Mining Farm with 78 GeForce RTX 3080s Spotted: Capable of Generating $128,088 Per Year

[Moonzy]

1 minute ago, Blademaster91 said:

I've seen of miners bragging at how many cards they've got are all sitting out in the open, not in a case with optimized airflow that the GPU is designed for.

afaik, open air temps are lower than in pc cases

unless im wrong?

[Bombastinator]

5 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

so you're not supposed to use a COMPUTER to COMPUTE? what?

name is just a name, the "intended" use argument is weak.

 

they did have mining specific GPUs, but it was unpopular because the risk is higher, because they're worthless on 2nd hand market

The impression I get is nobody who has a budget is going to get a high end gpu then until cryptomining dies.  Or someone produces specialized gaming cards that can’t be used for mining, or ASICS cheap enough that the cost of throwing away a useless asic is lower than the resale difference between a new and used mining card.

Edited December 30, 2020 by Bombastinator

[poochyena]

11 hours ago, atxcyclist said:

Where does the value become created in a cryptocurrency system? 

same as any other mined material, cost to obtain and scarcity.

[Moonzy]

4 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

The impression I get is nobody who has a budget is going to get a high end gpu then until cryptomining dies. 

that will probably the case, because nvidia sets a value for those cards in people's minds with MSRP, so people think that's how much things are worth, when people are actually buying them at almost twice the price

 

so yea, if you wanna get gpu at MSRP, you gotta wait until demand dies down, or supply increases to out-supply the demand

that said, miner only made up of what... 7% of nvidia's 3000 series market? or something like that

it's covered in a previous news or something

so majority of the scarcity is still caused by "normal" (or in this case, higher than normal) demands

[Bombastinator]

5 minutes ago, poochyena said:

same as any other mined material, cost to obtain and scarcity.

Basically what mining cards do is make it impossible to either subsidize electricity, or artificially raise costs above actual production like they need to do with helium if the world wants to have any in 20 years.  Stuff has an arguable value of hundreds of dollars a cubic foot and it gets sold to inflate kiddie balloons.  Crypto mining is bad for the world on just about every level.

Edited December 30, 2020 by Bombastinator

[jagdtigger]

11 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

so you're not supposed to use a COMPUTER to COMPUTE? what?

GPU = Graphics processing unit, end of story.

[Moonzy]

1 minute ago, jagdtigger said:

GPU = Graphics processing unit, end of story.

aight, have fun using it as a paper weight without the rest of the system

[Blademaster91]

5 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

afaik, open air temps are lower than in pc cases

unless im wrong?

In a well ventilated room vs a RGB gamer case covered in glass I guess, not sure about putting a bunch of GPUs in a bedroom with no air moving over them.

4 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

The impression I get is nobody who has a budget is going to get a high end gpu then until cryptomining dies.  Or someone produces specialized gaming cards that can’t be used for mining, or ASICS cheap enough that the cost of throwing away a useless asic is lower than the resale difference between a new and used mining card.

Yeah the last mining craze ruined GPU pricing, and Nvidia really took advantage of that. I wouldn't mind cryptomining becoming becoming unfeasible for consumer GPUs because I really miss the higher end GPUs being around the $600 range but what we really need are more companies making high end consumer GPUs.

[Moonzy]

1 minute ago, Blademaster91 said:

not sure about putting a bunch of GPUs in a bedroom with no air moving over them.

mmm, for small room i've seen miners use AC to cool their rigs, though im not sure how that works because you need more energy to pull heat out from a room with AC, so it's very inefficient

 

undervolting also does wonders

did i mention my 3060tis are running at 52c under full mining load right now? ambient is about 25c.

that's way below stock temps which is in the 60s

 

6 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

I really miss the higher end GPUs being around the $600 range but what we really need are more companies making high end consumer GPUs.

i don't remember nvidia launching any gpu with worse perf per dollar

but they did launch more and more powerful GPU, thus the price hike

 

so basically, the pricing per perf isnt raised, but your standards because nvidia made better and better GPUs

[atxcyclist]

28 minutes ago, poochyena said:

same as any other mined material, cost to obtain and scarcity.

When you mine gold, silver, or platinum, you can hold them in your hand. They are tangible. There is a big difference because cryptocurrency doesn’t have that.

[Moonzy]

1 hour ago, Bombastinator said:

Or someone produces specialized gaming cards that can’t be used for mining,

funny you mentioned this, by the way

 

did you know that 3060ti and 3070 have the same hash rate for ETH?

so miners are flocking to 3060ti now

 

i've seen 3070 in stock when i was shopping for my 3060ti, and retailers have mentioned that 3060ti and 3080 must be bought bundled with an entire pc (due to the "popularity")

while u can buy 3070 individually, so yea, there's this little fun bit of info

 

though of course, if 3060ti arent available, miners will still snatch up a 3070 if the price is right.

 

they are less efficient though, from my understanding

[superfantastic]

I know someone who mines bitcoin but he barely makes any money lol. I think he made like 100 bucks in 2019 doing it. Maybe he did something wrong, I don't know the details. But it sounds like a boring waste of time if you don't have a killer setup. And even then, it's still boring

[WkdPaul]

4 minutes ago, superfantastic said:

I know someone who mines bitcoin but he barely makes any money lol. I think he made like 100 bucks in 2019 doing it. Maybe he did something wrong, I don't know the details.

Depends on his specs, the currency he mined, and the time his system mines.

 

4 minutes ago, superfantastic said:

But it sounds like a boring waste of time if you don't have a killer setup. And even then, it's still boring

Not sure what you mean, crypto mining isn't a game, you just start the miner and then walk away, not sure how it's supposed to be fun or exciting?

[bcredeur97]

5 minutes ago, superfantastic said:

I know someone who mines bitcoin but he barely makes any money lol. I think he made like 100 bucks in 2019 doing it. Maybe he did something wrong, I don't know the details. But it sounds like a boring waste of time if you don't have a killer setup. And even then, it's still boring

You have to be bullish on bitcoin itself to profit from mining it. 
 

meaning you need to hold the coins you mine in hopes they keep appreciating in value. I too know several people who would mine and cash out constantly and they all did badly compared to if they had held the coins they mined 

[Moonzy]

Just now, wkdpaul said:

not sure how it's supposed to be fun or exciting?

Tweaking clocks, watching hashrate change in real time

Repositioning your hardware to look for best temps

Tweaking voltage and understand voltage to frequency curve

Diagnosing interesting issues that Google can't help you and forums refuses to help you with

 

Guess paul isn't as into hardware tinkering as I am

[WkdPaul]

Just now, Moonzy said:

Tweaking clocks, watching hashrate change in real time

Repositioning your hardware to look for best temps

Tweaking voltage and understand voltage to frequency curve

Diagnosing interesting issues that Google can't help you and forums refuses to help you with

 

Guess paul isn't as into hardware tinkering as I am

touché ... 

[Moonzy]

2 minutes ago, leadeater said:

When I run my systems for FAH or BOINC the last thing I want to do is extract the heat from my house, I like it warm 

Now I'm imagining KFConsole but it's your house, and you're the chicken

 

Mm crunchy, wait wrong mod

[wanderingfool2]

< removed as collateral >

 

In regards to the topic, it's unfortunate at how much graphics cards can be used for crypto currencies.  To those mentioning how currencies are backed by physical assets, compared to crypto, most countries don't use the fiat system anymore (which is unfortunate).  Honestly, I am surprised there isn't more legislation around this currently though, as people are using it to make profits that are not reported to the government (and in cases like this, I would consider the person to be effectively be running a business...and should be taxed accordingly)

Edited December 31, 2020 by LogicalDrm

[leadeater]

7 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

Now I'm imagining KFConsole but it's your house, and you're the chicken

 

Mm crunchy, wait wrong mod

It's not too bad, I open the door to that room when it gets close to 40C. In winter it struggles to get that warm though. But I do go stand in there in winter to warm up, it's nice haha. I do same thing at work in the hot aisle, which can get up to 50C in there.

[Kisai]

5 hours ago, mariushm said:

 

 

As for the guy who can't figure out the benefits of such currencies ... he should think harder.

Because there are no benefits that outweigh the cost. It's one thing if this was being generated only from otherwise-wasted energy (eg solar or geothermal generation where there is insufficient load to justify the capacity built, but a minimum capacity is needed to justify building it in the first place) but in nearly every case, crypto coins are raising the cost of energy in the same way people operating illegal grow-ops do.  The energy utilities know who is doing it, and as long as they're paying for it, they don't care. This is one of the things carbon taxes would ultimately fix by making dirty energy de-facto more expensive than green sources, and thus wasteful uses of energy become more efficient, or stop operating.

 

Since crypto is 100% waste, there will be an equilibrium point where it will be too expensive to use and something else will replace it. There is nothing stopping a more efficient cryptocoin to be made, nor is there anything preventing governments, financial companies or banks from generating their own coins that only they benefit from, snubbing all other coins they don't control, and likewise causing hardware shortages if they continue to use GPU parts for it. 

 

Quote

Such currencies have the potential to kill services like western union, money gram, which take 10-15% of the amount in fees,

 

That's a self-imposed penalty, nothing requires you to use these services, and banks actually insist that you do, even if you want to take your own money from one bank to another across the street. They don't physically have millions of dollars in physical cash. They want you to buy a bank draft, which costs you money too.

 

Quote

can make it easier to buy products without having to go through credit card processors and payment processors that may not accept some categories of content (ex porn, manga/hentai comics, marijuana or other things legal in your region but controversial in other places,  vape stuff - don't agree with it but nevertheless it can help some people stop smoking and for example paypal has recently just frozen or stolen tens of thousands of dollars from various sellers that sold vaping products through paypal.

Paypal is beholden to AMEX, VISA and Mastercard's rules, which in turn are rules imposed by their US HQ and hence US laws.

 

Quote

Even stuff like paying for your rent could be simplified... you guys in US still write checks and if you want to pay with a credit card they take a 20-30$ processing fee or some crap like that, because the credit card takes 2-5% in fees when you pay with your card.

Nobody in their right mind would pay rent in crypto coins. Nobody pays rent using cards because, again, the processing fees, and less-scrupulous landlords dodge taxes by saying they take in less rent than they actually do. This is a regulatory problem, and you push too hard on regulating renting, and then you chase out renting entirely or push it underground, which is what happens in big cities already, often with most SFH containing illegal suites.

 

Quote

Yeah. mining consumes a lot of power, but it's not the worst way to consume power... for example aluminum smelting plants consume way way way more power but you're not complaining and asking them to shut down.

 

Aluminum is an industrial material that has uses, and as long as it's cheaper to mine new aluminum rather than recycle, that's exactly what is going to happen. Again, green energy requirements and regulations changes this.

 

Even gold is an industrial metal, diamonds are an industrial material. You can mine both of these, but you can you can make diamonds. The question is if something's industrial value justifies it's value, or is it something else (as in the case of gold which tends to just be horded, with a mistaken belief that gold is money.) 

 

 

https://diamondfoundry.com/blogs/the-foundry-journal/surprise-it-takes-more-energy-to-mine-an-earth-created-diamond-than-cultivating-one-in-a-foundry

 

Like, it would be cheaper to produce diamonds with that energy and trade those than Bitcoin and Ethereum. At least there's something tradeable and usable with it.

 

Quote

Diamond mines operated by De Beers consume an average of 80.3 kWh per carat

 

Here's another document http://www.impactinstitute.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/Report_The_True_Price_of_Diamonds.pdf , Lab diamonds cost $9/c to make versus artisanal mining $1400/c.

 

Artisinal mining:

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Artisanal mining has a very high true price gap of almost 1,420 USD/carat polished diamond. Almost all of this is from social impacts (91%), with land transformation as the main environmental impact.

 

Lab diamonds:

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Energy use related external costs (climate change, air pollution, use of scarce energy materials) are the bulk of the external costs and are assessed at roughly 9 USD/polished carat

 

Meanwhile, e-waste, energy waste, is all bitcoin creates.

https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-energy-consumption

 

A single bitcoin transaction:

Quote

Equivalent to the power consumption of an average U.S. household over 23.54 days.

Compare diamonds:

https://www.jckonline.com/editorial-article/lab-created-diamonds-eco-friendly/

Quote

A single-stone HPHT press will use 175–225 kilowatt hours (kWh) per rough ct., which would end up around 650–1100 kWh per successful polished ct.

Quote

Jason Payne, founder of ADA Diamonds, has said the “most efficient” growers use 250 kWh per ct., which is the same amount of electricity the average U.S. household uses in 8.7 days or the electricity to fully charge a Tesla two-and-one-half times. But most use about 750 kWh to grow a diamond, he says.

So, producing diamonds? 2.7x more efficient than bitcoin in energy cost.

 

[superfantastic]

39 minutes ago, bcredeur97 said:

You have to be bullish on bitcoin itself to profit from mining it. 
 

meaning you need to hold the coins you mine in hopes they keep appreciating in value. I too know several people who would mine and cash out constantly and they all did badly compared to if they had held the coins they mined 

No idea what he did, but he brags about it a lot like it was a major achievement. He gives no details, I don't even know what card he used. He made it sound like it took a lot out of him, and then he makes a 100 bucks in a year lol

[superfantastic]

43 minutes ago, wkdpaul said:

Not sure what you mean, crypto mining isn't a game, you just start the miner and then walk away, not sure how it's supposed to be fun or exciting?

Considering I don't know shit about mining, everyone that ever talks about it makes it sounds like a boring afair. And it most definitely is a game, paul. An idle game.

[leadeater]

3 minutes ago, superfantastic said:

And it most definitely is a game, paul. An idle game

 

Edit:

My free gift counter argument for you miners 

 

[superfantastic]

1 minute ago, leadeater said:

 

More along the lines of adventure capitalist

[WkdPaul]

22 minutes ago, superfantastic said:

No idea what he did, but he brags about it a lot like it was a major achievement. He gives no details, I don't even know what card he used. He made it sound like it took a lot out of him, and then he makes a 100 bucks in a year lol

That's far from an achievement, I've mined on and off for the past few years, and $100 a year is ridiculous really (he probably spent more on electricity that that!).

 

I was lucky and mined a bit before the BTC boom, so I made profit, but my friend made a lot more by simply buying BTC directly, back then he bought 2 BTC for around $600 CAD each, that far more profits than I ever did mining it (I made about $1500 CAD in 3 years with on/off mining, and only in winter)