FBI struggles to unlock killer's phone

[AlTech]

So, the FBI have spent 2 months trying to unlock the phone of a killer and they still haven't managed to unlock it.

 

 

 

Quote

Speaking before the Senate Intelligence Committee, Comey mentioned the case as a prime example of device encryption hindering an investigation. "In San Bernardino, a very important investigation for us, we still have one of those killer’s phones that we have not been able to open," Comey told the Committee. "It’s been over two months now. We’re still working on it." Comey's testimony was public and

can be viewed here

, beginning at roughly 1:04:00.

 

Notably, Comey did not specify the manufacturer of the phone in question, although he has been vocally critical of Apple's device encryption system in the past. Comey also acknowledged that, while the San Bernardino case is urgent for many reasons, the vast majority of encryption cases involve more banal crimes. "It affects our national security work," Comey said, "but overwhelmingly this is a problem that local law enforcement sees."

 

God. I hate politicans and cops! They think they're f*cking gods. But they're not.

Source

[Nicko_barbeque]

i hate apple lol. 

[AlTech]

Just now, Nicko_barbeque said:

i hate apple lol. 

Their products are awesome. They can be awesome but sometime they make stupid decisions.

[Beskamir]

Good, that's the way encryption should be. Not saying that I support the killer or anything just that we shouldn't compromise our security/privacy in the event that we happen to require access to someone's files. Even if it means that person would be free to cause trouble.

[Xenift]

Shouldn't they be able to go to apple, request their encryption sequence, then unlock the phone? (If it's Apple of course.)

Also it might even be a blackberry, hell we know that those have crazy encryptions as well.

[Bensemus]

7 minutes ago, AluminiumTech said:

You hear that Apple fanboys?!! That's right, get f*cking rekt.

There's literally nothing in your quote or the source about Apple refusing or even being involved in this case...

[AlTech]

Just now, Bensemus said:

There's literally nothing in your quote or the source about Apple refusing or even being involved in this case...

Notably, Comey did not specify the manufacturer of the phone in question, although he has been vocally critical of Apple's device encryption system in the past. 

[Bensemus]

Just now, AluminiumTech said:

Notably, Comey did not specify the manufacturer of the phone in question, although he has been vocally critical of Apple's device encryption system in the past. 

Vocal about a company does not mean the phone they are unable to gain access to is made by said company. At all. Even going to the video there is no mention of any company.

[Tataffe]

I think that this is precisely how it should be. Just because someone is a suspect, you can't use every method you like just to get your investigation forward. Just like how you mustn't use torture against the suspect, although that is a different level.

[ionbasa]

3 minutes ago, Tataffe said:

I think that this is precisely how it should be. Just because someone is a suspect, you can't use every method you like just to get your investigation forward. Just like how you mustn't use torture against the suspect, although that is a different level.

Both suspects are dead. So that's irrelevant.

 

PS: I live about 10 miles from the shooting location. Drove past it on Interstate 10 on the way home a few minutes before it all went down, got home, turned on the TV, and realized how lucky I was to be home safely.

[Guest]

I don't see an issue here - as people have said, the device is encrypted for a reason. If law enforcement can break that encryption then pretty much anyone can and then there'd be no point.

[ionbasa]

On 2/10/2016 at 10:19 PM, Windspeed36 said:

I don't see an issue here - as people have said, the device is encrypted for a reason. If law enforcement can break that encryption then pretty much anyone can and then there'd be no point.

There is an obvious underlying issue though. Legally, they can have access to your paper and documents with probable cause and an warrant (the 4th goes in both directions, it protects from unreasonable search and seizure without an warrant, but also allows for search and seizure if an warrant is served).

 

In this case an warrant was served, so its withing the Governments legal rights to check the terrorists phones. Them using encryption on the phone was more than likely planned out to hinder the investigation. Considering they  were originally planning to have an bigger attack on Riverside Community College and shooting up CA RTE-91.

 

The only purpose this serves is to prevent justice, the terrorists new that, anticipated it, and likely encrypted their data to hide their communications with other radicals.

[techguru]

1 hour ago, Xenift said:

Shouldn't they be able to go to apple, request their encryption sequence, then unlock the phone? (If it's Apple of course.)

Also it might even be a blackberry, hell we know that those have crazy encryptions as well.

you don't understand encryption

[RedRound2]

6 hours ago, Xenift said:

Shouldn't they be able to go to apple, request their encryption sequence, then unlock the phone? (If it's Apple of course.)

Also it might even be a blackberry, hell we know that those have crazy encryptions as well.

Nope not blackberry

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/12/blackberry-ceo-says-apple-has-gone-to-dark-place-with-pro-privacy-stance/

http://9to5mac.com/2015/12/17/blackberry-criticizes-apple-on-privacy/

[No Nrg]

11 hours ago, AluminiumTech said:

So, the FBI have spent 2 months trying to unlock the phone of a killer and they still haven't managed to unlock it.

 

 

 

 

God. I hate politicans and cops! They think they're f*cking gods. But they're not.

Source

 

 

They have every right to open this phone, the person killed 12 people in a mass shooting while claiming faith to ISIS.

 

Has nothing to do with entitlement of police or state.

[Stadin6]

11 hours ago, Xenift said:

Shouldn't they be able to go to apple, request their encryption sequence, then unlock the phone? (If it's Apple of course.)

Also it might even be a blackberry, hell we know that those have crazy encryptions as well.

i don`t think Apple stores their encryption keys

[dalekphalm]

12 hours ago, Xenift said:

Shouldn't they be able to go to apple, request their encryption sequence, then unlock the phone? (If it's Apple of course.)

Also it might even be a blackberry, hell we know that those have crazy encryptions as well.

 

45 minutes ago, Stadin6 said:

i don`t think Apple stores their encryption keys

Indeed, Apple has said on many occasions that devices using iOS 8, I believe, or newer, were designed so that the Encryption Keys were stored on the device only.

 

In other words, Apple doesn't have backup encryption keys. If you forget your password, Apple cannot help you unlock your device. Just like if a court orders a warrant to search your phone, Apple cannot help them either. At best, they can reset the device and wipe existing encryption - which would have the side effect of wiping all data too.

 

At least, that's if Apple is to be believed. Some question that Apple might still have hidden back doors that it's unwilling to give up. Whether that's true? Who knows. Though until we receive some actual proof, that remains a tinfoil hat conspiracy theory.

[CommandMan7]

1 hour ago, No Nrg said:

They have every right to open this phone, the person killed 12 people in a mass shooting while claiming faith to ISIS.

 

Has nothing to do with entitlement of police or state.

I hate it has to be this way, but there is a cost to freedom. If there was a way to unlock that phone, specifically, then of course I'd be for it. But when governments gain the capability to break any encryption, maintaining the integrity of encryption of millions comes first. If this phone remains locked, the implication is that there is just a bit less evidence for this one specific case, in which this guy will almost certainly get convicted anyways. But if the encryption can be broken by the government, then all encryption is broken, forever. Let's say that the ability to crack encryption is given to all law enforcement - what is stopping them from obtaining your location data to see if you were speeding? 

 

My point is the 4th always made sense in the past, because the only data the government could access was static records and such. Just paper. Nowadays, there is such a wealth of data, data has started to become part of who a person is. Data nowadays is now an actual part of a person's identity. As such, it needs stronger protection.

[Lethal Seraph]

While I don't support warrant-less wiretapping and similar practices, their should be (considering a court order issued first) a backdoor to someones phone.

[Memories4K]

On 2/10/2016 at 10:46 AM, No Nrg said:

They have every right to open this phone, the person killed 12 people in a mass shooting while claiming faith to ISIS.

 

Has nothing to do with entitlement of police or state.

I find this whole story to be bullshit.

Besides cost of resources, there's no reason they can't decrypt it themselves if this phone actually mattered that much.

This is a ploy to scare the public into going against encryption.

 

They do have the right, the phone is in their custody, but encryption should be respected regardless of what purpose it is used for. (What's behind the encryption)

That is the only way to ensure transparency and liberty.

You don't have to empathize with the killer to see why that is important to the way our country runs.

 

On 2/10/2016 at 0:02 PM, Lethal Seraph said:

While I don't support warrant-less wiretapping and similar practices, their should be (considering a court order issued first) a backdoor to someones phone.

The very existence of a backdoor opens up the possibility for abuse by a number of agencies that have already proven they cannot be trusted to follow the law.

[dalekphalm]

Just now, Memories4K said:

I find this whole story to be bullshit.

Besides cost of resources, there's no reason they can't decrypt it themselves if this phone actually mattered that much.

This is a ploy to scare the public into going against encryption.

 

They do have the right, the phone is in their custody, but encryption should be respected regardless of what purpose it is used for. (What's behind the encryption)

That is the only way to ensure transparency and liberty.

You don't have to empathize with the killer to see why that is important to the way our country runs.

Just decrypt the device? You realize that's kind of a ridiculous statement, right? If the device was easy to decrypt, no one would use said encryption. The NSA super-data centre might be able to brute force decrypt it, given all compute resources were put at that singular disposal, but that's not ever going to happen.

 

Even if the NSA could decrypt things as needed, local police, and even FBI, aren't getting NSA mainframe compute access for murder trials, when the NSA is busy decrypting ISIS communications and other threats it considers vastly more important.

[Lethal Seraph]

Just now, Memories4K said:

The very existence of a backdoor opens up the possibility for abuse by a number of agencies that have already proven they cannot be trusted to follow the law.

True and very intimidating threat indeed. What I was thinking was a far more extensive checklist of what a backdoor might even be considered to use on. 

[warzkaz]

They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety

[Memories4K]

1 minute ago, dalekphalm said:

Just decrypt the device? You realize that's kind of a ridiculous statement, right? If the device was easy to decrypt, no one would use said encryption. The NSA super-data centre might be able to brute force decrypt it, given all compute resources were put at that singular disposal, but that's not ever going to happen.

 

Even if the NSA could decrypt things as needed, local police, and even FBI, aren't getting NSA mainframe compute access for murder trials, when the NSA is busy decrypting ISIS communications and other threats it considers vastly more important.

Exactly why i said besides the cost of resources and why this phone isn't as important to them as they're leading on.

[dalekphalm]

1 minute ago, Memories4K said:

Exactly why i said besides the cost of resources and why this phone isn't as important to them as they're leading on.

Yeah, but your whole point in that post relies on "Well they can just decrypt it themselves". That's a half-truth at best, and you know it.

 

The phone isn't important enough for the US Government to spend literally tens of millions of dollars and resources decrypting it. That's correct. Pretty much nothing is important enough for that, unless we're talking actual direct threats against the country.

 

And that's even assuming the NSA COULD crack the encryption. The encryption used on the latest iOS is supposed to be extremely difficult to crack, even by modern standards.