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It's not only the GPU itself - Some insight on why we can't buy RTX 3000

Summary

 Igor's lab published an interesting article that discusses and explains the causes of the RTX 3000 availability disaster that most of us suffer currently from. While mining is apparently part of the issue (surprisingly mostly for the lower-end GPUs), the devil also lays in other details such as the PWM controllers that are apparently very hard to get right now.

 

Quotes

Quote

 Did you know that even PWM controllers, for example, have become scarce and are almost worth their weight in gold? Anything that meets the NVIDIA reference, be it components from Monolith or UPI, is now strictly rationed. Here, the exact allocation to the AIC is done by NVIDIA coordinating the shipment quantities of the GPUs to the AIC with the vendors of the PWM controllers and also communicating to them in detail. Nice side effect for curious people like me: more people know the true numbers and the information holes get bigger. But making more just like that? No way!

 

My thoughts

 In generally like the insights that Igor regularly provides but I have been especially starving for these infos. It bugged me so hard to be left in the unknown what exactly is the problem behind producing more cards. While we all knew that the GPU itself is a problem, there is apparently much more to it.

 

Sources

https://www.igorslab.de/en/more-details-and-backgrounds-on-the-scarcity-why-graphic-cards-are-so-hard-to-buy-and-manufacture/

 

There is als a video available in German:

 

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shows once again how complicated supply chains are and that making Graphics Cards is a bit more complicated than one might think

Hi

 

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hi

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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well I never thought making a gpu is easy... so many parts! 

 

generally the less parts the easier to make. 

 

I made electronic devices that needed some transistors / caps (maybe 10) a pcp a battery and a tiny led... that's simple, but obviously wouldn't make a great gpu... 

I'm actually one of those people who thinks that anonymity is overrated. Some people confuse privacy and anonymity and think they go hand in hand, and that protecting privacy means that you need to protect anonymity. I think that's wrong. Anonymity is important if you're a whistle-blower, but if you cannot prove your identity, your crazy rant on some social-media platform shouldn't be visible, and you shouldn't be able to share it or like it.

 

Linus Torvalds 

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1 minute ago, valdyrgramr said:

I knew it!  Jensen is an angel dust dealer!  That explains the leather jacket!

It's the only explanation indeed... 🤔

I'm actually one of those people who thinks that anonymity is overrated. Some people confuse privacy and anonymity and think they go hand in hand, and that protecting privacy means that you need to protect anonymity. I think that's wrong. Anonymity is important if you're a whistle-blower, but if you cannot prove your identity, your crazy rant on some social-media platform shouldn't be visible, and you shouldn't be able to share it or like it.

 

Linus Torvalds 

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Just another excuse for unprecedented greed by the tech industry. Everything will pass, a pandemic will pass, bitcoin craziness will pass but they will forever be remembered as bunch of greedy bastards. That's it.

Cosmic Council Department of Defense ; Interplanetary Class 3 Relations & Diplomatic Affairs - OFFICE 117

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I wonder which part is the main chokepoint?

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3 hours ago, Tic-Tac said:

Just another excuse for unprecedented greed by the tech industry. Everything will pass, a pandemic will pass, bitcoin craziness will pass but they will forever be remembered as bunch of greedy bastards. That's it.

in many cases you cant simply start producing much more than you did before, for one because in most cases you dont have the ability to ( not enough room to grow with the factory you have) another because you have no clue how long the supply high will last, just look at amd during the bitcoin mining bubble in 2014-2015 they made a bunch more 290xs but because increasing production takes time as so does reducing it they ended up with tons of leftover inventory and they ended up loosing money.

and about cost going up when supply is scarse is simply the market finding out who really needs/wants the parts and is thus ready to pay for them

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Ooo so that’s why GPUs have been so hard to find. 
 

just out of curiosity, would this be affecting AMD GPUs as well? 

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6 hours ago, wamred said:

Ooo so that’s why GPUs have been so hard to find. 
 

just out of curiosity, would this be affecting AMD GPUs as well? 

I imagine it would affect all GPU's from all brands yeah.

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3 hours ago, Kaneitto said:

I imagine it would affect all GPU's from all brands yeah.

 

Probably also motherboard manufacture, and other things. 

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I just upgraded my PSU from a 650 to 1000w and I noticed they are also kind of hard to find in stock (the one I ordered from amazon wont ship until next month). I chalked it up to overall gaming/pc demand but I assume psus use PWMs, too.

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On 1/21/2021 at 12:39 AM, Dracarris said:

While mining is apparently part of the issue (surprisingly mostly for the lower-end GPUs),

In my country, 3060ti and 3080 are non-existent, while 3070 are available

 

You can import 3060ti from china, but you won't get any local manufacturer warranty and it costs $1000 anyways

The 3080 is just... Non-existent pretty much

 

The 3070 and 3090?

The 3090 did experience some price bump, but you can get one for about $2000, not too different from $1500, about 30% price hike compared to 100% price hike of the 3060ti.

 

The 3070? Funny story, it's actually cheaper than a 3060ti, at $950, while they are also local cards so it's covered by manufacturer warranty.

 

Both 3070 and 3090 are widely available, because they're not appetizing to anyone right now

 

I can only explain this by saying miners are wiping 3060ti and 3080 off the market, leaving 3070 behind (which aren't really preferred by miners)

 

We don't get much scalpers here because we're a low income country and no gamer in their sane mind is gonna pay $950 for a 3070, let alone scalped price above that.

My PCs: Desky | Beddie | Miney | Benchie

Things I need help with: (nothing at the moment)

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none atm

I hate Intel's pricing, Ryzen's weird quirks, Nvidia's pricing, and Radeon GPUs in general

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Products I like:

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Sony Xperia Z1 / Z2 / 10 ii, Asus Strix 970 / 1070, Samsung SSD, WD HDD, Corsair PSUs (AX, RM, CX(grey)), GeForce GPU, NZXT N450/S340, be quiet! Coolers, G.Skill Trident RAM, Logitech M525, Logitech G440, Razer Deathadder Elite

Products I hate:

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Xperia Z3, XiaoMi 5c, Radeon GPUs, Razer Audio Products, any bloatwares

Companies I absolutely adore: (and hope it stays that way)

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be quiet! - sent me AM4 mounting for my DRP3 even though it's way past the timeframe stated, no questions asked

Corsair - very good RMA experience, absolutely recommend

Companies I hate:

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Nvidia, Intel, Apple, TMT (Thundermatch, a retailer)

Personal Blacklisted Companies:

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Acer: shit tier quality products, shit tier customer service thus far, they "tried" to solve my issue but they arent really doing anything but delaying and delaying. (on-going case since July)

Gigabyte: horrible customer service (gigabyte had literally 0 customer service, asked me to go to retailer with NO WAY to email them about a question) but at least they fixed my shit in ONE MONTH (would probably take me 1 hour to fix if they let me email them)

XiaoMi Phones: built like a tank but the software is buggy as all hell

Seagate HDD: had too many dead seagate drives

Kingston SSD: 300V controller swap thingy

Razer (except their mouse)

Remember, just because I had good/bad experiences with these companies/product, doesn't mean you will have similar experiences too. I would still recommend these products if they made sense for your needs, but I'll add a disclaimer of my experience if it's relevant. Feel free to DM me asking why they are where they are.

 

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33 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

The 3090 did experience some price bump, but you can get one for about $200

damnn in denmark they're at 2500/2600$ and that's only on the few models i've been able to find listings of.

Anything i've written between the * and * is not meant to be taken seriously.

keep in mind that helping with problems is hard if you aren't specific and detailed.

i'm also not a professional, (yet) so make sure to personally verify important information as i could be wrong.

 

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6 minutes ago, flashiling said:

damnn in denmark they're at 2500/2600$ and that's only on the few models i've been able to find listings of.

I suspect being in a low income country, not many people buy higher end gaming GPUs and scalpers can't scalp poor people, both leading to abundance of gaming GPU in my local market.

My PCs: Desky | Beddie | Miney | Benchie

Things I need help with: (nothing at the moment)

Spoiler

none atm

I hate Intel's pricing, Ryzen's weird quirks, Nvidia's pricing, and Radeon GPUs in general

Spoiler

Products I like:

Spoiler

Sony Xperia Z1 / Z2 / 10 ii, Asus Strix 970 / 1070, Samsung SSD, WD HDD, Corsair PSUs (AX, RM, CX(grey)), GeForce GPU, NZXT N450/S340, be quiet! Coolers, G.Skill Trident RAM, Logitech M525, Logitech G440, Razer Deathadder Elite

Products I hate:

Spoiler

Xperia Z3, XiaoMi 5c, Radeon GPUs, Razer Audio Products, any bloatwares

Companies I absolutely adore: (and hope it stays that way)

Spoiler

be quiet! - sent me AM4 mounting for my DRP3 even though it's way past the timeframe stated, no questions asked

Corsair - very good RMA experience, absolutely recommend

Companies I hate:

Spoiler

Nvidia, Intel, Apple, TMT (Thundermatch, a retailer)

Personal Blacklisted Companies:

Spoiler

Acer: shit tier quality products, shit tier customer service thus far, they "tried" to solve my issue but they arent really doing anything but delaying and delaying. (on-going case since July)

Gigabyte: horrible customer service (gigabyte had literally 0 customer service, asked me to go to retailer with NO WAY to email them about a question) but at least they fixed my shit in ONE MONTH (would probably take me 1 hour to fix if they let me email them)

XiaoMi Phones: built like a tank but the software is buggy as all hell

Seagate HDD: had too many dead seagate drives

Kingston SSD: 300V controller swap thingy

Razer (except their mouse)

Remember, just because I had good/bad experiences with these companies/product, doesn't mean you will have similar experiences too. I would still recommend these products if they made sense for your needs, but I'll add a disclaimer of my experience if it's relevant. Feel free to DM me asking why they are where they are.

 

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1 minute ago, Moonzy said:

I suspect being in a low income country

not sure denmark falls under that description but i guess it would make sense if it did.

the only place that has a 3090 right now are listed for 2610$ after tax and shipping 

Anything i've written between the * and * is not meant to be taken seriously.

keep in mind that helping with problems is hard if you aren't specific and detailed.

i'm also not a professional, (yet) so make sure to personally verify important information as i could be wrong.

 

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Been looking on and off at one UK supplier. Haven't seen any stock this year - which doesn't mean they didn't get stock in, just that it didn't stick around long enough for me to notice it. Even to the end of last year, 3090 were popping in and out of stock all the time, haven't even seen that much. As long as pricing remains elevated, I can't see myself going current gen.

 

I was questioning my sanity buying a used 2080Ti at the time but that seems like deal of the decade now. I think my biggest mistake, along with most others, was assuming there'll be a price crash on used GPUs when the new ones came out. I sold some excess older GPUs around the nvidia Ampere announce and pricing has only been going up since then! Can't win them all.

Desktop Gaming system: Asrock Z370 Pro4, i7-8086k, Noctua D15, Corsair Vengeance Pro RGB 3200 4x16GB, EVGA 2080Ti, NZXT E850 PSU, Cooler Master MasterBox 5, Optane 900p 280GB, Crucial MX200 1TB, Sandisk 960GB, Acer Predator XB241YU 1440p144 G-sync
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