paypal goods and services?

[Howdy_World]

hey guys,

so i sent money to a seller on facebook using paypal goods and services and now hes telling me he cant use the money as its showing as pending and he wants to return the money because he doesnt want anything to do with it now after getting to know that he has to wait till i receive the item and confirm that its all good, now i really want that item, is there a way from my side to make the money available instantly before receiving the item so the seller can go ahead and ship the item already as hes hesitant that i will scam him and get a refund after he ship the item.

 

TL;DR : i want to make the money i sent by paypal goods and services available to the seller asap even before i receive the item

[Spotty]

5 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

as hes hesitant that i will scam him and get a refund after he ship the item.

Sounds more like he's scamming you. Probably wants you to pay via gift transfer which doesn't offer protections for the sender and you can't get a refund. This is common trick amongst scammers to get people to send money directly that they can't easily reclaim, once the scammers have the money they'll simply just block you and you'll never receive whatever it was they promised to send you.

 

Paypal will release the funds sooner if the seller provides paypal postage tracking information to show delivery.
https://www.paypal.com/us/brc/article/funds-availability

 

Out of curiosity, what is the item they are selling? How much are they charging for it? Does it seem like the deal is too good to be true? For example if it's an RTX 3080 for $300 you're not getting a good deal, you're getting scammed. Never be afraid to walk away from a deal if it doesn't feel right.

[SupaKomputa]

23 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

i want to make the money i sent by paypal goods and services available to the seller asap even before i receive the item

never do this, the seller should send the package after you made the payment, paypal will hold your money, and releasing it after you acknowledge deliveries.

[Howdy_World]

5 minutes ago, Spotty said:

Sounds more like he's scamming you. Probably wants you to pay via gift transfer which doesn't offer protections for the sender and you can't get a refund. This is common trick amongst scammers to get people to send money directly that they can't easily reclaim, once the scammers have the money they'll simply just block you and you'll never receive whatever it was they promised to send you.

 

Paypal will release the funds sooner if the seller provides paypal postage tracking information to show delivery.
https://www.paypal.com/us/brc/article/funds-availability

 

Out of curiosity, what is the item they are selling? How much are they charging for it? Does it seem like the deal is too good to be true? For example if it's an RTX 3080 for $300 you're not getting a good deal, you're getting scammed. Never be afraid to walk away from a deal if it doesn't feel right.

its a laptop with rtx 2060 for 350 euros, the seller seems legit but doesnt want to understand that he has to upload the tracking number because he doesnt want to ship before he gets cleared payments, im so mad and frustrated because i bought many items this way before without issues, i think i should have sent the money by paypal friends and family   

[Howdy_World]

2 minutes ago, SupaKomputa said:

never do this, the seller should send the package after you made the payment, paypal will hold your money, and releasing it after you acknowledge deliveries.

yes i know that but the seller doesnt want to understand, he told me that i can scam him by getting a refund afterwards, its so frustrating when you strike a deal and shi*t like this happens, now how am i gonna go through it? he doesnt even know how to refund the money as he keeps asking me how to do it, he didnt know whats a paypal at the beginning to start with  

[Spotty]

Just now, Howdy_World said:

i think i should have sent the money by paypal friends and family   

... The only people you send money to via paypal friends and family are friends, family, and scammers. If this person is not a friend or family member they're a scammer.

 

If paypal holds the funds until you receive delivery then that's the sellers problem, not yours. Paypal puts things like that in place as protections to help prevent people from being scammed. Don't try to work around the protections that are in place to protect you from being scammed.

 

1 minute ago, Howdy_World said:

yes i know that but the seller doesnt want to understand, he told me that i can scam him by getting a refund afterwards, its so frustrating when you strike a deal and shi*t like this happens, now how am i gonna go through it? he doesnt even know how to refund the money as he keeps asking me how to do it, he didnt know whats a paypal at the beginning to start with  

Those are things scammers will say to trick you.

 

2 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

its a laptop with rtx 2060 for 350 euros

Yeah, that deal sounds too good to be true. Scam

 

It would probably be a good idea to get in touch with paypal customer support and let them know you think that you're being scammed, tell them that the seller is refusing to send the item and is asking you to send the funds directly to circumvent the buyer protections. They'll cancel the transaction and hopefully flag the scammers account as fraudulent.

[SupaKomputa]

9 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

he didnt know whats a paypal at the beginning to start with  

then don't buy it from him. he is either clueless or he's intentionally trying to scam you. go to ebay.

[SupaKomputa]

16 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

its a laptop with rtx 2060 for 350 euros

i didnt read this. definitely a scam. lol.

if its too good to be true, it probably is.

[Howdy_World]

12 minutes ago, SupaKomputa said:

i didnt read this. definitely a scam. lol.

if its too good to be true, it probably is.

tbh it doesnt seem too good to be true because i bought same laptop for 400 euros locally though, so 350 isnt so cheap its not like hes asking 100 euros 

[Howdy_World]

20 minutes ago, Spotty said:

... The only people you send money to via paypal friends and family are friends, family, and scammers. If this person is not a friend or family member they're a scammer.

 

If paypal holds the funds until you receive delivery then that's the sellers problem, not yours. Paypal puts things like that in place as protections to help prevent people from being scammed. Don't try to work around the protections that are in place to protect you from being scammed.

 

Those are things scammers will say to trick you.

 

Yeah, that deal sounds too good to be true. Scam

 

It would probably be a good idea to get in touch with paypal customer support and let them know you think that you're being scammed, tell them that the seller is refusing to send the item and is asking you to send the funds directly to circumvent the buyer protections. They'll cancel the transaction and hopefully flag the scammers account as fraudulent.

but lets say i want to take the risk, as seller might be legit, how do i make the money available for him ? thats my main question 

[Spotty]

10 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

but lets say i want to take the risk, as seller might be legit, how do i make the money available for him ? thats my main question 

You've already done it by sending the money via paypal goods and services which is currently being held by Paypal. All the seller would need to do is deliver the goods and they'll get the money.

 

14 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

tbh it doesnt seem too good to be true because i bought same laptop for 400 euros locally though, so 350 isnt so cheap its not like hes asking 100 euros 

If you already own the same laptop why are you buying another one? What's the model of laptop?

[Howdy_World]

9 minutes ago, Spotty said:

You've already done it by sending the money via paypal goods and services which is currently being held by Paypal. All the seller would need to do is deliver the goods and they'll get the money.

 

If you already own the same laptop why are you buying another one? What's the model of laptop?

i told him that many times, but he doesnt want to understand or put the effort to understand, i really think hes legit but doesnt know how to upload the tracking number as he keeps asking how to do so.... regarding why i need another one, its for my dad, the one i bought for 400 locally is msi with i7 11th gen and rtx 2060, the one i paid for through paypal is ASUS strix with i7 11th  gen and rtx 2060

[Needfuldoer]

42 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

but lets say i want to take the risk, as seller might be legit, how do i make the money available for him ? thats my main question 

PayPal will release the funds to the seller once they have a tracking number as proof he sent you a package. There's nothing you can do to change that. If he doesn't like it, that's his problem, not yours. You've done everything right so far (except for engaging with a scammer in the first place.)

 

Buying things via PayPal friends and family puts all your trust in a stranger, because the money is gone as soon as you click "Send". You have zero recourse if they mail you a box of rocks, or nothing at all. The whole point of PayPal goods and services holding the funds in escrow is to give you the assurance that the seller will hold up their end of the deal. He doesn't want that because he doesn't want to sell you a laptop, he just wants your money.

 

Do not send this seller a penny by 'friends and family'. If you do, your odds of getting that laptop from him (or your money back) are just as good as if you flushed the cash down the toilet.

 

14 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

i told him that many times, but he doesnt want to understand or put the effort to understand

Again, him not understanding the platform he's using to make money is not your problem.

 

He's either that thick, or he's playing dumb and hoping you're too gullible, innocent, or trusting for your own good.

 

14 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

i really think hes legit

Oh sweet summer child.

 

14 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

but doesnt know how to upload the tracking number as he keeps asking how to do so....

Every time he asks, just send him this link:

 

https://www.paypal.com/in/smarthelp/article/how-do-i-add-tracking-information-to-my-payment-faq3222

 

[Howdy_World]

1 minute ago, Needfuldoer said:

PayPal will release the funds to the seller once they have a tracking number as proof he sent you a package. There's nothing you can do to change that. If he doesn't like it, that's his problem, not yours. You did everything right here (except for engaging with a scammer in the first place.)

 

Buying things via PayPal friends and family puts all your trust in a stranger, because the money is gone as soon as you click "Send". You have zero recourse if they mail you a box of rocks, or nothing at all. The whole point of PayPal goods and services holding the funds in escrow is to give you the assurance that the seller will hold up their end of the deal.

 

Do not send this seller a penny by 'friends and family'. If you do, your odds of getting a laptop from him (or your money back) are just as good as if you flushed the cash down the toilet.

ok, by any chance do you know of any way i can pay sellers online and they get the money instantly while i still get some sort of protection? any tips and tricks? i love to learn ne tricks as i always buy online and mostly not from ebay etc...this is the first time a seller asks to return the money as he thinks i will scam him by filing a dispute with paypal plus he has no knowledge about paypal either  

[XenosTech]

I find that I can't win my disputes. Last two times I've used papypal to get a refund because the seller stopped responding after sending the money as goods and services and paypal denied the refund both times. Even attached screenshots and everything and they said evidence wasn't sufficient

[Stahlmann]

If a seller doesn't want to use the goods and services feature it's most likely because he's not legit. If he is legit he has nothing to fear. Either he gets the money as soon as you confirm the delivery, or after a few days of you not responding he gets the money anyway when he enters the tracking number.

[Howdy_World]

7 minutes ago, Stahlmann said:

If a seller doesn't want to use the goods and services feature it's most likely because he's not legit. If he is legit he has nothing to fear. Either he gets the money as soon as you confirm the delivery, or after a few days of you not responding he gets the money anyway when he enters the tracking number.

how does he get the money if he enters the tracking number only? you said that i need to confirm delivery by signing the package for him to get the money, or is there another way ? as i didnt understand the last sentence  "or after a few days of you not responding he gets the money anyway when he enters the tracking number."

[Needfuldoer]

7 hours ago, Howdy_World said:

ok, by any chance do you know of any way i can pay sellers online and they get the money instantly while i still get some sort of protection?

The platform holding funds in escrow until there's proof of services rendered or products delivered is your protection.

 

There are no "tips and tricks" to work around this, besides putting blind trust into the kindness of strangers acting in good faith, and being willing to write off the loss if when you get taken for a ride.

 

Even eBay does this. Revenue from Buy it Now listings gets held until the buyer gets their product, just like auctions.

 

7 hours ago, Howdy_World said:

how does he get the money if he enters the tracking number only? you said that i need to confirm delivery by signing the package for him to get the money, or is there another way ? as i didnt understand the last sentence  "or after a few days of you not responding he gets the money anyway when he enters the tracking number."

If he gives PayPal the tracking number, they can see that there's actually a package being sent to you and when it gets delivered. They have no way to know if he sent you the laptop you expected, and old broken laptop, or a baggie of dog poop, but they can see that he sent you a package which should be proof enough for them to release the funds to him.

 

The point where you have the package in your hands is where he alleges you're going to scam him. In theory if you were unscrupulous you could lie and tell PayPal you got dog poop when he actually did send you the laptop you wanted. This becomes a he-said-she-said debate, and most platforms side with the buyer in those cases. He would theoretically be out the laptop and the money. But if he actually sent you dog poop, you would get your money back.

 

That's why he wants you to send the money by friends and family. It removes all your protection and cedes all power in the transaction to him. He could send you a laptop, he could send you dog poop, he could send you nothing at all and disappear. Either way, you take what you're given and if you don't get what you expect then that's too bad because he already has your money and there's nothing you can do about it but cry.

[Howdy_World]

4 minutes ago, Needfuldoer said:

The platform holding funds in escrow until there's proof of services rendered or products delivered is your protection.

 

There are no "tips and tricks" to work around this, besides putting blind trust into the kindness of strangers acting in good faith, and being willing to write off the loss if when you get taken for a ride.

 

Even eBay does this. Revenue from Buy it Now listings gets held until the buyer gets their product.

ah yeah i was gonna ask about ebay, i see sellers stating that item will be shipped when payment is cleared and from what i observed thats after a day or two ? so does that mean on ebay the money gets released before the buyer confirm item received ? how about those items that get shipped without tracking number ? how would ebay/paypal know that the item is received if thats how it works with these platforms as a safety measure ?

[SupaKomputa]

20 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

sellers stating that item will be shipped when payment is cleared

no that is clearly a scam, this is 2022, the internet marketplace has been going for a decade, he suppose to know the procedure, or at least have someone explain it to him, same goes with ebay. he said he doesn't know how to post the tracking code, bullshit, classic scammers trick.

 

you on the other hand are stubborn. 

 

the money will be released after 21 days, if you dont make any complaint.

postal tracking number is required so that paypal know the seller is sending you the package.

they can track the shipment and start counting the days after you received the package with or without your clearance.

[Howdy_World]

46 minutes ago, Needfuldoer said:

The platform holding funds in escrow until there's proof of services rendered or products delivered is your protection.

 

There are no "tips and tricks" to work around this, besides putting blind trust into the kindness of strangers acting in good faith, and being willing to write off the loss if when you get taken for a ride.

 

Even eBay does this. Revenue from Buy it Now listings gets held until the buyer gets their product, just like auctions.

 

If he gives PayPal the tracking number, they can see that there's actually a package being sent to you and when it gets delivered. They have no way to know if he sent you the laptop you expected, and old broken laptop, or a baggie of dog poop, but they can see that he sent you a package which should be proof enough for them to release the funds to him.

 

The point where you have the package in your hands is where he alleges you're going to scam him. In theory if you were unscrupulous you could lie and tell PayPal you got dog poop when he actually did send you the laptop you wanted. This becomes a he-said-she-said debate, and most platforms side with the buyer in those cases. He would theoretically be out the laptop and the money. But if he actually sent you dog poop, you would get your money back.

 

That's why he wants you to send the money by friends and family. It removes all your protection and cedes all power in the transaction to him. He could send you a laptop, he could send you dog poop. Either way, you take what you're given and if you don't get what you expect then that's too bad because he already has your money and there's nothing you can do about it but cry.

ok understood, but if he takes the money once he upload the tracking number and i receive a box with nothing and i file a claim that seller didnt send me what i paid for, how would paypal get my money back if the seller already withdraw/used them when he uploaded the tracking number? just asking for my own knowledge, i got your idea to not pay a stranger online unless with paypal goods and services

[LogicalDrm]

54 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

ok, by any chance do you know of any way i can pay sellers online and they get the money instantly while i still get some sort of protection? any tips and tricks? i love to learn ne tricks

Yes and no. If they use Credit card processor, they will get transfer sort of instantly (it will still be held by banks and processing to check that your account has money and there aren't any flags on either side). Cons: they can steal and sell your CC info, disputing will take up to months and will flag your card from months to indefinitely, doing this multiple times will flag your bank account. Pros: payment is almost instant, there's always possibility to dispute/chargeback.

 

In short, using middlemen is only secure payment method there is. When paying with cash, its still risk. You give them $100 for $50 worth of stuff and get dollar in return. If there's no receipt or anything, you don't have proof that you've even given them any money.

[Howdy_World]

7 minutes ago, LogicalDrm said:

Yes and no. If they use Credit card processor, they will get transfer sort of instantly (it will still be held by banks and processing to check that your account has money and there aren't any flags on either side). Cons: they can steal and sell your CC info, disputing will take up to months and will flag your card from months to indefinitely, doing this multiple times will flag your bank account. Pros: payment is almost instant, there's always possibility to dispute/chargeback.

 

In short, using middlemen is only secure payment method there is. When paying with cash, its still risk. You give them $100 for $50 worth of stuff and get dollar in return. If there's no receipt or anything, you don't have proof that you've even given them any money.

ok thanks for the valuable info

[SupaKomputa]

28 minutes ago, Howdy_World said:

ok understood, but if he takes the money once he upload the tracking number and i receive a box with nothing and i file a claim that seller didnt send me what i paid for, how would paypal get my money back if the seller already withdraw/used them when he uploaded the tracking number? just asking for my own knowledge, i got your idea to not pay a stranger online unless with paypal goods and services

this is how it goes :
you pay to paypal -> paypal hold your money.

paypal give order to send package -> seller upload tracking number (money still in paypal).

package arrived (from tracking number) -> start counting 20 days (paypal still hold the money)

 

before 20 days you report package arrived -> money still hold until day 21.

before 20 days you send complaint -> money hold until problem resolved.

after 21 days no complaint or package report -> money released to the seller.

 

return policy:
if you and the seller accept return, the money still hold until the package arrived to the seller, then your money will be returned.

 

this way you and the seller are protected.

[Kisai]

7 hours ago, Howdy_World said:

its a laptop with rtx 2060 for 350 euros, the seller seems legit but doesnt want to understand that he has to upload the tracking number because he doesnt want to ship before he gets cleared payments, im so mad and frustrated because i bought many items this way before without issues, i think i should have sent the money by paypal friends and family   

No, never do that. 

 

If you are buying a physical product from a stranger, they should send you an invoice..

 

Money transfers generally exist in two forms:

"Friends/Family" - Where you trust they are not going to screw you. This is what Western Union/Wire/Transferwise/etc would be used for. There is no seller or buyer protection.

"Purchases, Contracts and Payroll" - Where you pay/are paid for a product, good, service, or employment.

 

Because Employment often involves employment-taxes, usually Paypal is not a good option for this, but sometimes ends up being the only way to pay staff in foreign countries, leaving the employee to have to figure out the taxes themselves.

 

At any rate, no, it sounds like you're being scammed.