AMD FreeSync vs Nvidia G-Sync, Ultimate Verdict.

[Sauron]

FPS spikes. Remember that fps counter in games only check the fps every now and then. And programs like FRAPS averages the fps based on a set of sample. Pooling the live fps is too system resource intensive, causing performance degradation, already fps counter degrade performance as it is.

 

Even with g-sync on a lag spike that large would still be VERY noticeable...

[GoodBytes]

Why can't we just have it built in to every monitor and is seen as a needed part by all manufactures. No proprietary expensive junk.

Because both technology costs money and isn't free. Most consumers aren't gamers, and most consumers uses Intel integrated graphics. Already, manufactures refuses to use anything else than Intel integrated graphics as it is free graphics solution, and the consumer doesn't complain or mind or know how shitty it is, including drivers bugginess (they'll blame it on Windows, in any case). Now you know why Nvidia and MAD have given up in making low cost, low powered, graphics solution, even on laptops.

[GoodBytes]

Even with g-sync on a lag spike that large would still be VERY noticeable...

In a fraction of second? I don't think so. Already AMD crossfire micro shutter problem is only visible to some people.

Of course, it is easier to say, then seeing what reality is. The question is, do we care about when the graphics card gets old and AAA games more demanding after several years, or not? Are you type of person willing to spend a new GPU every 2 or so generation or can only afford a graphics card every 4-5 years?

[ivan134]

They are both proprietary.

Explain.

[Lewellyn]

Because both technology costs money and isn't free. Most consumers aren't gamers, and most consumers uses Intel integrated graphics. Already, manufactures refuses to use anything else than Intel integrated graphics as it is free graphics solution, and the consumer doesn't complain or mind or know how shitty it is, including drivers bugginess (they'll blame it on Windows, in any case). Now you know why Nvidia and MAD have given up in making low cost, low powered, graphics solution, even on laptops.

 

It shouldn't be free, but a divide between two different consumer pools will grow if it continues like this. If it's so much of a pain to spend more money to adopt a new graphics card then it decreases the chance that they will move at all. It stagnates the competitive fluctuations. Only enthusiasts with money to burn will benefit from this, currently. Hopefully it changes.

[GoodBytes]

It shouldn't be free, but a divide between two different consumer pools will grow if it continues like this. If it's so much of a pain to spend more money to adopt a new graphics card then it decreases the chance that they will move at all. It stagnates the competitive fluctuations. Only enthusiasts with money to burn will benefit from this, currently. Hopefully it changes.

My point is that both technology won't be on all monitors. Also, I don't want to pay more for the monitor that my parents will use. They don't game.

 

The only possibility to make what you suggest a reality, is that DisplayPort makes it part of the requirement for its specs.

[GoodBytes]

Explain.

Freesync is AMD technology that uses Dynamic Refresh Rate (DRR) feature of DisplayPort which VESA has adopted as part of an optional specs of standard DisplayPort.

DRR is a power saving feature for mobile device embedded displays. The desktop monitor needs hardware to support it, and the graphics card needs to use it in such a way that act like G-Sync.

Granted that hardware is much cheaper than G-Sync (which most likely Nvidia can drastically cut in price as I am sure their R&D is long paid off), and not from AMD per se.

 

FreeSync is not open source and fully detailed documented on its implementation, which it would probably mean that AMD needs to reveal a nice part of its drivers.

From what I can see, AMD is keeping all that closed doors, therefor Nvidia and Intel can't implement it identically. They need to re-invent the wheel basically, and see if it doesn't cross through AMD patents on it, if any. Patent or not, regardless, it is proprietary.

[boboman342]

@GoodBytes I don't understand why you think freesync isn't actually free? Sure you need a bunch of prerequisites, but it's not really an extra cost to you. 

Guru3d: Anything with a DisplayPort 1.2a or eDP (embedded Displayport) AMD Radeon wise inevitably will be supported pretty much meaning AMD Radeon graphics cards in the AMD Radeon HD 7000, HD 8000, R7 or R9 Series will inevitably support FreeSync for video playback and power-saving purposes. The AMD Radeon R9 295X2, 290X, R9 290, R7 260X and R7 260 GPUs additionally feature updated display controllers that will support dynamic refresh rates during gaming. AMD APUs codenamed "Kaveri," "Kabini," "Temash," "Beema" and "Mullins" also feature the necessary hardware capabilities to enable dynamic refresh rates for video playback, gaming and power-saving purposes. All products must be connected to a display that supports DisplayPort Adaptive-Sync. The software architecture of select games may not be compatible with dynamic refresh rate technology like FreeSync. In these instances, users will be able to toggle the activation of FreeSync in the AMD Catalyst driver.

[ivan134]

My point is that both technology won't be on all monitors. Also, I don't want to pay more for the monitor that my parents will use. They don't game.

 

The only possibility to make what you suggest a reality, is that DisplayPort makes it part of the requirement for its specs.

Why would your parents need bleeding edge monitors? New tech is more expensive when it comes out. I'm also willing to be your parents don't have flip phones even though your most basic smartphone does more than they need.

[GoodBytes]

@GoodBytes I don't understand why you think freesync isn't actually free? Sure you need a bunch of prerequisites, but it's not really an extra cost to you. 

Guru3d: Anything with a DisplayPort 1.2a or eDP (embedded Displayport) AMD Radeon wise inevitably will be supported pretty much meaning AMD Radeon graphics cards in the AMD Radeon HD 7000, HD 8000, R7 or R9 Series will inevitably support FreeSync for video playback and power-saving purposes. The AMD Radeon R9 295X2, 290X, R9 290, R7 260X and R7 260 GPUs additionally feature updated display controllers that will support dynamic refresh rates during gaming. AMD APUs codenamed "Kaveri," "Kabini," "Temash," "Beema" and "Mullins" also feature the necessary hardware capabilities to enable dynamic refresh rates for video playback, gaming and power-saving purposes. All products must be connected to a display that supports DisplayPort Adaptive-Sync. The software architecture of select games may not be compatible with dynamic refresh rate technology like FreeSync. In these instances, users will be able to toggle the activation of FreeSync in the AMD Catalyst driver.

Sure. Yes, while it isn't a dedicated hardware like Nvidia, the manufacture needs to implement the optional requirement if DisplayPort standard to support it. That costs money in terms of R&D from the monitor manufacture, support, and well the hardware needed. This adds cost to the monitor.  The price of the monitor would not remain the same with or without FreeSync support.

[GoodBytes]

Why would your parents need bleeding edge monitors? New tech is more expensive when it comes out. I'm also willing to be your parents don't have flip phones even though your most basic smartphone does more than they need.

They won't, that is my point. Like I said, few people care about G-Sync/FreeSync in comparison to the rest of the market (let alone gamers interested in it). My point was countering the one that said that this technology should be on all monitors.

 

Actually my parents don't have any cellular phone of any kind, just last month my mother got the Moto G as her busy schedule from work prevents her from being able to get calls for new job opportunities that she seeks. She is using calling cards wit the phone and only uses it for phone calls. They had no cheaper phone. She will probably cancel it once she does finds a job. I also don't even have cellular phone. But I am planning on buying one, just waiting for the new phones.

[Opcode]

You'll get tearing/stutter below the min refresh rate with AS and Nvidia's fix is multiplying the frame rates. VRR works at 1 FPS on Gsync even. Atm that's not possible on AS because the monitor needs a local frame buffer. But you get slight flickering, so the choice is flickering vs stutter.

Perfectly possible with FreeSync all it needs is implementation in the driver model and a display capable of that dynamic range.

 

Tho it's quite pointless to be playing games at 15 FPS. Especially when you've shelled out $400+ just for the display.

[boboman342]

Sure. Yes, while it isn't a dedicated hardware like Nvidia, the manufacture needs to implement the optional requirement if DisplayPort standard to support it. That costs money in terms of R&D from the monitor manufacture, support, and well the hardware needed. This adds cost to the monitor.  The price of the monitor would not remain the same with or without FreeSync support.

I just want a 4k ips monitor with adaptive refresh from 24-75hz for $400

[Opcode]

I just want a 4k ips monitor with adaptive refresh from 24-75hz for $400

Why 4k it seems like 1440p is the bread and butter for gaming right now. The power needed to drive 4k is still ludacris.

 

Samsung is coming with their 4k UE models but they cap at 60 Hz.

[boboman342]

Why 4k it seems like 1440p is the bread and butter for gaming right now. The power needed to drive 4k is still ludacris.

 

Samsung is coming with their 4k UE models but they cap at 60 Hz.

My 970 can drive 4k at ultra settings in games at 30fps or above, and adaptive refresh would help make the lower fps feel more like 60. So if it feels almost the same I might as well get more ppi for an increased level of detail. 

[KungPaoChino]

9-240 refresh rate....

Nine? Wow....

 

9 Frames per second + cinema = Best cinematic experience. Cannot get this experience from any system known to man.......

sike

[Opcode]

My 970 can drive 4k at ultra settings in games at 30fps or above, and adaptive refresh would help make the lower fps feel more like 60. So if it feels almost the same I might as well get more ppi for an increased level of detail. 

You have a source? Because benchmarks I'm looking at show the GTX 970 struggling at UHD resolutions to meet 30 FPS.

[boboman342]

You have a source? Because benchmarks I'm looking at show the GTX 970 struggling even at QHD resolutions to meet 30 FPS.

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/nvidia_geforce_gtx_970_and_980_reference_review,1.html

 

I have mine running 1444Mhz on the core and 8Ghz on the memory. I can get it to 1554Mhz but I have to turn up the fan speed and I don't want the extra noise.

[luke_2bossly]

We just need gaben to release a monitor and then green and red will just go hide in a corner

[Zah]

I don't understand why people care about the experience when it gets to 25 FPS, when every PC gamer will do everything in their power to not play at 25 FPS ever.

[BobbyG2]

Most movies are at 24fps. A minor/tv capable of syncing to the movies frame rate will help a bit.

I wonder if tvs will get a similar tech to this.

[sgloux3470]

You have a source? Because benchmarks I'm looking at show the GTX 970 struggling at UHD resolutions to meet 30 FPS.

 

 

Overclocked of course.

 

Anyway if you lower settings slightly it performs much better.  4K is certainly very viable with reduced quality settings. (And you don't even have to reduce them very much.)

[Lynx]

One clear advantage of FreeSync is Price, just look at the LG 29UM67 the FreeSync version of LG 29UM65,

 

LG 29UM67 $449 http://www.lg.com/us/monitors/lg-29UM67-P-ultrawide-led-monitor

LG 29UM65 $499 http://www.lg.com/us/monitors/lg-29UM65-P-ultrawide-monitor

it's cheaper!

 

So if you want to buy a monitor, and it's happen to have a FreeSync brother, why not get the FreeSync version?,

this is the beauty of Free in FreeSync as it's an Open Standard.

 

Performance wise, well, many reviewer give it a recommendation, and currently there's an issue regarding  the panel on pcper article, but it's not clear wheter it's freesync fault or the panel, so let's just wait for a proper monitor review from TFT Central, PC Monitor, and Blurbuster.

[Opcode]

Overclocked of course.

 

Anyway if you lower settings slightly it performs much better.  4K is certainly very viable with reduced quality settings. (And you don't even have to reduce them very much.)

The thing is double buffering doesn't necessarily providing double the frame rate as it's only duplicating frames. I personally would rather push a game at QHD resolutions at 60 FPS than at UHD resolutions around 30 FPS. The pixel density on QHD alone is so tight that the human eye can't make them out at a couple of inches from the screen (pixel pitch is usually below 0.24 mm). For what it costs for a 4k display I would go with a FHD or QHD display and just buy another GTX 970 to SLI.

[boboman342]

Sure. Yes, while it isn't a dedicated hardware like Nvidia, the manufacture needs to implement the optional requirement if DisplayPort standard to support it. That costs money in terms of R&D from the monitor manufacture, support, and well the hardware needed. This adds cost to the monitor.  The price of the monitor would not remain the same with or without FreeSync support.

 

 

One clear advantage of FreeSync is Price, just look at the LG 29UM67 the FreeSync version of LG 29UM65,

 

LG 29UM67 $449 http://www.lg.com/us/monitors/lg-29UM67-P-ultrawide-led-monitor

LG 29UM65 $499 http://www.lg.com/us/monitors/lg-29UM65-P-ultrawide-monitor

it's cheaper!

 

So if you want to buy a monitor, and it's happen to have a FreeSync brother, why not get the FreeSync version?,

this is the beauty of Free in FreeSync as it's an Open Standard.

 

Performance wise, well, many reviewer give it a recommendation, and currently there's an issue regarding  the panel on pcper article, but it's not clear wheter it's freesync fault or the panel, so let's just wait for a proper monitor review from TFT Central, PC Monitor, and Blurbuster.

@GoodBytes