noctua industrials if I go that route, just like the "this. Will. Never. Die. On. You" attitude.

I have a Noctua NF-S12B Redux. Quite and simple colors.

Fan Comparisons          F@H          PCPartPicker         Analysis of Market Trends (Coming soon? Never? Who knows!)

Designing a mITX case. Working on aluminum prototypes.

Open for intern / part-time. Good at maths, CAD and airflow stuff. Dabbled with Python.

Please fill out this form! It helps a ton! https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/841400-the-poll-to-end-all-polls-poll/

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On a side note, I emailed BlackNoise (NoiseBlocker) asking what they charge per one of their insane 177m3 industrial fans. Hopefully, they'll get back in a couple of days.

Fan Comparisons          F@H          PCPartPicker         Analysis of Market Trends (Coming soon? Never? Who knows!)

Designing a mITX case. Working on aluminum prototypes.

Open for intern / part-time. Good at maths, CAD and airflow stuff. Dabbled with Python.

Please fill out this form! It helps a ton! https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/841400-the-poll-to-end-all-polls-poll/

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