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Norway and Facebook clash over news censorship [Updated:FB backs down]

Sakkura

Facebook's rise as a news platform is generating lots of controversy recently.

 

Today, a major Norwegian newspaper published an open letter accusing Facebook of abusing its power when censoring images and news posts.

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Norway’s largest newspaper has published a front-page open letter to Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg, lambasting the company’s decision to censor a historic photograph of the Vietnam war and calling on Zuckerberg to recognize and live up to his role as “the world’s most powerful editor”.

 

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Espen Egil Hansen, the editor-in-chief and CEO of Aftenposten, accused Zuckerberg of thoughtlessly “abusing your power” over the social media site that has become a lynchpin of the distribution of news and information around the world, writing, “I am upset, disappointed – well, in fact even afraid – of what you are about to do to a mainstay of our democratic society.”

 

“I am worried that the world’s most important medium is limiting freedom instead of trying to extend it, and that this occasionally happens in an authoritarian way,” he added.

 

The specific incident that prompted the open letter of protest was Facebook censoring an article containing the historic Vietnam war image of a naked girl fleeing her napalm-bombed village.

The writer was suspended from posting on Facebook for 24 hours. When the newspaper posted a story discussing, and criticizing, the deletion, that post was also removed for containing the same image.

 

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The controversy stems from Facebook’s decision to delete a post by Norwegian writer Tom Egeland that featured The Terror of War, a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph by Nick Ut that showed children – including the naked 9-year-old Kim Phúc – running away from a napalm attack during the Vietnam war. Egeland’s post discussed “seven photographs that changed the history of warfare” – a group to which the “napalm girl” image certainly belongs.

 

Egeland was subsequently suspended from Facebook. When Aftenposten reported on the suspension – using the same photograph in its article, which was then shared on the publication’s Facebook page – the newspaper received a message from Facebook asking it to “either remove or pixelize” the photograph.

 

“Any photographs of people displaying fully nude genitalia or buttocks, or fully nude female breast, will be removed,” the notice from Facebook explains.

 

Before Aftenposten could respond, Hansen writes, Facebook deleted the article and image from the newspaper’s Facebook page.

The open letter criticized this decision, calling it an abuse of power and saying it limited the discretionary room for making editorial decisions from newspaper editors. It said that Facebook's algorithm was undermining journalistic editorial decisions.

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In his open letter, Hansen points out that the types of decision Facebook makes about what kind of content is promoted, tolerated, or banned – whether it makes those decisions algorithmically or not – are functionally editorial.

 

“The media have a responsibility to consider publication in every single case,” he wrote. “This right and duty, which all editors in the world have, should not be undermined by algorithms encoded in your office in California.”

 

“Editors cannot live with you, Mark, as a master editor.”

 

In the wake of the open letter, the prime minister of Norway, Erna Solberg, also decided to speak out about the situation. She did so on Facebook, but within hours, several of her posts on the topic were also removed. Several other government ministers were likewise censored.

 

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Facebook is taking a wrong step when they censor images like these, prime minister Erna Solberg said.

 

Half of the ministers in the Norwegian government shared the famous Nick Ut photo on their Facebook pages, among them prime minister Erna Solberg from the Conservative Party (Høyre).

 

But after only a few hours several of the Facebook posts including the Prime Minister’s post were deleted by Facebook.

 

– It is very regrettable that Facebook removed a post from my Facebook page, Solberg said to Aftenposten.
 

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In the post, she wrote:

 

– This picture is part of the world history. A picture of a terrified child ecaping from war. I appreciate the work of Facebook and other media outlets in stopping pictures and content that show abuse and violence. It is important that we all contribute in the fight against violence and child abuse.

 

– But Facebook is taking a wrong step when they censor images like these. It works to curb the freedom of speech.

Facebook did eventually respond to the newspaper via an anonymous spokesperson, but did not back down from the decision to censor the image or the various posts:

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«While we recognize that this photo is iconic, it’s difficult to create a distinction between allowing a photograph of a nude child in one instance and not others. We try to find the right balance between enabling people to express themselves while maintaining a safe and respectful experience for our global community. Our solutions won’t always be perfect, but we will continue to try to improve our policies and the ways in which we apply them.»

 

I think this debacle underscores the serious issues with Facebook as a news outlet. I was shocked when I learned that nearly half of Americans get their news from Facebook, because it's really poorly suited for that. The news sometimes has to describe the terrible things that happen in the world, or that happened in the past. It can't just leave out the things that are potentially offensive, as they're part of history and of the world that journalists report on. The freedom of expression is crucial to journalism and democracy.

 

Facebook should face the responsibility that comes with being a major news platform. Either hire your own editors, and make better decisions than in the past (the story about censoring right-wing voices is still in fresh memory), or function as a neutral conduit for accredited media like this Norwegian newspaper. Facebook doesn't necessarily have a lot to gain from spending money on editors, so why not rely on people like editor-in-chief Espen Egil Hansen to make the editorial decisions? If the future of news media is ruled by Facebook algorithms, reports on war crimes might never reach a broad audience, and that's not a future I want.

 

Source: The Guardian and Aftenposten

 

UPDATE:

 

Facebook has decided to back down and allow posting of the offending image.

 

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On Friday, following widespread criticisms from news organizations and media experts across the globe, Facebook reversed its decision, saying in a statement to the Guardian: “After hearing from our community, we looked again at how our Community Standards were applied in this case. An image of a naked child would normally be presumed to violate our Community Standards, and in some countries might even qualify as child pornography. In this case, we recognize the history and global importance of this image in documenting a particular moment in time.”

 

The statement continued: “Because of its status as an iconic image of historical importance, the value of permitting sharing outweighs the value of protecting the community by removal, so we have decided to reinstate the image on Facebook where we are aware it has been removed.”

 

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/sep/09/facebook-reinstates-napalm-girl-photo

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Everyone should stop reading after the 1st sentence. Manufactured controversy based human stupidity.

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As a journalist, Facebook to me is another US medium doing US medium things. And while it's revolting what US mediums can get away with, (especially Fox news across decennia) the only power we have is to leave. I do fear for the people who use Facebook as a news source. Truly.

 

EDIT: It's basically a clash of cultures

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Except I'd say USA has 'noticeable problems', that's for damn straight.

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6 minutes ago, That Norwegian Guy said:

As a journalist, Facebook to me is another US medium doing US medium things. And while it's revolting what US mediums can get away with, (especially Fox news across decennia) the only power we have is to leave. I do fear for the people who use Facebook as a news source. Truly.

The thing is, almost all news stuff on facebook is from news pages which are posting stuff on their own, without fb interfering I'd say almost 100% of the time, and if I had to pick one evil, I'd be more afraid or your regular newspapers/news channels than facebook. After all, it's not facebook who has been writing the articles you are reading, but the newspapers. Take Fox for instance. I am more afraid of them than Fb in this context. 

The ability to google properly is a skill of its own. 

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32 minutes ago, Sakkura said:

Facebook's rise as a news platform is generating lots of controversy recently.

 

Today, a major Norwegian newspaper published an open letter accusing Facebook of abusing its power when censoring images and news posts.

 

The specific incident that prompted the open letter of protest was Facebook censoring an article containing the historic Vietnam war image of a naked girl fleeing her napalm-bombed village.

The writer was suspended from posting on Facebook for 24 hours. When the newspaper posted a story discussing, and criticizing, the deletion, that post was also removed for containing the same image.

 

The open letter criticized this decision, calling it an abuse of power and saying it limited the discretionary room for making editorial decisions from newspaper editors. It said that Facebook's algorithm was undermining journalistic editorial decisions.

 

In the wake of the open letter, the prime minister of Norway, Erna Solberg, also decided to speak out about the situation. She did so on Facebook, but within hours, several of her posts on the topic were also removed. Several other government ministers were likewise censored.

 

Facebook did eventually respond to the newspaper via an anonymous spokesperson, but did not back down from the decision to censor the image or the various posts:

 

I think this debacle underscores the serious issues with Facebook as a news outlet. I was shocked when I learned that nearly half of Americans get their news from Facebook, because it's really poorly suited for that. The news sometimes has to describe the terrible things that happen in the world, or that happened in the past. It can't just leave out the things that are potentially offensive, as they're part of history and of the world that journalists report on. The freedom of expression is crucial to journalism and democracy.

 

Facebook should face the responsibility that comes with being a major news platform. Either hire your own editors, and make better decisions than in the past (the story about censoring right-wing voices is still in fresh memory), or function as a neutral conduit for accredited media like this Norwegian newspaper. Facebook doesn't necessarily have a lot to gain from spending money on editors, so why not rely on people like editor-in-chief Espen Egil Hansen to make the editorial decisions? If the future of news media is ruled by Facebook algorithms, reports on war crimes might never reach a broad audience, and that's not a future I want.

 

Source: The Guardian and Aftenposten

I think that a good compromise would be to exclude certain "accredited" news agencies from the standard algorithm, and have actual people review the content.

 

What would an accredited news agency be? I honestly don't know what criteria should be used. Affiliated with the Associate Press (AP) or Routers or something? I don't know the solution, but I know that one could be implemented.

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3 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

I think that a good compromise would be to exclude certain "accredited" news agencies from the standard algorithm, and have actual people review the content.

 

What would an accredited news agency be? I honestly don't know what criteria should be used. Affiliated with the Associate Press (AP) or Routers or something? I don't know the solution, but I know that one could be implemented.

Yeah that's not a bad idea. I get that Facebook wants algorithms both for cost reasons and because it's harder to accuse them of being biased, but it's getting a bit ridiculous when the algorithm is trying to erase history and also posting fake stories.

 

Their criteria for picking "trusted" news media or agencies could get controversial too, though.

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25 minutes ago, That Norwegian Guy said:

As a journalist, Facebook to me is another US medium doing US medium things. And while it's revolting what US mediums can get away with, (especially Fox news across decennia) the only power we have is to leave. I do fear for the people who use Facebook as a news source. Truly.

 

-snip-

 

9 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

I think that a good compromise would be to exclude certain "accredited" news agencies from the standard algorithm, and have actual people review the content.

 

What would an accredited news agency be? I honestly don't know what criteria should be used. Affiliated with the Associate Press (AP) or Routers or something? I don't know the solution, but I know that one could be implemented.

 

I agree with both sentiments.  On the one hand, Facebook is a private company and can do whatever they want within the confines of the law.  They can censor as much as they want, show only one side of all stories, become the Onion.  And really our only true option is to leave.  Companies care only about their money, and the only way to make a company change their stance is to speak with your wallet, which in this case is ad revenue, so you have to give up the site, or at least significantly reduce your usage, or at least stop clicking news stories on Facebook.

 

At the same time, Facebook could easily avoid some of these PR issues and sometimes silly automated censoring by simply allowing verified/authenticated/approved groups to have the algorithm simply flag them for human review, and not auto censor them.

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12 minutes ago, Sakkura said:

Yeah that's not a bad idea. I get that Facebook wants algorithms both for cost reasons and because it's harder to accuse them of being biased, but it's getting a bit ridiculous when the algorithm is trying to erase history and also posting fake stories.

 

Their criteria for picking "trusted" news media or agencies could get controversial too, though.

I agree - I'd be worried about Facebook "choosing" which Media agencies are trusted. That puts them in just as much control as they are in right now. It's not a great solution.

 

Perhaps a compromise would be for Facebook to approach the Associated Press and say "Any media agency you say, gets unrestricted posting privileges". Then local media can simply apply to the AP to be vetted.

 

Is this perfect? No. But at least it puts the decision making authority in the hands of the AP, which work with just about every major news agency already anyway.

10 minutes ago, ChineseChef said:

 

 

I agree with both sentiments.  On the one hand, Facebook is a private company and can do whatever they want within the confines of the law.  They can censor as much as they want, show only one side of all stories, become the Onion.  And really our only true option is to leave.  Companies care only about their money, and the only way to make a company change their stance is to speak with your wallet, which in this case is ad revenue, so you have to give up the site, or at least significantly reduce your usage, or at least stop clicking news stories on Facebook.

 

At the same time, Facebook could easily avoid some of these PR issues and sometimes silly automated censoring by simply allowing verified/authenticated/approved groups to have the algorithm simply flag them for human review, and not auto censor them.

I agree - Facebook is private, and has no legal - or even moral obligation to post what other people want. They can censor and limit their network to whatever rules they want.


It's bad PR though xD to do that

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8 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

I agree - I'd be worried about Facebook "choosing" which Media agencies are trusted. That puts them in just as much control as they are in right now. It's not a great solution.

-SNIP-


It's bad PR though xD to do that

 

I would say it would give Facebook more control than they have now.  Since right now everyone gets auto-censored (assuming they don't already have groups that are on a secret approved list, but that's a bit tinfoil haty).  What having openly approved sources would allow, is for FB to select who is viewed as legitimate and who isn't by their audience, and potentially others as well.  It would allow for the viewpoints and sources they agree with to post things that would potentially get censored by an algorithm, and the viewpoints or sources they don't agree with get auto-censored.  Then they could tweak the algorithm to be more restrictive, and at the same time, claim that groups that aren't pre-approved are simply not good sources.  This would give the illusion that one group is more trustworthy than the other.  Which would give the chosen sources a false sense of legitimacy even when they post complete BS.

 

I just want to see FB turn back into the simple pre-news and AD crazy site it has become, lol.  Is that too much to ask?  lol

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5 minutes ago, ChineseChef said:

 

I would say it would give Facebook more control than they have now.  Since right now everyone gets auto-censored (assuming they don't already have groups that are on a secret approved list, but that's a bit tinfoil haty).  What having openly approved sources would allow, is for FB to select who is viewed as legitimate and who isn't by their audience, and potentially others as well.  It would allow for the viewpoints and sources they agree with to post things that would potentially get censored by an algorithm, and the viewpoints or sources they don't agree with get auto-censored.  Then they could tweak the algorithm to be more restrictive, and at the same time, claim that groups that aren't pre-approved are simply not good sources.  This would give the illusion that one group is more trustworthy than the other.  Which would give the chosen sources a false sense of legitimacy even when they post complete BS.

 

I just want to see FB turn back into the simple pre-news and AD crazy site it has become, lol.  Is that too much to ask?  lol

Good points all around, but I doubt FB will back down from the media game. News Story clicks are too important to them.

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1 hour ago, dalekphalm said:

I agree - Facebook is private, and has no legal - or even moral obligation to post what other people want. They can censor and limit their network to whatever rules they want.


It's bad PR though xD to do that

In general, I would agree. But... if Facebook gets big enough, I think I might begin to disagree. The reason we have bans on government censorship is we don't want that much power concentrated in so few hands. Well, if Facebook becomes the default way to access news, doesn't that give them an inordinate amount of power too? Couldn't they end up wielding enormous influence on our democracy, if they control the information the voters get?

 

At some point, I think they either need to voluntarily make a serious effort to fix these issues, or it could become necessary to introduce legislation regulating their conduct.

 

That's not a pleasant thought, so honestly I just hope people stop relying so much on Facebook for news.

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3 minutes ago, Sakkura said:

In general, I would agree. But... if Facebook gets big enough, I think I might begin to disagree. The reason we have bans on government censorship is we don't want that much power concentrated in so few hands. Well, if Facebook becomes the default way to access news, doesn't that give them an inordinate amount of power too? Couldn't they end up wielding enormous influence on our democracy, if they control the information the voters get?

 

At some point, I think they either need to voluntarily make a serious effort to fix these issues, or it could become necessary to introduce legislation regulating their conduct.

 

That's not a pleasant thought, so honestly I just hope people stop relying so much on Facebook for news.

All of what you say are good points. I don't have the answer. I don't think anyone currently does. But we should damn well start thinking about a solution! :P

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Norway should ban Facebook! ;)

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Facebook might be used a lot for news but it's not a news platform and remains a private company. While I do not support the censorship of certain articles and images it is still their platform with their rules.

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wait, so this picture is controversial?

napalm2n-1-web.jpg

 

Did Zuckenberg not go to school or something? First time i saw it, it was on my history book in middle school ffs

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2 hours ago, Sakkura said:

snip

Norways largest news outlet

 

-> Aftenposten <-

 

AHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHA...ha..ha.

 

 

no. It's not the largest... it's the second or third largest by nearly 300k readers (in a 5.3m country)

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8 minutes ago, suicidalfranco said:

wait, so this picture is controversial?

napalm2n-1-web.jpg

 

Did Zuckenberg not go to school or something? First time i saw it, it was on my history book in middle school ffs

It's controversial because that's a picture of a naked child. Child pornography is against the EULA on Facebook, and furthermore, is illegal in most places.

 

That image is not child porn, but their algorithms are all automated now, so the computer can't tell the difference between an image featuring a naked child that is, and is not, child porn.

 

Plus, on Facebook, if people flag something as offensive, 9 times out of 10, Facebook will remove said item. You can be damn sure that some bored House-Wife will get offended by that picture.

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6 minutes ago, Prysin said:

Norways largest news outlet

 

-> Aftenposten <-

 

AHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA{censorsnip}HAHAHAHAHA...ha..ha.

 

 

no. It's not the largest... it's the second or third largest by nearly 300k readers (in a 5.3m country)

Heh, I actually called it "a major Norwegian newspaper" because I wasn't sure the Guardian was right about it being the largest.

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10 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

Plus, on Facebook, if people flag something as offensive, 9 times out of 10, Facebook will remove said item.

No way, I've flagged upwards of 50 posts containing hate speech that were never removed.

 

It's only nipples, dicks and vajayjays. That's all Facebook seems to care about. But you can threaten the lives of immigrants all you want. Where the fuck is the logic?

 

Edit: Facebook has just given into pressure and will allow the above photo. But I guess that one photo was never the issue, it's just a representative of a problem that'll become recurring.

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7 minutes ago, That Norwegian Guy said:

No way, I've flagged upwards of 50 posts containing hate speech that were never removed.

 

It's only nipples, dicks and vajayjays. That's all Facebook seems to care about. But you can threaten the lives of immigrants all you want. Where the fuck is the logic?

Well, for one thing, it takes quite a few flags before something is reviewed by a person. When nips are shown, you've got hundreds or thousands of angry conservatives yelling "WON'T SOMEONE PLEASE THINK OF THE CHILDREN!" and spamming that report button as if it'll give them an orgasm.

 

But I agree - mostly it's the nips, dicks, and vag's that they like to remove.

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27 minutes ago, That Norwegian Guy said:

Edit: Facebook has just given into pressure and will allow the above photo. But I guess that one photo was never the issue, it's just a representative of a problem that'll become recurring.

Yeah... they say something about looking at their procedures and yada yada, but algorithms don't get a lot smarter overnight, and their attitude towards nudity probably isn't going to change.

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29 minutes ago, Sakkura said:

Yeah... they say something about looking at their procedures and yada yada, but algorithms don't get a lot smarter overnight, and their attitude towards nudity probably isn't going to change.

Indeed - you would probably need true AI to be able to read the subtle differences in context between what makes something "inappropriate", and what makes something "historically important to see".

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1 hour ago, That Norwegian Guy said:

No way, I've flagged upwards of 50 posts containing hate speech that were never removed.

 

It's only nipples, dicks and vajayjays. That's all Facebook seems to care about. But you can threaten the lives of immigrants all you want*. Where the fuck is the logic?

 

Edit: Facebook has just given into pressure and will allow the above photo. But I guess that one photo was never the issue, it's just a representative of a problem that'll become recurring.

*Citation fucking needed on that.

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@Sakkura

from the "Facebook gives in article" in Norway

 

http://www.vg.no/nyheter/utenriks/vietnam/40-aar-siden-det-ikoniske-bildet-av-napalm-jenta/a/10054142/

 

incase anyone wonder how the naked girl looks today, 40 years after being hit by napalm bombs

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892e6e6c384a883f1f54980fa0ddf353.jpg?t%5

 

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1 minute ago, Prysin said:

@Sakkura

from the "Facebook gives in article" in Norway

 

http://www.vg.no/nyheter/utenriks/vietnam/40-aar-siden-det-ikoniske-bildet-av-napalm-jenta/a/10054142/

 

incase anyone wonder how the naked girl looks today, 40 years after being hit by napalm bombs

  Reveal hidden contents

892e6e6c384a883f1f54980fa0ddf353.jpg?t%5

 

Welp.

 

I can honestly say with 100% certainty, that I NEVER want to be hit with Napalm.

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