w3680 bclk

[Somerandomtechyboi]

welp i finally got a w3680 only to find the stupid thing not wanting to post at 3300 and walling around 3200 bios boot on 1 stick which is pretty depressing (vtt 1.6v)

 

tried lower multis and found that even 3000 at 215 bclk only half posts, then ditched the ram oc entirely only to find the stupid thing still half posts and gets stuck at code 52 whilst being at 215bclk and pcie at 120

 

 

am i doing something wrong here or is this w3680 just straight up trash

[thrasher_565]

what mb do you have? cuse people have gotten like 4,3ish form a i7920... posably the more cores the lower the the speed you will get.

[Zando_]

1 hour ago, thrasher_565 said:

what mb do you have? cuse people have gotten like 4,3ish form a i7920... posably the more cores the lower the the speed you will get.

920s are especially bad. The 6-core Xeons usually do 4.0Ghz at the worst, decent bins do 4.2-4.5, good bins do 4.5 at low voltages or much higher clocks at safe or benchable voltages. 

3 hours ago, Somerandomtechyboi said:

tried lower multis and found that even 3000 at 215 bclk only half posts, then ditched the ram oc entirely only to find the stupid thing still half posts and gets stuck at code 52 whilst being at 215bclk and pcie at 120

Why is PCIe at 120? Isn't that just begging for instability? I always kept PCIe at 100 IIRC. Make sure you try higher and lower BCLK numbers, X58 will hit a "soft wall" (best way to describe it I think), where pushing higher will actually be stable again. You've also got vCore at only 1.35v, give it 1.45 or even 1.5v to see what it will do, then bring voltages back down (you can daily 1.42-1.45v without much issue, 1.4v if you're super cautious). 

[Somerandomtechyboi]

4 hours ago, thrasher_565 said:

what mb do you have? cuse people have gotten like 4,3ish form a i7920... posably the more cores the lower the the speed you will get.

not interested in core clocks and i can only start properly ocing core once i get my cooler properly mounted cause gravity mount destroys cooling performance, though i guess i can run it at 4-4.2ghz and see how much vcore it needs as a reference to how good this thing actually is

 

2 hours ago, Zando_ said:

Why is PCIe at 120? Isn't that just begging for instability? I always kept PCIe at 100 IIRC. Make sure you try higher and lower BCLK numbers, X58 will hit a "soft wall" (best way to describe it I think), where pushing higher will actually be stable again. You've also got vCore at only 1.35v, give it 1.45 or even 1.5v to see what it will do, then bring voltages back down (you can daily 1.42-1.45v without much issue, 1.4v if you're super cautious). 

right vcore

just a little cautious due to the cooler otherwise id constantly run it at 1.5v but ill see if 1.5v helps

 

not exactly afraid of high volt considering i run 1.94v vtt for my w3503s when pushing 3300+

 

also got an i7 930 which seems to be a decent sample but refuses to go above 1.7v vtt so thats another frustrating cpu

 

pcie 115-120 is what i usually run cause afaik you need that for higher bclk but ill try 100 and 103

 

and ive also tried using literal default settings and run 220 bclk with vcore 1.35v vtt 1.5v vioh 1.3v everything else default and no post, confirmed bclk issue cause stuck on code bf, tried enabling slowmode which got it to half post at 220 and stuck at code 50

 

i fucking swear if this thing is a trash sample im gonna be pissed but i guess i have something to pair one of my other x58a ud3r with or maybe even my ex58 ud3r just to resell

 

 

4 hours ago, thrasher_565 said:

what mb do you have? cuse people have gotten like 4,3ish form a i7920... posably the more cores the lower the the speed you will get.

x58a ud3r

bloomfields usually clock 4-4.2ghz with ~1.35v

[thrasher_565]

6 hours ago, Somerandomtechyboi said:

welp i finally got a w3680 only to find the stupid thing not wanting to post at 3300 and walling around 3200 bios boot on 1 stick which is pretty depressing (vtt 1.6v)

 

tried lower multis and found that even 3000 at 215 bclk only half posts, then ditched the ram oc entirely only to find the stupid thing still half posts and gets stuck at code 52 whilst being at 215bclk and pcie at 120

so are you talking about ram speed? not cpu speed?

ram ocing on x58 was hard to do and on there site says you can do x ocing but most times you cant reach what it says how they got thows numbers dont no or its just marketing.

[Somerandomtechyboi]

4 minutes ago, thrasher_565 said:

so are you talking about ram speed? not cpu speed?

ram ocing on x58 was hard to do and on there site says you can do x ocing but most times you cant reach what it says how they got thows numbers dont no or its just marketing.

ive already hit 3400 on a w3503 with vtt 1.94v so now im aiming for 3600+ with this w3680 if it wasnt being a pile of shit

 

probably got the original ratings from a binned cpu or something but only a few boards can do 1:1 uncore giga boards being among the few so i can run really high ram freq without hitting uncore freq limit

 

its actually pretty easy but it gets pretty annoying >3200

[thrasher_565]

32 minutes ago, Somerandomtechyboi said:

ive already hit 3400 on a w3503 with vtt 1.94v so now im aiming for 3600+ with this w3680 if it wasnt being a pile of shit

 

probably got the original ratings from a binned cpu or something but only a few boards can do 1:1 uncore giga boards being among the few so i can run really high ram freq without hitting uncore freq limit

 

its actually pretty easy but it gets pretty annoying >3200

what dose the cpu have to do with the ram speed? i thought the mb had more infuance on it? i dont no i really dont no about ocing just trying to understand.

[Somerandomtechyboi]

1 hour ago, thrasher_565 said:

what dose the cpu have to do with the ram speed? i thought the mb had more infuance on it? i dont no i really dont no about ocing just trying to understand.

mobo had influence when the memory controller was still on the northbridge like on lga 775, now its only influence is the ram topology being able to handle the ram speed instead of also acting like the imc

 

cpu now has the imc since x58/1156 on intel so how fa you can ran oc is mostly dictated by the cpu

 

i was looking forward to clocking the rams past 3600 but now the stupid thing wont even bios boot much past 3200

[Zando_]

14 hours ago, Somerandomtechyboi said:

not interested in core clocks and i can only start properly ocing core once i get my cooler properly mounted cause gravity mount destroys cooling performance, though i guess i can run it at 4-4.2ghz and see how much vcore it needs as a reference to how good this thing actually is

What are you clocking then? Uncore? I believe that needs both vCore and the other voltages (that you've already raised) turned up. Keep RAM as low and slow as possible with auto or super loose timings, until you've got the CPU stable, then you start turning up RAM. X58 is a balancing act and trying to balance too many things at once will lead to a bunch of hard-to-troubleshoot instability.

[Somerandomtechyboi]

Just now, Zando_ said:

What are you clocking then? Uncore? I believe that needs both vCore and the other voltages (that you've already raised) turned up. Keep RAM as low and slow as possible with auto or super loose timings, until you've got the CPU stable, then you start turning up RAM. X58 is a balancing act and trying to balance too many things at once will lead to a bunch of hard-to-troubleshoot instability.

all my transcend pscs seem to have shelf died so ill see if i can revive a few with some cleaning, best stick does 3000+ with all ram timings on auto probably cause the board is optimized for psc, so running at 1300 ish auto should work without issue

 

ive also got some 8gb m393b2k70dh0 sticks aka 2rx4 ecc 2gbit d die so ill give those a test aswell, id be surprised if it even hits 3000 just because pcb is probbaly gonna be the limit

 

uncore is kept at 1:1 or around that, probably <4000 cause id rather not deal with uncore limit at 3:2

 

hwbot sub i saw for a 980x on air at 3500 ddr3 only needed 1.54v vtt on gdies so im staying around the 1.5-1.6v range but i may raise it higher if neccesary

 

usually i start with rams at 3000+ for a new chip since thats pretty much my binning process and most of the bloomfields should be able to atleast bios boot 3000 though there were some really trash w3503s that didnt even do 3000

 

might also be a good idea to find some references using giga x58 boards see if just copy pasting settings will get it to run 200+ bclk

 

and the cpus pads have been cleaned by scratching with a needle cause when i first got it the thing was stuck at 00 aka dead cpu + visible rust or filth on the pads i cant clean with just my fingernails or 99% IPA and after over half an hour i did get it to run just that the third channel is dead so yea might wanna buy a razor and do a better job cleaning the pads instead of using a stupid needle, so maybe thats the real cause but ill have to buy a razor to properly clean the pads and revive the 3rd channel, even if it stays the same atleast itll have a decent amount of resale value paired with one of my other giga x58 that i wanna sell then ill just go and buy a w3670

[Somerandomtechyboi]

@thrasher_565 @Zando_

found the issue regarding 3200 wall

 

apparently 3t command rate is broken so lowered 2t and now im suddenly doing 3300 on 2 sticks so ill just do abit of an oc session see if i hit my expected clocks or not

 

first will be 2 stick shenanigans, then 1 stick max freq, then 3 stick freq

 

bclk issue might even be from setting cmd3t so ill also retest that

[Somerandomtechyboi]

 

3000 ddr3 posted to windows with uncore memclk 5:4, prime95 doesnt insta crash all threads so potentially able to run <3:2 ratio stabily, uncore at 20x mem multi at 16x

 

twin stick 3300 bios, seems like im still hitting bclk limit and also might need to bin sticks so yeah im gonna have to buy another xeon w and some more gdies

 

its getting really late so ill probably stop pretty soon

 

just need to verify <3:2 potentially being stable alongside trying to get the 18x multi working, maybe ill save this for tomorrow and ill do what i was supposed to do and help my friend with extracting files from his hdd cause his laptop broke

 

and yea seems like this board can run >2800 in the third channel just that bloomfields seem to wall at ~2800 on the 3rd channel, welp just means i wont need a replacement board, damn impressive for being a lower end x58 board

[Zando_]

2 hours ago, Somerandomtechyboi said:

apparently 3t command rate is broken so lowered 2t and now im suddenly doing 3300 on 2 sticks so ill just do abit of an oc session see if i hit my expected clocks or not

Makes sense, I didn't even know 3t was a thing. Always ran 2t. I believe 1t is better for performance, but it's very rare to get sticks that clock well with that, so it ends up being slower. 

33 minutes ago, Somerandomtechyboi said:

3000 ddr3 posted to windows

Nice! That's already damn good for DDR3 on a regular board. IIRC a friend got some up to... 3200Mhz or higher I think, but that was on an LGA1150 ASRock XOC board with dedicated VRMs for the RAM DIMMs. 

34 minutes ago, Somerandomtechyboi said:

seems like im still hitting bclk limit and also might need to bin sticks so yeah im gonna have to buy another xeon w and some more gdies

If it's a BCLK limit, how does a new CPU help that? BCLK should be the northbridge, not CPU. Speaking of which, have you tried cooling that? My EVGA Classified boards have massive heatsinks on the northbridge, the ASUS Rampage III Extreme had some pretty beefy cooling for it as well, so it seems they can get quite hot and cause instability. Waterblocks for these boards usually cover the northbridge as well, it gets rather toasty. If it doesn't have a fan already, worth pointing a 40 or 60mm one at it IMO. 

 

That's the heatsink EVGA slapped on the X58 Classified SLI 3-Way and 4-Way northbridge:

I believe this is my 3-Way which was missing the stock 40mm fan, thus the Noctua. My 4-Way had an EVGA fan. 

[Somerandomtechyboi]

1 minute ago, Zando_ said:

Makes sense, I didn't even know 3t was a thing. Always ran 2t. I believe 1t is better for performance, but it's very rare to get sticks that clock well with that, so it ends up being slower. 

afaik 1t doesnt have that big of a performance bump over 2t, probs similar to tuning other primaries, so yeah primaries to the wind for frequency as long as the secondaries and tertiaries are fine

 

2 minutes ago, Zando_ said:

Nice! That's already damn good for DDR3 on a regular board. IIRC a friend got some up to... 3200Mhz or higher I think, but that was on an LGA1150 ASRock XOC board with dedicated VRMs for the RAM DIMMs. 

3200 is on the lower end of 1150 afaik

id expect more like 3600+ with a half decent cpu since haswell does have the best imc on ddr3 and is capable of 4000+ with some good chips

 

x58 maybe but im gonna have to bin some chips for imc

 

3 minutes ago, Zando_ said:

If it's a BCLK limit, how does a new CPU help that? BCLK should be the northbridge, not CPU. Speaking of which, have you tried cooling that? My EVGA Classified boards have massive heatsinks on the northbridge, the ASUS Rampage III Extreme had some pretty beefy cooling for it as well, so it seems they can get quite hot and cause instability. Waterblocks for these boards usually cover the northbridge as well, it gets rather toasty. If it doesn't have a fan already, worth pointing a 40 or 60mm one at it IMO. 

 

That's the heatsink EVGA slapped on the X58 Classified SLI 3-Way and 4-Way northbridge:

I believe this is my 3-Way which was missing the stock 40mm fan, thus the Noctua. My 4-Way had an EVGA fan. 

forgot board binning was a thing

my asus p6x58de is complete dogshit for bclk and literally unstable above 200, needs slowmode to hit 220bclk where a normal board wouldnt

 

could just be my x58a ud3r being a trash sample so ill give it a shot with my other x58a ud3r see if that helps anything, i hope binning boards for ram oc capabilities isnt a thing or isnt a big deal on x58 cause if this other x58a ud3r has trash ram channels then im screwed either way

 

>220bclk though thats when cpus come into play cause afaik most 32nm should be able to do 250bclk with qpi slowmode but above that and its time to bin cpus