Aorus B550 Pro v2 - Upgrading from a 5800x to a 5800x3D, BIOS and Secure Boot questions

[Skyyblaze]

Hi all, so I'm going to upgrade from a 5800x to a 5800x3D tomorrow, my mainboard is a GIGABYTE Aorus B550 Pro v2 and I have a couple of questions.

 

First of all, will I need a BIOS update for the 3D to work? I'm currently running on version f14e, the compatibility sheet states that it should work as low as f10 but then the changelog for version f15 says it offers support for the 5800x3D. I would rather avoid updating my BIOS unless I have to because everything runs fine and I don't want to deal with resigning my OpenCore bootloader for Secure Boot.

 

Which brings me to my second question, I do not have Bitlocker enabled but I do have Secure Boot on for anti-cheat reasons, will I run into any trouble with Secure Boot if I just swap my CPU and nothing else?

Thanks for help in advance!

[YoungBlade]

The good news is that your motherboard has BIOS flashback, so you don't need to be able to get into the BIOS to update it. If you do find that you need to update the BIOS, you can do so without needing to put back in the old 5800X. You just need a USB stick.

 

Therefore, you can just install the 5800X3D. If it doesn't boot, then BIOS flashback is what I'd try first as a troubleshooting step.

 

Since you don't have Bitlocker, you should be fine - the new CPU shouldn't lock you out of anything. These days, Windows is pretty good about a single hardware change when it comes to activation. As for anti-cheat, that's dependent on the game - I know some games will lock you out after a certain number of hardware changes as an anti-piracy measure, but just a CPU swap shouldn't trigger that, one would hope.

 

However, depending on how the motherboard is set up, you may need to reconfigure things in the BIOS after you install the new CPU, even if you don't do a BIOS update. The 5800X3D is a different chip on a fundamental level - the 3D V-Cache means that it locks out a lot of overclocking features, for example. It's very possible that, upon detecting the new CPU, the board will restore a lot of settings to their defaults anyway. Certainly any tweaking you did in the OC settings would get wiped out - if they didn't, that would be a known hack to force overclocking on the X3D chips.

 

 

[Tetras]

9 minutes ago, Skyyblaze said:

will I run into any trouble with Secure Boot if I just swap my CPU and nothing else?

I'd be more concerned about the TPM than secure boot, but you could disable both prior to the update and reenable it afterwards. Gigabyte can be a bit finicky with these though, so I'd be cautious and do some reading on the best way to tackle that first.

 

10 minutes ago, Skyyblaze said:

the compatibility sheet states that it should work as low as f10

I think that is incorrect, since it says support for Ryzen 5000, not the X3D specifically.

 

11 minutes ago, Skyyblaze said:

I'm currently running on version f14e

From a quick read around, it looks like F14e has AGESA 1.2.0.5 and the X3D is listed as AGESA 1.2.0.6b, but there are posts where somebody checked the microcodes and found the 5800X3D in much earlier BIOS.

[Skyyblaze]

24 minutes ago, YoungBlade said:

The good news is that your motherboard has BIOS flashback, so you don't need to be able to get into the BIOS to update it. If you do find that you need to update the BIOS, you can do so without needing to put back in the old 5800X. You just need a USB stick.

 

Therefore, you can just install the 5800X3D. If it doesn't boot, then BIOS flashback is what I'd try first as a troubleshooting step.

 

Since you don't have Bitlocker, you should be fine - the new CPU shouldn't lock you out of anything. These days, Windows is pretty good about a single hardware change when it comes to activation. As for anti-cheat, that's dependent on the game - I know some games will lock you out after a certain number of hardware changes as an anti-piracy measure, but just a CPU swap shouldn't trigger that, one would hope.

 

However, depending on how the motherboard is set up, you may need to reconfigure things in the BIOS after you install the new CPU, even if you don't do a BIOS update. The 5800X3D is a different chip on a fundamental level - the 3D V-Cache means that it locks out a lot of overclocking features, for example. It's very possible that, upon detecting the new CPU, the board will restore a lot of settings to their defaults anyway. Certainly any tweaking you did in the OC settings would get wiped out - if they didn't, that would be a known hack to force overclocking on the X3D chips.

 

 

 

Alright so from what I get here is that I should just install the new chip, hope for the best and troubleshoot afterwards if needed. I honestly don't have much changed in my BIOS beyond XMP, ReBar support and setting Curve Optimizer to -15.

 

17 minutes ago, Tetras said:

I'd be more concerned about the TPM than secure boot, but you could disable both prior to the update and reenable it afterwards. Gigabyte can be a bit finicky with these though, so I'd be cautious and do some reading on the best way to tackle that first.

 

I think that is incorrect, since it says support for Ryzen 5000, not the X3D specifically.

 

From a quick read around, it looks like F14e has AGESA 1.2.0.5 and the X3D is listed as AGESA 1.2.0.6b, but there are posts where somebody checked the microcodes and found the 5800X3D in much earlier BIOS.

 

Alright so I might have luck! Regarding TPM, would disabling and re-enabling TPM change the keys? I have OpenCore self-signed and the key-files flying around somewhere on an USB stick so I could re-add them if needed.

 

And I meant this part on this list: https://www.gigabyte.com/de/Motherboard/B550-AORUS-PRO-V2-rev-10/support#support-cpu

[Dedayog]

16 minutes ago, Skyyblaze said:

 

Alright so from what I get here is that I should just install the new chip, hope for the best and troubleshoot afterwards if needed. I honestly don't have much changed in my BIOS beyond XMP, ReBar support and setting Curve Optimizer to -15.

 

 

Alright so I might have luck! Regarding TPM, would disabling and re-enabling TPM change the keys? I have OpenCore self-signed and the key-files flying around somewhere on an USB stick so I could re-add them if needed.

 

And I meant this part on this list: https://www.gigabyte.com/de/Motherboard/B550-AORUS-PRO-V2-rev-10/support#support-cpu

No offens but how hard is it to just update your BIOS?

 

It would have taken less effort and time than writing this thread to ask.

[Skyyblaze]

2 minutes ago, Dedayog said:

No offens but how hard is it to just update your BIOS?

 

It would have taken less effort and time than writing this thread to ask.

Well I made bad experiences with BIOS updates and TPM/Secure Boot on my ROG Ally so I want to avoid the headache if I can.

[Dedayog]

Just now, Skyyblaze said:

Well I made bad experiences with BIOS updates and TPM/Secure Boot on my ROG Ally so I want to avoid the headache if I can.

Your call. My bios updates are smooth as silk.  On my steam deck as well.

 

Think that's a ROG Ally issue.

 

Hope it all works out for you 

[Skyyblaze]

4 minutes ago, Dedayog said:

Your call. My bios updates are smooth as silk.  On my steam deck as well.

 

Think that's a ROG Ally issue.

 

Hope it all works out for you 

That might be. From all I gathered the system should at least boot with the 3D on f14e so I can worry about the details afterwards. I wish anti-cheat systems couldn't mandate stuff like Secure Boot so gaming PCs wouldn't have to worry about that part but that's another topic.

Thanks!

[Tetras]

1 hour ago, Skyyblaze said:

And I meant this part on this list: https://www.gigabyte.com/de/Motherboard/B550-AORUS-PRO-V2-rev-10/support#support-cpu

Yeah, but the update notes for F10 says support for "Ryzen 5000", so I wonder if they incorrectly updated the compatibility list and applied F10 to multiple Ryzen 5000 CPUs, even though support for the X3D models came much later.

 

1 hour ago, Skyyblaze said:

Regarding TPM, would disabling and re-enabling TPM change the keys? I have OpenCore self-signed and the key-files flying around somewhere on an USB stick so I could re-add them if needed.

Yes, I think it does (maybe depending on the option used), but if you're using a firmware TPM I believe changing the CPU changes the keys anyway.

 

From what I've read online, the safest way to do this is:

1. Disable TPM in the Windows OS.
2. Reboot and confirm TPM is disabled.
3. Disable TPM in the BIOS and unload the keys (iirc Gigabyte have a specific order you're supposed to do this).
4. Install the new CPU.
5. Reenable TPM and initialise the new keys.
6. Enable TPM in the Windows OS.
7. Reboot and confirm TPM is enabled.

If you're not using Windows and the OS doesn't use the TPM, I don't think it would matter.

 

Also, if you're using Bitlocker and it is tied to the TPM, then I wouldn't recommend following those steps as it could cause problems with accessing your data, especially if you don't have access to a recovery key.

[Skyyblaze]

3 hours ago, Tetras said:

Yeah, but the update notes for F10 says support for "Ryzen 5000", so I wonder if they incorrectly updated the compatibility list and applied F10 to multiple Ryzen 5000 CPUs, even though support for the X3D models came much later.

 

Yes, I think it does (maybe depending on the option used), but if you're using a firmware TPM I believe changing the CPU changes the keys anyway.

 

From what I've read online, the safest way to do this is:

1. Disable TPM in the Windows OS.
2. Reboot and confirm TPM is disabled.
3. Disable TPM in the BIOS and unload the keys (iirc Gigabyte have a specific order you're supposed to do this).
4. Install the new CPU.
5. Reenable TPM and initialise the new keys.
6. Enable TPM in the Windows OS.
7. Reboot and confirm TPM is enabled.

If you're not using Windows and the OS doesn't use the TPM, I don't think it would matter.

 

Also, if you're using Bitlocker and it is tied to the TPM, then I wouldn't recommend following those steps as it could cause problems with accessing your data, especially if you don't have access to a recovery key.

Alright I'll best update then tomorrow and hope for the best. A 64gb USB stick that has two partitions and Ventoy on it should be fine for a modern UEFI and flashing the BIOS right?

[Dedayog]

3 hours ago, Tetras said:

Yeah, but the update notes for F10 says support for "Ryzen 5000", so I wonder if they incorrectly updated the compatibility list and applied F10 to multiple Ryzen 5000 CPUs, even though support for the X3D models came much later.

 

Yes, I think it does (maybe depending on the option used), but if you're using a firmware TPM I believe changing the CPU changes the keys anyway.

 

From what I've read online, the safest way to do this is:

1. Disable TPM in the Windows OS.
2. Reboot and confirm TPM is disabled.
3. Disable TPM in the BIOS and unload the keys (iirc Gigabyte have a specific order you're supposed to do this).
4. Install the new CPU.
5. Reenable TPM and initialise the new keys.
6. Enable TPM in the Windows OS.
7. Reboot and confirm TPM is enabled.

If you're not using Windows and the OS doesn't use the TPM, I don't think it would matter.

 

Also, if you're using Bitlocker and it is tied to the TPM, then I wouldn't recommend following those steps as it could cause problems with accessing your data, especially if you don't have access to a recovery key.

Very interesting, as Gigabyte just updates the BIOS without doing anything at all, even when I dropped in the 7800X3D.  

 

Curious why so different.

[Tetras]

1 hour ago, Dedayog said:

Very interesting, as Gigabyte just updates the BIOS without doing anything at all, even when I dropped in the 7800X3D.  

 

Curious why so different.

There were stories for awhile about not disabling the TPM (before a CPU change) causing issues with the OS, even when it wasn't actually used and I think Gigabyte had the most complicated reactivation procedure, but I haven't seen any posts about it for some time, so I don't know if the BIOS updates were changed, or if Microsoft fiddled with something that made the OS more resilient, since it is only recently that everybody is running with it enabled.

[Skyyblaze]

So a little update, the Flash went well and I'm on f17 now. I'll still only install the 3D tomorrow but some headaches popped up. The Device Paths of all my monitors got changed so now I have to re-setup Wallpaper Engine and my monitor management software and as I feared Secure Boot became kind of a mess.

Of course OpenCore wasn't able to boot as soon as I turned SecureBoot on so I went into the Key Managent and appended my keys as before but I still somehow get "Invalid Signature Detected - Secure Boot Violation". It's no big deal as I can just boot each OS directly but my tinker mind wants to know "why?".

 

Thanks for the help!

Also just curious, what's are normal idle temps and frequencies for a 5800x3D? I have a beQuiet! Dark Rock 4 non-Pro and would like some comparison values!

[Skyyblaze]

Little update: The 5800x3D works as advertised, boosting to 4450mhz and everything seems great! I also figured out I'll have to re-sign OpenCore with a new certificate as the old Microsoft one got revoked. Thanks for the help everyone!