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Windows 10 loses market-share to Windows 7 for second month in a row on Steam hardware survey / again on NetMarketShare

Delicieuxz
On 3/4/2017 at 5:29 PM, Delicieuxz said:

DX 12 has turned out to be a big dud, so far. Most games actually lose performance when using it, and there's also Vulkan, which does the same thing as Windows 10 and runs on everything going back to Windows XP. I read of one developer who recently scrapped their DX 12 efforts in favour of starting work on Vulkan, because DX 12 offered nothing over Vulkan, while Vulkan offered much over DX 12, being multi-platform, and open source. Also, the vast majority of gamers currently have Nvidia GPUs, which so far don't benefit from DX 12 or Vulkan.

This is a pretty ignorant comment. 

 

DX12 lack of performance has been due to games being ported from a DX11 base. 

As for Nvidia not supporting dx12/vulkan well enough to matter, Software is usually what drives what hardware can support.

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2 minutes ago, goodtofufriday said:

This is a pretty ignorant comment. 

 

DX12 lack of performance has been due to games being ported from a DX11 base. 

It can't be ignorant if it's a perfect description of how DX 12 has been, so far. Regardless the cause, so far, DX 12 has been a non-event.

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Just now, Delicieuxz said:

It can't be ignorant if it's a perfect description of how DX 12 has been, so far. Regardless the cause, So far, DX 12 has been a non-event.

Youre basically complaining a Ferrari engine doesnt perform as well when placed in a honda civic.

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8 minutes ago, Delicieuxz said:

It can't be ignorant if it's a perfect description of how DX 12 has been, so far. Regardless the cause, so far, DX 12 has been a non-event.

What he is getting at is that, most of the current DX12 games haven't actually been developed and/or optimized on DX12 they have just been ported over from the DX11 API to DX12. That leaves many of the advantages of the newer API unused, unless the developer takes advantage of them.

 

Just clarifying what it seemed he was trying to explain to you.

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I'm actually surprised because Windows 10 for me in the UK is the best. I've never had any ads or anything. Just been a very hassle free pleasant experience to be honest.

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I do not use windows for 3 years now and i am very happy.

I do my work on linux, we use linux on our servers and work computers.

I use linux on my laptop too.

It's fast, reliable, stable, customizable, simple, powerful and of course fun. :)

 

Thanks god i ditched games. I realized that games are waste of time. Now i just play BF3 online VERY RARELY not on my laptop. My laptop does not have GPU (it only has HD 4000 this is not for games) So technically i do not need windows. 

Programing and linux are friends in my opinion. Life with linux is much more interesting then with windows. 

Windows is total garbage IMHO :D 

Developers must make games for Vulkan. It does everything DX12 has and even more. World will become a better place if developers start to make games on Vulkan not on DX.

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Hate windows 10 its ugly and feels like a tablet lol. Windows 7 for me until they stop support for that. And then i will have to make the jump. Lets hope im drunk at the time becuase if im not i can see the PC going out the window when that happens. 

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Sadly I just "upgraded" to Kaby lake, so I can't get any other Windows than(then?) 10 (They forced it so hard they disabled all updates for Kaby lake on 7 8/.1).

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26 minutes ago, jnkokseby said:

Sadly I just "upgraded" to Kaby lake, so I can't get any other Windows than(then?) 10 (They forced it so hard they disabled all updates for Kaby lake on 7 8/.1).

Windows 7 and 8(.1) both work fine with Kaby Lake. And even if Windows Update becomes restricted for Kaby processors, you will still be able to get whatever updates you want from WSUS (best just to get the security updates, and skip the rest).

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6 hours ago, jnkokseby said:

Sadly I just "upgraded" to Kaby lake, so I can't get any other Windows than(then?) 10 (They forced it so hard they disabled all updates for Kaby lake on 7 8/.1).

 

5 hours ago, Delicieuxz said:

Windows 7 and 8(.1) both work fine with Kaby Lake. And even if Windows Update becomes restricted for Kaby processors, you will still be able to get whatever updates you want from WSUS (best just to get the security updates, and skip the rest).

The lack of future updates are purely because they no longer support Windows 7 & 8.1 with newer hardware.

 

If you bypass the updates then they're gonna find out and they're gonna disable every way to get updates.

 

I don't see why everybody is reacting in a highly hostile manner.

Judge a product on its own merits AND the company that made it.

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1 minute ago, AluminiumTech said:

 

The lack of future updates are purely because they no longer support Windows 7 & 8.1 with newer hardware.

 

If you bypass the updates then they're gonna find out and they're gonna disable every way to get updates.

 

I don't see why everybody is reacting in a highly hostile manner.

Its another attempt to force people to use Windows 10-when the majority don't want to use it (or can not afford to use it due to the software that is important to their business).

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13 hours ago, Dabombinable said:

Its another attempt to force people to use Windows 10-when the majority don't want to use it (or can not afford to use it due to the software that is important to their business).

You should also have added that a lot of programs actually perform worse on Windows 10.

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14 hours ago, AluminiumTech said:

 

The lack of future updates are purely because they no longer support Windows 7 & 8.1 with newer hardware.

 

If you bypass the updates then they're gonna find out and they're gonna disable every way to get updates.

 

I don't see why everybody is reacting in a highly hostile manner.

Because:

 

a: 8.1 is still mainstream support so no excuse there for doing this

 

and b: Win7 is on extended and that means security only and there is no reason to cut them just because of newer HW.

 

Once again MS proves how untrustworthy they are and they are willing to use straight up illegal means to accomplish their goal.

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1 minute ago, jagdtigger said:

8.1 is still mainstream support so no excuse there for doing this

Mainstream support =/= compatibility updates for new hardware, especially when said hardware does not support the OS.

2 minutes ago, jagdtigger said:

Once again MS proves how untrustworthy they are and they are willing to use straight up illegal means to accomplish their goal.

Except there is nothing illegal about this. Anyone that paid attention to Kaby Lake and Ryzen release would have known that the operating systems wouldn't be supported, and anyone with an IQ above that which rivals a dead goldfish's would conclude that one of two things would happen: Updates could cause instability on the new platforms, or Microsoft wouldn't allow them, for the reason former.

Microsoft never breached contract made with a single consumer or OEM. They almost breached contract with OEMs, as they were still enabled to ship Windows 7 machines with Skylake, but they aren't with Kaby.

 

 

It's unfortunate. It's caused me to change my plans of having a Windows 7 Ryzen build, but only in the fact that now I won't receive updates if I want to use W7. But instead of bitching at the first possible chance, I took a look at the full picture.

It costs a significant amount of money and time to validate those updates on a platform, and both operating systems are no longer sold retail, or OEM on Kaby Lake. Realisitcally, extremely few people running 7 on either arch is a waste of money, and seeing how big mouthed so many people become when their unsupported configurations are when something goes wrong, and cast blame upon companies like MS, it's wise to just block updates via MS' official means.

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Quote

Except there is nothing illegal about this.

That would be a personal conjecture of yours.

 

Windows 7 was still being sold when it was advertised that its extended support end-date would be January 2020, and when there was nothing expressed or indicating that buying a new CPU would interfere with receiving extended support. The efforted exclusion of newer CPUs from that extended support is an arbitrarily added condition by Microsoft.
 
The reasonable person test applies, as do contract laws, and it could be said that adding a condition to the advertised extended support date is a breach of contract, and false advertising, violating the terms that existing at the time most people bought Windows 7 - and contract terms cannot be changed unilaterally by one side without the right to do so being a part of the original contract that was agreed to. No such clause exists in the original Windows 7 EULA, or the Windows 7 SP1 EULA. Therefore, Microsoft cannot unilaterally make any changes to the Windows 7 usage terms, including by putting any restrictions on which hardware is eligible to receive extended support updates.
 
So, what Microsoft is doing is definitively illegal, but there might need to be someone willing to challenge it in court for there to be an enforcement of Microsoft's contractual obligations.

You own the software that you purchase - Understanding software licenses and EULAs

 

"We’ll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the american public believes is false" - William Casey, CIA Director 1981-1987

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@Drak3

Show me where they stating that newer HW will void the right for updates during the extended period(I checked their life cycle site but no mention about HW limitations in any of the FAQ's...). Until that i will label this as highly illegal move. Its literally begging for a class action. Especially in case of 8.1.

 

Plus kaby lake dont have any radical changes above its predecessor so no need to flat out block the updates.

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Jumped on W10 a few days before the free offer ended.

 

I don't know what's wrong with my install (it's a fresh one), but it's pretty unstable. I don't shut down my computer, put it to sleep at night, and wake up the next day. After 3-5 sleeps something always breaks. Be it chrome, MS word, or other programs. I also had explorer.exe freeze on me on several occasions. I don't remember ever having these many issues in W7...

 

Oh yea, I'm also one of those that had ads:
a2tjc1g.png

 

I really miss W7... But for the sake of future OS support and DX12 games (when they actually get built from the ground up with DX12), I may as well get used to this OS now. 

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People keep bumping this thread and I get the wrong impression that it happened yet again :P 

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On 3/4/2017 at 5:56 PM, TheKDub said:

Lenovo Yoga 710-15IKB
i5 7200U, 8GB of DDR4 RAM, 256GB Samsung M.2 SSD, 1080p IPS display, GTX 940MX GPU.
As for the rest of the internals, that's the real question. The WIFI card was some qualcomm card that has no windows 8.1 drivers from what I could find.

Then there's all the lenovo specific stuff with the yoga function (360* hinge and all the stuff with that), as well as the touchscreen.

Its a little sketchy, but try either using driverscape (don't use the utility) or searching the hardware IDs

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1 minute ago, SpaceGhostC2C said:

People keep bumping this thread and I get the wrong impression that it happened yet again :P 

Well, it can't be long now before we get to see march's results? We shall see xD 

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Just now, iamdarkyoshi said:

Its a little sketchy, but try either using driverscape (don't use the utility) or searching the hardware IDs

I gave up on it, It's too much of a pain in the ass to try finding the specific models of each device the laptop uses, and I don't really want to rip the entire thing apart to find out. (Device Manager doesn't have all of them)

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1 minute ago, TheKDub said:

I gave up on it, It's too much of a pain in the ass to try finding the specific models of each device the laptop uses, and I don't really want to rip the entire thing apart to find out. (Device Manager doesn't have all of them)

By searching this first line, I was able to get a 64 bit win7 OS installed on a laptop that only was officially supported by asus with 32 bit VISTA. Everything worked, even the esoteric hardware items like the media buttons on the touchpad

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On 18/3/2017 at 1:11 AM, jnkokseby said:

Sadly I just "upgraded" to Kaby lake, so I can't get any other Windows than(then?) 10 (They forced it so hard they disabled all updates for Kaby lake on 7 8/.1).

here's proof and if you'd wonder how i'll tell

Capture.PNG

Mobo: ASRock B150M Pro4s | CPU: Intel core i7 7700 with stock cooler | Storages: 2x80GB Seagate Barracuda 7200rpm + Zotac 120GB | Memory: 2x4GB Kingston HyperX Fury | PSU: 400W HYN 80+ | GPU: PowerColor Radeon R9 270X 2GB | Tower: an old one from the other decade | Monitor: ASUS Widescreen 900p + ViewSonic FHD| Speaker: microlab

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On 19/3/2017 at 5:46 AM, crystal6tak said:

Jumped on W10 a few days before the free offer ended.

 

I don't know what's wrong with my install (it's a fresh one), but it's pretty unstable. I don't shut down my computer, put it to sleep at night, and wake up the next day. After 3-5 sleeps something always breaks. Be it chrome, MS word, or other programs. I also had explorer.exe freeze on me on several occasions. I don't remember ever having these many issues in W7...

 

Oh yea, I'm also one of those that had ads:
a2tjc1g.png

 

I really miss W7... But for the sake of future OS support and DX12 games (when they actually get built from the ground up with DX12), I may as well get used to this OS now. 

DX12 still proves poor proportion compared to DX11 still now. If you still game on DX11, you still rock. What's wrong if you can reinstall any OS you want at anytime?

Mobo: ASRock B150M Pro4s | CPU: Intel core i7 7700 with stock cooler | Storages: 2x80GB Seagate Barracuda 7200rpm + Zotac 120GB | Memory: 2x4GB Kingston HyperX Fury | PSU: 400W HYN 80+ | GPU: PowerColor Radeon R9 270X 2GB | Tower: an old one from the other decade | Monitor: ASUS Widescreen 900p + ViewSonic FHD| Speaker: microlab

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