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Why does pc analytics.com say the phantom spirit 120se is a better cooler than the frost spirit 140 when, the fs140 shows better results??

koolj12
Go to solution Solved by GuiltySpark_,

Another source of information that includes both: https://youtu.be/ltNDbgDDLPs

 

 

Should be noted you're getting a good product either way.

 

180W: 

image.thumb.png.700f2b7af6a2247608b99d86c9935c36.png

 

253W:

image.thumb.png.c3b8b0ad67c049900de274e5688a535f.png

 

2 hours ago, TatamiMatt said:

Gonna double down on this, why the massive discrepancy between the FS and FC does anyone know?

It isn't massive, as @GuiltySpark_pointed out. It's just that the graph is designed to accentuate the difference. Otherwise, all those lines would blob together. 😮 

 

To answer your question would require looking at the physical differences between them,  such as # of fins, spacing, dimensions, fan specs, cold plate differences, # of hot pipes and sizes, and more. It will also vary wildly between some CPUs, of course. 

I've been using computers since around 1978, started learning programming in 1980 on Apple IIs, started learning about hardware in 1990, ran a BBS from 1990-95, built my first Windows PC around 2000, taught myself malware removal starting in 2005 (also learned on Bleeping Computer), learned web dev starting in 2017, and I think I can fill a thimble with all that knowledge. 😉 I'm not an expert, which is why I keep investigating the answers that others give to try and improve my knowledge, so feel free to double-check the advice I give.

My phone's auto-correct is named Otto Rong.🤪😂

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18 minutes ago, RevGAM said:

It isn't massive, as @GuiltySpark_pointed out. It's just that the graph is designed to accentuate the difference. Otherwise, all those lines would blob together. 😮 

 

To answer your question would require looking at the physical differences between them,  such as # of fins, spacing, dimensions, fan specs, cold plate differences, # of hot pipes and sizes, and more. It will also vary wildly between some CPUs, of course. 

I initially thought they were identical but looking at it again it seems the FS has a higher fin density than the FC, same height but 1.6mm spacing and 1.8mm spacing respectively. However FCs fan specs are better. It performed much more similarly in the AMD graphs in the following test however so nothing too much to worry about in that regards, but strange to include better fans then reduce fin density, surely the better fans would allow more air to flow through the fins, unpacking the fins then would increase it further but at what point do diminishing returns apply for both sides, amount of fins dissapating heat quicker or the allowance of more airflow, cooling faster?

System specs:

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D [-30 PBO all core]

GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT NITRO+ [1050mV, 2.8GHz core, 2.6Ghz mem]

Motherboard: MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI

RAM: G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB 32GB 6000MHz CL32 DDR5

Storage: 2TB SN850X, 1TB SN850 w/ heatsink, 500GB P5 Plus (OS Storage)

Case: 5000D AIRFLOW

Cooler: Thermalright Frost Commander 140

PSU: Corsair RM850e

 

PCPartPicker List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/QYLBh3

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5 minutes ago, TatamiMatt said:

I initially thought they were identical but looking at it again it seems the FS has a higher fin density than the FC, same height but 1.6mm spacing and 1.8mm spacing respectively. However FCs fan specs are better. It performed much more similarly in the AMD graphs in the following test however so nothing too much to worry about in that regards, but strange to include better fans then reduce fin density, surely the better fans would allow more air to flow through the fins, unpacking the fins then would increase it further but at what point do diminishing returns apply for both sides, amount of fins dissapating heat quicker or the allowance of more airflow, cooling faster?

im just gonna buy the pahntom spirit 120se and slap on Noctua NF-A12x15 and call it a day and hope for longevity.  

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4 minutes ago, koolj12 said:

im just gonna buy the pahntom spirit 120se and slap on Noctua NF-A12x15 and call it a day and hope for longevity.  

Run it initially without the noctua fans (unless you already have them) the fans on the PS120 are pretty good and if you need the extra buy the noctuas, but no point spend extra money if youre happy with the noise and performance of the cooler with stock fans

System specs:

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D [-30 PBO all core]

GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT NITRO+ [1050mV, 2.8GHz core, 2.6Ghz mem]

Motherboard: MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI

RAM: G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB 32GB 6000MHz CL32 DDR5

Storage: 2TB SN850X, 1TB SN850 w/ heatsink, 500GB P5 Plus (OS Storage)

Case: 5000D AIRFLOW

Cooler: Thermalright Frost Commander 140

PSU: Corsair RM850e

 

PCPartPicker List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/QYLBh3

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2 minutes ago, TatamiMatt said:

Run it initially without the noctua fans (unless you already have them) the fans on the PS120 are pretty good and if you need the extra buy the noctuas, but no point spend extra money if youre happy with the noise and performance of the cooler with stock fans

100%. If its not too much of a issue I would love to see a photo of your pc we both have the same parts and I was wondeirng what it would look like. thank you again 

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11 minutes ago, koolj12 said:

100%. If its not too much of a issue I would love to see a photo of your pc we both have the same parts and I was wondeirng what it would look like. thank you again 

I will do when i get home, around 6pm GMT, I'm running my FC140 in a middle & rear fan setup to allow the RAM to be seen so might look a tad odd at first sight. I'm also still waiting on a new GPU cable and 3 more fans to finish standardizing everything!

System specs:

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D [-30 PBO all core]

GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT NITRO+ [1050mV, 2.8GHz core, 2.6Ghz mem]

Motherboard: MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI

RAM: G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB 32GB 6000MHz CL32 DDR5

Storage: 2TB SN850X, 1TB SN850 w/ heatsink, 500GB P5 Plus (OS Storage)

Case: 5000D AIRFLOW

Cooler: Thermalright Frost Commander 140

PSU: Corsair RM850e

 

PCPartPicker List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/QYLBh3

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21 minutes ago, TatamiMatt said:

I will do when i get home, around 6pm GMT, I'm running my FC140 in a middle & rear fan setup to allow the RAM to be seen so might look a tad odd at first sight. I'm also still waiting on a new GPU cable and 3 more fans to finish standardizing everything!

sounds good I appreciate it alot, I dont wanna inconvenience you or anyhting no stress 

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2 hours ago, TatamiMatt said:

I initially thought they were identical but looking at it again it seems the FS has a higher fin density than the FC, same height but 1.6mm spacing and 1.8mm spacing respectively. However FCs fan specs are better. It performed much more similarly in the AMD graphs in the following test however so nothing too much to worry about in that regards, but strange to include better fans then reduce fin density, surely the better fans would allow more air to flow through the fins, unpacking the fins then would increase it further but at what point do diminishing returns apply for both sides, amount of fins dissapating heat quicker or the allowance of more airflow, cooling faster?

Mass is more important than fans up to a point but you can still improve the unchangeable mass with better fans. As to why TR did that, I can't say.

I've been using computers since around 1978, started learning programming in 1980 on Apple IIs, started learning about hardware in 1990, ran a BBS from 1990-95, built my first Windows PC around 2000, taught myself malware removal starting in 2005 (also learned on Bleeping Computer), learned web dev starting in 2017, and I think I can fill a thimble with all that knowledge. 😉 I'm not an expert, which is why I keep investigating the answers that others give to try and improve my knowledge, so feel free to double-check the advice I give.

My phone's auto-correct is named Otto Rong.🤪😂

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21 hours ago, TatamiMatt said:

Run it initially without the noctua fans (unless you already have them) the fans on the PS120 are pretty good and if you need the extra buy the noctuas, but no point spend extra money if youre happy with the noise and performance of the cooler with stock fans

Actually, I wouldn't get the Noctuas. They're very good but not top performers. As far as bearings is concerned,  they're one of the best. 

 

If you need better fans, tag me and let me know the max thickness that'll fit in the middle, and I'll give you some suggestions. Too bad @TeraSeraphseems to have stopped coming here because she also knows several. I don't have my data in front of me but, off the top of my head I remember that Iceberg Thermal's IceGale Xtra is really good. EK Furious Meltemi is, too, but it's DC'd.

Edited by RevGAM
Corrected Otto Rong's sabotage

I've been using computers since around 1978, started learning programming in 1980 on Apple IIs, started learning about hardware in 1990, ran a BBS from 1990-95, built my first Windows PC around 2000, taught myself malware removal starting in 2005 (also learned on Bleeping Computer), learned web dev starting in 2017, and I think I can fill a thimble with all that knowledge. 😉 I'm not an expert, which is why I keep investigating the answers that others give to try and improve my knowledge, so feel free to double-check the advice I give.

My phone's auto-correct is named Otto Rong.🤪😂

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1 hour ago, TatamiMatt said:

I will do when i get home, around 6pm GMT, I'm running my FC140 in a middle & rear fan setup to allow the RAM to be seen so might look a tad odd at first sight. I'm also still waiting on a new GPU cable and 3 more fans to finish standardizing everything!

Nudge nudge photo...;)

I've been using computers since around 1978, started learning programming in 1980 on Apple IIs, started learning about hardware in 1990, ran a BBS from 1990-95, built my first Windows PC around 2000, taught myself malware removal starting in 2005 (also learned on Bleeping Computer), learned web dev starting in 2017, and I think I can fill a thimble with all that knowledge. 😉 I'm not an expert, which is why I keep investigating the answers that others give to try and improve my knowledge, so feel free to double-check the advice I give.

My phone's auto-correct is named Otto Rong.🤪😂

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7 hours ago, koolj12 said:

100%. If its not too much of a issue I would love to see a photo of your pc we both have the same parts and I was wondeirng what it would look like. thank you again 

 

5 hours ago, RevGAM said:

Nudge nudge photo...;)

Sorry guys, hit the gym after work photos incoming

 

Might have to be a few replies due to 20mb max size

 

Turned off no side panel (flash off flash on)

20231206_183913.thumb.jpg.4bf7cfa7134f5a3a6dea4f1f09ece1ec.jpg20231206_183859.thumb.jpg.5d5f9d99be9fe739070ec513f5f5c629.jpg

 

Turned on no side panel

20231206_183949.thumb.jpg.02adaa3fa233e064dca91fd94571dc44.jpg

 

Turned on no side panel night shot

20231206_184132.thumb.jpg.159691c80dd372f5c8cdef4f45ff27f7.jpg

 

Turned on no side panel flash

20231206_184208.thumb.jpg.df292f18b5a0b94fcea7fe7c309ee01f.jpg
 

 

System specs:

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D [-30 PBO all core]

GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT NITRO+ [1050mV, 2.8GHz core, 2.6Ghz mem]

Motherboard: MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI

RAM: G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB 32GB 6000MHz CL32 DDR5

Storage: 2TB SN850X, 1TB SN850 w/ heatsink, 500GB P5 Plus (OS Storage)

Case: 5000D AIRFLOW

Cooler: Thermalright Frost Commander 140

PSU: Corsair RM850e

 

PCPartPicker List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/QYLBh3

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Turned on w/ side panel (various shots)

20231206_184521.thumb.jpg.85d349886581e9381e49366e128fd4a9.jpg20231206_184254.thumb.jpg.c7bff16652099c5e9a875129dc6e8947.jpg20231206_184239.thumb.jpg.849949499ff2362bdb9a49c1360e4c70.jpg

System specs:

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D [-30 PBO all core]

GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT NITRO+ [1050mV, 2.8GHz core, 2.6Ghz mem]

Motherboard: MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI

RAM: G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB 32GB 6000MHz CL32 DDR5

Storage: 2TB SN850X, 1TB SN850 w/ heatsink, 500GB P5 Plus (OS Storage)

Case: 5000D AIRFLOW

Cooler: Thermalright Frost Commander 140

PSU: Corsair RM850e

 

PCPartPicker List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/QYLBh3

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200MP shot 1 no side panel (zoom in on this one)

20231206_184011.jpg.7868057ce7289e1c5d98eba40133a4a4.jpg

System specs:

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D [-30 PBO all core]

GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT NITRO+ [1050mV, 2.8GHz core, 2.6Ghz mem]

Motherboard: MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI

RAM: G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB 32GB 6000MHz CL32 DDR5

Storage: 2TB SN850X, 1TB SN850 w/ heatsink, 500GB P5 Plus (OS Storage)

Case: 5000D AIRFLOW

Cooler: Thermalright Frost Commander 140

PSU: Corsair RM850e

 

PCPartPicker List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/QYLBh3

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200MP shot 2 w/ side panel (and zoom on tis one too)20231206_184321.jpg.5cd036129df528fbc9203b997da6712a.jpg

 

 

Apologies for the spam, thought id get a bit of a range of shots for y'all  😊

System specs:

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D [-30 PBO all core]

GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT NITRO+ [1050mV, 2.8GHz core, 2.6Ghz mem]

Motherboard: MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI

RAM: G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB 32GB 6000MHz CL32 DDR5

Storage: 2TB SN850X, 1TB SN850 w/ heatsink, 500GB P5 Plus (OS Storage)

Case: 5000D AIRFLOW

Cooler: Thermalright Frost Commander 140

PSU: Corsair RM850e

 

PCPartPicker List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/QYLBh3

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2 minutes ago, TatamiMatt said:

200MP shot 1 no side panel

20231206_184011.jpg.7868057ce7289e1c5d98eba40133a4a4.jpg

oh lala thats a pretty pc haha,  what fans did you use for it? I was thinking using the Noctua NF-P12 1700 rpm and keeping the corsiar fans it comes with in the front. but my problem mainly rn is figuring out how to configure the fans for maximum airflow. also I dont undertsand fan preasure. also what part of buidling gave you the most trouble? that nitro+ is beatifull but holy moly I didnt realize how beefy it is!

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21 minutes ago, koolj12 said:

oh lala thats a pretty pc haha,  what fans did you use for it? I was thinking using the Noctua NF-P12 1700 rpm and keeping the corsiar fans it comes with in the front. but my problem mainly rn is figuring out how to configure the fans for maximum airflow. also I dont undertsand fan preasure. also what part of buidling gave you the most trouble? that nitro+ is beatifull but holy moly I didnt realize how beefy it is!

Build was fine, ive built a good few pcs at this point and tinkered with my own for hours on end, i will say the case was phenomenal to work with, the 5000D has so much room and cable managing was super easy, havent tweaked it (cables) 100% yet as i still have some more fans to add (well replace to standardise, 2 on the back and the one corsair fan on the front). Im using the fractal design prisma pwms, both the AL-12s and AL-14s. Theyre pretty decent price to performance fans with quite nice rgb that daisy chains, ill detail performance below (about £45 for a 3 pack btw) 

 

Fan: 140mm

RPM: 500-1700

dBA: 34.1 (little noisy at full whack but can never hear it with headphones on)

CFM: 103.85

mmH2O: 2.38

 

Fan: 120mm

RPM: 500-2000

dBA: 32.7 (similar to 140s but a touch quieter)

CFM: 85.71

mmH2O: 2.78

 

Also have 2 little 40mm fans one hitting VRM heatsinks to keep them cool and push air to the upper exhaust and one right by the GC exhaust to pull any hot air out right away to stop any build up or recycling (also glass gets warm to the touch even with it after long periods of GC utilisation so helps to just keep it cooler)

 

If youre confused about Static pressure and airflow, think of a car,

static pressure is youre push, or acceleration

airflow is youre movement or speed,

you cant have one without the other but they do slightly different things

 

PM me (or im sure RevGAM too) if you want any help with the fan stuff

 

Yeah nitro+ is a chunky card, the 7900xt and xtx nitro+ cards are even bigger

System specs:

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D [-30 PBO all core]

GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT NITRO+ [1050mV, 2.8GHz core, 2.6Ghz mem]

Motherboard: MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI

RAM: G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB 32GB 6000MHz CL32 DDR5

Storage: 2TB SN850X, 1TB SN850 w/ heatsink, 500GB P5 Plus (OS Storage)

Case: 5000D AIRFLOW

Cooler: Thermalright Frost Commander 140

PSU: Corsair RM850e

 

PCPartPicker List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/QYLBh3

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6 hours ago, RevGAM said:

Actually, I wouldn't get the Noctuas. They're very good but not top performers. As far as bearings is concerned,  they're one of the best. 

 

If you need better fans, tag me and let me know the max thickness that'll fit in the middle, and I'll give you some suggestions. Too bad @TeraSeraphsends to have speed coming here because she also knows several. I don't have my data in front of me but, off the top of my head I remember that Iceberg Thermal's IceGale Xtra is really good. EK Furious Meltemi is, too, but it's DC'd.

 

It costs a lot more, but I am curious about the PS EVO. It's all black and they have different fans. Specs listed below. I have been looking for a review, but they don't seem to be as popular as the regular FS. 

 

TL-K12 FAN Spec:
Dimension:L120 mm x W120 mm x H25 mm
Weight:220g
Rated Speed:2150 RPM±10% (MAX)
Noise Level:27 dBA
Air Flow:69 CFM (MAX)
Air Pressure:2.87 mm H2O (MAX)
Ampere:0.16 A
Connector:4 Pin (PWM Fan connector)
ARGB Connector: 3 PIN 5V
Bearing Type : S-FDB V2 Bearing

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12 hours ago, Steve_17 said:

 

It costs a lot more, but I am curious about the PS EVO. It's all black and they have different fans. Specs listed below. I have been looking for a review, but they don't seem to be as popular as the regular FS. 

 

TL-K12 FAN Spec:
Dimension:L120 mm x W120 mm x H25 mm
Weight:220g
Rated Speed:2150 RPM±10% (MAX)
Noise Level:27 dBA
Air Flow:69 CFM (MAX)
Air Pressure:2.87 mm H2O (MAX)
Ampere:0.16 A
Connector:4 Pin (PWM Fan connector)
ARGB Connector: 3 PIN 5V
Bearing Type : S-FDB V2 Bearing

You should probably start a new thread. What do you mean PS EVO? I have no idea what that is, nor does Google.

As for the TR fans, those look pretty good to use on a case or heatsink. They're also good on lesser radiators. Personally, from my testing, I don't recommend fans with less than 3 mmAq on dense rads. Does that help?

I've been using computers since around 1978, started learning programming in 1980 on Apple IIs, started learning about hardware in 1990, ran a BBS from 1990-95, built my first Windows PC around 2000, taught myself malware removal starting in 2005 (also learned on Bleeping Computer), learned web dev starting in 2017, and I think I can fill a thimble with all that knowledge. 😉 I'm not an expert, which is why I keep investigating the answers that others give to try and improve my knowledge, so feel free to double-check the advice I give.

My phone's auto-correct is named Otto Rong.🤪😂

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40 minutes ago, RevGAM said:

You should probably start a new thread. What do you mean PS EVO? I have no idea what that is, nor does Google.

PS EVO, new version of the phantom spirit with better fans, much higher RPM, doesnt change the airflow a whole lot but almost double the mmAq and their V2 S-FDB bearings as opposed to V1s

 

Also imo, much nicer looking

 

Also new thread started, ive tagged everyone in current discussion, please move discussion not directly related to original post topic there

System specs:

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D [-30 PBO all core]

GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT NITRO+ [1050mV, 2.8GHz core, 2.6Ghz mem]

Motherboard: MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI

RAM: G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB 32GB 6000MHz CL32 DDR5

Storage: 2TB SN850X, 1TB SN850 w/ heatsink, 500GB P5 Plus (OS Storage)

Case: 5000D AIRFLOW

Cooler: Thermalright Frost Commander 140

PSU: Corsair RM850e

 

PCPartPicker List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/QYLBh3

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Following on from previous thread seen below

 

 

@RevGAM @Steve_17 @koolj12

System specs:

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D [-30 PBO all core]

GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT NITRO+ [1050mV, 2.8GHz core, 2.6Ghz mem]

Motherboard: MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI

RAM: G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB 32GB 6000MHz CL32 DDR5

Storage: 2TB SN850X, 1TB SN850 w/ heatsink, 500GB P5 Plus (OS Storage)

Case: 5000D AIRFLOW

Cooler: Thermalright Frost Commander 140

PSU: Corsair RM850e

 

PCPartPicker List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/QYLBh3

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4 minutes ago, koolj12 said:

theres a 120 Evo? is it better?

Heatsink is identical, however with a coat of black paint all over 

 

Tis the fans that got an upgrade, slightly faster CFM due to higher RPM but the main change is the fan blade shape resulting in almost double the pressure

System specs:

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D [-30 PBO all core]

GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT NITRO+ [1050mV, 2.8GHz core, 2.6Ghz mem]

Motherboard: MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI

RAM: G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB 32GB 6000MHz CL32 DDR5

Storage: 2TB SN850X, 1TB SN850 w/ heatsink, 500GB P5 Plus (OS Storage)

Case: 5000D AIRFLOW

Cooler: Thermalright Frost Commander 140

PSU: Corsair RM850e

 

PCPartPicker List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/QYLBh3

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2 minutes ago, TatamiMatt said:

Heatsink is identical, however with a coat of black paint all over 

 

Tis the fans that got an upgrade, slightly faster CFM due to higher RPM but the main change is the fan blade shape resulting in almost double the pressure

so its better basically

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31 minutes ago, koolj12 said:

so its better basically

I havent seen any real testing, but id assume so, there are no real drawbacks to the changes bar a very slight increase in noise, but id wager its one of, if not the best 6mm heatpipe coolers thermalright have got at the minute and just overall in the market at the minute. That massive increase in pressure and airflow wont make a massive difference to cooling, but id say its be entirely noticable and worth the upgrade if its only a few quid/bucks extra. i can buy it from amazon currently for £41 and im somewhat considering it. But gonna wait on more reviews and testing before i make any decision as i already have a plenty beefy cooler

System specs:

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D [-30 PBO all core]

GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7800 XT NITRO+ [1050mV, 2.8GHz core, 2.6Ghz mem]

Motherboard: MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI

RAM: G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB 32GB 6000MHz CL32 DDR5

Storage: 2TB SN850X, 1TB SN850 w/ heatsink, 500GB P5 Plus (OS Storage)

Case: 5000D AIRFLOW

Cooler: Thermalright Frost Commander 140

PSU: Corsair RM850e

 

PCPartPicker List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/QYLBh3

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2 minutes ago, TatamiMatt said:

I havent seen any real testing, but id assume so, there are no real drawbacks to the changes bar a very slight increase in noise, but id wager its one of, if not the best 6mm heatpipe coolers thermalright have got at the minute and just overall in the market at the minute. That massive increase in pressure and airflow wont make a massive difference to cooling, but id say its be entirely noticable and worth the upgrade if its only a few quid/bucks extra. i can buy it from amazon currently for £41 and im somewhat considering it. But gonna wait on more reviews and testing before i make any decision as i already have a plenty beefy cooler

I dont see it on my amazon is on ali express for me, I think this may be the new upcoming king 

 

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