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AMD fTPM causing random stuttering.

Had an idea but again likely far off. I wonder if it's a server key retrieval/timeout issue. Something like Windows periodically requests data to make sure the key/certificate hasn't been tampered with or even removed. The internal fTPM url of where it sends/requests data is being blocked by the router/windows/anti virus firewall and when this happens it freaks out.

 

It doesn't happen with a hardware type tpm because this likely doesn't broadcast data as it's harder to compromise than a software approach.

 

The only way to know for sure would be to run a program like wireshark and monitor incoming/outgoing requests around the time the issue happens. Worth even remotely trying or is this far fetched?

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Good lord this has been plagueing me ever since I upgraded from X370 to X570, on my old gigabyte board I had the dedicated TPM, then when I went to Zen3 I decided to use the fTPM.

 

I thought I had a gremlin or something, couldn't figure it out and it was driving me nuts.

 

Now I am looking to buy the discrete TPM for my MSI X570 Tomahawk Max WiFi and the documentation is literal ass. Does anyone who can decipher their ridiculous documentation have any clue which actual chip I should be buying?

 

I don't want to turn off Bitlocker or rely on using the decyption key as I am away from home a lot and use game streaming so one reboot will take me offline til I can get home, and it would take days to decrypt my larger spin disks.

 

Edit for anyone curious: I ended up finding what I needed, MS-4136 for my MSI X570. 

Bwoop Bwoop its the sound of the police'

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6 minutes ago, caramelgeoff said:

Good lord this has been plagueing me ever since I upgraded from X370 to X570, on my old gigabyte board I had the dedicated TPM, then when I went to Zen3 I decided to use the fTPM.

 

I thought I had a gremlin or something, couldn't figure it out and it was driving me nuts.

 

Now I am looking to buy the discrete TPM for my MSI X570 Tomahawk Max WiFi and the documentation is literal ass. Does anyone who can decipher their ridiculous documentation have any clue which actual chip I should be buying?

 

I don't want to turn off Bitlocker or rely on using the decyption key as I am away from home a lot and use game streaming so one reboot will take me offline til I can get home, and it would take days to decrypt my larger spin disks.

Apologies if I'm off track, but you currently use BitLocker and don't want to disable fTPM because of that, correct? Or am I misreading?

 

I used BitLocker on a previous machine and it bit me bad with no recovery. Never again! Veracrypt (fork of Truecrypt) is an absolute solid choice if you want to encrypt your drives. I have used it for many years. No problem disabling fTPM and still keeping encryption if that's what you're after.

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17 minutes ago, TreesP said:

Apologies if I'm off track, but you currently use BitLocker and don't want to disable fTPM because of that, correct? Or am I misreading?

 

I used BitLocker on a previous machine and it bit me bad with no recovery. Never again! Veracrypt (fork of Truecrypt) is an absolute solid choice if you want to encrypt your drives. I have used it for many years. No problem disabling fTPM and still keeping encryption if that's what you're after.

Yeah, I currently use bitlocker. If I turn off the fTPM I fall back to my system needing the decryption key at startup. Bitlocker itself is fine for my needs I just need the TPM so my system can be rebooted and managed remotely. (can't enter the key remotely!)

 

I have offline storage of my bitlocker decryption keys so not to worried about that part.

 

For anyone looking I ended up finding what I needed, MS-4136 for my MSI X570. 

Bwoop Bwoop its the sound of the police'

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7 minutes ago, caramelgeoff said:

Yeah, I currently use bitlocker. If I turn off the fTPM I fall back to my system needing the decryption key at startup. Bitlocker itself is fine for my needs I just need the TPM so my system can be rebooted and managed remotely.

 

For anyone looking I ended up finding what I needed, MS-4136 for my MSI X570. 

I'm not sure what to suggest in your case. I switched to Veracrypt for whole disk encryption (local) when BitLocker let me down, and it was/has been faultless. I don't use it for whole disc encryption now, I use encrypted containers with Veracrypt and they can be mounted on all platforms/devices with a portable version.

 

If you need remote access, maybe look into Virtualbox? Not sure how that works with BitLocker though.

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10 hours ago, gymleader said:

One thing I will point out. This is likely unrelated but thought I would bring it up because who knows. Hopefully someone can disprove this.

 

So when I first built the PC I had a RM1000x. I was learning stuff about voltages so for those 2-3 days I didn't notice this issue. Yesterday I replaced the power supply with an older RM850x as I knew that had good voltage rails to check if there was any differences to the RM1000x I had installed.

 

This first stutter (I have noticed anyway) coincidentally happened 40 minutes after putting this 850w in. There are reports of even 3080s tripping OCP on 850w PSU so I wonder if the random power spiking of GPUs is just enough to make something weird happen on the PSU/CPU momentarily? Like it's not enough to trigger OCP but it's enough to cause this issue people have experienced. The ftpm thing fixing it is just a mask. Maybe it also can't handle the power spikes from the GPU?

 

Does anyone have more than an 850w PSU (say 1000w=+) that can confirm they still have the issue?

 

Also Asus has released AGESA 1.2.0.6 so maybe this helps?

It almost always happens on the desktop when very little is going on, on my system.  Those power spikes will only happen under heavy load.  On the topic of tripping overcurrent protection though, that only happens on power supplies with overly sensitive protection circuits, of which Seasonic seems to be one of the primary offenders.

One GPU-related connection I have noticed though, is that disabling hardware GPU scheduling (something I did for unrelated reasons) seems to have reduced the frequency of the problem.  It doesn't really make any sense why that would affect this issue, but it seems to have on my system.  It's a moot point though since it still happens so I still need to disable fTPM.

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Looks like I have the same stutter bug, it happens randomly I don't know how to trigger it, even with no system load just an open browser nothing else.

The sound is distorted ( sounds for me like freezes in an console emulator) and the mouse cursor hangs for ~1.5 sec.

 

I had luck to capture it on video while streaming.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAnSf3tDcjU

 

My PC Specifications:

  • CPU: AMD Ryzen 9 5950X
  • RAM: G.Skill TridentZ Neo 2x16GB (32GB total)
  • Motherboard: ASUS ROG Crosshair VIII Dark Hero (BIOS 3904 (12/2021))
  • GPU: AMD Radeon RX Vega 56
  • Cooling: NZXT Kraken Z73 (360mm rad)
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50 minutes ago, CraYu said:

it happens randomly I don't know how to trigger it, even with no system load just an open browser nothing else.

Yep, looks like exactly the same thing, and the same annoying issue of what exactly is causing this? We know disabling fTPM solves it, but what is going on?

 

I read on the Lenovo forums that they dismissed a customer warranty purely based on the fact that they were not able to reproduce it on demand when they had the unit in their possession. It was sent back with the same issue. How do you reproduce a totally random stutter? If it was repeatable on demand, it would not be random.

 

Anyhow, disable fTPM and your problem will vanish.

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1 hour ago, CraYu said:

Looks like I have the same stutter bug, it happens randomly I don't know how to trigger it, even with no system load just an open browser nothing else.

The sound is distorted ( sounds for me like freezes in an console emulator) and the mouse cursor hangs for ~1.5 sec.

 

I had luck to capture it on video while streaming.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAnSf3tDcjU

 

My PC Specifications:

  • CPU: AMD Ryzen 9 5950X
  • RAM: G.Skill TridentZ Neo 2x16GB (32GB total)
  • Motherboard: ASUS ROG Crosshair VIII Dark Hero (BIOS 3904 (12/2021))
  • GPU: AMD Radeon RX Vega 56
  • Cooling: NZXT Kraken Z73 (360mm rad)

Just curious what PSU do you have?

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11 minutes ago, TreesP said:

Yep, looks like exactly the same thing, and the same annoying issue of what exactly is causing this? We know disabling fTPM solves it, but what is going on?

 

I read on the Lenovo forums that they dismissed a customer warranty purely based on the fact that they were not able to reproduce it on demand when they had the unit in their possession. It was sent back with the same issue. How do you reproduce a totally random stutter? If it was repeatable on demand, it would not be random.

 

Anyhow, disable fTPM and your problem will vanish.

Yes that would be not random if it can be triggered, If I would know what Windows is doing in the background maybe then.

 

I'll give it a try after downgrading the BIOS to 3601, with the current one it's not possible to disable TPM.

 

Just now, gymleader said:

Just curious what PSU do you have?

Corsair RM750x

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Someone just shared a possible fix for this issue on reddit, if you guys want to try it

 

The fix suggests you to disable an TPM Function called "TpmCoreProvFunctionLogger", to disable this use ViVe Tool and use the command "vivetool addconfig 31621124 1" 

 

To revert back, use "vivetool delconfig 31621124 1"

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Yep, disable fTPM through trusted computing in bios seems to "fix" the issue for now.

 

But, this is only consider as a workaround.

 

We need a real fix from AMD / Microsoft that let us enable fTPM without causing random stuttering. 

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My setup is a 5900X 6900XT X570 Taichi

 

The easiest way to reproduce the issue for me is:

  • Have fTPM enabled ofc.
  • Have 2 monitors attached to the graphics card. DP or HDMI does not seem to matter.
  • Open CS:GO on one monitor.
  • Open VLC and play video or music on the second screen

On my setup stutters happen pretty much every 1-5 Minutes.

 

Disable fTPM and the stutters are completely gone.

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On 1/28/2022 at 1:45 AM, djmakk said:

I have test both a 3700x, 3800x, and a 5800x in the same board. Same issue. Both cleaned installs. If its CPU dependent then the fault rate is extremely high. Also dont pcie bus errons get logged in Event Viewer? There is never an entry with this stutter. 

AMD turned down AER reporting in Agesa 1.0.3 for Zen2 and later, it only logs fatal errors now.

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This seemed to happen to me just now after installing a physical TPM module (fTPM disabled) I got the audio and video stutter, however this was while streaming from my Ryzen PC to my (also Ryzen) laptop with Windows 11 (and therefore fTPM of some sort probably). So it could be either of those, I'm not sure but I never noticed it before on the laptop.

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Glad to find this topic and know that I'm not alone on this. I caught the stutter on video as well.

 

I've been having this stuttering issue since July last year, when I enabled fTPM for the first time. I'm running Windows 10 on a Ryzen 5900X with a Gigabyte X570 Pro WiFi (rev 1.2 / BIOS F35d). Back in July, I was on BIOS version F33. It happens while listening to music, watching videos, editing videos and during gaming also. It happens for about 3-4 times a day and doesn't seem to be affecting performance or anything else.

 

One thing I noticed though... While the stutter is happening, the Power Reporting Deviation on HWiNFO reports a low percentage and switches to red for the duration of the stutter.

 

image.png.e3378b780c2350c5b66ce728c9f61c11.png

 

Hoping to catch the moment where the stutter would happen, I decided to record the screen with OBS while watching today's WAN Show. I also had HWiNfO and the Task Manager on screen for the recording. A few seconds went by and it happened...

 


It happens on 0:11. You can definitely see a lot of values jumping for a brief second and Power Reporting Deviation having a new minimum. Also, it sounds way worse on my headphones than the OBS recording. The sound freezes for a second like Windows is about to BSOD.

 

Here's my main components:

Motherboard: Gigabyte X570 Pro WiFi (rev 1.2 / latest BIOS)
CPU: AMD Ryzen 5900X
VGA: ASUS TUF 3060 Ti LHR
RAM: 2x 16GB RAM @ 3200MHz (Corsair Vengeance Pro RGB)
Sound Card: ASUS Xonar Essence STX Sound Card
PSU: Cooler Master V850 Power Supply
System SSD: PNY NVME CS3030 500GB
Windows 10 Pro 21H2 (with updated drivers and latest system updates)

 

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Some of our Russia news sites made articles about this issue. Like this one https://3dnews.ru/1059041/svyazannaya-s-modulem-amd-ftpm-oshibka-stala-prichinoy-podvisaniy-windows?utm_source=yxnews&utm_medium=mobile that referring to this news, I guess, https://hothardware.com/news/bugs-in-ryzen-ftpm-reportedly-tanking-windows-11-performance

I wonder if now AMD or whoever will notice this and fix it.

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I have windows 10 and i am facing the same problem if i enable or switch the ftpm modes. Initially i changed it to be able to get the win11 eligibility , but now i turned it back to it's old state and f*** it . I refuse to upgrade . This is a bios /microcode level issue , no windows update will fix it . My motherboard is an asus X570 Tuf gaming plus ,paired with a 3900X cpu

I hATE sIGNATURES  ;)

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Hey guys,

 

I found smt on Reddit, which has worked for me so far:

 

 

You may try and report if it works for you.

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Might be totally unrelated but here goes. Couple days ago this got posted as a preview build for an upcoming WIndows 11 update (I think I'm correct in stating this anyway):

 

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/topic/january-25-2022-kb5008353-os-build-22000-469-preview-920e6297-567b-4b95-afe9-35d17de02c3a

 

I did a ctrl + f for tpm and sure enough under improvements and fixes:

 

"Addresses an issue that might cause the Get-TPM PowerShell command to fail when it attempts to report Trusted Platform Module (TPM) information. The command fails with the error, “0x80090011 Microsoft.Tpm.Commands.TpmWmiException,Microsoft.Tpm.Commands.GetTpmCommand"

 

 

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1 hour ago, gymleader said:

Might be totally unrelated but here goes. Couple days ago this got posted as a preview build for an upcoming WIndows 11 update (I think I'm correct in stating this anyway):

 

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/topic/january-25-2022-kb5008353-os-build-22000-469-preview-920e6297-567b-4b95-afe9-35d17de02c3a

 

I did a ctrl + f for tpm and sure enough under improvements and fixes:

 

"Addresses an issue that might cause the Get-TPM PowerShell command to fail when it attempts to report Trusted Platform Module (TPM) information. The command fails with the error, “0x80090011 Microsoft.Tpm.Commands.TpmWmiException,Microsoft.Tpm.Commands.GetTpmCommand"

 

 

I think it's nothing about AMD, just an another error from fTPM.

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Well well well naughty ASUS. I've been having this issue with my X570 Dark Hero + 5950x on W10 for months and months and I can't disable fTPM at all on current or latest BIOS.

Downgraded to ASUS 3601 BIOS, disabled fTPM and re-did overclock. Everything seems fine so far

MOAR COARS: 5GHz "Confirmed" Black Edition™ The Build
AMD 5950X 4.7/4.6GHz All Core Dynamic OC + 1900MHz FCLK | 5GHz+ PBO | ASUS X570 Dark Hero | 32 GB 3800MHz 14-15-15-30-48-1T GDM 8GBx4 |  PowerColor AMD Radeon 6900 XT Liquid Devil @ 2700MHz Core + 2130MHz Mem | 2x 480mm Rad | 8x Blacknoise Noiseblocker NB-eLoop B12-PS Black Edition 120mm PWM | Thermaltake Core P5 TG Ti + Additional 3D Printed Rad Mount

 

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Interesting, I have yet to see an issue on any of my AMD machines under Windows 11 (running a 5950x, 3950x, and 4750U Pro respectively).

Is there a conclusive test or way to trigger the stutter? I'm curious if I've gotten lucky or if I've just missed it happening.

The Potato Box:

AMD 5950X

EVGA K|NGP|N 3090

128GB 3600 CL16 RAM

 

The Scrapyard Warrior:

AMD 3950x

EVGA FTW3 2080Ti

64GB 3200 CL16 RAM

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Happened to me I was on Windows 11 beta and updated on thru. And I had so much background usage via userbenchmark. I ended up flashing  back to 10 and taking the update again without going thru the beta. I haven't seen any stutter even when I had the high background usage. But I auto overclock to the max it'll let me with Ryzen Master. Ol 3950x it's a brute.

 

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Hi everyone.

I reported audio lagging/stuttering issues on my Asus G15 on reddit and stumbled across this thread a while back when trying to find a fix:

With the regedit fix and power mode modification, I am still getting random stuttering. 

Has anyone been able to turn of fTPM on their laptops? 

 

Thanks 

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