Apple cracking down on apps that have high subscription fees

[The Court of Demons]

 

 

Summary

 Apple to determine which app subscriptions are ripoffs  

 

Quotes

Quote

 

Now confirmed: Apple is rejecting apps with irrationally high prices for in-apps and subscriptions.

 

My thoughts

When one of the masters of ripping of people determine that your app may be a rip-off, I need some WD-40 for my gears right now

Sources

 

 

[JamesTheFolf]

15 minutes ago, The Court of Demons said:

 

 

Summary

 Apple to determine which app subscriptions are ripoffs  

 

Quotes

 

My thoughts

When one of the masters of ripping of people determine that your app may be a rip-off, I need some WD-40 for my gears right now

Sources

 

 

I'm surprised because on those apps they make even more money because the subscriptions are more. This could affect their bottom line pretty heavily depending on how many apps are affected. Tho I really wonder what do they use to determine if an app is charging too much for their subscription.

[Guest]

Sounds like good guy apple tbh. 

[Dedayog]

Lol, sounds like a PR stunt to me.

 

Apple's 30% take from apps is already so obscene.

 

Bottom line?  Apple is a $1 trillion+ company and has damn near $200 billion in CASH.  

 

Apple Q1 cash hoard: Here's how much Apple has on hand (cnbc.com)

 

 

[Fnige]

Just now, Dedayog said:

Apple's 30% take from apps is already so obscene.

 

I should point out that 30% is industry standard. Nothing special about apple with that

[Dedayog]

1 minute ago, SlimyPython said:

I should point out that 30% is industry standard. Nothing special about apple with that

They're the ones that set that industry standard.  Sure, I'll lump Google in as complete greedy pricks too. 

[Fnige]

1 minute ago, Dedayog said:

They're the ones that set that industry standard.  Sure, I'll lump Google in as complete greedy pricks too. 

and steam, gog. A lot more if i bothered to look around a bit more.

 

I guess the main question would be how much does it cost to actually host something like this

[DrMacintosh]

59 minutes ago, jrhaberland said:

I'm surprised because on those apps they make even more money because the subscriptions are more.

You really shouldn't be, because consumers getting ripped off from apps that bill you weekly negatively reflects on the App Store and Apple overall. 

[DrMacintosh]

10 minutes ago, Dedayog said:

Lol, sounds like a PR stunt to me.

Ensuring your platform doesn't become filled with scams is a PR stunt, sure. 

[Bombastinator]

25 minutes ago, Dedayog said:

They're the ones that set that industry standard.  Sure, I'll lump Google in as complete greedy pricks too. 

Not sure That is true.  Might be of course.

[NicBas48]

38 minutes ago, SlimyPython said:

I should point out that 30% is industry standard. Nothing special about apple with that

Apple has made the 30% fee an industry standard with only a few other app stores like Google. The problem is those app stores don't allow subscription purchases from other payment like Stripe that only charge a 2.9% fee + $0.30/transaction for digital features. Those other payment services can be used to purchase physical good.

 

What may still be unknown about Apple rejecting high subscription prices is what they use as a criteria for valid subscription pricing. Apple app reviewers might not always understand the complexity and value of app features. So if an app does get rejected for this reason, it may be hard to get the decision reversed.

[tim0901]

On the one hand, I get it. I like that Apple are trying to prevent people from getting ripped off by services like this, that's cool.

 

On the other hand, I don't like that Apple - the ones who own the store - are now essentially dictating the prices at which independent companies can sell their products. It is the right of a company to charge as much as they want for their own product - who do Apple think they are to say otherwise? It's like Micro Center saying to Intel "Hey your CPUs are overpriced, reduce the price or we won't stock them" - an absurd notion that would recieve a middle finger from Intel as they went elsewhere to sell their products (thanks to the wonders of competition!) The only reason Apple have any chance of getting away with this is because of the App Store's monopoly on iOS apps - they've created this position where they can dictate prices like this, and companies don't really have a choice but to accept it.

 

A potentially better solution to the problem Apple are trying to solve here could be to implement a Steam-style refunds system, allowing users to evaluate themselves whether something is worth it or not. But of course such a system has many problems of its own.

 

Also, given how Apple have been repeatedly inconsistent with regards to policing what's allowed on the App Store or not, I don't expect to see them being consistent about this either. So expect future arguments about how app X charges $4.99 for some feature, but Apple refuses to let app Y on the store at the same price.

[Bombastinator]

1 hour ago, NicBas48 said:

Apple has made the 30% fee an industry standard with only a few other app stores like Google. The problem is those app stores don't allow subscription purchases from other payment like Stripe that only charge a 2.9% fee + $0.30/transaction for digital features. Those other payment services can be used to purchase physical good.

 

What may still be unknown about Apple rejecting high subscription prices is what they use as a criteria for valid subscription pricing. Apple app reviewers might not always understand the complexity and value of app features. So if an app does get rejected for this reason, it may be hard to get the decision reversed.

What app that isn’t literally life saving is worth 8 bucks a week?   The problem with any regulation of any kind anywhere are edge cases.  Do you prevent edge cases an allow a majority of problem inducers? Or do you put down something more restrictive in which some edge cases may be caught?  It’s a perennial problem in society in general.

[RejZoR]

I'm not an Apple fanboy despite how much everyone tries to paint me as one when I'm defending Apple with some common sense, but why is everyone constantly attacking Apple as "masters of ripoff"? Based on what? Shit Android fanboys keep repeating day after day, month after month, year after year? Coz that's what I'm encountering basically every time I just mention Apple isn't overpriced, ripoff or literally any of that. And it always ends with "yeah, but muh closed ecosystem walled garden yadidadida" at which point I just roll my eyes.

 

People always just look at hardware specs and declare something is "ripoff". Oh but Apple only has X core CPU and display only has Y pixels and uh oh so small battery and declare it as "overpriced". Always same tired arguments. Is it? I ditched Android for iPhone because I care how quickly I get software updates and for how long I'll be getting them over just hardware specs. It's been few years ago when I basically stopped caring about display, camera or whatever on high end phones because they already have it so good it just doesn't matter for me anymore. Not getting any updates after 2 years however is a big thing. Because if my iPhone XR was running Android, I'd be out of updates by now. And I've been on Android for 8 years and it was always the same shit. I got left on old Android version just when Google introduced some new cool feature. And my god I hated how long it always took for things to actually be received by user. Google launched new Android version and then it sometimes took up to a freaking year to receive it on whatever vendor like Samsung you were. And even when they were already seeding the update to actual devices, I was always left waiting for weeks and even months because I was somehow always in a region that was getting updates last. There is none of that shit with Apple. If Apple releases a software update, you get it this moment. No months of waiting, no "you live in wrong region" bullshit. You always get update the moment you see news about it online. And while Apple doesn't officially state it, their track record does. Their phones are receiving MAJOR iOS updates for 5 years pretty much without exceptions. And some phones keep receiving security updates even past that. I think 7 years was the longest it happened iirc. Show me one Android phone that does that out of the box, not some garage cooked ROM install. There just aren't any. Even Google itself only offers 3 years on their very own Pixel phones.

 

Then there is this constant "walled garden" and "closed ecosystem" argument. Which is just so worn out and literally no one outside of extreme power users even gives a shit about. You get all the important apps on App Store. Only people whining about it are those who want to run some pirated app and they need to sideload it bypassing app store. Why else one would care so much about it? Everything I could install on Android, I also have on iOS. And don't show me those 5 people who run degoogled phones and sideload everything. I was one of those on phone without Google services and it's just such clusterfuck of compromises I just couldn't be bothered with it. Apple is a good compromise if you don't want to feed your entire life to creepy uncle Google, but still want same functionality as on Android that just works without all the shit you have to deal with on degoogled phones. Guess what, not everyone are specs whores. Some of us actually value that the thing is working as a complete product, not just insane specs and then you're on your own with outdated software shit after 2 years. iPhones are fast, super optimized so even less RAM and smaller batteries generally doesn't mean much, they generally have very good cameras for photos and videos, their displays have always been one of the best even if they still happen to use IPS LCD, market leading vibration feedback and excellent speakers, they have exceptional software support and "muh closed walled garden" is actually beneficial as it's much harder to get some crapware on your phone and Apple does really good job at curating their app store, yet still offers all the services you get on Android. Compared to GooglePlay, there is just so much less crapware and copycat junk it's not even funny at this point. I kid you not.

 

Coz once you stop wanking to stupid pointless hardware specs and start appreciating how iPhones work as a very complete package and are really "just works" devices, they all of a sudden aren't that expensive or even overpriced. Coz most people just want their phone to work for a long time and do that reliably on software and hardware side. It's also why I totally understood Anthony when he said he's using iPhone in one of videos he hosted. His argument was the same as mine. You may fiddle with everything in your life, but you just want some things to "just work". And Apple is really good at that and a lot of people also appreciate that. Except annoying Android fanboys who will praise their stupid devices and piss on Apple no matter what. Guess what, not everyone appreciate the same shit you do. And when you consider that, iPhones are not overpriced at all. They cost about the same, but some of HW specs are traded for superior software support. And I can take that. I would on Android, if any of them will ever offer 5 years of full updates that you don't wait for like an absolute cretin every time...

 

Now, back to the original topic of this thread...

I think that's a good thing and just falls into what I said how Apple curates their App Store pretty well. There are a lot of apps on both GooglePlay and App Store that charge ridiculous prices and hide them under subscription fees like "Free trial for 30 days and then we charge 60€ a week" or something equally ridiculous for some I don't know beauty camera app or something. This is good to see.

[Bombastinator]

1 minute ago, RejZoR said:

I'm not an Apple fanboy despite how much everyone tries to paint me as one when I'm defending Apple with some common sense, but why is everyone constantly attacking Apple as "masters of ripoff"? Based on what? Shit Android fanboys keep repeating day after day, month after month, year after year? Coz that's what I'm encountering basically every time I just mention Apple isn't overpriced, ripoff or literally any of that. And it always ends with "yeah, but muh closed ecosystem walled garden yadidadida" at which point I just roll my eyes.

 

People always just look at hardware specs and declare something is "ripoff". Oh but Apple only has X core CPU and display only has Y pixels and uh oh so small battery and declare it as "overpriced". Always same tired arguments. Is it? I ditched Android for iPhone because I care how quickly I get software updates and for how long I'll be getting them over just hardware specs. It's been few years ago when I basically stopped caring about display, camera or whatever on high end phones because they already have it so good it just doesn't matter for me anymore. Not getting any updates after 2 years however is a big thing. Because if my iPhone XR was running Android, I'd be out of updates by now. And I've been on Android for 8 years and it was always the same shit. I got left on old Android version just when Google introduced some new cool feature. And my god I hated how long it always took for things to actually be received by user. Google launched new Android version and then it sometimes took up to a freaking year to receive it on whatever vendor like Samsung you were. And even when they were already seeding the update to actual devices, I was always left waiting for weeks and even months because I was somehow always in a region that was getting updates last. There is none of that shit with Apple. If Apple releases a software update, you get it this moment. No months of waiting, no "you live in wrong region" bullshit. You always get update the moment you see news about it online. And while Apple doesn't officially state it, their track record does. Their phones are receiving MAJOR iOS updates for 5 years pretty much without exceptions. And some phones keep receiving security updates even past that. I think 7 years was the longest it happened iirc. Show me one Android phone that does that out of the box, not some garage cooked ROM install. There just aren't any. Even Google itself only offers 3 years on their very own Pixel phones.

 

Then there is this constant "walled garden" and "closed ecosystem" argument. Which is just so worn out and literally no one outside of extreme power users even gives a shit about. You get all the important apps on App Store. Only people whining about it are those who want to run some pirated app and they need to sideload it bypassing app store. Why else one would care so much about it? Everything I could install on Android, I also have on iOS. And don't show me those 5 people who run degoogled phones and sideload everything. I was one of those on phone without Google services and it's just such clusterfuck of compromises I just couldn't be bothered with it. Apple is a good compromise if you don't want to feed your entire life to creepy uncle Google, but still want same functionality as on Android that just works without all the shit you have to deal with on degoogled phones. Guess what, not everyone are specs whores. Some of us actually value that the thing is working as a complete product, not just insane specs and then you're on your own with outdated software shit after 2 years. iPhones are fast, super optimized so even less RAM and smaller batteries generally doesn't mean much, they generally have very good cameras for photos and videos, their displays have always been one of the best even if they still happen to use IPS LCD, market leading vibration feedback and excellent speakers, they have exceptional software support and "muh closed walled garden" is actually beneficial as it's much harder to get some crapware on your phone and Apple does really good job at curating their app store, yet still offers all the services you get on Android. Compared to GooglePlay, there is just so much less crapware and copycat junk it's not even funny at this point. I kid you not.

 

Coz once you stop wanking to stupid pointless hardware specs and start appreciating how iPhones work as a very complete package and are really "just works" devices, they all of a sudden aren't that expensive or even overpriced. Coz most people just want their phone to work for a long time and do that reliably on software and hardware side. It's also why I totally understood Anthony when he said he's using iPhone in one of videos he hosted. His argument was the same as mine. You may fiddle with everything in your life, but you just want some things to "just work". And Apple is really good at that and a lot of people also appreciate that. Except annoying Android fanboys who will praise their stupid devices and piss on Apple no matter what. Guess what, not everyone appreciate the same shit you do. And when you consider that, iPhones are not overpriced at all. They cost about the same, but some of HW specs are traded for superior software support. And I can take that. I would on Android, if any of them will ever offer 5 years of full updates that you don't wait for like an absolute cretin every time...

 

Now, back to the original topic of this thread...

I think that's a good thing and just falls into what I said how Apple curates their App Store pretty well. There are a lot of apps on both GooglePlay and App Store that charge ridiculous prices and hide them under subscription fees like "Free trial for 30 days and then we charge 60€ a week" or something equally ridiculous for some I don't know beauty camera app or something. This is good to see.

Myself I ditched android because I was incapable of trusting Google any longer.  It’s not a question a to whether or not a given entity has problems.  It’s a question of which one has the biggest problems.  iOS is not problem free, but the problems seem less to me than android problems. 

[Kisai]

2 hours ago, Dedayog said:

They're the ones that set that industry standard.  Sure, I'll lump Google in as complete greedy pricks too. 

Oooh, swing and a miss.

 

https://web.archive.org/web/20131030055517/http://www.ps3news.com/console-news/bethesdas-fallout-3-patch-1-5-overlooks-ps3-expansions-again/

 

Quote

This could all point back to the surcharge on downloads that Sony began implementing on PSN downloads back in October, 2008, around the time Fallout 3 was released.

Since then Sony has charged developers $0.16/GB for content downloaded through PSN. Even content that's free, like the Fallout patches, would be subject to the charge for the first 60 days that the content is out. Paid content would be subject to the fee as long as there's a charge associated with it.

Read more: http://www.ps3news.com/console-news/bethesdas-fallout-3-patch-1-5-overlooks-ps3-expansions-again/#ixzz2jBLlVvwJ

I don't know if Sony still charges 16 cents per GB for the PS4 and PS5, but the first consoles that supported digital downloads were certainly ripping the developers off. AWS still does this with all their digital downloads last time I checked. Gee wouldn't it ever suck to have a title downloaded a million times and take 100GB (CP2077) so it would cost $16 to download a complete patch of the game.

 

Apple and other digital stores charging 30% often don't mention the data costs, if they have them at all. Data charges is one reason why indie developers will shun certain stores because they can not afford to put it on that store. This is why a lot more books, comics and indie videos are not available on Amazon, it's just too expensive. eg a proper 300dpi version of a graphic novel would be several GB, when Amazon charges you 15 cents per MB.

 

 

[tim0901]

1 hour ago, RejZoR said:

I'm not an Apple fanboy despite how much everyone tries to paint me as one when I'm defending Apple with some common sense

I'm not asking for an argument here. I'm merely going to explain my view, and my opinion as to why you may feel that you have this reputation, given what I've seen around this site (full disclaimer: I'm not on here constantly. I will have missed things you have posted). Feel free to completely ignore it, but don't bother writing a heated response if you take offense to what I've said. I'm not trying to insult you - I'm just trying to help. I'll put it in a spoiler because it's not relevant to the thread itself:

 

Spoiler

Your 1000 word post here may read like a coherent, well thought out argument to you, but to me here it reads like a 4-year-old having a temper tantrum, which is an immediate "I don't have time for this" from me. You're throwing around insults about the people you're arguing against left right and centre (the "stupid Android fanboys" that are "wanking to pointless specs" and "whining" about "muh xyz") - which is the point when many, including myself, consider that you've lost an argument. You maintain you aren't an Apple fanboy, and yet this sort of behaviour perfectly fits that of a stereotypical fanboy for any brand or company. Posts like this where you go on a completely unrelated rant about Android fans for 1000 words before writing anything about the actual topic really don't help your case either. If you want people to take you seriously, cut out the insults, text-speech (coz, muh etc.) and vulgar language - and especially cut out the rants about fanboys of the opposing brand. Present a well-written argument and people are far more likely to hear you out.

 

Another reason is that, as far as I've seen, you never even acknowledge that the opponents have good things going for them. For example, I can't find a single positive opinion about Android in this post, and you belittle Android users multiple times for caring about different things, such as "walled garden" and "pointless specs". To quote yourself: "not everyone appreciate the same shit you do". I think you need to take your own advice here - the best reviewers are the ones who are quite happy to say "I don't like this, but it's still a great product and I can see why people would like it" - something that Anthony is very good at.

 

But the biggest reason you get piled on around here is, well, you're the outsider on this site. You have the opinion that's very opposite to the majority of the userbase here - you're the sheep surrounded by the pack of wolves. If you're going to make posts that are constantly 100% pro-Apple, then the very anti-Apple userbase here is going to jump on you. You bring it on yourself by constantly bringing up this brand-wars argument on every post like this - nobody mentioned Android here until you did. The only mention of Google here was that they were just as bad at taking a 30% cut - nothing was said about them being in any way superior. Why bring it up at all?

 

 

[RejZoR]

3 hours ago, tim0901 said:

I'm not asking for an argument here. I'm merely going to explain my view, and my opinion as to why you may feel that you have this reputation, given what I've seen around this site (full disclaimer: I'm not on here constantly. I will have missed things you have posted). Feel free to completely ignore it, but don't bother writing a heated response if you take offense to what I've said. I'm not trying to insult you - I'm just trying to help. I'll put it in a spoiler because it's not relevant to the thread itself:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Your 1000 word post here may read like a coherent, well thought out argument to you, but to me here it reads like a 4-year-old having a temper tantrum, which is an immediate "I don't have time for this" from me. You're throwing around insults about the people you're arguing against left right and centre (the "stupid Android fanboys" that are "wanking to pointless specs" and "whining" about "muh xyz") - which is the point when many, including myself, consider that you've lost an argument. You maintain you aren't an Apple fanboy, and yet this sort of behaviour perfectly fits that of a stereotypical fanboy for any brand or company. Posts like this where you go on a completely unrelated rant about Android fans for 1000 words before writing anything about the actual topic really don't help your case either. If you want people to take you seriously, cut out the insults, text-speech (coz, muh etc.) and vulgar language - and especially cut out the rants about fanboys of the opposing brand. Present a well-written argument and people are far more likely to hear you out.

 

Another reason is that, as far as I've seen, you never even acknowledge that the opponents have good things going for them. For example, I can't find a single positive opinion about Android in this post, and you belittle Android users multiple times for caring about different things, such as "walled garden" and "pointless specs". To quote yourself: "not everyone appreciate the same shit you do". I think you need to take your own advice here - the best reviewers are the ones who are quite happy to say "I don't like this, but it's still a great product and I can see why people would like it" - something that Anthony is very good at.

 

But the biggest reason you get piled on around here is, well, you're the outsider on this site. You have the opinion that's very opposite to the majority of the userbase here - you're the sheep surrounded by the pack of wolves. If you're going to make posts that are constantly 100% pro-Apple, then the very anti-Apple userbase here is going to jump on you. You bring it on yourself by constantly bringing up this brand-wars argument on every post like this - nobody mentioned Android here until you did. The only mention of Google here was that they were just as bad at taking a 30% cut - nothing was said about them being in any way superior. Why bring it up at all?

 

 

What the F does this have to do with anything? Are you seriously one of those who dig through one's history just to do the lame "gotcha dance"? Seriously? Has it ever occurred to you that "defending" Apple sometimes doesn't make you a fanboy or "pro-Apple" person as you seem to assert it? I see bunch of such idiots on GSM Arena on daily basis. Say anything positive about Apple and suddenly you're biggest fucking Apple fanboy apparently because shitting on Apple is hip and merely not straight up shitting on it makes you a fanboy.

 

Explaining things from other perspective, the other perspective I never see any train of thought ever go to. I don't expect anyone to take it as "truth", just an opinion why they might be doing it. Like everyone outraged when Apple did the battery and camera flag if it's replaced by 3rd party. And I was the only one who ever said "I kinda get it why" and went on explaining it. But people just straight up ignore that coz they are too busy shitting on Apple. But if you think of it, would you be happy buying 800€ second hand iPhone not knowing if battery was replaced by some cheap Chinese crap of AliExpress and replaced by a butterfingered guy and have its water resistance compromised or would you like to know it's pristine? My guess is Apple shop workers need to have same quick and simple access knowing that when they are doing phone trade in without having to disassemble it.

 

Or how everyone constantly whines about closed Apple ecosystem yet I was once again the only one who gave a view on why that can also be beneficial. Which is again evident from absolutely smooth and swift transition of Macs from x86 to ARM. If ecosystem wasn't so tightly and entirely controlled by Apple, whole migration would take years and would be half baked just like all Windows attempts. This isn't me defending Apple. This is just me giving a different view on the matter.

 

The same way my explanation against "muh overpriced iPhone" tells hardware specs are not everything that defines worth of a device. Which is something all the Android fanboys like to do so much. Uh oh, it has a display with 5000Hz and 700 trillion pixels and 128GB of RAM and 2TB of storage and 9000 megapixels camera with 70 mega ampere hours battery and just dismiss Android is an absolute clusterfuck of fragmented OS with garbage long term support and absurd delay between Google releasing updates and users receiving them through 3rd party phone vendor. That's not me shitting on Android. That's just me stating a literal fact. Android as OS is not bad and I literally never said it is. But the way it's managed globally is. But people yet again see me state that as shitting on Android.

 

Only know I see how hard it is to express any thought about Apple products without shitstorm of people throwing lame accusations at you just because you don't follow the herd of sheep and you happen to express a different opinion on the matter that's seemingly favorable for Apple "side". Heh.

[Master Disaster]

7 hours ago, DrMacintosh said:

Ensuring your platform doesn't become filled with scams is a PR stunt, sure. 

Taking the high ground on ethics & morals while they're arguably the worst in the business is 100% a PR stunt.

[Bombastinator]

7 hours ago, tim0901 said:

On the one hand, I get it. I like that Apple are trying to prevent people from getting ripped off by services like this, that's cool.

 

On the other hand, I don't like that Apple - the ones who own the store - are now essentially dictating the prices at which independent companies can sell their products. It is the right of a company to charge as much as they want for their own product - who do Apple think they are to say otherwise? It's like Micro Center saying to Intel "Hey your CPUs are overpriced, reduce the price or we won't stock them" - an absurd notion that would recieve a middle finger from Intel as they went elsewhere to sell their products (thanks to the wonders of competition!) The only reason Apple have any chance of getting away with this is because of the App Store's monopoly on iOS apps - they've created this position where they can dictate prices like this, and companies don't really have a choice but to accept it.

 

A potentially better solution to the problem Apple are trying to solve here could be to implement a Steam-style refunds system, allowing users to evaluate themselves whether something is worth it or not. But of course such a system has many problems of its own.

 

Also, given how Apple have been repeatedly inconsistent with regards to policing what's allowed on the App Store or not, I don't expect to see them being consistent about this either. So expect future arguments about how app X charges $4.99 for some feature, but Apple refuses to let app Y on the store at the same price.

I wouldn’t be at all surprised for microcenter to say something like that.  Perhaps not about CPUs because there are too few makers, but about,oh, I dunno, USB cables?  Sure. A pretty standard thing for any business.  It’s actually pretty much the entire business model of Walmart.  Walmart doesn’t buy and resell products.  They sell their shelf space to different companies.  And they have LOTS of requirements that are often so harsh the company in question frequently implodes trying to fill them.  Wonder why there seems to be an issue getting the exact same product twice in a row there? That’s it.  This is not to say your point has no merit.   All app stores have a serious slop chest problem that in some ways is endemic to the very concept of an App Store.  It’s not specific to Apple though. 

[The Court of Demons]

Me: "Looks at thread"

Me Again: "Well that escalated quickly"

 

[tim0901]

3 hours ago, RejZoR said:

What the F does this have to do with anything? Are you seriously one of those who dig through one's history just to do the lame "gotcha dance"?

I did not dig through your history at all. AS I SAID - this is from what I've seen of you around the site - although 99% is from this post here.

 

But I can now think of another reason why people don't listen to you here:

7 hours ago, tim0901 said:

don't bother writing a heated response if you take offense to what I've said.

you don't listen to what other people are saying.

[tim0901]

3 minutes ago, The Court of Demons said:

Me: "Looks at thread"

Me Again: "Well that escalated quickly"

 

Yeah... sorry dude... welcome to the forum!

[RejZoR]

33 minutes ago, tim0901 said:

I did not dig through your history at all. AS I SAID - this is from what I've seen of you around the site - although 99% is from this post here.

 

But I can now think of another reason why people don't listen to you here:

you don't listen to what other people are saying.

Coz people who just piss on Apple because it's apparently hip and cool annoy the fuck out of me. Not because I'd particularly be a fan of Apple, but because I hate people say dumb shit. You'll see me get equally annoyed about other non Apple things. But hey, if no one wants to learn anything about anyhting, then go ahead. Omg Apple sux. Am I cool enough yet? Apple is such useless garbage. Getting there I guess...

[Dedayog]

1 hour ago, tim0901 said:

I did not dig through your history at all. AS I SAID - this is from what I've seen of you around the site - although 99% is from this post here.

 

But I can now think of another reason why people don't listen to you here:

you don't listen to what other people are saying.

Not to defend anyone but saying that is a catch 22.  And kinda of sets someone up.

 

Like... Hey, don't hit me back if I hit you. Yep, makes sense