AMD Announces Ryzen 7000 Series - Launching This Fall

[steelo]

I'll be hanging on to my Ryzen 5 1600AF for a few more years and even then will probably still be at least 2 gens behind when I do upgrade. 

[Senzelian]

Integrated graphics are amazing for troubleshooting!

 

I won't be upgrading, but I'm hoping for a few boards with TB4.

[Quackers101]

1 hour ago, steelo said:

I'll be hanging on to my Ryzen 5 1600AF for a few more years and even then will probably still be at least 2 gens behind when I do upgrade. 

waiting for the lazer chips and stuff? and a bit of quantum.

[frozensun]

All this I mean can someone explain me real life purpose of 99 % regular users of PC of PCI-E 5.0 (I'm on 3.0) DDR 5 which costs like "gold" and wifi 6E, what is 6E anyway.

Pci-e gen 4 are lighning fast.

It is like you are driving BMW on highway 240 km/h and then comes Lisa and tells us:" Hell we made your BMW to drive 280 km/h but the limit on highway is 150 km/h.

But as long as there are users who change PCs every year AMD and Intel will profit from them...

And they will now bombard us with damn syntethic tests which in real life don't have any useful purpose.

 

[Quackers101]

16 minutes ago, frozensun said:

All this I mean can someone explain me real life purpose of 99 % regular users of PC of PCI-E 5.0 (I'm on 3.0) DDR 5 which costs like "gold" and wifi 6E, what is 6E anyway.

Pci-e gen 4 are lighning fast.

 

But as long as there are users who change PCs every year AMD and Intel will profit from them...

And they will now bombard us with damn syntethic tests which in real life don't have any useful purpose.

wifi 6E is not wifi 7 so yeah, been so long with wifi 6/6E. its just closing in on more bandwith and better connectivity while being more reliable.

agree that, why would I want PCIe 5? when we bearly got PCIe 4 and the cost?! Do hope they at least support lower end PCIe for a while.

Also when the GPU be covering 50% of the lanes that are supposed to be "used" and paid for.

*6 slot GPU on the way*

[SupaKomputa]

8 hours ago, Senzelian said:

Integrated graphics are amazing for troubleshooting!

 

I won't be upgrading, but I'm hoping for a few boards with TB4.

im hoping that the Igpu is not there just for backup, if they allow it to work in tandem with the dgpu, that would be massive.

more video ports.

[Quackers101]

17 minutes ago, SupaKomputa said:

im hoping that the Igpu is not there just for backup, if they allow it to work in tandem with the dgpu, that would be massive.

more video ports.

kind of doubt that, maybe there might be some boost. not sure they would work as great as what intel is going to offer once arc GPUs are "out".

[SupaKomputa]

1 minute ago, Quackers101 said:

kind of doubt that, maybe there might be some boost. not sure they would work as great as what intel is going to offer once arc GPUs are "out".

Yeah, such a waste for the backpanel video outputs. A radeon + igpu acceleration would be good, at least.

[Mark Kaine]

So no AVX512 thingy...?

 

 

 

20 hours ago, Chiyawa said:

I think AVX-512 is obsolete that Intel begin to ditched it. AVX2 is more likely in my opinion.

Hello!

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/rpcs3/comments/tqt1ko/clearing_up_some_avx512_misinformation_and_how_to/

 

ps: also i think why they "ditched" it is because they want to sell it on their "server grade cpus" for that sweet extra $$$  ‐.-

[Chiyawa]

Okay, after a few more rewatching the keynote, I learned that:

 

X670 supports PCIe Gen 5 for one NVME slot but GPU slot is optional. So, not all X670 motherboard support PCIe Gen 5 GPU. Wow, I nearly miss that.

[Chiyawa]

2 minutes ago, Mark Kaine said:

Hello!

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/rpcs3/comments/tqt1ko/clearing_up_some_avx512_misinformation_and_how_to/

 

ps: also i think why they "ditched" it is because they want to sell it on their "server grade cpus" for that sweet extra $$$  ‐.-

Oh well, I learnt something today. Still, I'm not aware of any software that use AVX-512 instruction. Maybe I don't use it.

[Mark Kaine]

4 minutes ago, Chiyawa said:

Oh well, I learnt something today. Still, I'm not aware of any software that use AVX-512 instruction. Maybe I don't use it.

its also good for encoders, deep learning, etc... hence why i think their "professional cpus" will still support it (apparently there isn't really an issue with the chip design itself) 

[frozensun]

On 5/23/2022 at 9:38 PM, Quackers101 said:

wifi 6E is not wifi 7 so yeah, been so long with wifi 6/6E. its just closing in on more bandwith and better connectivity while being more reliable.

agree that, why would I want PCIe 5? when we bearly got PCIe 4 and the cost?! Do hope they at least support lower end PCIe for a while.

Also when the GPU be covering 50% of the lanes that are supposed to be "used" and paid for.

*6 slot GPU on the way*

I still state that boards were lot better before.

My Rampage V Exteme has I believe 6 PCI-E slots 12 usb ports bunch of sata ports..and now I look at there boards who barely have w pci-e and not even post q -led code.

I don't remember latest Asus board with 2 bios chips...etc etc...

A Rampage V Exteme is a Godess to all recent boards and I would  not sell it for 1k.

[bcredeur97]

On 5/23/2022 at 10:01 AM, CephDigital said:

I was more suprised they put the iGPU in the IO die instead of its own chiplet. That means you can now get a 16 core CPU with an iGPU which is nutty. Always prefered having an iGPU than not having one as it helps massively when issues occur with the main dGPU.

plus you know sometimes you want to build a NAS/server/etc and would like an iGPU just to get it setup and going get the OS installed and such, and then just use it every now and then to troubleshoot if you need. It's convenient! It makes sense for every cpu to at least come with some potato GPU inside.

[Blademaster91]

16 minutes ago, frozensun said:

I still state that boards were lot better before.

My Rampage V Exteme has I believe 6 PCI-E slots 12 usb ports bunch of sata ports..and now I look at there boards who barely have w pci-e and not even post q -led code.

I don't remember latest Asus board with 2 bios chips...etc etc...

A Rampage V Exteme is a Godess to all recent boards and I would  not sell it for 1k.

I think you used to get more for the cost with motherboards, now every AIB crams in a ton of power phases for marketing, dumb RGB which requires buggy software to even turn off, and POST code LED's used to come on $150 boards. And I find it weird these boards with PCI-e 5.0 only have 3 pci-e slots, although with graphics cards having massive 3 slot coolers its not like you could use more.

Also Gigabyte has revealed their X670 motherboards at Computex 2022, the Pro AX is said to be around $300, I thought $200 was a lot for a board.

https://www.techpowerup.com/295196/hands-on-with-the-new-gigabyte-x670-motherboards-at-computex-2022

[sounds]

On 5/23/2022 at 10:42 AM, Senzelian said:

Integrated graphics are amazing for troubleshooting!

 

I won't be upgrading, but I'm hoping for a few boards with TB4.

I agree with you that a potato iGPU has uses. It's also wasted on some customers - nothing can perfectly please everybody.

 

Socket AM5 motherboards could have ThunderBolt 4, but most likely will try to confuse you by shipping with USB4. Check out Tom's Guide for this pro tip -

Quote

Though USB4 is capable of 40Gbps transfer speeds, some devices only support up to 20Gbps – particularly lower-priced products. You can look for a “20” or a “40” in a device’s spec sheet or box to see which one it supports. And while USB4 is capable of delivering 100W of power, it has a minimum requirement of 7.5W.

Like the confusion AMD is somehow ... allowing to happen around X670 PCI gen 4 x16 vs. X670E PCI gen 5 x16, you can expect to see the same thing with USB4 "20" ports that do support Thunderbolt ... that is Thunderbolt 3. I mean, an AM5 AMD CPU will have that crappy iGPU to drive those external displays and everything...

 

Hopefully that clears everything up. Basically, expect disappointment.

 

Edit: Some AM5 motherboard specs leaked and they might ship with Thunderbolt 4.

[igormp]

56 minutes ago, bcredeur97 said:

plus you know sometimes you want to build a NAS/server/etc and would like an iGPU just to get it setup and going get the OS installed and such

I personally don't get that. I usually do those installs remotely, or on an external disk and then move it onto the actual machine, but to each their own, I guess. 

[leadeater]

On 5/25/2022 at 7:59 AM, frozensun said:

I still state that boards were lot better before.

My Rampage V Exteme has I believe 6 PCI-E slots 12 usb ports bunch of sata ports..and now I look at there boards who barely have w pci-e and not even post q -led code.

I don't remember latest Asus board with 2 bios chips...etc etc...

A Rampage V Exteme is a Godess to all recent boards and I would  not sell it for 1k.

That's completely different platform type, that's HEDT. Compare back to the same platform type back then rather than trying to compare a platform that has vastly more PCIe lanes off the CPU so you can actually do more.

 

You'd be wanting to compare against Asus Maximus VIII

• 2x x16 slots direct CPU
• 1x x16 slot PCH
• 3x x1 slot PCH
• Lots of USB that don't matter

All the other thing you say have been missing are still on all the ROG Maximus/Crosshair boards till this day

 

https://rog.asus.com/nz/motherboards/rog-maximus/rog-maximus-z690-formula-model/

https://rog.asus.com/nz/motherboards/rog-maximus/rog-maximus-z690-extreme-model/

https://rog.asus.com/nz/motherboards/rog-maximus/rog-maximus-z690-hero-model/

https://rog.asus.com/nz/motherboards/rog-maximus/rog-maximus-xiii-apex-model/

https://rog.asus.com/motherboards/rog-maximus/rog-maximus-ix-hero-model/

 

A lot of the x1 slots etc have been exchanged for M.2 slots, something people actually would use.

 

And for AMD

https://rog.asus.com/nz/motherboards/rog-crosshair/rog-crosshair-viii-dark-hero-model/

https://rog.asus.com/nz/motherboards/rog-crosshair/rog-crosshair-viii-hero-wi-fi-model/

 

Above is not every single one, just samples.

[BiG StroOnZ]

Some interesting info regarding the 5.5GHz demo:

 

 

Does this mean there's still overclock headroom available?

 

[leadeater]

29 minutes ago, BiG StroOnZ said:

Does this mean there's still overclock headroom available?

If it's anything like Zen 3 then nope

[BiG StroOnZ]

1 minute ago, leadeater said:

If it's anything like Zen 3 then nope

 

[tim0901]

On 5/23/2022 at 2:04 PM, LAwLz said:

Overall I would say this was a pretty weak announcement from AMD, and that things are looking pretty good for Intel.

If the rumors and news about Inte's 13th gen turns out to be true then Intel will most likely lead in single core and multi core performance.

Agreed - especially regarding core count. No increase in core count since Zen 2 is particularly disappointing - imagine telling someone a few years ago that it would be Intel pushing for higher core counts!

If the rumors are true and Intel is indeed planning on doubling the number of e-cores with the 13900k then a 15-20% increase in per-thread performance over Zen 3 really doesn't sound like enough. The 12900k's p-cores are already ~10% faster than Zen 3 cores (ignoring the 5800X3D as we've no idea if that tech is coming to Zen 4) and so when you consider the 25% increase in thread count as well as whatever single-core gains Intel can find (probably 10-15% at least?) I can't see AMD being in a great situation. I've seen rumors of a 10-15% increase in single core performance and 40% more multi core performance for 13th gen... that would be rather painful for AMD if correct.

Power consumption will definitely continue to be an interesting comparison point - Intel's core count increase will likely bring their power consumption figures upwards (although I'm very willing to be wrong, process refinements could definitely offset this) but how will that figure compare to AMD's also increasing numbers? I imagine AMD will retain the efficiency crown but who knows. I also think pricing will be a huge factor this gen. AMD can't really afford to go greedy again now that competition is in full force, but with TSMC raising their prices will they have much choice but to pass that increase on? Intel definitely has an advantage there by using their own fabs.

 

I really have to wonder if Intel caught AMD off guard with how good Alder Lake turned out, or is it that AMD are focusing everything on Zen 5? Either way this feels very much like a stop-gap release. Dial up the clocks, double the cache (I doubt there are many more architectural improvements than that) and pray its enough until Zen 5 arrives (although if the rumours of that being delayed until 2024-2025 are true... oh no AMD?) I also wonder if this is why AMD are aiming for Q3 - let Zen 4 be the top dog for a few weeks before 13th gen arrives.

[Quackers101]

1 hour ago, tim0901 said:

really have to wonder if Intel caught AMD off guard with how good Alder Lake turned out, or is it that AMD are focusing everything on Zen 5? Either way this feels very much like a stop-gap release. Dial up the clocks, double the cache (I doubt there are many more architectural improvements than that) and pray its enough until Zen 5 arrives (although if the rumours of that being delayed until 2024-2025 are true... oh no AMD?) I also wonder if this is why AMD are aiming for Q3 - let Zen 4 be the top dog for a few weeks before 13th gen arrives.

intel on a FAB spree, might just add as much as they want jk. would burn hotter than 100 suns.

[KaitouX]

9 hours ago, tim0901 said:

Agreed - especially regarding core count. No increase in core count since Zen 2 is particularly disappointing - imagine telling someone a few years ago that it would be Intel pushing for higher core counts!

If the rumors are true and Intel is indeed planning on doubling the number of e-cores with the 13900k then a 15-20% increase in per-thread performance over Zen 3 really doesn't sound like enough. The 12900k's p-cores are already ~10% faster than Zen 3 cores (ignoring the 5800X3D as we've no idea if that tech is coming to Zen 4) and so when you consider the 25% increase in thread count as well as whatever single-core gains Intel can find (probably 10-15% at least?) I can't see AMD being in a great situation. I've seen rumors of a 10-15% increase in single core performance and 40% more multi core performance for 13th gen... that would be rather painful for AMD if correct.

Power consumption will definitely continue to be an interesting comparison point - Intel's core count increase will likely bring their power consumption figures upwards (although I'm very willing to be wrong, process refinements could definitely offset this) but how will that figure compare to AMD's also increasing numbers? I imagine AMD will retain the efficiency crown but who knows. I also think pricing will be a huge factor this gen. AMD can't really afford to go greedy again now that competition is in full force, but with TSMC raising their prices will they have much choice but to pass that increase on? Intel definitely has an advantage there by using their own fabs.

 

I really have to wonder if Intel caught AMD off guard with how good Alder Lake turned out, or is it that AMD are focusing everything on Zen 5? Either way this feels very much like a stop-gap release. Dial up the clocks, double the cache (I doubt there are many more architectural improvements than that) and pray its enough until Zen 5 arrives (although if the rumours of that being delayed until 2024-2025 are true... oh no AMD?) I also wonder if this is why AMD are aiming for Q3 - let Zen 4 be the top dog for a few weeks before 13th gen arrives.

Assuming Zen 4 follows the expected gains from the demos and they don't change pricing/core count, only the 16-core part would be able to beat Alder Lake by a significant margin, let alone Raptor Lake.

Being pretty optimistic Zen 4 gains would make a 5600X and 5800X successor be slightly behind the 12600K and 12700K, while the 5900X successor would be slightly ahead of the 12900K. That's in MT, in ST Intel would be faster by a decent margin.

 

Power consumption might not be that great of a deal with Raptor Lake, at least if Intel doesn't do what they've done to the 12900K, and increased the power consumption in almost 100W for less than 10% more performance, at 190W it's less than 5% difference. The 12600K and 12700K are already basically as efficient as the 5600X and 5800X, while the 12700 is similar to the 5900X, they don't need much to compete in efficiency, only the 5950X and it's successor are probably going to stay isolated as the most efficient consumer CPUs in MT tasks.

[LAwLz]

9 hours ago, tim0901 said:

Power consumption will definitely continue to be an interesting comparison point - Intel's core count increase will likely bring their power consumption figures upwards (although I'm very willing to be wrong, process refinements could definitely offset this) but how will that figure compare to AMD's also increasing numbers? I imagine AMD will retain the efficiency crown but who knows.

I think AMD will be more efficient as well. 

Maybe not as efficient as they are now, but still better than Intel. 

 

Personally, I don't think efficiency or power consumption matters that much, as long as it is somewhat reasonable and the performance is good. 

It's only when a product performs worse and still uses more power than it hink its worth bringing up. 

A product performing 20% better and uses 30% more power? Who cares... 

A product performing 20% worse while still using 30% more power? That's embarrassing. 

 

 

Of course I'm taking about desktop products here. With laptop and other battery powered things efficiency is important. 

 

 

I also think people stare too blindly at peak power consumption when making comparisons. Power consumption at medium loads are arguably even more relevant, if we are talking about things like laptops. Most people rarely if ever fully load their system.