13900k Outrageous temps. Need tips what to do.

[DarkWaver]

With cinebench.

Using these specs.

Getting a cinebench score of 36491. With a 240AIO EK watercooler

Is there anything that i should do here, that really would help, i dont really like how noisy it gets in games etc, should i try and repaste the cpu with some better compound and tighten it more equally, any other suggestions on undervolting and power limiting that doesnt reduce performance more than 5% ish or something like that ?

[whispous]

Have you disassembled, cleaned and re-pasted the cooler/CPU?

[xhackforeverxdx]

U too ? xD i had a thread about it aswell and i run a 360 aio pulling fresh air in the front lmao * only * 36k points your cpu is really hitting the Thermal limit quite hard i think your cooler just cant handel it at your current settings try to lock the performance cores to 5.3 ghz or smth and try a - voltage offset that thing draws 320w in my system even my 360mm aio with fresh air is at its limit 

[191x7]

240mm AIO on a 13900K? 360mm AIO-s have a hard time with that chip!

[RONOTHAN##]

6 minutes ago, DarkWaver said:

Is there anything that i should do here, that really would help, i dont really like how noisy it gets in games etc, should i try and repaste the cpu with some better compound and tighten it more equally, any other suggestions on undervolting and power limiting that doesnt reduce performance more than 5% ish or something like that ?

I do want to first point out that a 240mm AIO is a bit undersized for that chip. Temps on it can be relatively controllable with the right setup, but under max load it is pretty easy to overwhelm a 240mm AIO. A 360mm variant is advisable. 

 

If you do want to keep trying to use that AIO, an undervolt and a contact frame are likely gonna be a good idea. Get one of those Thermalright Bend Correction frames, they're about $10 depending on where you get it and they help a ton with the temperature of the CPU. Once you get that, test it and see if it stays in a decent temp range, it really should (with my chip personally it was in the neighborhood of 5-10C). If it's still not quite enough better, then start undervolting. There are two main methods for undervolting, a static overclock and a negative offset. Each method has their pros and cons, offsets are a little bit easier to understand and a bit quicker, though they are more susceptible to odd behavior like clock stretching and random crashes when under medium to light load conditions (these are both rare, but can theoretically happen). Static overclocks are my generally preferred method, it's IMO a bit more bulletproof a solution, but it will result in a higher idle voltage and does take a bit more effort to get it all working. 

 

For a voltage offset, go into BIOS, find the VCore voltage mode option in the overclocking tab, and set it to offset. Then dial in negative voltages, go in increments of something like 0.01V or 0.025V depending on how much patience you have. Get into Windows, test for stability (something like 5-10 minutes at most, you're just doing a quick test), if it's stable increase your negative offset and repeat, if it's unstable go back to the last stable setting and do a long stability test to confirm it's stable. 

 

For the static OC method, it is a bit more weird. Go into the BIOS and head into the DigitALL power menu, and set the VCore LLC mode to Level 5 and switching frequency to the highest value (that's what that board does best with IIRC). Back out of that and go to the top, and set the CPU multipliers to stock settings (should be 55 for P cores and 43 for E cores IIRC). Finally, go down to the VCore voltage mode and set it to override. Set the VCore value to something higher than what you'd think, 1.4V should account for V droop and get you to where you'd expect it to be. Go into Windows, check for stability, see if you're thermal throttling, and keep dropping the voltage until you stop thermal throttling or you crash. If you crash but are still hitting near thermal limits, drop the core clock multipliers and try again. Once you're tuned so that you're at max frequency that doesn't thermal throttle with the lowest voltage you can, run a long stress test and check for stability. 

[DarkWaver]

13 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

I do want to first point out that a 240mm AIO is a bit undersized for that chip. Temps on it can be relatively controllable with the right setup, but under max load it is pretty easy to overwhelm a 240mm AIO. A 360mm variant is advisable. 

 

If you do want to keep trying to use that AIO, an undervolt and a contact frame are likely gonna be a good idea. Get one of those Thermalright Bend Correction frames, they're about $10 depending on where you get it and they help a ton with the temperature of the CPU. Once you get that, test it and see if it stays in a decent temp range, it really should (with my chip personally it was in the neighborhood of 5-10C). If it's still not quite enough better, then start undervolting. There are two main methods for undervolting, a static overclock and a negative offset. Each method has their pros and cons, offsets are a little bit easier to understand and a bit quicker, though they are more susceptible to odd behavior like clock stretching and random crashes when under medium to light load conditions (these are both rare, but can theoretically happen). Static overclocks are my generally preferred method, it's IMO a bit more bulletproof a solution, but it will result in a higher idle voltage and does take a bit more effort to get it all working. 

 

For a voltage offset, go into BIOS, find the VCore voltage mode option in the overclocking tab, and set it to offset. Then dial in negative voltages, go in increments of something like 0.01V or 0.025V depending on how much patience you have. Get into Windows, test for stability (something like 5-10 minutes at most, you're just doing a quick test), if it's stable increase your negative offset and repeat, if it's unstable go back to the last stable setting and do a long stability test to confirm it's stable. 

 

For the static OC method, it is a bit more weird. Go into the BIOS and head into the DigitALL power menu, and set the VCore LLC mode to Level 5 and switching frequency to the highest value (that's what that board does best with IIRC). Back out of that and go to the top, and set the CPU multipliers to stock settings (should be 55 for P cores and 43 for E cores IIRC). Finally, go down to the VCore voltage mode and set it to override. Set the VCore value to something higher than what you'd think, 1.4V should account for V droop and get you to where you'd expect it to be. Go into Windows, check for stability, see if you're thermal throttling, and keep dropping the voltage until you stop thermal throttling or you crash. If you crash but are still hitting near thermal limits, drop the core clock multipliers and try again. Once you're tuned so that you're at max frequency that doesn't thermal throttle with the lowest voltage you can, run a long stress test and check for stability. 

I have tried setting a -0.080v voltage offset which ran a full 10m cinebench 23, with e cores at 4.1 and all p cores at 5.4. I have ordered some proper thermal compound since i think what i used was some really cheap stuff i had laying around.

However i understand maxing out in cinebench, which i would never expect anything less off. But i can even hit 100s and 90s+ in games like apex legends, which seems crazy ?

 

[xhackforeverxdx]

3 minutes ago, DarkWaver said:

I have tried setting a -0.080v voltage offset which ran a full 10m cinebench 23, with e cores at 4.1 and all p cores at 5.4. I have ordered some proper thermal compound since i think what i used was some really cheap stuff i had laying around.

However i understand maxing out in cinebench, which i would never expect anything less off. But i can even hit 100s and 90s+ in games like apex legends, which seems crazy ?

 

Hitting 100c in cinebench is pretty normal for a 240 aio since it draws up do 300w+ thats smth almost no cooler can handel in derbauers vid u can see him hitting 100c in cinebench even with a costum loop but in games the temps should not be that high is your aio on the top ? drawing in the hot air of your gpu could cause that 

[RONOTHAN##]

2 minutes ago, DarkWaver said:

I have tried setting a -0.080v voltage offset which ran a full 10m cinebench 23, with e cores at 4.1 and all p cores at 5.4. I have ordered some proper thermal compound since i think what i used was some really cheap stuff i had laying around.

However i understand maxing out in cinebench, which i would never expect anything less off. But i can even hit 100s and 90s+ in games like apex legends, which seems crazy ?

 

I think all of that is because of the really bad thermal paste, upper 90s in games shouldn't really be happening, even on a subpar (for this chip) cooler. 

[DarkWaver]

9 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

I think all of that is because of the really bad thermal paste, upper 90s in games shouldn't really be happening, even on a subpar (for this chip) cooler. 

Yeah i am thinking the same, doing the grizzly themalpaste and contact plate. But also gonna swap out my fans on my EK cooler. Which fans would people recommend for silence and performance is nf-15 noctua still the king or ?

Also just checked it was some stock "cooler master thermal paste kit" no specifics at all.

[DarkWaver]

14 minutes ago, xhackforeverxdx said:

Hitting 100c in cinebench is pretty normal for a 240 aio since it draws up do 300w+ thats smth almost no cooler can handel in derbauers vid u can see him hitting 100c in cinebench even with a costum loop but in games the temps should not be that high is your aio on the top ? drawing in the hot air of your gpu could cause that 

it is a tight 220t cooler master case. so 3 intake fans, 1 intake fan at the back and then the aio spitting out at the top. However the GPU shouldnt be running too hot, it is an 3080, but when i game comp titles it is mostly the CPU that really gets hot.

Is there a configuration optimization you would do for that case in terms of intake outtake. I have it mounted to the wall at the moment, so that there is a gap to the table above it, which is why i think intake top would be worse thane the side. 

[RONOTHAN##]

5 minutes ago, DarkWaver said:

Yeah i am thinking the same, doing the grizzly themalpaste and contact plate. But also gonna swap out my fans on my EK cooler. Which fans would people recommend for silence and performance is nf-15 noctua still the king or ?

Also just checked it was some stock "cooler master thermal paste kit" no specifics at all.

yeah, get some new thermal paste for that chip. I'd probably do the Thermalright contact frame, it does come with a good enough thermal paste (about the same tier as the MX-4) and is a bit easier to get installed. Plus it's 1/3 the price, which is good too. 

 

Also, the EK fans do perform really well, you aren't gonna get a noticeable performance increase from them. For silence, not sure, I don't follow fans all that closely, but they still shouldn't be far off. 

[xhackforeverxdx]

8 minutes ago, DarkWaver said:

it is a tight 220t cooler master case. so 3 intake fans, 1 intake fan at the back and then the aio spitting out at the top. However the GPU shouldnt be running too hot, it is an 3080, but when i game comp titles it is mostly the CPU that really gets hot.

Is there a configuration optimization you would do for that case in terms of intake outtake. I have it mounted to the wall at the moment, so that there is a gap to the table above it, which is why i think intake top would be worse thane the side. 

I think u dont fully understand what getting hot means  Your gpu might sit only at 60/70c while gaming cause the cooler is pretty big and made for that card but that card still draws like what 300 watt and dumps that into your system and where does that heat go ^^ straight into your radiator since it exhausts hot air so ye 240mm aio as exhaust for a 13900k there u have your Problem

[freeagent]

A guy at my home forum just posted an R23 shot of his KF at 6.1GHz doing 451w lol.. 

 

That chip is intense..

[DarkWaver]

4 minutes ago, xhackforeverxdx said:

I think u dont fully understand what getting hot means  Your gpu might sit only at 60/70c while gaming cause the cooler is pretty big and made for that card but that card still draws like what 300 watt and dumps that into your system and where does that heat go ^^ straight into your radiator since it exhausts hot air so ye 240mm aio as exhaust for a 13900k there u have your Problem

Yes but my point was, when pushing 1080p gaming and limiting to 240FPS it is a cpu limiting factor that afaik only pushes the gpu to a 15-25% utilization, however i do get what you are saying i should prob try out a different intake outake configuration. Would you do intake back intake AIO and then all 3 front outtake ?

[DarkWaver]

15 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

yeah, get some new thermal paste for that chip. I'd probably do the Thermalright contact frame, it does come with a good enough thermal paste (about the same tier as the MX-4) and is a bit easier to get installed. Plus it's 1/3 the price, which is good too. 

 

Also, the EK fans do perform really well, you aren't gonna get a noticeable performance increase from them. For silence, not sure, I don't follow fans all that closely, but they still shouldn't be far off. 

Ill take your word for it, i just remember it being the case with an old AIO cooler master i had once, performance and overall silence was a major increase right after install, but EK is known for watercooling afterall.

[xhackforeverxdx]

2 minutes ago, DarkWaver said:

Yes but my point was, when pushing 1080p gaming and limiting to 240FPS it is a cpu limiting factor that afaik only pushes the gpu to a 15-25% utilization, however i do get what you are saying i should prob try out a different intake outake configuration. Would you do intake back intake AIO and then all 3 front outtake ?

I dont really understand u how do u want to mount a aio in the back ? xD when its 240mm only places u could put that aio is on the top and in the front also does your Case have a front glass panel ? i see there a diff versions if yours has a glaspanel in the front i have a feeling your system aint getting air at all xD 

[DarkWaver]

5 minutes ago, xhackforeverxdx said:

I dont really understand u how do u want to mount a aio in the back ? xD when its 240mm only places u could put that aio is on the top and in the front also does your Case have a front glass panel ? i see there a diff versions if yours has a glaspanel in the front i have a feeling your system aint getting air at all xD 

There is a lack of a comma, as established the AIO is at the top it was supposed to say intake back, intake AIO. It does not have glass front panel, i knew about the dangers of such a stupid marketing idea. It has the open mesh.

[xhackforeverxdx]

1 minute ago, DarkWaver said:

There is a lack of a comma, as established the AIO is at the top it was supposed to say intake back, intake AIO. It does not have glass front panel, i knew about the dangers of such a stupid marketing idea. It has the open mesh.

If its open mesh i would just put it in the front a 240 aio is already a bit to small for your i9 so atleast give that poor boy fresh air at not preheated system air ^^ 

[DarkWaver]

17 minutes ago, xhackforeverxdx said:

If its open mesh i would just put it in the front a 240 aio is already a bit to small for your i9 so atleast give that poor boy fresh air at not preheated system air ^^ 

Is there a benefit to having it in the front vs on the top, even if i turn the intakes outtake configuration around so that the AIO gets fresh air in ?

 

[xhackforeverxdx]

4 minutes ago, DarkWaver said:

Is there a benefit to having it in the front vs on the top, even if i turn the intakes outtake configuration around so that the AIO gets fresh air in ?

 

Of course there is a big diff if u draw fresh air instead of preheated air from your gpu 

[DarkWaver]

50 minutes ago, xhackforeverxdx said:

Of course there is a big diff if u draw fresh air instead of preheated air from your gpu 

I think you are maybe misunderstanding ehat i am saying to you. I would have the aio at the top taking fresh air in from that aio into the system alongside the backfan. GPU would do its thing inside and the 3 front fans would pull the heat out the front. 
 

how is this setup ^ worse/different from yours apart from location ?

[NorKris]

8 hours ago, DarkWaver said:

I think you are maybe misunderstanding ehat i am saying to you. I would have the aio at the top taking fresh air in from that aio into the system alongside the backfan. GPU would do its thing inside and the 3 front fans would pull the heat out the front. 
 

how is this setup ^ worse/different from yours apart from location ?

Front Rad/AIO (intake) is the best config for any PC. 

Get noctua or Grizzly kryonaut thermal paste. 
push pull Arctic P12 ARGB fans 

 

if this wont help, then only a 360 will  

[DarkWaver]

On 1/31/2023 at 11:05 AM, NorKris said:

Front Rad/AIO (intake) is the best config for any PC. 

Get noctua or Grizzly kryonaut thermal paste. 
push pull Arctic P12 ARGB fans 

 

if this wont help, then only a 360 will  

The problem here is, that the gpu is so big that the aio cant fit in the front. So the only options are to keep it as it is now. With intakes at front and back, while the aio is exhaust at the top.

 

Or intake at the top and back, then exhaust at the front?

 

the new allignment plate, new thermal paste, dust cleanup and settings optimization allowed me to hit 300w on the cpu and 39000 in cinebench 23.

fiddling more with the settings i had it hit only 100c on 2 p cores most being between 93-98 and still hitting 38000s.

 

i do wonder if there is more i could do. 
 

 

ITU is running -0.1v on cores -0.015 on cache and turbo limit of 245w. Would the radiator as an intake make a huge difference i wonder.

[NorKris]

1 hour ago, DarkWaver said:

The problem here is, that the gpu is so big that the aio cant fit in the front. So the only options are to keep it as it is now. With intakes at front and back, while the aio is exhaust at the top.

 

Or intake at the top and back, then exhaust at the front?

 

the new allignment plate, new thermal paste, dust cleanup and settings optimization allowed me to hit 300w on the cpu and 39000 in cinebench 23.

fiddling more with the settings i had it hit only 100c on 2 p cores most being between 93-98 and still hitting 38000s.

 

i do wonder if there is more i could do. 
 

 

ITU is running -0.1v on cores -0.015 on cache and turbo limit of 245w. Would the radiator as an intake make a huge difference i wonder.

*AIO/Rads intake always 

 

exhaust Rads can increase CPU temps as much as 5c