Trying to find the troublesome part, is it the CPU (3800XT) or the 32GB RAM? (EDIT: DIMM_B1 and DIMM_B2 slots not working with new CPU)

[MarkR17]

EDIT V2: See below for more details, to avoid clutter in this post. Currently two top-most RAM slots work, but not any other slots. All RAM slots work with the old CPU.

 

So far I acquired a very recent upgrade, for the lack of options.

Mainly two upgrades, first from the Ryzen 5 1600 to the Ryzen 7 3800XT (Before you ask, the 5600X isn't available. And I got the 3800XT for the same price as the 5600X MSRP, if you could get one)

I also upgraded from the elCheapo 16GB DDR4 2133 RAM which was a single stick (from the Great RAM Shortage) to newer GSkill Ripjaws V DDR4 32GB 3600 RAM, which has two sticks.

 

One BIOS update later the CPU and RAM was upgraded.

 

Disappointment ensues when after putting everything together, the system would not boot, but the fans are spinning. No video output.

It puts out three beeps, one long followed by two shorter beeps. According to the mobo manual the RAM was not detected. These beeps also occur when there are not any RAM sticks at all.

The motherboard shows no debug LEDs, only the power on LED is on and the built-in RGB lights.

 

I already tried putting the RAM sticks in different positions and combinations, did not work either. I already reseated them multiple times, still does not work.

It never works as long as there are more than one stick of RAM.

 

The REALLY weird part is that when I decided to turn it on again, it actually worked for about a minute until the computer crashed and it remained that way.

For extra funsies I decided to put one stick of the newer RAM with the older elCheapo RAM stick, just to see what happens. Did not boot, as expected (not that I want to run this)

 

Then I removed one RAM stick and it boots up perfectly. Set the RAM to the XMP profile, runs perfectly fine at the rated 3600. One memory test (using MemTest) later did not reveal any memory errors.

The CPU itself also did not show any stability issues by itself.

 

No CPU overclocking was done in any way or shape possible. The only overclock, if it counts as one is applying the XMP memory profile.

 

The CMOS has been manually reset multiple times to ensure that the BIOS settings are as default as possible.

 

-- How about the older CPU?

 

Initially I thought the RAM was bad until I decided to put the older CPU back, with the newer RAM remaining in place.

 

It works much better than expected with the older CPU. Not only can it detect these two sticks of RAM, it seems to be stable at 3200Mhz.

Above that speed and blue screens happens, but that is probably because the old Ryzen memory controller is not capable of doing that (I did overclock the old Ryzen 5 1600).

 

I do not have a different motherboard at hand to rule out the motherboard but the memory controller is on the CPU.

That being said, it is possible that the older X370 board does not play nice with the new Ryzen 7 3800XT (but it is supported).

 

Memory test is still running but no errors so far with the older CPU, with both sticks of RAM

 

Both CPU and RAM are still in the return window. I condersider returning either of them, whatever turns out to be broken.

 

 

I am currently betting that my new CPU has a bad memory controller while my new RAM is probably fine.

I am mainly interested in that RAM, the CPU upgrade was more of a panic buy given the current AMD CPU shortages and possibly(?) the 3000 CPUs no longer being in production

 

EDIT: Would not completely rule out the Motherboard, in one shape or another. That being said, a new mobo is not exactly cheap.

 

I am aware of these other things:

- The motherboard was never supposed to run that kind of RAM, it is not on the QVL list. This does not explain how it works well with the old CPU.

- I was actually expecting some trouble with the RAM given that older motherboard but I at least expected to boot that system with the safe RAM speed of 2133 Mhz (non-XMP).

- Inserting the RAM sticks takes more force than expected, a bit more than I feel comfortable. That board uses a single tab to hold the RAM in place.

- No physical damage to either parts, no bent pins on the CPU, RAM is new and there are no signs of damage and RAM slots of the board are clean.

- As a side note, the newer CPU runs much hotter, about 30 degrees Celcius hotter than the older one (from 40C to 70C at stock). And I am using a big air cooler. This was expected but by that much?

 

Specs

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3800XT (from the 1600)

Cooler: Thermalright HR-02 (140mm air cooler)

RAM: 32GB GSkill Ripjaws V DDR4 32GB 3600 (from the ElCheapo 16GB 2133)

MoBo: ASUS ROG Strix X370-F (it does not support the newest Ryzen CPUs)

GPU: Radeon RX 570 8GB (This is not a gaming rig, this is used for "work")

SSD: Samsung EVO 850 500GB

PSU: beQuiet Straight Power 10 600W

[WhitetailAni]

16 minutes ago, MarkR17 said:

Inserting the RAM sticks takes more force than expected, a bit more than I feel comfortable. That board uses a single tab to hold the RAM in place.

My Asus B350-F Gaming board uses that too. I personally thought it took less force than other modules, but my comparison is SDRAM (the DIMMs with 2 notches).

Also, I'm running 3200 MHz on B350 and 3600.

DOCP works fine.

Yes, I know it seems weird. It was built for 1st gen Ryzen, but my 1600X died in a cleaning accident.

I'm going to guess and say CPU.

[MarkR17]

Update on my part, I am testing that RAM with my old CPU using Memtest. It seems to be stable at 3400Mhz, which is impressive from that old CPU.

That rules the RAM out. RAM is about as good as it can get given the limitations from 1st gen Ryzen. (Ofc timings are a bit relaxed, but I have no time to tweak them right now).

 

In contrast the newer CPU will not even boot with two sticks of RAM at stock settings, only works with one.

 

This makes even less sense. Thing is, I thought a CPU can never break, not couning overclocking and other deliberate things for obvious reasons.

[MarkR17]

Another update, it is actually possible to run two these RAM sticks with the new CPU, but currently only the top most two RAM slots work, which are NOT in dual channel.

 

Kinda like this:

CPU Socket

|

|

DIMM_A1 (does work)

DIMM_A2 (does work)

 

DIMM_B1 (does not work!)

DIMM_B2 (does not work!)

 

putting any RAM stick in DIMM_B1 or DIMM_B2 does not work with the new 3800XT. These two "faulty" slots do work with the 1600 perfecty fine in dual channel in all slots, even at 3400 Mhz.

This suggests a broken memory channel which indicates a broken memory controller.

 

From what I've heard broken or bad memory controllers with AMD are a thing, is that true?

Its not first gen Ryzen though. And with my first gen Ryzen CPU I manage to hit 3400Mhz with that RAM which is insane by first gen Ryzen standards.

The two other RAM slots do not work at all, even with only a single RAM stick.

 

The problem ATM is that the RMA process with AMD could be troublesome, I have to proof that it really is the CPU and not anything else since they could claim that I am running that CPU on an incompatible platform (X370 w/ DDR4 3600). I may rather have that crippled RAM than dealing with the RMA which might take weeks in the current climate. On the other hand I do have the older stuff so I at least I have something in the meantime.

 

Again, I do NOT have another motherboard right now and currently getting another AM4 motherboard is difficult. I only have another older CPU an older RAM.

 

I still got that old "ElCheapo" 2133 RAM stick which is JEDEC compliant. ofc it does not work with the "broken" RAM slots. Which it does when paired with the old CPU. At least I could use that to proof a point.

 

How much am I missing out from not having dual channel memory?. I mainly need the extra RAM capacity. RAM does work at the rated 3600Mhz in the only working configuratoin. Can the faster RAM speed make up for the lack of dual channel?

 (This is NOT used for gaming. Currently testing if 3600Mhz works)

 

EDIT: Also tried a different compatible BIOS, did not fix it.

[narrdarr]

Just want to confirm something.

Does b2 work when a2 is in use or b1 when a1 is in use?

 

 what method did you use when clearing cmos?

 

You updated the bios to which version?

This may sound weird but have you updated your chipset driver then cleared cmos?

 

 

[MarkR17]

Currently only these combinations work:

 

Single stick of Ram

1x Stick in DIMM_A1

1x Stick in DIMM_A2

Two sticks

2x Sticks in DIMM_A1 and DIMM_A2 (this is not in dual channel!)

 

These combinations below do NOT work, it will not boot at all, it beeps three times which indicates that RAM is not detected.
1x Stick in DIMM_B1

1x Stick in DIMM_B2

2x Sticks in DIMM_A1 + DIMM_B1 (Except it worked once for one minute then it crashed. It never worked again after that)

2x Sticks in DIMM_A2 + DIMM_B2

Havent tried DIMM_B1 + DIMM_B2 but that is pointless because its not in dual channel

 

This only applies to the new CPU (3800XT). The other combinations work fine with the old CPU (1600)

 

This motherboard does not have a clear CMOS button so I the only available method which is shorting the CMOS reset pins with the screwdriver while the system is completely unplugged.

I have not tried to remove the CMOS battery, but the CMOS battery should good as the board is not that old. I also have no spare CMOS battery right now.

 

Previously I used the newest BIOS 5603, currently it is downgraded to 5406. This is odd because I assumed that downgrading the BIOS should not work.

 

I also double checked the CPU pins, no bent or dirty pins, same for the motherboard.

 

 

 

I already installed the latest chipset drivers before doing any BIOS updates.

- Installed chipset drivers first

- Then updated to the latest BIOS with the old CPU

- Works perfectly fine with the old CPU

- Then CPU upgrade ensued which breaks RAM compatibility.

- Sometime after that I cleared the CMOS.

 

EDIT: I *might* upgrade the RAM again in the far future. Having non-working RAM slots is the problem here.

 

[narrdarr]

I help a guy a while with a similar issue. He was clearing cmos the same way with no luck. Had him do it the old fashion way by removing the battery and a board drain. It worked for him.

 

Power down

switch psu off

Unplug the system

Remove the battery

Hold the case power on switch for 30 sec with no power attached.

Put ram in correct slots a2 and b2

Insert battery

Attach power cable and boot.

 

Also ensure the ram is center and evenly slotted.my asus z170 was very picky about it.

 

 

 

 

[MarkR17]

Thanks man, the computer is booting now(?)

 

With one additional caveat though:

 

I decided to clean the AM4 socket because I think that there are small dustlets that may have prevented any connections from the pins to the socket.

The AM4 socket was not perfectly clean, it was just a tiny bit dusty. (and that was after applying it multiple times)

 

However, getting it very clean was difficult with my current tools I have right now, so I resorted using a vacuum to remove any potential dust, applying it to the socket at the lowest power setting for about 2 seconds.

 

I know I should never use a vacuum to clean a computer but at that point I had no other options left. Think it as an act of desperation, having nothing to lose.

 

I assume that the extra pins for the I/O die from the 3000 series CPU got blocked by dust.

AM4 sockets do not use a socket cover unlike LGA sockets.

 

I will stress test the computer now and if nothing bad happens in the next hours I will mark it as solved.

 

 

That still does NOT explain how that RAM worked so well with the old CPU.

 

 

 

Other options(?)

- My relative was about to get an AM4 system, I might try it out on their system? (But I may have to ask again, because pretty much every AMD CPU is out of stock).

- Get a cheap AM4 motherboard by myself? The problem is, any cheapo AM4 motherboards have crappy VRM.

- Albeit I could get said cheapo AM4 board just so that my old components have a home. This might take a while, and by the time I get that board and installed it my new components are no longer returnable (without a really good reason)

 

One last question:

- Now that everything seems to work, I should NOT update the BIOS in the future?

 

 

[narrdarr]

Oh good

---

Please dont clean with a vacuum the ps like that. Highly unlikely the dust would have done anything. You were kinda just throwing ideas at a wall to see what would happen. However if you wanted to clean the socket. You can squeeze rubbing alcohol into the socket. 

 

----

I have seen weirder things happen with pcs I wouldn't think to hard about why the ram worked then didn't work ECT.

 

-----

I doubt there will be any more updates for that board but yes I would continue to update bios.

[MarkR17]

Computer is stable. Marked this as solved. No more replies required, the thread can be closed