Think 1.4v is too much? (8700k)

[Mister Woof]

Been running my delidded 8700k w/conductonaut at 5ghz at 1.375v with middle setting LLC for about 3 years now. Upgraded my cooler to a Deepcool Assassin 3, and have a 5800x on the way.

 

Was thinking I'm on the YOLO train right now (upgrade oto the 5800x soon, or if I return that then I'll get something else anyway).

 

I'm presently at 5.1ghz, 1.4v, 0 AVX offset, and middle setting of LLC. Under load seems to be around 1.38v vcore.

 

I'm running ASUS Realbench right now and max cpu temp is 82c at about 10m in. Motherborad VRM reports around 84c.

 

Ran CBR23 and topped out at 79c, and scored 10550.

 

0 WHEAs at present.

 

Think 1.4v is okay? Conventional wisdom has been that's the max safe cap, but I haven't tried that high myself for extended periods of time.

 

Chip longevity isn't a priority as long as it lasts the end of the year or so.

 

[AntiTrust]

7 minutes ago, Mister Woof said:

Chip longevity isn't a priority as long as it lasts the end of the year or so.

 

as long as its not crashing, overheating and throttling and if longevity is not a concern then yes anything is ok 

[Mister Woof]

Just now, AntiTrust said:

as long as its not crashing, overheating and throttling and if longevity is not a concern then yes anything is ok 

Passed the short 15m ASUS Realbench test, 82c max on the cpu, 86 max on the motherboard vrm.

 

Gonna do the hour test, play some games, and if it survives that I'll call it good I guess.

[AntiTrust]

by the way I feel this post, my 8700k is starting to feel dated.. I may go for the delid / max overclock as well soon... if I kill it I'll have an excuse to go ryzen.. 

[Mister Woof]

3 minutes ago, AntiTrust said:

by the way I feel this post, my 8700k is starting to feel dated.. I may go for the delid / max overclock as well soon... if I kill it I'll have an excuse to go ryzen.. 

Lol I know right?

 

But to be honest I don't really feel like it's actually feeling slower. I want to upgrade just...because.

 

Even in the more CPU heavy games I play it hasn't really bogged me down. I've had this delidded under liquid metal since early 2018, and it's been pretty much a champ since.

 

I ordered the 5800x on impulse thanks to a notification, and then I figured I needed a new cooler...so I picked up the Assassin III. I was going to just save it for the 5800x...but I thought I'd throw it on my 8700k until it gets here and see what happens.

 

And....here I am. Getting more thermal headroom and wanting to push it more LOL. At this point I think I may end up just returning the 5800x.

[AntiTrust]

36 minutes ago, Mister Woof said:

But to be honest I don't really feel like it's actually feeling slower. I want to upgrade just...because.

yeah I mean I really cant complain about performance in anything, its just the because factor is creeping in again 

 

just curious how did you delid, did you buy one of the tools or did you do the vice method? I was considering shipping to silicon lottery for a professional delid/binning  

[Mister Woof]

15 minutes ago, AntiTrust said:

yeah I mean I really cant complain about performance in anything, its just the because factor is creeping in again 

 

just curious how did you delid, did you buy one of the tools or did you do the vice method? I was considering shipping to silicon lottery for a professional delid/binning  

Got a retail chip in December 2017 with an underwhelming but attractive cooler (Cryorig H7 Quad Lumi) because I was 100% not intending on overclocking.

 

Well that didn't work out because by New Years Day 2018 I was at 4.8ghz and 1.3v and the cooler just wasn't having anything more. So eventually I just decided to delid after watching several videos.

 

I want to say around March or so I ordered the debauer delid kit and the thermal grizzly conductonaut off Amazon and was at 5ghz after a day of testing. 

 

I wouldn't go the SL route because I don't think it's worth it really from the performance side, because there's not really a gaming difference between 4.8ghz (almost all can get this without even delidding) and 5.1ghz.

 

it's worth it if you will have fun doing it, and the SL method takes that away basically.

 

I know personally I've had as much overclocking and goofing around than actually using it.

[AntiTrust]

3 minutes ago, Mister Woof said:

I wouldn't go the SL route because I don't think it's worth it really from the performance side, because there's not really a gaming difference between 4.8ghz (almost all can get this without even delidding) and 5.1ghz.

 

it's worth it if you will have fun doing it, and the SL method takes that away basically.

 

I know personally I've had as much overclocking and goofing around than actually using it.

great advice, you're 100% correct here

 

yeah I remember the derbaur kit was the bees knees back in the day I wonder if I can pick up a used one somewhere, now that intel switched back to soldering people might be selling.

[Guest]

18 minutes ago, AntiTrust said:

yeah I mean I really cant complain about performance in anything, its just the because factor is creeping in again 

 

just curious how did you delid, did you buy one of the tools or did you do the vice method? I was considering shipping to silicon lottery for a professional delid/binning  

Just a double edged shaving razor does the trick. This type of razor because they are super sharp and thin. Cuts the glue like butter baby.

 

@Mister Woof I see 5.2ghz there. 80c is good. Then you'll be benching near my figures  

[Mister Woof]

2 minutes ago, AntiTrust said:

great advice, you're 100% correct here

 

yeah I remember the derbaur kit was the bees knees back in the day I wonder if I can pick up a used one somewhere, now that intel switched back to soldering people might be selling.

Yeah, I gave mine to a friend in another state and have yet to recover it. I don't think I'll be using it again so I just kind of forgot about it.

[podkall]

Can I ask you, if I'm overclocking, is any voltage under 1,35V concidered "safe"?

[Mister Woof]

26 minutes ago, podkall said:

Can I ask you, if I'm overclocking, is any voltage under 1,35V concidered "safe"?

Usually 1.45v and under with adequate cooling for skylake chips is considered "safe". I like under 1.4 myself but that's totally arbitrary on my part. Now that I have an upgrade path in mind, this chip is more or less expendable and I feel better about experimenting more aggressively with it.

 

But that's never a guarantee and thighs could go wrong anyway.

 

There's more to it regarding damage with LLC and resistance, etc, but I'm not smart enough to explain it well.

 

Overclocking always carries the risk of bricking parts.

[podkall]

1 minute ago, Mister Woof said:

Usually 1.45v and under with adequate cooling for skylake chips is considered "safe". I like under 1.4 myself but that's totally arbitrary on my part.

 

But that's never a guarantee and thighs could go wrong anyway.

 

There's more to it regarding damage with LLC and resistance, etc, but I'm not smart enough to explain it well.

 

Overclocking always carries the risk of bricking parts.

I get that, what about Ryzen CPU? is it similar story?

[Mister Woof]

4 minutes ago, podkall said:

I get that, what about Ryzen CPU? is it similar story?

Ryzen is totally different.

 

I have my first generation at around 1.4v, but newer generations are more sensitive as I recall. First generation was supposed to be okay up to 1.45v, but don't quote me on that as I think that was later found to cause degradation quickly. I think second gen was similar.

 

It seems that third generation because of how it boosts tended to have high voltage during idle and lightly threaded loads and then drop below 1.3 under high load, and that was normal, but it was bad to set a fixed voltage higher than 1.325 or something. Again, don't quote me on that as I only have experience with first gen.

 

 

[podkall]

1 minute ago, Mister Woof said:

Ryzen is totally different.

 

I have my first generation at around 1.4v, but newer generations are more sensitive as I recall. First generation was supposed to be okay up to 1.45v, but don't quote me on that as I think that was later found to cause degradation quickly. I think second gen was similar.

 

It seems that third generation because of how it boosts tended to have high voltage during idle and lightly threaded loads and that was normal, but it was bad to set a fixed voltage higher than 1.325 or something. Again, don't quote me on that as I only have experience with first gen.

 

 

How do I know which generation is mine?

I have Ryzen 3 1200 and behind it in brackets it says (Summit Ridge)

[Mister Woof]

Just now, podkall said:

How do I know which generation is mine?

I have Ryzen 3 1200 and behind it in brackets it says (Summit Ridge)

First gen 

 

1000 and 2000g = first gen

2000 and 3000g = second gen

3000 and 4000h = 3rd gen

5000 = fourth gen

[podkall]

1 minute ago, Mister Woof said:

First gen 

 

1000 and 2000g = first gen

2000 and 3000g = second gen

3000 and 4000h = 3rd gen

5000 = fourth gen

Thanks for the info, so I should in theory have one of the highest headrooms when it comes to Ryzen?

also does the 3 behind Ryzen have a similar meaning as Intel having for example i3 i5 etc.?

[Mister Woof]

5 minutes ago, podkall said:

Thanks for the info, so I should in theory have one of the highest headrooms when it comes to Ryzen?

also does the 3 behind Ryzen have a similar meaning as Intel having for example i3 i5 etc.?

All of them have mostly terrible headroom beyond what the stock highest clock is for their respective generations, iirc.

 

Like a a ryzen 5 1600 can "gain" a lot from oc in that its normal all core is 3.3ghz and you can usually get 3.8-4ghz (500-700mhz oc), but the 1600x is 4ghz and usually going past that is very difficult for either chip.

 

Is mostly just that nonx chips are clocked really low and can be OC to be unnerfed

 

Of course there are people who can oc these chips but generally unless you have a first or second gen non x it's not worth your time.

[podkall]

8 minutes ago, Mister Woof said:

All of them have mostly terrible headroom beyond what the stock highest clock is for their respective generations, iirc.

 

Like a a ryzen 5 1600 can "gain" a lot from oc in that its normal all core is 3.3ghz and you can usually get 3.8-4ghz (500-700mhz oc), but the 1600x is 4ghz and usually going past that is very difficult for either chip.

 

Is mostly just that nonx chips are clocked really low and can be OC to be unnerfed

 

Of course there are people who can oc these chips but generally unless you have a first or second gen non x it's not worth your time.

I got one more question, it's a overclocking question about "issue" I'm having right now...

Can I ask you here or should I make a dedicated thread for the question and @ you?

[xg32]

3 hours ago, Mister Woof said:

.

 

i think sandy bridge and zen 2 showed me there's a wall somewhere regardless of temps. my 2600k was fine until i pushed 1.42v through it, and that took 2 years, and we all know about zen 2.

 

Mid-80s is probably ok until you hit the hottest days of the year, as for degradation, no1 knows, i'd have to guess it's fine, definitely would save the 5.1 oc as a profile at the very least.

[Mister Woof]

Just now, podkall said:

I got one more question, it's a overclocking question about "issue" I'm having right now...

Can I ask you here or should I make a dedicated thread for the question and @ you?

Probably better to start your own thread to get more eyes on your specific problem from the get-go instead of the new issue coming up mid-thread.

 

But I'll be happy to try to help.

[Mister Woof]

2 minutes ago, xg32 said:

i think sandy bridge and zen 2 showed me there's a wall somewhere regardless of temps. my 2600k was fine until i pushed 1.42v through it, and that took 2 years, and we all know about zen 2.

 

Mid-80s is probably ok until you hit the hottest days of the year, as for degradation, no1 knows, i'd have to guess it's fine, definitely would save the 5.1 oc as a profile at the very least.

We'll see if I'm even on this by the time summer comes along.

 

When I do finally upgrade I'll be reducing the OC a bit on the 8700k and retiring my Ryzen 5 1600 system with this as the replacement.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, xg32 said:

i think sandy bridge and zen 2 showed me there's a wall somewhere regardless of temps.

More or less Because of temps. They start to scale when they get really cold. Something about reducing leakage. No matter, always a point of diminishing returns no matter what the cooling frequency and voltage. *shrugs*