Finally Someone Decided To Do Something About Miners

[BluJay614]

Okay, I've seen some bitching here, and some valid points being made. Personally, I don't see how they could tell if you where using their cards for mining or not without forcing it to install spyware into your system the moment it was first powered on. However, as soon as that would be found out there would be so much bad PR about that, it may just tank the company worse then the Note 7 did to Samsung.

I myself am rather irritated at the inflated prices and lackluster supply. I'm also rather irritated by this whole Vega debacle, but that I'm waiting to see what is actually true. I'm also not afraid to be vocal about how upset I am, though you won't find me throwing it in your face. To be clear, I do not hate miners. Like Paul (Paul's Hardware), I understand that Miners have a legitimate reason for doing what they are doing. Doesn't make me happy about it, but I do.

[Princess Luna]

I'll never understand why people see value in virtual fake bits given to people who do useless pointless math equations on the computer... like the entire process feels like a huge waste of computing power and electricity... if only F@H gave bits there would be a reason behind it but the way it is.... bloody pointless.

 

For all I care you can do whatever you want with your hardware, I just will never understand how can people actually see value in cryptocurrency... I prefer being old fashion/oldschool and just get real money from a real job...

[Clanscorpia]

While I hate miners as much as the next gamer, I think this is a downright unethical move. What happened to all the support about being able to use your product as you choose, doing what you want with it. Not having companies turn down warranty because you used it in a way they didnt want you to. I dont think that this is ok for them to do.

[suicidalfranco]

ahahah, lol the amount of kids crying in these forum everytime the word miner pops up. So now people have to spend their hard earned cash and not be granted pernission whatever they want with what they bought? What's next? ISP's should cap everyone out of the wazoo and Net Neutrality truly is shit  because it's their lines/band you're using?

[Misanthrope]

4 minutes ago, Captain Chaos said:

Then who's the smart one here and who's the dumbass? 

Yeah by that sociopathic standard Ted Kaczynski was a genious. Would you be singing his praises?

[Juanitology]

19 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

You know, Nvidia/AMD and graphics card manufacture can just all boost manufacturing allowing both gamer and miners to get their cards. Why would one say no to money?

It's not as simple as turning up a dial. There's a lot of different components that are required to make a graphics card, and boosting production significantly is a massive logistic headache. Not only do you have to invest in hiring more people/ buy more assembling, soldering, PCB printing machines, you have to increase supply of all the components going up the chain from the smallest resistor to the GPU die itself. And then you have the issue of yields, HMB and GDDR5X availability, and so on. 

 

If an AIB/AMD/Nvidia did invest the massive amounts of money required to greatly expand their capacity that way and the mining bubble went bust, they'd be stuck with a huge glut of cards they can't sell and capacity they can't use. There's simply too much uncertainty in the market right now for that kind of move, they're happy to keep their current manufacturing capacity maxed out and selling all the stock they can make. 

[dfsdfgfkjsefoiqzemnd]

Just now, Armakar said:

has no alternatives

Because there's a worldwide shortage of 460s, 560s, 1050s and 1080ti's , right? 

 

 

[PCGuy_5960]

Just now, suicidalfranco said:

ahahah, lol the amount of kids crying in these forum everytime the word miner pops up. So now people have to spend their hard earned cash and not be granted pernission whatever they want with what they bought? What's next? ISP's should cap everyone out of the wazoo and Net Neutrality truly is shit  because it's their lines/band you're using?

The hate for miners is basically "Stop making money so that I can play games". lol

[porina]

I am aware of other cases where the use of consumer level products in a commercial/industrial environment would be voided in warranty as they are not designed for intense operation, but the comparison doesn't fit well with a GPU. The stress loads of mining are NOT that different from normal use workloads. It isn't practical to prohibit one but not the other. The only weak argument might be that normal use is not 24/7 and mining is. Personally I think the bigger problem is cutting corners on designing on the part of the card makers. If they are getting elevated RMA rates, they should have had a better design in the first place.

 

The minor problem for AMD/nvidia, as opposed AIBs, is that they want to keep all markets going at the same time. Losing gamers now might result in less future potential for their ecosystem, even if they still have a unit sale for mining.

[Armakar]

Just now, Captain Chaos said:

Because there's a worldwide shortage of 460s, 560s, 1050s and 1080ti's , right? 

 

 

Yes, because everyone can afford a 1080Ti, and a 1050 gives more than enough performance for 1440p.

 

So your saying either for out the money for a 1080Ti to max out 1080p, or deal with lower quality graphics and lower FPS rates with a 1050?

[AlTech]

18 minutes ago, djdwosk97 said:

And why exactly should AMD and Nvidia tell a large majority of buyers/potential buyers to fuck off? 

Because RMA rates are now through the damn roof and cos AMD and Nvidia want repeat loyal customers to get their hands on GPUs.

 

They don't like miners as they are typically not loyal and are typically not invested in either company.

[pas008]

9 minutes ago, Armakar said:

it literally is their business when miners are costing them tons because miners destroy the cards and then RMA it..

When you get a new car/bike, you aren't suppoused to throttle it as fast as it goes. So if I buy a brand new Veyron, throttle it (and therefore break the engine) and return it, and make Bugatti pay for a new car, that's "none of their business"? Ofcourse it is, they are a business and they are losing money to idiots using the cards outside the intended purposes. My dad's 15,000$ EACH amplifiers CAN be used to play my guitar out of through daisy chaining, however if I did this i'd likely blow the amp. So is it fair if I did that, knowing it would blow the amp, then returned it to Macintosh  andmade them pay for it? No, it's not.

first off

cpu can be ran 24/7 and gpus can be ran 24/7 dont you know about gaming mining/looting/etc all over the world for online item shops

also what if I'm rendering video/etc 24/7 with my co workers

and where does it say these gpus dont have 100% duty?

4 minutes ago, mynameisjuan said:

First its inflating GPU prices for people who actually want to buy a GPU to game or for content creation.

 

Second is the cards are dying earlier than normal and increasing RMAs. Every RMA cost a company money then they have to increase cost to make up for it. 

 

This hurts everyone but the miners themselves. All this for fake currency that is wasting power

thats the nature of the beast

and its not wasting power its converting it into cash

cash to power a tool, to create some worth value

 

 

both you guys sound like you dont understand that these are tools

 

you arent entitled to everything

 

how many people use to sit in stores to try to get tickle me elmo dolls couple decades ago

same difference

 

 

 

[Clanscorpia]

1 minute ago, AluminiumTech said:

Because RMA rates are now through the damn roof and cos AMD and Nvidia want repeat loyal customers to get their hands on GPUs.

 

They don't like miners as they are typically not loyal and are typically not invested in either company.

Most of them invested more money in one purchase then we will in a lifetime

[suicidalfranco]

2 minutes ago, Armakar said:

Because mining is so intelligent? Are you implying the consumer is the dumbass? The only people who are powerless here is the consumer who needs graphics cards and has no alternatives. The dumbasses are partners not enforcing that miners shouldn't use these cards to mine.

a miner is a consumer.

[Misanthrope]

3 minutes ago, AluminiumTech said:

Because RMA rates are now through the damn roof and cos AMD and Nvidia want repeat loyal customers to get their hands on GPUs.

 

They don't like miners as they are typically not loyal and are typically not invested in either company.

Again this is not true of AMD that released a beta driver just to attract miners. About Nvidia I cannot say at best one way or the other but AMD wants miners and their money. They're just trying to fool stupid customers to make them think they're special with a few scrap of almost-non-existent cards on rip-off bundles.

[pas008]

6 minutes ago, Armakar said:

Because mining is so intelligent? Are you implying the consumer is the dumbass? The only people who are powerless here is the consumer who needs graphics cards and has no alternatives. The dumbasses are partners not enforcing that miners shouldn't use these cards to mine.

these cards are theirs to do what they want with them

 

so phones shouldnt have custom roms?

you shouldnt be able to soft mod anything?

[Misanthrope]

1 minute ago, Clanscorpia said:

Most of them invested more money in one purchase then we will in a lifetime

Citation needed.

[Clanscorpia]

Just now, Misanthrope said:

Citation needed.

Ive seen multiple people on the forums who are light miners buying 7 or 8 RX 480s/1060s. Unless you have a lot of money most of us cant afford to buy that.

[Armakar]

1 minute ago, pas008 said:

these cards are theirs to do what they want with them

 

so phones shouldnt have custom roms?

you shouldnt be able to soft mod anything?

"soft mod" / rooting and literally destroying the device in months then sending it back for repair knowing it would be destroyed in the first place.

 

aalso, rooting inflates phone prices to double? don't think so

[Misanthrope]

7 minutes ago, BluJay614 said:

Okay, I've seen some bitching here, and some valid points being made. Personally, I don't see how they could tell if you where using their cards for mining or not without forcing it to install spyware into your system the moment it was first powered on.

Well is actually not that difficult to figure out: most flesh and bone gamers tend to die after 50 to 80 continuous hours of gaming so after logging about that much, yeah you can assume they're miners 99% of the time.

[Misanthrope]

Just now, Clanscorpia said:

Ive seen multiple people on the forums who are light miners buying 7 or 8 RX 480s/1060s. Unless you have a lot of money most of us cant afford to buy that.

Anecdotal evidence is not a valid citation.

[79wjd]

18 minutes ago, Johnnyboyhogg said:

Is any miner going to to tell them they used it to mine on, I know i wouldn't 

Some people certainly would -- but probably not most, and certainly not anyone who actually wants to get a replacement. Just like I would never tell WD that I have a WD Blue in my NAS or Intel that I've overclocked my cpu. 

1 minute ago, AluminiumTech said:

Because RMA rates are now through the damn roof and cos AMD and Nvidia want repeat loyal customers to get their hands on GPUs.

 

They don't like miners as they are typically not loyal and are typically not invested in either company.

RMA rates are high/er, but thats only bad if it ends up costing more money than they make in profit off of all the extra GPU sales they make to miners, which probably isn't likely considering that the cost to manufacturer and RMA cards isn't what makes up the bulk of the cost of the card. And still, there are better ways to handle that than refusing to sell GPUs to miners

 

I was also referring to what OP said in his post and not what Inno3D is doing: 

34 minutes ago, NvidiaIntelAMDLoveTriangle said:

Maybe this is a wake up call for AMD and Nvidia to have drivers that detect when someone is mining on their cards and brick them instantly.

 

 

Also, the issue with upsetting customers is that they'll go elsewhere......well, at the end of the day, both AMD and Nvidia should piss off consumers equally and so anyone who was pissed off at AMD will switch to Nvidia and anyone who was pissed off with Nvidia will switch to AMD largely negating that issue. 

[IKnight]

I hate the fact that miners jack up prices, but come on, that doesn't give me a valid reason to hate miners themselves. At the end of the day, they are just trying to earn some cash (wouldn't we all like that?).

[suicidalfranco]

6 minutes ago, AluminiumTech said:

Because RMA rates are now through the damn roof and cos AMD and Nvidia want repeat loyal customers to get their hands on GPUs.

citation needed

6 minutes ago, AluminiumTech said:

They don't like miners as they are typically not loyal and are typically not invested in either company.

so if you're not some blind fanboy all stores should close the doors to those darn customers who don't want to bow down and lick a specifc brand's boot, is that right?

[dfsdfgfkjsefoiqzemnd]

9 minutes ago, Armakar said:

because everyone can afford a 1080Ti, and a 1050 gives more than enough performance for 1440p.

Then what would you use for 1440p?  A 1070?  That isn't going to cut it if you want to play any demanding game on high or ultra.  A 1070 struggles to give 75fps in GTA5 on ultra even in 1080p, nevermind almost doubling the pixel count by trying 1440.