Disappointed in Framework 12 pre-order (US Only)

[pim69]

I really thought these framework 12's could be a great option to get for my kids with their good build quality and cool colours, but just getting 1TB, 16gb memory and an i5 and windows, and the cost is up to $1500?? I assume it's in USD since it's a US only pre-order. That cost seems insane for what I thought was being marketed as a kid-friendly good quality laptop. Why does it cost as much as a gaming pc?? Is it just me? I'd like to support this company but the cost seems crazy, and pre-order only for USA also throws it out the window for me as I want to get them for my kids next school year.

[Kilrah]

Comes up as 1077USD here, and you can always get it without RAM/storage and get cheaper stuff if you wish.

 

So what's the config you did to get 1500?

[Skipple]

There's a reason they offer to allow you to bring-your-own components. It's significantly cheaper. 

Purchase your own SSD, RAM, Windows license. And the cost from Framework is ~$700. The components, purchasing them on your own, shouldn't cost more than $200 so you are looking at $900. 

[pim69]

$719 is the base price with nothing at all, not even a power adapter. No I don't want to play hardware roulette with figuring out which external power brick is garbage/good, and there is no point buying it without expansion cards for usbc (so that you can charge it at all, so is actually a requirement). Add HDMI/DP, USBA, and microSD (admittedly very optional). Now I'm at $845USD bare-bones, still needing to buy RAM, SSD, windows. My assumption was not that framework would be any worse in their part margins than other vendors. I would really rather never buy an i3 cpu for any computer, but that price comes to 1065 with an i5.

 

I had parted it out as if I was buying a laptop vs getting a lenovo, dell, etc, where I buy everything from their website. DIY edition, so I can choose the colours for my kids. if you add 1tb storage, 16gb ram, windows home and the i5 cpu, you get the $1500 I mentioned. maybe my kids can live with an i3, but once we're over $1,000 USD I'd rather the computer have more lifespan than an i3 could provide.

 

[jaslion]

16 minutes ago, pim69 said:

(so that you can charge it at all, so is actually a requirement

You can use it without the expansion kits. The ports are all usb c so it does work without.

 

As for the price the 12 inch is aimed at mass buying preconfiged by schools mostly. For personal they have always pushed the diy approach. If you aren't going diy then simply don't go framework. Get something else off the shelf.

[Qyygle]

Just buy any reputable usb c power delivery rated power supply. There’s no need to play roulette with this.

Match or exceed the 60W they sell and you’re fine.

[OddOod]

1 hour ago, pim69 said:

cost is up to $1500??

You have to be buying about a dozen expansion cards for that to work out
 

 

1 hour ago, pim69 said:

Why does it cost as much as a gaming pc??

Modularity and small runs.
Maintainability has a cost.
And they are a small company which means they have to work with factories that can handle low minimum orders, there is a premium for that because while the BOM cost is pretty fixed (outside a few components that they might not be hitting the lowest price order quantities) the fee to set up a line for it isn't insignificant.

[pim69]

21 minutes ago, OddOod said:

You have to be buying about a dozen expansion cards for that to work out
 

Modularity and small runs.
Maintainability has a cost.
And they are a small company which means they have to work with factories that can handle low minimum orders, there is a premium for that because while the BOM cost is pretty fixed (outside a few components that they might not be hitting the lowest price order quantities) the fee to set up a line for it isn't insignificant.

I parted with i5, power brick, 4 expansion cards, 1tb storage, 16gb memory and windows home edition. Not their largest storage or RAM, just what I felt was a reasonable hardware mix. I WANT to support this company, I'm not making up numbers.

 

I hear you on the modularity bit and small company, but it's shocking how massive a difference this makes in cost. Even if I go with the bare bones i3 and buy windows, storage, RAM myself, that's still over $800 USD for basically a case, motherboard, CPU and a decent mix of output ports. Parting out that stuff myself is certainly going to top $1,000 for a kids laptop. I just can't make it work for a nice colour. Especially because I have 3 kids.

[OddOod]

22 minutes ago, pim69 said:

Especially because I have 3 kids.

My three brothers and I feel that
 

22 minutes ago, pim69 said:

I just can't make it work for a nice colour

The colors don't seem to change price? 

 

22 minutes ago, pim69 said:

a decent mix of output ports

You really don't need any of their modules. You can just grab some cheap USBC dock
 

22 minutes ago, pim69 said:

buy windows, storage, RAM myself

Windows doesn't need to be activated, these are kids laptops, and even if you do want it activated and don't just use some github activation method (shady and understandable why you might want to avoid them), you can get aftermarket keys from a reseller for 10 bucks a pop
For storage, 500GB is quite a bit for just file storage, the issue you're really facing is that it only supports 2230 drives, not the full size 2280s. But still, storage isn't spendy. 90$ for a decent 1TB from crucial
RAM as well is cheap. I'm seeing 32GB for under 100$. 
All in, per machine, that's 700 for the kit plus 200 for the RAM/SSD/WinKey, plus 100$ for a mid range USBC dock which puts you right at 1000 bucks pre tax per kid. 

[Poinkachu]

27 minutes ago, pim69 said:

I parted with i5, power brick, 4 expansion cards, 1tb storage, 16gb memory and windows home edition. Not their largest storage or RAM, just what I felt was a reasonable hardware mix. I WANT to support this company, I'm not making up numbers.

 

I hear you on the modularity bit and small company, but it's shocking how massive a difference this makes in cost. Even if I go with the bare bones i3 and buy windows, storage, RAM myself, that's still over $800 USD for basically a case, motherboard, CPU and a decent mix of output ports. Parting out that stuff myself is certainly going to top $1,000 for a kids laptop. I just can't make it work for a nice colour. Especially because I have 3 kids.

If color is an issue... there's always custom laptop skins

But yea, it's a laptop, and kinda a niche market too if we're talking about framework laptops (modular, repairability, etc).

[pim69]

58 minutes ago, OddOod said:

My three brothers and I feel that
 

The colors don't seem to change price? 

 

You really don't need any of their modules. You can just grab some cheap USBC dock
 

Windows doesn't need to be activated, these are kids laptops, and even if you do want it activated and don't just use some github activation method (shady and understandable why you might want to avoid them), you can get aftermarket keys from a reseller for 10 bucks a pop
For storage, 500GB is quite a bit for just file storage, the issue you're really facing is that it only supports 2230 drives, not the full size 2280s. But still, storage isn't spendy. 90$ for a decent 1TB from crucial
RAM as well is cheap. I'm seeing 32GB for under 100$. 
All in, per machine, that's 700 for the kit plus 200 for the RAM/SSD/WinKey, plus 100$ for a mid range USBC dock which puts you right at 1000 bucks pre tax per kid. 

I appreciate the suggestions and I can keep them in mind while shopping around. My statements imply that I am only concerned about colour, but I watched the LTT launch video and I feel the overall quality of the product is good PLUS the colour. I was hoping to support a seemingly good company with quality products and integrity, I'm just not sure my pocket book can handle it. After conversion to CAD I'm probably looking at $1500 CAD, which for me is easily double what I'd aim for. The last Lenovo I purchased for my ex was in the $750 range, and with inflation I could probably accept a kids laptop reaching that cost, but double it is probably not realistic.

[pim69]

58 minutes ago, Poinkachu said:

If color is an issue... there's always custom laptop skins

But yea, it's a laptop, and kinda a niche market too if we're talking about framework laptops (modular, repairability, etc).

Yes you make a good point about skins, I will definitely consider that and gives me an opportunity to support another LTT sponsor. I just wish they'd make phone protectors for Oneplus phones.

[Poinkachu]

7 hours ago, pim69 said:

Yes you make a good point about skins, I will definitely consider that and gives me an opportunity to support another LTT sponsor. I just wish they'd make phone protectors for Oneplus phones.

If anything custom skins should be better for kids, since you know... kids and easily bored most often goes hand-in-hand

And if they intend to game on it as well, something with a discrete gpu probably a better buy.

[JTrevail]

Go Team Sage

 

Selecting the RAM and SSD is easy, and people will gladly give you recommendations.