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Jagged Shadows,Pop in,Low LOD and jagged aa

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Instead of TAA or similar alternatives (they don't work anyway), we should bring back the AA types we used before. So the part we will focus on will be easier. For example, FXAA and MSAA together were more than enough for me. They made very nice edges. But that depends on the person. We all know we've never experienced this before, but the problem started out of nowhere. Sometimes after a format, sometimes after a hardware change or all of a sudden. I mean, we have to go back, we don't need new or different solutions, it won't be enough anyway. When I remember my old graphics, no so-called alternative method will satisfy me.

 

Many things have been tried but unfortunately nothing works. My suggestion, those who really know about these things or who seriously trust their guesses should be divided into two groups. As software and hardware groups. And they should seek solutions without hiding anything from each other. I would prefer software in such a case. I mentioned before.

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On 5/23/2021 at 7:55 PM, Colonizor48 said:

The gpu thinks everything is a LOD therefore not applying anti aliasing right and using aproximated shadows.  But the software thinks its not and its normal, menaing the object itself is rendered at a normal resolution.But the shadows and AA are aproximated. And this conflict causes delays in Loading in objects not in low LOD. Due to conflicts. THis is my educated guess.

I believe you hit the nail on the head here. The problem is related to a miscalculation of the global levels of detail. The problem is most visible with transparent patterned textures like fences etc, and textures on top of other textures, like street markings (which are also transparent textures).

 

I've been following this issues since December 2016. It appeared suddenly for me. I was playing old games on my old-a$$ Windows XP machine. Initially I thought it would go away, but then I started reading forums and realized how insidious this problem is. I was playing games like GTA: San Andreas, GTAIII and Max Payne 2. They suddenly started looking HIDEOUSLY. Using late 2000s hardware I could play these and other old games at max settings (duh), with RivaTuner eye-candy like unclamped negative LOD bias, high antialiasing and MSAA for transparent textures. I tried reinstalling drivers (not with DDU though) but it didn't help. That's what has stopped me ever since to buy a new gaming PC (well, plus COVID and the GPU shortage). I don't want to play recent games which will look worse than 20-year old games. And on top of that, to read posts saying it's all in our heads.

 

I also used to believe electricity could be the culprit for a while. Or some crypto mining trojan or something... The weird thing is that I didn't change anything software- or hardware-wise when it happened, from what I remember. I used to think RivaTuner could be causing it, has anyone here ever used it? Others have told that when they buy a new system, it works fine for a short while and then it all goes bad. What could be causing this? User behavior, like using third-party software or using certain settings?

 

I wonder if the problem is software or hardware in nature. Could using certain settings damage a video card or motherboard component at the physical level? Or could a card's firmware get stuck with a variable that most games and even utilities (even Nvidia Inspector) can't fix? If programmers assign LOD levels by using some variable that is assumed to be zero but actually becomes stuck at minus <some power of 2>, incrementing it by a few units won't matter. From what I've read on antialiasing, different methods have different overhead and results, but what we see definitely isn't normal. Instead of multiple samples per pixel, it's like a single random value is picked every 4x4 pixels instead... Could we force a negative AA factor so that the two negatives cancel each other?

 

People have told they brought their PC to a friend's house and it worked normally there, could it be because of the screen used? What if some screens bug themselves and give a faulty feedback to the PC, and the video drivers, DirectX (which seems to be the most heavily affected) or Windows is tricked into thinking the resolution is really low despite not being so? Is LOD dependent on render resolution? TAA helps most people, but not many games support it. People for whom it doesn't help and for whom Z-fighting is severe may have a more complex version of the problem, or according to me a different problem which has LOD problems as a "side dish".

 

That would maybe explain why using DSR helps significantly. Still, it's not a solution in most cases as it's a total waste of frames. Rendering the whole scene using 4 times the number of pixels when the problem is just the edges, and they looked great in the past with very little overhead! We reach the point of diminishing returns the moment we start increasing the resolution as you only see significant improvement when you increase the resolution a lot. Plus, older games don't support high resolutions, and newer games have to be played at 30fps instead of 60+ just so we don't see the hideous shimmering in all of its "glory"...

 

It doesn't seem to be a Windows issues as it happened on XP for me. Win7 uses older paradigms which may be less likely to cause the issue, but Windows 10 is built different (not in a good way), and the issue is probably even harder to avoid. Still, the problem seems to be in DirectX, video drivers or some of the BIOSes. Some modification to the drivers must have occurred in the early 2010s which was done to improve performance, with new AA norms which don't work as good as before but "run better". Higher resolutions were probably a justification for nerfing the AA. Maybe it works better most of the time, but it also allows things to go really bad for some of us. It doesn't affect enough people for Nvidia/AMD to put effort into changing their driver architectures. Big YouTubers could indeed bring this problem to their attention.

 

And - no, we aren't spoiled for getting used to nice, proper AA. Unaffected users' AA is perhaps not as flawless as it used to be in the past, which is why we see it even in other people's videos, but it's decent enough. For us though it's beyond unacceptable.

 

It's not like I'm gonna buy a new PC anytime soon with the inflated prices, lol, but I hope I can drive the hunt in the right direction. Yes, what @Colonizor48 says is true, we do need a scientific approach. I'm gonna read more on LOD and AA now, I wonder what changed about them some years ago. And while a virus is unlikely, an unaddressed flaw in any piece of software may have the same effect as malware even though it's not intended.

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7 hours ago, DBFTW said:

I believe you hit the nail on the head here. The problem is related to a miscalculation of the global levels of detail. The problem is most visible with transparent patterned textures like fences etc, and textures on top of other textures, like street markings (which are also transparent textures).

 

I've been following this issues since December 2016. It appeared suddenly for me. I was playing old games on my old-a$$ Windows XP machine. Initially I thought it would go away, but then I started reading forums and realized how insidious this problem is. I was playing games like GTA: San Andreas, GTAIII and Max Payne 2. They suddenly started looking HIDEOUSLY. Using late 2000s hardware I could play these and other old games at max settings (duh), with RivaTuner eye-candy like unclamped negative LOD bias, high antialiasing and MSAA for transparent textures. I tried reinstalling drivers (not with DDU though) but it didn't help. That's what has stopped me ever since to buy a new gaming PC (well, plus COVID and the GPU shortage). I don't want to play recent games which will look worse than 20-year old games. And on top of that, to read posts saying it's all in our heads.

 

I also used to believe electricity could be the culprit for a while. Or some crypto mining trojan or something... The weird thing is that I didn't change anything software- or hardware-wise when it happened, from what I remember. I used to think RivaTuner could be causing it, has anyone here ever used it? Others have told that when they buy a new system, it works fine for a short while and then it all goes bad. What could be causing this? User behavior, like using third-party software or using certain settings?

 

I wonder if the problem is software or hardware in nature. Could using certain settings damage a video card or motherboard component at the physical level? Or could a card's firmware get stuck with a variable that most games and even utilities (even Nvidia Inspector) can't fix? If programmers assign LOD levels by using some variable that is assumed to be zero but actually becomes stuck at minus <some power of 2>, incrementing it by a few units won't matter. From what I've read on antialiasing, different methods have different overhead and results, but what we see definitely isn't normal. Instead of multiple samples per pixel, it's like a single random value is picked every 4x4 pixels instead... Could we force a negative AA factor so that the two negatives cancel each other?

 

People have told they brought their PC to a friend's house and it worked normally there, could it be because of the screen used? What if some screens bug themselves and give a faulty feedback to the PC, and the video drivers, DirectX (which seems to be the most heavily affected) or Windows is tricked into thinking the resolution is really low despite not being so? Is LOD dependent on render resolution? TAA helps most people, but not many games support it. People for whom it doesn't help and for whom Z-fighting is severe may have a more complex version of the problem, or according to me a different problem which has LOD problems as a "side dish".

 

That would maybe explain why using DSR helps significantly. Still, it's not a solution in most cases as it's a total waste of frames. Rendering the whole scene using 4 times the number of pixels when the problem is just the edges, and they looked great in the past with very little overhead! We reach the point of diminishing returns the moment we start increasing the resolution as you only see significant improvement when you increase the resolution a lot. Plus, older games don't support high resolutions, and newer games have to be played at 30fps instead of 60+ just so we don't see the hideous shimmering in all of its "glory"...

 

It doesn't seem to be a Windows issues as it happened on XP for me. Win7 uses older paradigms which may be less likely to cause the issue, but Windows 10 is built different (not in a good way), and the issue is probably even harder to avoid. Still, the problem seems to be in DirectX, video drivers or some of the BIOSes. Some modification to the drivers must have occurred in the early 2010s which was done to improve performance, with new AA norms which don't work as good as before but "run better". Higher resolutions were probably a justification for nerfing the AA. Maybe it works better most of the time, but it also allows things to go really bad for some of us. It doesn't affect enough people for Nvidia/AMD to put effort into changing their driver architectures. Big YouTubers could indeed bring this problem to their attention.

 

And - no, we aren't spoiled for getting used to nice, proper AA. Unaffected users' AA is perhaps not as flawless as it used to be in the past, which is why we see it even in other people's videos, but it's decent enough. For us though it's beyond unacceptable.

 

It's not like I'm gonna buy a new PC anytime soon with the inflated prices, lol, but I hope I can drive the hunt in the right direction. Yes, what @Colonizor48 says is true, we do need a scientific approach. I'm gonna read more on LOD and AA now, I wonder what changed about them some years ago. And while a virus is unlikely, an unaddressed flaw in any piece of software may have the same effect as malware even though it's not intended.

I belive a good explination could be simply the pcie slot/gpu not getting enough power for proper calculations? Either that or some sort of wierd driver issue that can spread somehow? But these are jsut shots in the dark. Has anyone tried DDU while disconnecting the internet and reinstaling the drivers without internet?

 

(EDIT: trying this it has not worked. Its probably not directly related to the internet or harder to remove then just running ddu.)

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I also suffer from this virus bug or whatever it is. I noticed that it started happening just after i messed around with the color management in windows. My new screen has horrible color banding issues and i was trying to get that fixed, which is where this whole mess started. So it could possibly be connected to the color management.

Edit: forgot to mention i also fiddled with the cleartype stuff in windows, so that could be a lead aswell.

i know it seems unlikely but its all i have to go on

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23 hours ago, haemse said:

I also suffer from this virus bug or whatever it is. I noticed that it started happening just after i messed around with the color management in windows. My new screen has horrible color banding issues and i was trying to get that fixed, which is where this whole mess started. So it could possibly be connected to the color management.

Edit: forgot to mention i also fiddled with the cleartype stuff in windows, so that could be a lead aswell.

i know it seems unlikely but its all i have to go on

Okay this is another lead. WIndows is applying cleartype to stuff other then text. Does anyone know where cleartype/color settings are stored and a way to delete the files/regestry entries and reset them? It would probably be somewhere in the regestry.

 

(EDIT UPON TESTING THIS BY CHANGING CLEAR TYPE SETTINGS WHILE PLAYING A GAME IT DOESN'T SEEM TO BE THE CULPRIT. BUT ITS NOT 100% OUT EITHER. ILL TEST IT WITH A DIFFERENT GAME)

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On 6/13/2021 at 1:47 PM, DBFTW said:

I believe you hit the nail on the head here. The problem is related to a miscalculation of the global levels of detail. The problem is most visible with transparent patterned textures like fences etc, and textures on top of other textures, like street markings (which are also transparent textures).

 

I've been following this issues since December 2016. It appeared suddenly for me. I was playing old games on my old-a$$ Windows XP machine. Initially I thought it would go away, but then I started reading forums and realized how insidious this problem is. I was playing games like GTA: San Andreas, GTAIII and Max Payne 2. They suddenly started looking HIDEOUSLY. Using late 2000s hardware I could play these and other old games at max settings (duh), with RivaTuner eye-candy like unclamped negative LOD bias, high antialiasing and MSAA for transparent textures. I tried reinstalling drivers (not with DDU though) but it didn't help. That's what has stopped me ever since to buy a new gaming PC (well, plus COVID and the GPU shortage). I don't want to play recent games which will look worse than 20-year old games. And on top of that, to read posts saying it's all in our heads.

 

I also used to believe electricity could be the culprit for a while. Or some crypto mining trojan or something... The weird thing is that I didn't change anything software- or hardware-wise when it happened, from what I remember. I used to think RivaTuner could be causing it, has anyone here ever used it? Others have told that when they buy a new system, it works fine for a short while and then it all goes bad. What could be causing this? User behavior, like using third-party software or using certain settings?

 

I wonder if the problem is software or hardware in nature. Could using certain settings damage a video card or motherboard component at the physical level? Or could a card's firmware get stuck with a variable that most games and even utilities (even Nvidia Inspector) can't fix? If programmers assign LOD levels by using some variable that is assumed to be zero but actually becomes stuck at minus <some power of 2>, incrementing it by a few units won't matter. From what I've read on antialiasing, different methods have different overhead and results, but what we see definitely isn't normal. Instead of multiple samples per pixel, it's like a single random value is picked every 4x4 pixels instead... Could we force a negative AA factor so that the two negatives cancel each other?

 

People have told they brought their PC to a friend's house and it worked normally there, could it be because of the screen used? What if some screens bug themselves and give a faulty feedback to the PC, and the video drivers, DirectX (which seems to be the most heavily affected) or Windows is tricked into thinking the resolution is really low despite not being so? Is LOD dependent on render resolution? TAA helps most people, but not many games support it. People for whom it doesn't help and for whom Z-fighting is severe may have a more complex version of the problem, or according to me a different problem which has LOD problems as a "side dish".

 

That would maybe explain why using DSR helps significantly. Still, it's not a solution in most cases as it's a total waste of frames. Rendering the whole scene using 4 times the number of pixels when the problem is just the edges, and they looked great in the past with very little overhead! We reach the point of diminishing returns the moment we start increasing the resolution as you only see significant improvement when you increase the resolution a lot. Plus, older games don't support high resolutions, and newer games have to be played at 30fps instead of 60+ just so we don't see the hideous shimmering in all of its "glory"...

 

It doesn't seem to be a Windows issues as it happened on XP for me. Win7 uses older paradigms which may be less likely to cause the issue, but Windows 10 is built different (not in a good way), and the issue is probably even harder to avoid. Still, the problem seems to be in DirectX, video drivers or some of the BIOSes. Some modification to the drivers must have occurred in the early 2010s which was done to improve performance, with new AA norms which don't work as good as before but "run better". Higher resolutions were probably a justification for nerfing the AA. Maybe it works better most of the time, but it also allows things to go really bad for some of us. It doesn't affect enough people for Nvidia/AMD to put effort into changing their driver architectures. Big YouTubers could indeed bring this problem to their attention.

 

And - no, we aren't spoiled for getting used to nice, proper AA. Unaffected users' AA is perhaps not as flawless as it used to be in the past, which is why we see it even in other people's videos, but it's decent enough. For us though it's beyond unacceptable.

 

It's not like I'm gonna buy a new PC anytime soon with the inflated prices, lol, but I hope I can drive the hunt in the right direction. Yes, what @Colonizor48 says is true, we do need a scientific approach. I'm gonna read more on LOD and AA now, I wonder what changed about them some years ago. And while a virus is unlikely, an unaddressed flaw in any piece of software may have the same effect as malware even though it's not intended.

In my opinion the first thing we need to figure out how to do is to figure out how to consistantly replicate the issue on a device that isn't effected yet. BEFORE WE DO ANYTHING TO A PC THAT ISNT EFFECTED YET MAKE A DISK IMAGE. THIS WILL BE USEFUL FOR TESTING LATER. ALSO GET THE HASHES OF THE GPU AND MOBO BIOSES

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I have already said that this is an electricity problem. All of your games run faster, it is about everything - physics, movement, stairs and flicker.
I gave a link to a guy (look for my past message) who has games like this (here in the topic, many games go like this)
He has a lot of gta v videos. Take any, for example the beginning of a game where Michael meets a psychoanalyst. Look at movements, animations, and lip movements. In another tab, open any other letsplay, also 60 fps pc. Open the 2 clips, on the right and left side of the screen.
This guy is literally everything faster, you can even notice that the sound and lip movements are not synchronized, the lips move faster. So everything moves faster, for example, grass from the wind, tree branches (if you can't see this from the animation)

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3 hours ago, pepegus said:

I have already said that this is an electricity problem. All of your games run faster, it is about everything - physics, movement, stairs and flicker.
I gave a link to a guy (look for my past message) who has games like this (here in the topic, many games go like this)
He has a lot of gta v videos. Take any, for example the beginning of a game where Michael meets a psychoanalyst. Look at movements, animations, and lip movements. In another tab, open any other letsplay, also 60 fps pc. Open the 2 clips, on the right and left side of the screen.
This guy is literally everything faster, you can even notice that the sound and lip movements are not synchronized, the lips move faster. So everything moves faster, for example, grass from the wind, tree branches (if you can't see this from the animation)

Im really tired to hear the same thing about the Electricity Problem, if you dont have this issue PLEASE dont Comment Thanks.

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5 hours ago, pepegus said:

I have already said that this is an electricity problem. All of your games run faster, it is about everything - physics, movement, stairs and flicker.
I gave a link to a guy (look for my past message) who has games like this (here in the topic, many games go like this)
He has a lot of gta v videos. Take any, for example the beginning of a game where Michael meets a psychoanalyst. Look at movements, animations, and lip movements. In another tab, open any other letsplay, also 60 fps pc. Open the 2 clips, on the right and left side of the screen.
This guy is literally everything faster, you can even notice that the sound and lip movements are not synchronized, the lips move faster. So everything moves faster, for example, grass from the wind, tree branches (if you can't see this from the animation)

Regardless i still get like 20fps in no mans sky. So its not running faster. Honestly it might be some sort of electrical issue but not the kind your thinking. Maybe just the gpu not getting enough power or RF radiation interfering or somthing. But I dont think its caused by this. It probably has multiple causes and solutions. The closest thing to this speed up is stuff movig back and forth for no reason, including shadows when they are far away. Ill try to get footage of that.

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2 hours ago, Cebreros said:

Im really tired to hear the same thing about the Electricity Problem, if you dont have this issue PLEASE dont Comment Thanks.

We need people without the issue to help us. But at the same time its probably not electricity. But im not 100% rulling it out. There are some records of changing the power socket fixing it. If it is one its probably the PSU not getting enough power or RF radiation or somthing.

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Could someone do a little experiment to see if the PC not getting enough power is the issue? Hook up a wattage measure between your PC and outlet and check the twp of your pc and compair them. Maybe the game is approximating stuff to save power? Or maybe its some wierd power saving feature that microsoft put into windows or directx for some fricking reason. Do the same if u have a monitor that plugs in the wall use a wattage meter on that too.

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5 hours ago, Colonizor48 said:

If it is one its probably the PSU not getting enough power

  That would mean some serious issues with power delivery to your house if you can't even power a 1-2 kW computer properly. Devices don't "get" power, they "pull" power. If the supplying end is not built to handle the load it'll hopefully trip some internal protection (e.g. overcurrent protection or overpower protection) or if something failed or you have a unit that doesn't have protection it'll become (extremely) unreliable at best and potentially destroy whatever's attached to it. For house stuff you'll probably (hopefully) trip a breaker if you draw too much.

5 hours ago, Colonizor48 said:

Could someone do a little experiment to see if the PC not getting enough power is the issue? Hook up a wattage measure between your PC and outlet and check the twp of your pc and compair them. Maybe the game is approximating stuff to save power? Or maybe its some wierd power saving feature that microsoft put into windows or directx for some fricking reason. Do the same if u have a monitor that plugs in the wall use a wattage meter on that too.

Note that if you measure at the socket, the power draw from the wall will be higher than what your PC uses due to imperfect efficiency. For example if your PC draws 1000 W, an 80% efficient power supply will draw 1250 W from the wall.

Crystal: CPU: i7 7700K | Motherboard: Asus ROG Strix Z270F | RAM: GSkill 16 GB@3200MHz | GPU: Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti FE | Case: Corsair Crystal 570X (black) | PSU: EVGA Supernova G2 1000W | Monitor: Asus VG248QE 24"

Laptop: Dell XPS 13 9370 | CPU: i5 10510U | RAM: 16 GB

Server: CPU: i5 4690k | RAM: 16 GB | Case: Corsair Graphite 760T White | Storage: 19 TB

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12 minutes ago, tikker said:

  That would mean some serious issues with power delivery to your house if you can't even power a 1-2 kW computer properly. Devices don't "get" power, they "pull" power. If the supplying end is not built to handle the load it'll hopefully trip some internal protection (e.g. overcurrent protection or overpower protection) or if something failed or you have a unit that doesn't have protection it'll become (extremely) unreliable at best and potentially destroy whatever's attached to it. For house stuff you'll probably (hopefully) trip a breaker if you draw too much.

Note that if you measure at the socket, the power draw from the wall will be higher than what your PC uses due to imperfect efficiency. For example if your PC draws 1000 W, an 80% efficient power supply will draw 1250 W from the wall.

No im thinking a surge protector issue or wire issue probably. Has anyone tried just hooking up their pc to the wall directly? I woudl but my outlet is in a wierd spot and i cant hook it up directly.

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Starting to see this in some videos too. I would do almost anything for this issue to just go away. Honestly i think electrical interference might be a lead of some sort. There are some weird records of changing the outlet and it somehow working. Or just changing the HDD sata slot. And i know electrical interference can cause headphone issues. Could it be something like this? We wont know until we do some experiments. But this is a lead.

Here are out leads so far:

Windows color settings

Windows clear type being applied to non text stuff

A weird driver issue.

A GPU issue

A MOBO issue

A PSU issue

PC not getting enough power

RF interference

Registry settings

GPU bios

CMOS

Game changing somthing in GPU cache

Some weird power saving feature

Windows being weird in general.

Probably some others in forgetting.

Lets try to test each one of these individually before comming up with any new theories.

 

Also if you find any retentive information in any old threads or threads/information from other websites then post it here. Additionally it could be one or a combination of these issues or different people might have the same issue but different causes. We dont know enough yet.

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2 hours ago, Colonizor48 said:

Starting to see this in some videos too. I would do almost anything for this issue to just go away. Honestly i think electrical interference might be a lead of some sort. There are some weird records of changing the outlet and it somehow working. Or just changing the HDD sata slot. And i know electrical interference can cause headphone issues. Could it be something like this? We wont know until we do some experiments. But this is a lead.

Here are out leads so far:

Windows color settings

Windows clear type being applied to non text stuff

A weird driver issue.

A GPU issue

A MOBO issue

A PSU issue

PC not getting enough power

RF interference

Registry settings

GPU bios

CMOS

Game changing somthing in GPU cache

Some weird power saving feature

Windows being weird in general.

Probably some others in forgetting.

Lets try to test each one of these individually before comming up with any new theories.

 

Also if you find any retentive information in any old threads or threads/information from other websites then post it here. Additionally it could be one or a combination of these issues or different people might have the same issue but different causes. We dont know enough yet.

I see it in videos as well, may i ask do you only see it in gameplay videos or every video. I only see it in gameplay videos and not real life recordings so honestly it has lead me to believe that this stuff is normal, like 99% of the gameplay videos I watch have the same issue yet the person recording the video dont notice it at all.

 

‐------------------------------------------------------------

 

Now very little is known about this "issue" that's if it even is an issue so take what I say with a grain of salt.

 

I'm really starting to think this is all in our heads and I'm going to explain why

 

1. Almost everything has been disproved at this point, people have bought entirely new setups, moving houses and even countries, people have been going to the extreme to fix this issue with no avail. 

 

Just by moving houses and buying new equipment rules out almost everything, so: electricity, software, hardware, some radiation problem, monitor, windows settings and basically everything colonizer said in his post previous to this.

 

I would also like to mention  this happens on both amd/nvidia cards so it has nothing to do with any specific gpu or gpu manufacturer's heck this even happens on consoles.

 

2. There is no footage of people without this issue, obviously there are things to do which you can mask this issue (setting games to 4k, taa etc).

I assume everyone here with the jaggies issue uses 1080p on most games. So if you go watch a 1080p video you will most likely see the issue (I would like to mention youtube isnt exactly the greatest place to compare footage and it is better to watch uncompressed mp4 files due to YouTube's compression changing how the videos look) Now everyone who has claimed to have fixed this issue have never provided proof even when asked for it and in the rare case that they do give proof they actually do have the jaggies and when pinpointed out to them they start seeing it as well.

 

3. Something interesting I have noticed is that people that have started notices this, it always seems to be in the exact same small pool of games or after changing graphic settings, so for example gta, not everyone in the world plays gta but yet it feels like 75% of the people who have got this issue bring up that they first started seeing the issue in gta and then it "spread" to every other game and device. I dont know what it is about gta that causes it to have such bad jaggies and lod but I think it just might have to do with the age of the game and some other things, If someone, let's just say me, started noticing this in a certain game and it bothered me i would most certainly look it up and see what the issue is and then i hear that other people  have the same issue and that there Is apparently no fix and that if you have it, you will have it in every game and after hearing that I would probably start looking out for it and when I do spot it, once I have seen it I cannot unsee it and causes me to go insane.

This can also apply for the whole changing graphics thing I mentioned earlier like someone will most likely start looking at the graphics after changing graphics settings and once they notice they jaggies they will start searching what it is and the same story will play out. And the last thing for this point, some people including myself start noticing it after a power outage which can really play into the electricity theory and I understand why people think it is electricity but as I said earlier electricity has been disproved many times.

 

Those are the three main reasons I'm really starting to believe this is normal.

 

I would also like to mention again:

Almost every gaming video has this issue, People I've talked to in the discord covering this issue have said that they see this video in 99% of gameplay videos they watch including myself and it just doesn't make sense to me how if this is an issue why would it be in videos, jaggies maybe but deffo not lod also as I said this issue isnt present in non gameplay videos ( for me at least ) and yes I know I covered this in the 2nd of the main points.

 

Something else I find odd is if something was broken or something like that why would setting games to 4k basically almost get rid of the issue with jaggies, just throwing that out there.

 

I could totally be wrong on this but I have this issue and have been doing excessive research on this topic and this is the conclusion I have ended up with.

 

If this is really the case  then I know it sucks that there probably won't be a fix and we will just have to wait for better aa and better tech to come out.

 

One last thing I want to mention, if this really is an issue the reason why linus or any tech channel for that matter doesn't cover this is because we have not proved that this is an issue. There is literally no footage without this issue that I can come across so it really is hard to prove that this is an issue.

 

Now I apologize for the long read and I understand that some of the things I said is possibly flawed and I could be completely wrong. but I am just putting what I think this issue is out there, I still stand by my point that this is possibly temporal aliasing but that is normal and I think everyone has it and the only thing we can do to mask it is with taa or playing at 4k.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Delays said:

I see it in videos as well, may i ask do you only see it in gameplay videos or every video. I only see it in gameplay videos and not real life recordings so honestly it has lead me to believe that this stuff is normal, like 99% of the gameplay videos I watch have the same issue yet the person recording the video dont notice it at all.

 

‐------------------------------------------------------------

 

Now very little is known about this "issue" that's if it even is an issue so take what I say with a grain of salt.

 

I'm really starting to think this is all in our heads and I'm going to explain why

 

1. Almost everything has been disproved at this point, people have bought entirely new setups, moving houses and even countries, people have been going to the extreme to fix this issue with no avail. 

 

Just by moving houses and buying new equipment rules out almost everything, so: electricity, software, hardware, some radiation problem, monitor, windows settings and basically everything colonizer said in his post previous to this.

 

I would also like to mention  this happens on both amd/nvidia cards so it has nothing to do with any specific gpu or gpu manufacturer's heck this even happens on consoles.

 

2. There is no footage of people without this issue, obviously there are things to do which you can mask this issue (setting games to 4k, taa etc).

I assume everyone here with the jaggies issue uses 1080p on most games. So if you go watch a 1080p video you will most likely see the issue (I would like to mention youtube isnt exactly the greatest place to compare footage and it is better to watch uncompressed mp4 files due to YouTube's compression changing how the videos look) Now everyone who has claimed to have fixed this issue have never provided proof even when asked for it and in the rare case that they do give proof they actually do have the jaggies and when pinpointed out to them they start seeing it as well.

 

3. Something interesting I have noticed is that people that have started notices this, it always seems to be in the exact same small pool of games or after changing graphic settings, so for example gta, not everyone in the world plays gta but yet it feels like 75% of the people who have got this issue bring up that they first started seeing the issue in gta and then it "spread" to every other game and device. I dont know what it is about gta that causes it to have such bad jaggies and lod but I think it just might have to do with the age of the game and some other things, If someone, let's just say me, started noticing this in a certain game and it bothered me i would most certainly look it up and see what the issue is and then i hear that other people  have the same issue and that there Is apparently no fix and that if you have it, you will have it in every game and after hearing that I would probably start looking out for it and when I do spot it, once I have seen it I cannot unsee it and causes me to go insane.

This can also apply for the whole changing graphics thing I mentioned earlier like someone will most likely start looking at the graphics after changing graphics settings and once they notice they jaggies they will start searching what it is and the same story will play out. And the last thing for this point, some people including myself start noticing it after a power outage which can really play into the electricity theory and I understand why people think it is electricity but as I said earlier electricity has been disproved many times.

 

Those are the three main reasons I'm really starting to believe this is normal.

 

I would also like to mention again:

Almost every gaming video has this issue, People I've talked to in the discord covering this issue have said that they see this video in 99% of gameplay videos they watch including myself and it just doesn't make sense to me how if this is an issue why would it be in videos, jaggies maybe but deffo not lod also as I said this issue isnt present in non gameplay videos ( for me at least ) and yes I know I covered this in the 2nd of the main points.

 

Something else I find odd is if something was broken or something like that why would setting games to 4k basically almost get rid of the issue with jaggies, just throwing that out there.

 

I could totally be wrong on this but I have this issue and have been doing excessive research on this topic and this is the conclusion I have ended up with.

 

If this is really the case  then I know it sucks that there probably won't be a fix and we will just have to wait for better aa and better tech to come out.

 

One last thing I want to mention, if this really is an issue the reason why linus or any tech channel for that matter doesn't cover this is because we have not proved that this is an issue. There is literally no footage without this issue that I can come across so it really is hard to prove that this is an issue.

 

Now I apologize for the long read and I understand that some of the things I said is possibly flawed and I could be completely wrong. but I am just putting what I think this issue is out there, I still stand by my point that this is possibly temporal aliasing but that is normal and I think everyone has it and the only thing we can do to mask it is with taa or playing at 4k.

 

Here is the discord server where I got alot of this info and research from if anyone is interested

https://discord.gg/SzBFwCF5CK

 

 

No its not just edge shimmering its also low LOD and pop in which i get.(albiet this might just be due to a crappy gpu). This doesnt explain that.

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2 minutes ago, Colonizor48 said:

No its not just edge shimmering its also low LOD and pop in which i get.(albiet this might just be due to a crappy gpu). This doesnt explain that.

May I ask what do you mean by this are you talking about in the videos.

 

(Btw I only quoted your post to talk about the whole it being in videos thing, everything below the line is something else and what my own opinion on this issue is)

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1 minute ago, Delays said:

May I ask what do you mean by this are you talking about in the videos.

 

(Btw I only quoted your post to talk about the whole it being in videos thing, everything below the line is something else and what my own opinion on this issue is)

Low draw distance and low quality textures and blocky shadows even on highest settings. This isnt just an issue with AA in general because some games work fine(portal 2)

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6 minutes ago, Colonizor48 said:

Low draw distance and low quality textures and blocky shadows even on highest settings. This isnt just an issue with AA in general because some games work fine(portal 2)

Yes what I said is not saying this whole issue has to do with aa but I just think specifically the jaggies are. Dont take this or anything I say as 100% factual though

I don't know why aa works better in some games than others but as I said this whole thing is confusing.

 

Overall though i think this issue might be normal and what I am talking about in my long ass thread is about all the issues not just specifically jaggies. I have these issues all of these issues too

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1 minute ago, Delays said:

Yes what I said is not saying this whole issue has to do with aa but I just think specifically the jaggies are. Dont take this or anything I say as 100% factual though

I don't know why aa works better in some games than others but as I said this whole thing is confusing.

 

Overall though i think this issue might be normal and what I am talking about in my long ass thread is about all the issues not just specifically jaggies. I have these issues all of these issues too

Yeah in my opinion its no coinsidence that all these issues manifest at the same time. I think somthing is 100% wrong with aa because there are records of the jaggies going away for some people but the methods they used usually dont work for others.

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I dont want to be part of the "It has always looked like that" group but im also starting to think that way. I looked up random footage of different games that i compared to the games running on my pc and they were pretty much identical. But i just feel like i could tell instantly when it changed and everything started to look terrible. like a switch got flicked and i could suddenly see how ugly the game looked. 

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5 minutes ago, Colonizor48 said:

Yeah in my opinion its no coinsidence that all these issues manifest at the same time. I think somthing is 100% wrong with aa because there are records of the jaggies going away for some people but the methods they used usually dont work for others.

I do find it interesting that it always seems to be the same band of issues for everyone but I think some of these are just found while looking out for jaggies and also if you go back the 3rd point in my long post, whenever someone hears something related to this on the internet related to this and they start looking out for it once they have seen it they cannot unsee it, if you get what I mean

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8 minutes ago, haemse said:

I dont want to be part of the "It has always looked like that" group but im also starting to think that way. I looked up random footage of different games that i compared to the games running on my pc and they were pretty much identical. But i just feel like i could tell instantly when it changed and everything started to look terrible. like a switch got flicked and i could suddenly see how ugly the game looked. 

 

Yeah same, I really didnt want to be a part of that group either since this annoys me as much as it probably annoys most people in this thread but after spending excessive time just researching this I honestly dont know what it could be anymore.

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Can someone pls tweet some major tech ytbers about the issue to raise awareness? Send them this thread and the one from before.

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1 hour ago, Colonizor48 said:

Can someone pls tweet some major tech ytbers about the issue to raise awareness? Send them this thread and the one from before.

I'm fairly sure this has been done, but we always get ignored or get a poorly thought out answer saying it's a gpu/hardware problem or something else that has been disproved. They dont spend time doing research on the issue because noone has ever proved this is one, if we are going to want help from a big tech ytber as I mentioned in my previous post if you watch games that have been filmed in 1080p resolution and without taa/filmic smaa you will most likely spot the issue easily like there is no video out there which doesn't have this issue that I have come across unless the person is using 4k or taa/filmic smaa.

 

I think the next step for people who thinks this is a issue perhaps record some gameplay, make comparisons with other videos. 

 

The reason why this issue has been ignored for so many years is because there is no evidence supporting that this is an actual issue, so perhaps if we gather some evidence we might get noticed that is if this is a real issue the only thing is how.?

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