When will 240W PD Capable Docks/Chargers make their way to consumers?

[Catt0s]

The USB PD 3.1 EPR Spec allows 240W Power Delivery (48V,5A). Only a few devices currently support using this. Why are companies like UGreen and Anker holding out on implementing it? Sure, it might be overkill for most consumers now, but I imagine people who want to "future-proof" the charger they carry around would buy it, and they would be able to split it across multiple ports like they already do. 

I am aware that there is not much silicon that supports the spec yet, but isn't that what these companies are supposed to provide a push for?

[Aleph256]

Nah - these companies are supposed to sell their clients what they think they need. The objective is to make money.

As you pointed out, no widespread support for this spec -> little market -> not worth the manufacturing costs.

[Doobeedoo]

I wondered the same but those few phones that support it do come with their own charger. Also mostly they're using their propriatery protocol over PD though. 

But for sure we should see it eventually, maybe with new type of si-ca battery brands may crank up the charging. Same for laptops, even more a reason.

[Catt0s]

i jinxed it https://www.theverge.com/2024/11/6/24289498/delta-electronics-240w-usb-c-pd-charger-first-adapter

 

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Delta-Electronics/ADP-240KB-BA

[Tridefender]

There's too many short circuit chances, once it wobbles when you pull it out/push it in, the 240w power is going strait to CPU and fry your entire device

[Catt0s]

1 minute ago, Tridefender said:

There's too many short circuit chances, once it wobbles when you pull it out/push it in, the 240w power is going strait to CPU and fry your entire device

did you read the spec? The connector has a specific design for a reason

[Tridefender]

Just now, Catt0s said:

did you read the spec

I did, I mean the USB type c should not allow such power/voltages. Therefore I don't hope such protocols be implemented.

 

Plus 48v is over the safe voltage of 36v

[Catt0s]

8 minutes ago, Tridefender said:

I did, I mean the USB type c should not allow such power/voltages. Therefore I don't hope such protocols be implemented.

 

Plus 48v is over the safe voltage of 36v

48V compatible USB-C must be active cables with the chip that supports them, or the PD negotiation won't work. Is that what you mean?

Its already part of the PD 3.1 EPR Spec, you know?

[Tridefender]

9 minutes ago, Catt0s said:

48V compatible USB-C must be active cables with the chip that supports them, or the PD negotiation won't work. Is that what you mean?

Its already part of the PD 3.1 EPR Spec, you know?

The problem is that you are using voltages as high as 48v, and if you check the electrical lay out of a type c interface you would immediately notice, if you didn't pull it out correctly, the 48 volts will be plugged in to your entire device: this is done after negotiation so the 48 volts is there. I doubt the protective chips can stop the current before any damage done.

[Catt0s]

15 minutes ago, Tridefender said:

The problem is that you are using voltages as high as 48v, and if you check the electrical lay out of a type c interface you would immediately notice, if you didn't pull it out correctly, the 48 volts will be plugged in to your entire device: this is done after negotiation so the 48 volts is there. I doubt the protective chips can stop the current before any damage done.

but 36V to the CPU is fine? Its just a matter of more protection circuitry being used on supported devices..

 

Additionally, the Type-C connector is not designed to let you have the connector at such an angle, and the mating sequence ensures the voltage contacts are the first/last to be connected/disconnected - and addresses arcing

[Tridefender]

2 minutes ago, Catt0s said:

but 36V to the CPU is fine?

36v is not fine to your pc, vbus is just next to your CC, if because érosion of the interface and it made contact with the cc pair,  it will destroy your PD chip, but this is the least severe.

If the vbus connects with the tx, then you get a 48v on an connection that can hold 3.6v maximum. It goes into the PCH chip/GPU and destroys them.

[Tridefender]

Now not to mention the arc when you pulls out..

This is a demo video for 48v 10a power supply, you have 5a which should be less severe, but will still oxidize your touch pads and etc.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=IsRZxiNNJes&pp=ygUKRGMgYXJjIDQ4dg%3D%3D

 

[Catt0s]

3 minutes ago, Tridefender said:

36v is not fine to your pc, vbus is just next to your CC, if because érosion of the interface and it made contact with the cc pair,  it will destroy your PD chip, but this is the least severe.

If the vbus connects with the tx, then you get a 48v on an connection that can hold 3.6v maximum. It goes into the PCH chip/GPU and destroys them.

If VBUS is in contact with CC or TX due to erosion, then it would be like that from the start, right? In this case, it cannot negotiate a high power. Remember, VBUS is the first mate in the sequence. 

 

1 minute ago, Tridefender said:

Now not to mention the arc when you pulls out..

This is a demo video for 48v 10a power supply, you have 5a which should be less severe, but will still oxidize your touch pads and etc.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=IsRZxiNNJes&pp=ygUKRGMgYXJjIDQ4dg%3D%3D

 

 

The USB-C spec addresses arcing in appendix H, including 48V operation. 

[Tridefender]

1 minute ago, Catt0s said:

If VBUS is in contact with CC or TX due to erosion, then it would be like that from the start, right? In this case, it cannot negotiate a high power. Remember, VBUS is the first mate in the sequence. 

 

 

The USB-C spec addresses arcing in appendix H, including 48V operation. 

The problem is not "from the start" the problem is that it might be okay in the start, but it wobbles during charge/when you pull it out.

[Catt0s]

16 minutes ago, Tridefender said:

The problem is not "from the start" the problem is that it might be okay in the start, but it wobbles during charge/when you pull it out.

If the cable wobbles, then the mechanical connection is damaged. Even standard voltages are dangerous in that case. The receptacle has the longer pads for VBUS, not the cable. The Plug has all contacts of the same length. So if it is pulled out at an angle, CC would disconnect before VBUS, triggering the power to shut off "as fast as possible"