Expert Needed: 5800X3D Memory Overclock Questions

[FreakRoom97]

Upgraded to a 5800X3D last month, been trying memory overclocking with a pair of sH!T binned dual rank b-dies (2x16, 3600C16@1.35v, Acer Predator).

 

How are my timings? (Any mistakes? Lower anything?)

 

Should I get a better memory kit? I’m currently running the sticks at 1.55v, if I get better binned b-dies will they perform the same with less voltage? (I have to use ram fans to make them stable over a longer period of time.)

 

The kit runs stable doing OCCT mem test and gaming (warzone).

 

Thank y’all

[TrigrH]

Try asking here:

https://www.overclock.net/threads/5800x3d-owners.1798046/page-50

You can also use this doc for reference:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1dsu9K1Nt_7apHBdiy0MWVPcYjf6nOlr9CtkkfN78tSo/edit#gid=197347422

[RONOTHAN##]

tRCDWR can basically always do 8 on B die

tRAS can probably go lower than 28 (most of the time you can set it to 21, though with tRP 14 you might be limited on tRAS thanks to tRC)

tWR might be able to do 10, both kits of dual rank B die do 10 on Ryzen, though granted they've both been better bins.

tWTR can probably do 6 or 7 instead of 8, though the performance difference probably isn't worth the effort. 

tCWL might be able to do 12, 90% of the time that timing is 1-2 ticks below tCL.

tRDRDSD and tWRWRSD can probably go a tick lower each, though maybe not.

 

Not a bad memory overclock you've got there. I'd be perfectly happy with what you've got, though I'd try setting those particular timings lower.

[Shimejii]

Honestly it seems that as long as its STABLE, id be fine with that. Remember you have to keep that in mind because windows has the wonderful habit of crashing during updates when ram is Overclocked and botching the windows update. So be mindful of that.

 

What workloads besides gaming are you trying to tune for?

[191x7]

Is this a mistake, 1.55V on DDR4?

[RONOTHAN##]

Just now, 191x7 said:

Is this a mistake, 1.55V on DDR4?

It's B die, as long as it's got some airflow 1.55V is fine. There are kits with XMPs rated at 1.6V IIRC with those memory chips, and they scale up to ~1.8V easy given they have direct airflow. 

[FreakRoom97]

56 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

tRCDWR can basically always do 8 on B die

tRAS can probably go lower than 28 (most of the time you can set it to 21, though with tRP 14 you might be limited on tRAS thanks to tRC)

tWR might be able to do 10, both kits of dual rank B die do 10 on Ryzen, though granted they've both been better bins.

tWTR can probably do 6 or 7 instead of 8, though the performance difference probably isn't worth the effort. 

tCWL might be able to do 12, 90% of the time that timing is 1-2 ticks below tCL.

tRDRDSD and tWRWRSD can probably go a tick lower each, though maybe not.

 

Not a bad memory overclock you've got there. I'd be perfectly happy with what you've got, though I'd try setting those particular timings lower.

Thank you! Lowered tRCDWR, tRDRDSD, and tWRWRSD. No luck on tWR, tWTR,and tCWL. The kit is not very expensive (sub $200), maybe I’ll keep overvolting until it explodes

[FreakRoom97]

31 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

It's B die, as long as it's got some airflow 1.55V is fine. There are kits with XMPs rated at 1.6V IIRC with those memory chips, and they scale up to ~1.8V easy given they have direct airflow. 

120mm fan @ 1500 rpm in a room with ac 

[RONOTHAN##]

23 minutes ago, FreakRoom97 said:

Thank you! Lowered tRCDWR, tRDRDSD, and tWRWRSD. No luck on tWR, tWTR,and tCWL. 

Do a couple stress tests, Linpack Xtreme, HCI Memtest, OCCT, etc. to make sure it's stable, some of the timings you're pushing are pretty tight (tRTP of 6 is very low in my experience) so it's possible you're not fully stable. Unstable RAM is annoying. 

 

23 minutes ago, FreakRoom97 said:

The kit is not very expensive (sub $200), maybe I’ll keep overvolting until it explodes

Wouldn't really recommend it, the performance difference between 1.5V and 1.8V+ is fairly low, only really mattering if you're doing competitive benchmarking, especially on the 5800X3D thanks to it's massive cache. Plus, a kit that doing 3800MHz CL14-14-14 at 1.55V is actually pretty good, most of the kits of good B die I've had don't do flat 14s at that voltage and clock, I'd want to keep that, especially since if you buy another it might not be B die depending on exactly what the kit is rated at. 

 

If you want to overclock memory because it's fun (fair enough), look on eBay/FB Marketplace/Craigslist for used Corsair memory kits. Corsair kits have a version number on them so you can know what's B die and what's not. Look on the sticker for "v4.31", that's Samsung B die. They're dirt cheap (I've seen a 16GB kit of B die Corsair go for $40) so you can feel free to overvolt them to your hearts content, and Corsair B die in those sticks (not 3600MHz CL14 or higher ratings, I'm talking about the cheap 3200MHz CL16 bins) isn't binned, so actually are playing the silicon lottery. Sometimes you get a kit that doesn't do more than 3200MHz, sometimes you get a kit that once you give it 1.6V will shoot to the moon with frequency and tighten timings like crazy. Other used kits aren't a bad idea, personally I've gotten 2 different dual rank Ripjaws V kits of B die bins (3200MHz CL14 and 4400MHz CL17) for $100 and $80 respectively, though while you can get good deals on other kits and it's worth checking, Corsair B die kits do tend to be the cheapest way to guarantee B die. 

[Somerandomtechyboi]

1 hour ago, 191x7 said:

Is this a mistake, 1.55V on DDR4?

Certain ics like samsung b die, micron rev e/b/j, hynix djr, etc. Can tolerate higher volts without issue. ~1.7v id consider fine to push on a ram chip thats capable of scaling upto and not degrading at that volt while also not degrading the imc, though at these kinds of volts your cooling is prob kneecapping your overclock anyways

 

Ofc b die scales 2.1v+ but at that point youd prob fry your imc rather than the ram itself cause at a certain voltage the imc may start degrading and at an even higher volt (2v+) it may straight up instadie

 

 

Personally i havent had any degradation to ram or imc running my ddr3 generic samsung rev f stick to 2.46v 8-11-10-20, but only reason im running deathzone volt is just because i can and i have trash hardware i dont care about degrading or killing (x5660 has garbage 3rd core and ram is horrible with timings), though still id keep atleast a 0.3v buffer from the boards max settable voltage to make sure sht doesnt start degrading, though at some point cooling will be a limiter, esp if you have an ic that doesnt scale with volt much like my ddr2 nanya d die, does 1520 7-9-6-9 (noice) at a rather measly 2.38v but if it heats up too much itll crash, even when the damn thing is only warm or barely warm. Though that doesnt mean volt scaling dies like b die are immune either, it just means youll prob run into a temp wall at a higher volt

 

The github ddr4 oc tutorial is surprisingly comprehensive and great for noobs and experienced alike, maybe itll also help op. I also suggest watching or listening to buildzoid in the background as he is also a great source of info for ram oc, he also does b die oc so you may be able to take some of his settings as a reference to help your ram oc

 

2 hours ago, FreakRoom97 said:

Upgraded to a 5800X3D last month, been trying memory overclocking with a pair of sH!T binned dual rank b-dies (2x16, 3600C16@1.35v, Acer Predator).

 

How are my timings? (Any mistakes? Lower anything?)

 

Should I get a better memory kit? I’m currently running the sticks at 1.55v, if I get better binned b-dies will they perform the same with less voltage? (I have to use ram fans to make them stable over a longer period of time.)

 

The kit runs stable doing OCCT mem test and gaming (warzone).

 

Thank y’all

That doesnt look like a sht bin if it can run straight 14s like that, but you could have just lucked out with a sht bin ram and got good b die ics

 

Honestly if i were you op i would immedeatly test that garbage stick capabilities at 2-2.1v, but im the kind of idiot to throw safety out of the window from time to time so i suggest not doing bullcrap like me unless you know what you are doing or happen to have disposable hardware

 

Ideally youd be running the stick near 1.75v though that can be pretty hard to cool, i do still suggest giving it a go as theres no risk of ram degradation and prob next to no risk of imc degradation cause if 2v over a few hours of benching wont degrade the imc noticably then i doubt 1.75v will, though if you wanna stay on the safe side then 1.65v as i have seen ppl daily around that volt and they seem to all be fine, over 1.75v and you need to half ram capacity cause b die gets unstable when you let windows access all the available ram at over 1.75v so dont bother

 

Btw what timings is that bin? 16-16-16 or crappier 16-18-18/16-19-19? 3600 16-16-16 is pretty much the same thing as 3200 cl14 binning wise so in that case itd be decent bin, the other cl16 bins are garbage that most modern ics should be capable of, even garbage ics like samsung c die that dont scale above 1.35v and even degrade above 1.35v

[FreakRoom97]

4 minutes ago, Somerandomtechyboi said:

Certain ics like samsung b die, micron rev e/b/j, hynix djr, etc. Can tolerate higher volts without issue. ~1.7v id consider fine to push on a ram chip thats capable of scaling upto and not degrading at that volt while also not degrading the imc, though at these kinds of volts your cooling is prob kneecapping your overclock anyways

 

Ofc b die scales 2.1v+ but at that point youd prob fry your imc rather than the ram itself cause at a certain voltage the imc may start degrading and at an even higher volt (2v+) it may straight up instadie

 

 

Personally i havent had any degradation to ram or imc running my ddr3 generic samsung rev f stick to 2.46v 8-11-10-20, but only reason im running deathzone volt is just because i can and i have trash hardware i dont care about degrading or killing (x5660 has garbage 3rd core and ram is horrible with timings), though still id keep atleast a 0.3v buffer from the boards max settable voltage to make sure sht doesnt start degrading, though at some point cooling will be a limiter, esp if you have an ic that doesnt scale with volt much like my ddr2 nanya d die, does 1520 7-9-6-9 (noice) at a rather measly 2.38v but if it heats up too much itll crash, even when the damn thing is only warm or barely warm. Though that doesnt mean volt scaling dies like b die are immune either, it just means youll prob run into a temp wall at a higher volt

 

The github ddr4 oc tutorial is surprisingly comprehensive and great for noobs and experienced alike, maybe itll also help op. I also suggest watching or listening to buildzoid in the background as he is also a great source of info for ram oc, he also does b die oc so you may be able to take some of his settings as a reference to help your ram oc

 

That doesnt look like a sht bin if it can run straight 14s like that, but you could have just lucked out with a sht bin ram and got good b die ics

 

Honestly if i were you op i would immedeatly test that garbage stick capabilities at 2-2.1v, but im the kind of idiot to throw safety out of the window from time to time so i suggest not doing bullcrap like me unless you know what you are doing or happen to have disposable hardware

 

Ideally youd be running the stick near 1.75v though that can be pretty hard to cool, i do still suggest giving it a go as theres no risk of ram degradation and prob next to no risk of imc degradation cause if 2v over a few hours of benching wont degrade the imc noticably then i doubt 1.75v will, though if you wanna stay on the safe side then 1.65v as i have seen ppl daily around that volt and they seem to all be fine, over 1.75v and you need to half ram capacity cause b die gets unstable when you let windows access all the available ram at over 1.75v so dont bother

 

Btw what timings is that bin? 16-16-16 or crappier 16-18-18/16-19-19? 3600 16-16-16 is pretty much the same thing as 3200 cl14 binning wise so in that case itd be decent bin, the other cl16 bins are garbage that most modern ics should be capable of, even garbage ics like samsung c die that dont scale above 1.35v and even degrade above 1.35v

16-16-16-36@1.35V, I just got into ram overclocking recently, been eyeing the high end dominators and royals🥹

[Somerandomtechyboi]

17 minutes ago, FreakRoom97 said:

16-16-16-36@1.35V, I just got into ram overclocking recently, been eyeing the high end dominators and royals🥹

thats a b die bin, equivalent to 3200 cl14, thats not garbage b dies you find in those 3200 cl16 or 3600 cl18/garbage cl16 rams

 

Dominators and royals are just pointless, no reason to buy em when a 3200 cl14/3600 cl16 (16-16-16) bin will do 4800+ cl16 given enough volt (~1.7v), youd get more out of subzero cooling your rams than wasting money on overpriced tridentz royals, unfortunately dual rank is pretty hard to run on most boards so assuming you dont got a great oc board like b550 unify (x)/b550 aorus master then youll prob have a hard time reaching much more than 4200 on a dual rank config which wont make up for the latency penalty when running desync fclk

 

I do suggest trying to raise fclk more, i think there are some volts you can tweak to potentially increase fclk clock capability

 

Now id suggest trying to run the tightest timings possible on 1.65-1.75v, maybe cl13 is doable

[FreakRoom97]

1 hour ago, RONOTHAN## said:

Do a couple stress tests, Linpack Xtreme, HCI Memtest, OCCT, etc. to make sure it's stable, some of the timings you're pushing are pretty tight (tRTP of 6 is very low in my experience) so it's possible you're not fully stable. Unstable RAM is annoying. 

 

Wouldn't really recommend it, the performance difference between 1.5V and 1.8V+ is fairly low, only really mattering if you're doing competitive benchmarking, especially on the 5800X3D thanks to it's massive cache. Plus, a kit that doing 3800MHz CL14-14-14 at 1.55V is actually pretty good, most of the kits of good B die I've had don't do flat 14s at that voltage and clock, I'd want to keep that, especially since if you buy another it might not be B die depending on exactly what the kit is rated at. 

 

If you want to overclock memory because it's fun (fair enough), look on eBay/FB Marketplace/Craigslist for used Corsair memory kits. Corsair kits have a version number on them so you can know what's B die and what's not. Look on the sticker for "v4.31", that's Samsung B die. They're dirt cheap (I've seen a 16GB kit of B die Corsair go for $40) so you can feel free to overvolt them to your hearts content, and Corsair B die in those sticks (not 3600MHz CL14 or higher ratings, I'm talking about the cheap 3200MHz CL16 bins) isn't binned, so actually are playing the silicon lottery. Sometimes you get a kit that doesn't do more than 3200MHz, sometimes you get a kit that once you give it 1.6V will shoot to the moon with frequency and tighten timings like crazy. Other used kits aren't a bad idea, personally I've gotten 2 different dual rank Ripjaws V kits of B die bins (3200MHz CL14 and 4400MHz CL17) for $100 and $80 respectively, though while you can get good deals on other kits and it's worth checking, Corsair B die kits do tend to be the cheapest way to guarantee B die. 

Thank you for the advices! I’ll make use of them in the future. The tuning seems to be working fine. I have OCCT AVX2 95% open for an hour now, will proceed testing the ram by playing warzone.