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Since LTT is in the business of acquiring cards and reselling them at EMMESSARPEE so people can avoid inflated prices maybe it's not in anyone's interest that any cards get bad-mouthed at this time.

With LMG's VAG programme in mind, in whose interest is a relationship with a manufacturer or supplier soured by cynicism? 

 

Do people want a chance at a new high-end card, or do people want their prejudices about the value of a toy justified in a video?

 

 

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5 hours ago, Rex Hite said:

Since LTT is in the business of acquiring cards and reselling them at EMMESSARPEE so people can avoid inflated prices maybe it's not in anyone's interest that any cards get bad-mouthed at this time.

With LMG's VAG programme in mind, in whose interest is a relationship with a manufacturer or supplier soured by cynicism? 

 

Do people want a chance at a new high-end card, or do people want their prejudices about the value of a toy justified in a video?

 

 

What are you even talking about?

 

If value is not something to consider in a review, then it's time to stop reviewing and just be a marketing channel at that point. Now Linus did mention value, but his take makes no sense. The 3080Ti is too expensive as a gaming card. It doesn't have enough VRAM as a "value" 3090. So what purpose is it serving exactly other than Nvidia trying to get in on money scalpers would get from gamers on 3080's and tinfoil hat theory, taking away silicon that might have gone towards 3080's as they can make more money from 3090's and 3080Ties.

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10 minutes ago, Sir Beregond said:

What are you even talking about?

 

If value is not something to consider in a review, then it's time to stop reviewing and just be a marketing channel at that point.

Yes.

LMG's product is not reviews, their product is engagement. In that context I think the two reviews in question are perfectly fine.

That, taken in consideration with the VAG brings into focus why those reviews are 'fine, on-brand, and of far more potential benefit to the viewer than a 'salty' review that simply copies the sentiment of channels that don't have a VAG.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Rex Hite said:

Yes.

LMG's product is not reviews, their product is engagement. In that context I think the two reviews in question are perfectly fine.

That, taken in consideration with the VAG brings into focus why those reviews are 'fine, on-brand, and of far more potential benefit to the viewer than a 'salty' review that simply copies the sentiment of channels that don't have a VAG.

 

 

And of what value is that to a consumer/customer and the audience? VAG is nice and all, but let's be honest, extremely limited, so that shouldn't factor at all into sentiments in a review. Pricing is definitely screwed right now, but unless you have unlimited money like certain youtubers, will always play a factor in deciding good and bad value products. If you want to call it "engagement", that's just fancy mental gymnastics to otherwise get around a review with bad take and a bad conclusion as the video was very much a review like any other review.

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Value is suggested by the seller but determined by the buyer, or viewer, in this case.

 

It's fair that many viewers can see no value in the videos. As was made clear, those videos have limited appeal because the products under review have limited appeal. It seemed obvious from the videos and Linus has been upfront about making that point explicit. Not every video can be for everybody. This video card situation has really emphasized the economic divides in the video card marketplace.

 

Engagement is important because it's the job. It's not incidental or a by-product of the process. It helps pay the bills.  A video is a cost and engagement is the reward. So I think it's good to watch these videos bearing that in mind.

 

Since LMG has developed a buy/seller/broker relationship with video card suppliers for VAG they have taken on additional responsibilities. I hope people appreciate what LMG has taken on.

 

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49 minutes ago, Rex Hite said:

Value is suggested by the seller but determined by the buyer, or viewer, in this case.

 

It's fair that many viewers can see no value in the videos. As was made clear, those videos have limited appeal because the products under review have limited appeal. It seemed obvious from the videos and Linus has been upfront about making that point explicit. Not every video can be for everybody. This video card situation has really emphasized the economic divides in the video card marketplace.

 

Engagement is important because it's the job. It's not incidental or a by-product of the process. It helps pay the bills.  A video is a cost and engagement is the reward. So I think it's good to watch these videos bearing that in mind.

 

Since LMG has developed a buy/seller/broker relationship with video card suppliers for VAG they have taken on additional responsibilities. I hope people appreciate what LMG has taken on.

 

So basically what you are saying is LMG is not allowed to have a bad opinion on a clearly crappy value horrible card for gamers (for the money) because of their corporate overlords. Got it.

 

Keep calling that "engagement". If true it just means lost credibility. Any content is "engagement". So I don't see what you are going on about. Is it a review or not?

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I think VAG has created a complicated relationship for LMG.

I'm sure they want to be unbiased and have their rules for that. I bet they even follow those rules.

 

But it would be awkward for them to declare a card a waste of silicon, something no one wanted or asked for, terrible value even at the non scalped price and a cynical ploy by NVIDIA to foist overpriced products on an already frustrated market, then offer it in the VAG. That would discredit their review. They would be offering a product they don't recommend. That would be a very cynical thing to do and I don't see why they would or should.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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6 hours ago, Sir Beregond said:

but unless you have unlimited money like certain youtubers, will always play a factor in deciding good and bad value products. If you want to call it "engagement", that's just fancy mental gymnastics to otherwise get around a review with bad take and a bad conclusion as the video was very much a review like any other review.

Have we watched the same LTT video? 🤔

They said the 3080TI is as fast as a 3090 while gaming (8k not included). It's $300 cheaper than a 3090. In conclusion it's an OK deal for pure gaming. And they said: "if you can find it for MSRP it's a no-brainer". All of these things are logical and true but yet you complain about the price of a product nobody has to buy while nobody is even able to buy anything. If you could choose, you shouldn't choose the 3080TI as a value proposition but the 3070 or 3060. It offers little more performance for a highly inflated price like each and every high-end product before. What a revelation.

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Just now, HenrySalayne said:

Have we watched the same LTT video? 🤔

They said the 3080TI is as fast as a 3090 while gaming (8k not included). It's $300 cheaper than a 3090. In conclusion it's an OK deal for pure gaming. And they said: "if you can find it for MSRP it's a no-brainer". All of these things are logical and true but yet you complain about the price of a product nobody has to buy while nobody is even able to buy anything. If you could choose, you shouldn't choose the 3080TI as a value proposition but the 3070 or 3060. It offers little more performance for a highly inflated price like each and every high-end product before. What a revelation.

A 3090 is at best 10% average better than a 3080. They are within the same tiers of performance.

 

In the past, a Titan would be the true halo product, and gaming cards like the 780Ti, 980Ti, 1080Ti, and even the 2080Ti represented a tier of higher performance over the base 80 class part that usually represented some form of performance increase value for dollar over the base 80 class part...the 2080Ti being not the best one, but still 20-30% was usually the performance uplift.

 

So why do we keep lowering what a "halo" product is in order to justify highly inflated MSRPs for gaming cards? A 3090 has 24GB which helps in areas Titans are used for, but let's make one thing clear, it is not a Titan until it can use Titan pro-sumer drivers.

 

The point is, the LTT review was still justifying the 3080Ti as a card to get at MSRP with a double-down on WAN Show as a "halo product". How many halo products are there going to be in one generation??? So not only is it the most expensive launch price for a xx80Ti class card...ever. It offers the LEAST performance uplift over the base xx80 class card...ever.

 

All in all there really is no justification for this card as a gaming card. 12GB we've established is not enough for professional use like in Adobe. So who exactly is this card targeting aside from gamers already getting screwed hard? I guess Nvidia might as well get in on the screwing?

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9 hours ago, Sir Beregond said:

It offers the LEAST performance uplift over the base xx80 class card...ever.

Yeah. That's what I've been saying. Comparing the card to the 3090, the price seems fine. Marketing dept. win. Compare it to the 3080, and you have issues. It's a matter of perspective. Some people gobble it up, and some people see through it. Linus used to see through it, but seems to be gobbling it up this time around.

 

Just because we live in a time when prices are inflated and product is scarce, doesn't mean you have to accept what they offer. Whoever "they" is. This is how new norms are created, and for the most part, new norms are just higher prices.

 

Gold plated shit is still shit.

Be patient.

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16 hours ago, Cvet76 said:

Yeah. That's what I've been saying. Comparing the card to the 3090, the price seems fine. Marketing dept. win. Compare it to the 3080, and you have issues. It's a matter of perspective. Some people gobble it up, and some people see through it. Linus used to see through it, but seems to be gobbling it up this time around.

 

Just because we live in a time when prices are inflated and product is scarce, doesn't mean you have to accept what they offer. Whoever "they" is. This is how new norms are created, and for the most part, new norms are just higher prices.

 

Gold plated shit is still shit.

Yeah but one needs to evaluate the 3090 as a card too. The 24GB certainly helps with professional use cases, but still, it's not actually a Titan halo product.

 

You are right, new norms get created. What passes as halo products now in the form of Titans or 3090's used to just be a GTX 580 tier card back in the day. Then AMD sucked so Nvidia shifted tiers in chips, kept the same names and prices and suddenly we paid more for less and that same price x80 card suddenly had the chips used in x60 tier cards. Than the first $1000 GPU came out with the original Titan, but that was ok, its prosumer and a "halo products". Seems the lines keep shifting. The 3080 was a shift in the right direction at $699 and containing top chip (albeit cutdown), but still a step in the right direction after the horrible pricing and value of the 20-series. Seems we are just bound to go back the other way again.

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