Why would I want higher impedance DT770 Pro's?

[AstroBenny]

I'm considering switching to the DT770 Pro's from my M50Xs due to finding them quite uncomfortable during prolonged periods of use. One thing I'm not sure on though is, even after reading this:

http://support.beyerdynamic.com/hc/en-us/articles/202503041-Which-DT-770-for-which-source-

 

is why would you want higher impedance if they are "harder" to drive? Surely you would just get the 32 Ohm version because anything can drive it ? 

I don't have a dedicated DAC/AMP at the moment as I'm just using my onboard audio but may invest in the future.

Thank you.

[ShadowCaptain]

17 minutes ago, AstroBenny said:

SNIP

I assume that if you are plugging it into high end equiptment you would want the higher impedance option since you are likely connecting it to an AMP/DAC anyway and it would be way too hot 
(that is my assumption)

 

if you want a version to use on all devices like mobiles etc then the lowest option is a better idea

[Curufinwe_wins]

In theory a higher impedance allows for a more detailed sound signature.

[Dackzy]

1. There really is no reason

2. The DT line up is really the only line up where Ohm matters, normally Ohm means close to nothing

[SSL]

27 minutes ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

In theory a higher impedance allows for a more detailed sound signature.

 

That doesn't make any sense.

[Curufinwe_wins]

13 minutes ago, SSL said:

 

That doesn't make any sense.

For someone who is such a hifi "guru", I'm amused you don't know this.

 

Lower mass /thinner wire coils, which naturally produce less distortion and finer response (all other things equal), have higher impedance (impedance is inversely proportional to cross-sectional area). Additionally, the higher voltage signals they are designed to run with, as a natural side effect, allow for higher fidelity (if specifically taken advantage of). 

 

"In theory" is extremely important because so many more factors make so much more of a difference (arguably most importantly the audio source and the source file) than impedance does ESP when comparing otherwise very different headphones (since there are many ways outside of coil wire size reductions, which are generally good, that can artificially increase impedance).

 

Not that it isn't mainly marketing, but even the comments BeyerDynamic makes on the OP quote allude to this fact.

 

Quote

the 32 ohms DT 770 Pro works great with computer soundcards, audio interfaces, portable recorders and players (mobile phone, tablet, handheld recording device, etc., units, powered by (rechargeable) batteries or external supplies), also with instruments like digital piano, synthesizer or instrument amplifiers (e. g. for guitar).

 

DT 770 Pro with 250 ohms is suitable for stationary sources like mains powered studio monitor controllers, hifi-amplifiers, headphone amplifiers, etc.. Both versions, 32 and 250 ohms are based on very low mass, so called: underhang voice coils, which can reproduce enormous details with low distortion. For the lower impedance, we use slightly thicker - and heavier - wire for the coil, therefore, it plays louder with lower supply voltages (from mentioned units) as the 250 ohms version.

 

80 ohms DT 770 Pro is optimized for very high listening levels in a recording studio, for example musicians, playing an instrument, etc.. You normally can find very high power headphone amplifiers here and achievable level is more important than the last bit of sound quality. This transducer uses an overhang voicecoil, which is longer than the air gap. Its larger surface increases the electrical power handling (better cooling) but its higher mass results in a different distortion behaviour.

 

[AstroBenny]

33 minutes ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

For someone who is such a hifi "guru", I'm amused you don't know this.

 

Lower mass /thinner wire coils, which naturally produce less distortion and finer response (all other things equal), have higher impedance (impedance is inversely proportional to cross-sectional area). Additionally, the higher voltage signals they are designed to run with, as a natural side effect, allow for higher fidelity (if specifically taken advantage of). 

 

"In theory" is extremely important because so many more factors make so much more of a difference (arguably most importantly the audio source and the source file) than impedance does ESP when comparing otherwise very different headphones (since there are many ways outside of coil wire size reductions, which are generally good, that can artificially increase impedance).

 

Not that it isn't mainly marketing, but even the comments BeyerDynamic makes on the OP quote allude to this fact.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Dackzy said:

1. There really is no reason

2. The DT line up is really the only line up where Ohm matters, normally Ohm means close to nothing

 

Arguments aside, which should I get?:P

Will a phone/mobo be capable of driving the 80 Ohm set by themselves?

[Dackzy]

28 minutes ago, AstroBenny said:

 

 

Arguments aside, which should I get?:P

Will a phone/mobo be capable of driving the 80 Ohm set by themselves?

most likely yes

[johnt]

5 hours ago, AstroBenny said:

-snip-

This is super simple to answer when it comes to the 770 line. The 250-ohm version come with the comfiest pads under $200. The 32 and 80 versions come with pseudo leather that is noticeably not as comfortable (I also tried the 80-ohm model and returned it). The comfy velvet pads can be purchased for the lower impedance models, but you just added $35 to your cost. Not to mention, Amazon generally sells the 250-ohm version for close to or less than the lower impedance models. Makes zero sense other than supply and demand I guess.

 

Also, I purchased a Micca OriGen DAC/Amp combo some time after I purchase my 770s. I use my headphones at work with crappy HP branded computers and while I had no issues with volume specifically, the headphones seemed lackluster. Distortion and sibilance were pronounced even with all Windows and HP sound "enhancements" turned off. The dedicated DAC/Amp made a significant improvement in my case. The bass response was greatly improved, and having a physical volume knob is a huge convenience.

 

If you want comfort over prolonged periods, the lower weight and open back of the Sennheiser 558 is undeniable. The pads on the DT770-250 are still superior (as is the headband), but open back headphones are a great alternative for prolonged use, as long as they work for your room conditions.

[AstroBenny]

1 hour ago, JohnT said:

This is super simple to answer when it comes to the 770 line. The 250-ohm version come with the comfiest pads under $200. The 32 and 80 versions come with pseudo leather that is noticeably not as comfortable (I also tried the 80-ohm model and returned it). The comfy velvet pads can be purchased for the lower impedance models, but you just added $35 to your cost. Not to mention, Amazon generally sells the 250-ohm version for close to or less than the lower impedance models. Makes zero sense other than supply and demand I guess.

 

Also, I purchased a Micca OriGen DAC/Amp combo some time after I purchase my 770s. I use my headphones at work with crappy HP branded computers and while I had no issues with volume specifically, the headphones seemed lackluster. Distortion and sibilance were pronounced even with all Windows and HP sound "enhancements" turned off. The dedicated DAC/Amp made a significant improvement in my case. The bass response was greatly improved, and having a physical volume knob is a huge convenience.

 

If you want comfort over prolonged periods, the lower weight and open back of the Sennheiser 558 is undeniable. The pads on the DT770-250 are still superior (as is the headband), but open back headphones are a great alternative for prolonged use, as long as they work for your room conditions.

Any other suggestions for closed-back?

[SSL]

6 hours ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

For someone who is such a hifi "guru", I'm amused you don't know this.

 

In theory, higher impedance == lighter voice coil. Sure.

 

Drawing the conclusion that this allows a more "detailed frequency response" (what the H does that mean?) is just buying into trashy, in vogue, marketing blarney.

 

[Curufinwe_wins]

48 minutes ago, SSL said:

 

In theory, higher impedance == lighter voice coil. Sure.

 

Drawing the conclusion that this allows a more "detailed frequency response" (what the H does that mean?) is just buying into trashy, in vogue, marketing blarney.

 

Hard to call something in vogue when it's been that way for 50 years....

 

Anyways, it is just a fact that all other things equal, a lighter voice coil can be more responsive in small/sensitive movements. Again, I'm not saying it means ANYTHING in practice, because so many other factors dominate (and again there are ways to cheat high impedance), just that in theory higher impedance headphones can be made more sensitive (and less distorted).

 

Even the theory wouldn't be relevant except that the coil wire impedance is really the only physical difference I am aware of in the DT770 pro lineup (someone mentioned the padding I guess.)

[SSL]

8 hours ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

Hard to call something in vogue when it's been that way for 50 years....

 

Anyways, it is just a fact that all other things equal, a lighter voice coil can be more responsive in small/sensitive movements. Again, I'm not saying it means ANYTHING in practice, because so many other factors dominate (and again there are ways to cheat high impedance), just that in theory higher impedance headphones can be made more sensitive (and less distorted).

 

Even the theory wouldn't be relevant except that the coil wire impedance is really the only physical difference I am aware of in the DT770 pro lineup (someone mentioned the padding I guess.)

 

Nah, you explicitly said "lighter voice coil equals more detailed". That's bilge of the highest order. The recent wank-fest over high magnetic flux and ultra-responsive, nano thickness diaphragms is just hot air.

[johnt]

15 hours ago, AstroBenny said:

Any other suggestions for closed-back?

Unfortunately not from me. The DT770-250 (or with the velvet pads) is the king of comfort and quality for under $200. I've seen it go on sale between $130 to $160 pretty often which makes it even harder to argue against.

 

Is it the cost that's bugging you the most or the style?

[AstroBenny]

38 minutes ago, JohnT said:

Unfortunately not from me. The DT770-250 (or with the velvet pads) is the king of comfort and quality for under $200. I've seen it go on sale between $130 to $160 pretty often which makes it even harder to argue against.

 

Is it the cost that's bugging you the most or the style?

Just not sure whether to go with 80 Ohm or 250 Ohm. Are you sure the 80 Ohm doesn't have the same pads? (velour)

[johnt]

7 hours ago, AstroBenny said:

Just not sure whether to go with 80 Ohm or 250 Ohm. Are you sure the 80 Ohm doesn't have the same pads? (velour)

Good question. I just checked Amazon and it shows that the "DT770 Pro 80ohm" does have the velour pads, while the "DT770 80ohm" (non-pro branded) does not. So I guess if you went with the Pro version it would come with the comfy pads. But funny thing is the Pro-80ohm is $175 and the Pro-250ohm is $150.

[SSL]

9 hours ago, AstroBenny said:

Just not sure whether to go with 80 Ohm or 250 Ohm. Are you sure the 80 Ohm doesn't have the same pads? (velour)

 

80 ohm has more bass.