Nvidia sell to scalper and they don't care.

[Soda Popinsky]

Like many of you, I think scalping should be illegal. It is unfair that they can buy all the GPU and resale those at an astronomical price. I do not have the resource nor time to pass my day on Newegg to get a RTX 3080 for example or create a bot to buy it for myself. At least you think Nvidia will not encourage this kind of behavior if they have any respect to their customer. Well.... No, Nvidia does not care at all about us. The proof: I chat with a scalper. After asking how he did that, he simply told me he had close ties with Nvidia. Nvidia is probably not doing more money by selling to him, but they still do. This behavior from a GPU manufacturer tell you how little they care about customers. The scalper seems to be a good guy and he is just trying to do a little extra. And in this pandemic situation, lots of poeple need this money. I chat with Nvidia and if I don't have a copy of the transaction they will do nothing. The scalper explain in detail how he is doing it and Nvidia is definitly aware of this. 

[wall03]

Nowadays, it is very hard to stop scalping because bots can easily pass captchas and protocals. We're not ready for bots

[IkeaGnome]

No big company actually cares about their customers. If you don't like it, speak with your wallet.

[wall03]

5 minutes ago, Voluspa said:

No big company actually cares about their customers. If you don't like it, speak with your wallet.

except in this market, you can't, because AMD doesn't care either

[Soda Popinsky]

I'm telling they are not using bot. They are an instegrator. Basically they build PC and are tied with Nvidia. Nvidia send more than they need and they know it. The extra card, the integrator sales it on ebay.

[Soda Popinsky]

4 minutes ago, DriftMan said:

Well, you know what, they still can lie to you, they have no reason to tell you the truth, they have no reason to say "I tried so hard to fuck all of you with bots and/or stealing", you just say "I just buy from the seller, directly"

 

Do you have any real source? Publish it, but "X told me" isn't a real nor trustworthy source, even less if it's an asshole you are talking to

I chat with him and he explain it in detail. He is an integrator and all the card they don't sell in a computer, they sell it trought ebay. How can a ebay guy can get 60 card + with bot? Also, Nvidia and Newegg for example don't sell more then 1 card per customer...

[TetraSky]

Of course they don't care.

 

Whoever buys the product, is a customer. Scalper or not.

 

If anything, I'm surprised Nvidia hasn't raised their own prices to match the high demand and low supply. They would be well within their rights to do so, 

[kelvinhall05]

Muh scalper bad!!1

 

17 minutes ago, Soda Popinsky said:

It is unfair that they can buy all the GPU and resale those at an astronomical price.

Why? Most of them are buying it on credit. You could do the same exact thing.

18 minutes ago, Soda Popinsky said:

I do not have the resource nor time to pass my day on Newegg to get a RTX 3080 for example or create a bot to buy it for myself.

Plenty of bots available to use on Github, among other sites. I also find it amusing how you "don't have the time to scalp" but you have time to whine about it on a forum.

19 minutes ago, Soda Popinsky said:

At least you think Nvidia will not encourage this kind of behavior if they have any respect to their customer.

The scalpers buying these cards are their customers. The point of a business is to make money. That's it. They don't care who is buying the cards as long as it is making them money.

20 minutes ago, Soda Popinsky said:

Well.... No, Nvidia does not care at all about us

Why should they? They're making money. Who cares if a few people are gonna cry about it on a tech forum? Nobody needs the latest and greatest GPU to survive.

21 minutes ago, Soda Popinsky said:

The proof: I chat with a scalper. After asking how he did that, he simply told me he had close ties with Nvidia.

This is not proof. This is a statement that you very likely made up.

22 minutes ago, Soda Popinsky said:

Nvidia is probably not doing more money by selling to him, but they still do.

At the bare minimum they are making the same money faster. I wouldn't be surprised if they are indeed making more money. More demand = more buyers = more profit.

24 minutes ago, Soda Popinsky said:

This behavior from a GPU manufacturer tell you how little they care about customers.

Again, I doubt this conversation ever happened.

25 minutes ago, Soda Popinsky said:

And in this pandemic situation, lots of poeple need this money.

So you're complaining that he is flipping stuff at a markup to make money, but then trying to justify it?

25 minutes ago, Soda Popinsky said:

I chat with Nvidia and if I don't have a copy of the transaction they will do nothing.

They won't do anything because it never happened, lol. And even if it did, like I said, there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. You may get triggered by it, but it's not illegal or unethical or anything.

[Dionyz]

10 minutes ago, TetraSky said:

Of course they don't care.

 

Whoever buys the product, is a customer. Scalper or not.

 

If anything, I'm surprised Nvidia hasn't raised their own prices to match the high demand and low supply. They would be well within their rights to do so, 

They would get into legal trouble if they did that. Monopolies get sued all the time and you have to see the reason why. There lies your answer. 

[IkeaGnome]

27 minutes ago, wall03 said:

except in this market, you can't, because AMD doesn't care either

Granted I have a desk job, so I can refresh when they tend to restock, but I was able to get a 5800x and 6800 xt less than a week after the 6800xt released directly from AMD.

[wall03]

Just now, Voluspa said:

Granted I have a desk job, so I can refresh when they tend to restock, but I was able to get a 5800x and 6800 xt less than a week after the 6800xt released directly from AMD.

I was talking about the company overall, not just the scalping, which is considerably worse the NVIDIA I may note

[kelvinhall05]

7 minutes ago, Dionyz said:

They would get into legal trouble if they did that. Monopolies get sued all the time and you have to see the reason why. There lies your answer. 

How the hell is changing prices suddenly making them a monopoly? Lmao

[Tristerin]

35 minutes ago, Voluspa said:

No big company actually cares about their customers. If you don't like it, speak with your wallet.

#preach

 

[IkeaGnome]

5 minutes ago, wall03 said:

I was talking about the company overall, not just the scalping, which is considerably worse the NVIDIA I may note

So if we're going with companies that don't do anything shady at all, who should we buy from?

Edit:

Or do we speak with wallets and not buy any parts?

Edited December 18, 2020 by Voluspa
Added a tad more

[wall03]

Just now, Voluspa said:

So if we're going with companies that don't do anything shady at all, who should we buy from?

in the CPU/GPU market, no one

Online shopping? Can't name a single company

Wait. Was that a rhetorical question? My bad.

You can't trust any big companies, so who do we trust. For real.

[SpaceGhostC2C]

31 minutes ago, TetraSky said:

If anything, I'm surprised Nvidia hasn't raised their own prices to match the high demand and low supply

They don't want the headline. Plus they set the price to convey a particular price/performance ratio in comparison charts, so won't do it before AMD does it, and AMD is playing the same game.

In fact, if it wasn't for the shift in price/performance compared to Turing, the hype for this cards wouldn't even be that big: unless you are swimming in money and you must have a 3090, any appeal disappears at eBay prices. They'll need to wait till "TIs" or "Supers" or whatever to skim a bit more cream off the hype while saving face.

[Applefreak]

35 minutes ago, Soda Popinsky said:

Like many of you, I think scalping should be illegal. It is unfair that they can buy all the GPU and resale those at an astronomical price. I do not have the resource nor time to pass my day on Newegg to get a RTX 3080 for example or create a bot to buy it for myself. At least you think Nvidia will not encourage this kind of behavior if they have any respect to their customer. Well.... No, Nvidia does not care at all about us. The proof: I chat with a scalper. After asking how he did that, he simply told me he had close ties with Nvidia. Nvidia is probably not doing more money by selling to him, but they still do. This behavior from a GPU manufacturer tell you how little they care about customers. The scalper seems to be a good guy and he is just trying to do a little extra. And in this pandemic situation, lots of poeple need this money. I chat with Nvidia and if I don't have a copy of the transaction they will do nothing. The scalper explain in detail how he is doing it and Nvidia is definitly aware of this. 

The only way to stop those guys and girls is to make sure they pay taxes on their profits, in some countries. Some countries have laws that forbid the markup of products in such away but in order for those laws to come into affect, one would have to make that claim and then have the card sent into evidence. In turn you won't have a card until the trial is over, which can take years with both parties accusing each other. In the end, you pay for it because you want it. If you can wait, you can buy it for less. Yes it is unfair and I not condone such behavior as I believe it shows poor character. I know for a fact that the same thing has been going on with cars for much longer than in the pc market. People are buying luxury cars, like a new Ferrari for example and selling them off before it has even shipped at double the price. Some companies are tracking those sales however and won't allow you to buy another car if you cannot show you still own the previous model. 

From a business standpoint with mass commodities such as graphics cards, the bitcoin mining boom may have helped amd further develop it's current lineup of graphics cards and cpus by selling off large quantities of radeon 7 and vega 64 and 56 cards. So there could be an upside to it.

Also keep in mind that those shortages that people are profiting on are not just a result of higher than average demand but also due to the early shutdowns in asia this year. I would assume only 1 in 10 or even less gpu die is sold as a graphics card to consumers. Server farms need them to make money and quadro cards are more profitable to sell than consumer cards.

 

In the end, I don't even want the current lineup cards as they are being sold right now, I want the models that come later with board revisions and more memory. If you can wait, you won't be bothered as much. What bothers me is that older cards are out of stock as well, so should my current one die, I could not even replace it with some low end stuff. Yes I would like to play the latest games but at the point they are patched and stable in performance, those cards should be available. When supplies can keep up, those who made a profit now won't even have enough money to buy up containers of gpus in order to limit availability again.

 

Sry. for the long reply.

[IkeaGnome]

1 minute ago, wall03 said:

in the CPU/GPU market, no one

Online shopping? Can't name a single company

Wait. Was that a rhetorical question? My bad.

You can't trust any big companies, so who do we trust. For real.

It was kind of rhetorical, but not really.

You can't really purchase parts based on companies "amazing /s" track records. If you do that, you're limited to what one has done stuff you disagree less with. In all honesty, I don't care about RTX or DLSS. This upgrade was going to be AMD from the get go. With Nvidia recent...happenings... I'm glad I went that way. That doesn't make AMD perfect.

We're into an industry that virtually every company will have bad policies if you dig far enough. Even the places your food comes from. Not what it's made out to be. In America we have our own issues with where our food comes from. If you're from Europe, just look up Greenhouses of Almeria. 

I'm not trying to go off on a big tangent or turn this into humane issues this....humane issues that. In general though, look at where our "stuff" comes from in America. It's either China, or low paying factories. Even the "American Made" tag that is supposed to make us see the product in a better light isn't always true. Yes, there are companies you can buy from that do a better job at vetting supply chains, but this stuff still falls through the cracks.

[MS-DOS]

Stop buying and prices will drop. I have a 1600 super and im not buying shit until I like the pricess.

[Moonzy]

idk what you're talking about, i bought 3x 3060ti by walking into stores, on 3 separate days

using them happily now

 

1 hour ago, Soda Popinsky said:

I chat with him and he explain it in detail. He is an integrator and all the card they don't sell in a computer, they sell it trought ebay.

proof?

 

also,

58 minutes ago, kelvinhall05 said:

Plenty of bots available to use on Github, among other sites. I also find it amusing how you "don't have the time to scalp" but you have time to whine about it on a forum.

Amen  this is what i've been saying lmao

[unsorted]

* Nvidia seeking as much profit as they can.

* Scalpers seeking as much profit as they can.

* Everyone involved in the production of the product seeking as much profit as they can.

* market indicating it is prepared to pay more

 

No, no. I want them to care about me and my Christmas shopping list!

No, no. I want them to care about ME!

 

I paid for that oven mitt and lavish kitchen, Jensen. You owe meeeeeeee.

Who will save Christmas?

[Ja Krispie]

2 hours ago, Soda Popinsky said:

Like many of you, I think scalping should be illegal. It is unfair that they can buy all the GPU and resale those at an astronomical price. I do not have the resource nor time to pass my day on Newegg to get a RTX 3080 for example or create a bot to buy it for myself. At least you think Nvidia will not encourage this kind of behavior if they have any respect to their customer. Well.... No, Nvidia does not care at all about us. The proof: I chat with a scalper. After asking how he did that, he simply told me he had close ties with Nvidia. Nvidia is probably not doing more money by selling to him, but they still do. This behavior from a GPU manufacturer tell you how little they care about customers. The scalper seems to be a good guy and he is just trying to do a little extra. And in this pandemic situation, lots of poeple need this money. I chat with Nvidia and if I don't have a copy of the transaction they will do nothing. The scalper explain in detail how he is doing it and Nvidia is definitly aware of this. 

It sucks, but I just wait till I can buy it at retail. I don't need anything right away like GPU, CPU, Consoles ect. I can wait out the scalpers and find it for MSRP. Illegal though? For non essential items I disagree.

[unsorted]

15 minutes ago, Psybadek said:

 Illegal though? For non essential items I disagree.

For any items, I disagree. Gov shouldn't be deciding what is essential and what isn't...but of course they do.

 

Anyway, governments buy things in bulk and sell them for inflated prices ALL THE TIME. They manipulate the market to extract as much wealth from the masses as possible. Their subsidies RAISE the prices for us all. If scalping were made illegal, they'd be out of luck. LOL.

[dizmo]

I don't think it should be illegal when it comes to luxury goods. You're basically inviting the government into your life, letting them tell you what you can and can't do with your personal possessions. That's a pretty slippery slope. How would you like it if they started putting limits on the amount of time you spent on your PC, as they decided more than 3 hours a day is bad for the general public's health?

 

Is it unfair? Sure. However, you can simply wait and stock will get back to normal. Nothing is requiring you to buy the video card now. Nvidia isn't encouraging the behavior, but at the end of the day, they're a business and a card sold is a card sold. Especially in their market position, where there's only two options, and both have stock issues; people will forgive and forget, or buy because they're simply the only option. It's also entirely possible that Nvidia set aside a certain amount of cards for bulk purchases. That's up to them and their business model, though I doubt it's true in the light that you put it in. Something you have to remember: a customer is a customer. Just because they're not a gamer, doesn't mean they're not a customer. There's likely no agreement with what he does with the product after he's received it, and frankly, they have no business knowing that.

 

While you're correct that in the current climate people need the extra cash, I'd argue that perhaps now isn't the best time to be spending any money on an unnecessary luxury item. While most people paint people selling these cards as high rollers snatching up all the stock, it's simply not the case. While there's certainly a few, it's mostly thousands of people buying a handful of cards each and reselling them. Or someone who bought the card, looks at what they're selling for, and says "I could really use the extra cash right now instead.." For those selling their card to have the extra cash, it's probably a smarter decision than having a shiny new toy to play with. Those that have plenty of expendable income aren't hurt by paying more.

 

2 hours ago, Voluspa said:

No big company actually cares about their customers. If you don't like it, speak with your wallet.

Unfortunately doesn't work in every instance, especially here where you only really have 2 options and they're about the same as far as ethics and practices go.

1 hour ago, Dionyz said:

They would get into legal trouble if they did that. Monopolies get sued all the time and you have to see the reason why. There lies your answer. 

There is no monopoly here though. It also depends on the country. In the US, a company is allowed to price it's product at whatever they like. It is, after all, their product.

1 hour ago, Applefreak said:

The only way to stop those guys and girls is to make sure they pay taxes on their profits, in some countries. Some countries have laws that forbid the markup of products in such away but in order for those laws to come into affect, one would have to make that claim and then have the card sent into evidence. In turn you won't have a card until the trial is over, which can take years with both parties accusing each other. In the end, you pay for it because you want it. If you can wait, you can buy it for less. Yes it is unfair and I not condone such behavior as I believe it shows poor character. I know for a fact that the same thing has been going on with cars for much longer than in the pc market. People are buying luxury cars, like a new Ferrari for example and selling them off before it has even shipped at double the price. Some companies are tracking those sales however and won't allow you to buy another car if you cannot show you still own the previous model. 

From a business standpoint with mass commodities such as graphics cards, the bitcoin mining boom may have helped amd further develop it's current lineup of graphics cards and cpus by selling off large quantities of radeon 7 and vega 64 and 56 cards. So there could be an upside to it.

Also keep in mind that those shortages that people are profiting on are not just a result of higher than average demand but also due to the early shutdowns in asia this year. I would assume only 1 in 10 or even less gpu die is sold as a graphics card to consumers. Server farms need them to make money and quadro cards are more profitable to sell than consumer cards.

 

In the end, I don't even want the current lineup cards as they are being sold right now, I want the models that come later with board revisions and more memory. If you can wait, you won't be bothered as much. What bothers me is that older cards are out of stock as well, so should my current one die, I could not even replace it with some low end stuff. Yes I would like to play the latest games but at the point they are patched and stable in performance, those cards should be available. When supplies can keep up, those who made a profit now won't even have enough money to buy up containers of gpus in order to limit availability again.

 

Sry. for the long reply.

It wouldn't stop them. The amount of tax they'd have to pay isn't anywhere near the potential profit. They're making 2x, so if they took a hit they're still getting hundreds of dollars. Which countries have laws against the mark up of luxury goods?

 

Older cards aren't produced anymore. So once they're gone, they're gone. If they can't produce the current cards, how would they produce the older ones?

1 hour ago, Voluspa said:

It was kind of rhetorical, but not really.

You can't really purchase parts based on companies "amazing /s" track records. If you do that, you're limited to what one has done stuff you disagree less with. In all honesty, I don't care about RTX or DLSS. This upgrade was going to be AMD from the get go. With Nvidia recent...happenings... I'm glad I went that way. That doesn't make AMD perfect.

We're into an industry that virtually every company will have bad policies if you dig far enough. Even the places your food comes from. Not what it's made out to be. In America we have our own issues with where our food comes from. If you're from Europe, just look up Greenhouses of Almeria. 

I'm not trying to go off on a big tangent or turn this into humane issues this....humane issues that. In general though, look at where our "stuff" comes from in America. It's either China, or low paying factories. Even the "American Made" tag that is supposed to make us see the product in a better light isn't always true. Yes, there are companies you can buy from that do a better job at vetting supply chains, but this stuff still falls through the cracks.

Which Nvidia happenings? AMD had worse stock at launch than Nvidia. At least Nvidia was honest about the shortage of available stock.

Agreed about track records though. Look at CDPR. They constantly touted the "only released when it's ready" line and they released...something that's worse than a beta.

1 hour ago, MS-DOS said:

Stop buying and prices will drop. I have a 1600 super and im not buying shit until I like the pricess.

It work in theory, but doesn't in practice. You'd need everyone to stop buying, and then prices would only drop once supply is back. At which point it'd drop anyway.

[Mark Kaine]

4 hours ago, Tristerin said:

#preach

 

yeah but then you're just not getting a gpu at all? 

 

speak with your wallet isn't always the answer, and usually doesn't even work because you're still giving someone money who's practices you may not like... 

 

 

And in this case we are seeing a *duopoly* with strong family ties in action who share the market worldwide between them and dictate prices however they want since there is literally no competition. 

 

The solution is pretty clear, market regulators have to do their job or this will never change... 

 

And yes, it's not going to be easy, something has to be done about it anyway. 

 

 

Quote

 

What Is a Duopoly?

A duopoly is a situation where two companies together own all, or nearly all, of the market for a given product or service. A duopoly is the most basic form of oligopoly, a market dominated by a small number of companies. A duopoly can have the same impact on the market as a monopoly if the two players collude on prices or output. Collusion results in consumers paying higher prices than they would in a truly competitive market, and it is illegal under U.S. antitrust law.

It shouldn't even be hard to proof tbh, as everyone can see it anyway. 

It's no different than a monopoly in this case and indeed, illegal. 

 

Hence "speak with your wallet" literally doesn't work in this situation...