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Build/Upgrade old gaming pc (e5 1620 or i5 4670k)?

Go to solution Solved by Bombastinator,
1 minute ago, xayok11355 said:

True, i did not take IPC into account. However, both chips i mentioned are from the same year, so i'm not sure if they differ in IPC? Are there generally any differences in IPC between server and consumer grade CPU's? From my understanding, the e5 1620 is basically an i5/i7 from the same era in terms of structure, and just slightly modified, so i guess there wouldn't be any difference?

I can definitely see how having more cores/threads is gonna benefit most stuff today. IIRC back when Intel launched Haswell, the general consensus was that the i5 is the best gaming CPU, because games wouldn't benefit from the extra threads of an i7. I haven't actually kept myself updated in this regard, but i'm gonna assume newer games make much better use of all the cores/threads, seeing as how Ryzens outperform the i5 lineup (or does this come down to IPC?)

Thanks

In this case it doesn’t.  The overclock ability of the i5 could make the chip faster than the e1650 in some things.  It would have to be a good overclock though.  With them both sitting not overclocked the e1650 is faster.  Is it possible that with enough overclock you could get the 4670k to run some stuff faster than the e1650? Sure.  Not a whole lot though, and the problem the 4670k runs into is if it hits a need for more than 4 threads it starts creating overhead.  Most modern games are 6 thread, because that’s what jaguar1 had available for games.  That means that running those games the 4670k will have 2 threads worth of overhead all the time where the e1650 won’t.   This is what killed the 5ghz single core chips and made the 2.4ghz duos crush them.

Budget (including currency): Whatever is necessary for the GPU

Country: Switzerland

Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: Minecraft, Fortnite, and any sort of new f2p games

Hi all

I was asked to build/upgrade a pc for a friends son. He seems to mostly play minecraft and fortnite, as well as new games that are (i think most of them) f2p. He currently has a setup with an Intel E5 1620v2, but i'm wondering if my old I5-4670k would be (significantly?) better. If it would be around the same performance wise, i'd rather sell it tbh.

His Current Setup:

Intel E5 1620 v2
16GB ram (not sure what speed, but considering the cpu, probably not amazing)
256gb SSD

Nvidia Quado K2200
Not so amazing PSU
Proprietary DELL Mobo

Alternative Setup:
i5-4670k
Asus Maximus VI Hero
16GB Ram @ 2166mhz
The rest of the hardware from the current system

In any case, i'll need a new GPU and a new PSU. What GPU do you guys think would be a good fit for these systems? Also, i get mixed answers and benchmark scores on the internet, but to me it seems like the two cpu's seem to be more or less on par (at least when not OC'd). Would there be a huge increase in performance if i'd switch to the i5-4670k, with possibily some minimal OC (not planing on fiddling with voltages etc.)? If the performance is similar, i'd rather sell the CPU, as it seems to still hold some value.
Prices seem to be quite different from the US, so as a help, here's a well known swiss site to compare prices between shops. https://www.toppreise.ch/en


Personally i was thinking of going with a RTX2060 or a Radeon 5600XT, but i'm not sure if they might be overkill for the system. On the other hand, i could go RX580, but i'm not sure if that would be on the low end.

Thanks for the help :).

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Looking at he ark.intel stuff for both chips the xenon e5 is actually a bit more chip.  It’s got higher base clocks, more cache, and the e5 is 4/8 whereas the the 4670k is 4/4.  The e5 is older so there may be ipc things or whatnot that could cause issues.  Assuming the e5 is a bit like a 4770k I find that mine pairs pretty well with a 580. 

Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

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I checked out intels pages on it as well, and to me it also seemed like the e5 is on par or slightly better than the i5. I thought that maybe i was just missing something.

I'm thinking of pairing it with a 1660 super then, as it's only slightly more expensive, and seems to be quite a bit better.

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1620 V2 would be a good upgrade over 4670k.

 

Here, e5 1620 is compared to a 4790.

 

Also, get a used 1070. They go for around $130-150 in used market. I find a lot of 1070/ti in my location for pretty cheap price. You can alternatively get a used rx580 for around $80-100 USD.

 

 

SSD TIER LIST

 

CPU - Ryzen 7 3700X

Mobo - ASRock X470 Taichi

Memory - G.Skill Trident Z RGB (8x2 3200MHz) 

Storage - Sabrent Rocket 1TB - Seagate Barracuda 2TBWD Black 1TB

GPU - MSI GeForce GTX 980Ti LIGHTNING

CaseFractal Design Meshify C

PSUSuper Flower Leadex II Gold 650W

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So, i've done some more research.

Seems like the cpu is an e5 1620v3, which has hyperthreading but only boosts up to 3.6ghz.
On the other hand, my old i5 4670k has no hypethreading, but i could easily OC it to around 4.2ghz i assume.
I'm still not sure what would be the better benefit. Ditch the 4 HT cores, but have a lower clock speed, or ditch the 4 extra HT cores but have a (much) higher clock speed. 

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2 hours ago, xayok11355 said:

So, i've done some more research.

Seems like the cpu is an e5 1620v3, which has hyperthreading but only boosts up to 3.6ghz.
On the other hand, my old i5 4670k has no hypethreading, but i could easily OC it to around 4.2ghz i assume.
I'm still not sure what would be the better benefit. Ditch the 4 HT cores, but have a lower clock speed, or ditch the 4 extra HT cores but have a (much) higher clock speed. 

 

On 12/1/2020 at 8:07 PM, VEXICUS said:

1620 V2 would be a good upgrade over 4670k.

 

Here, e5 1620 is compared to a 4790.

 

Also, get a used 1070. They go for around $130-150 in used market. I find a lot of 1070/ti in my location for pretty cheap price. You can alternatively get a used rx580 for around $80-100 USD.

 

 

This☝️

SSD TIER LIST

 

CPU - Ryzen 7 3700X

Mobo - ASRock X470 Taichi

Memory - G.Skill Trident Z RGB (8x2 3200MHz) 

Storage - Sabrent Rocket 1TB - Seagate Barracuda 2TBWD Black 1TB

GPU - MSI GeForce GTX 980Ti LIGHTNING

CaseFractal Design Meshify C

PSUSuper Flower Leadex II Gold 650W

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I'm honestly not convinced that a 4/8 cpu with a (substantially) lower clock speed will outperform an OC'd i5 4670k.
Also that video you posted if kind of funny. The title says "BETTER CPU THAN I7", yet out of 7 games that were tested, 5 out of them the i7 clearly won, 1 of them the e5 did and one of them was 0.2fps difference, so i'd call that a draw honestly.

If we take a look at GamerNexus video for example, i5-4690k, we can see that the OC'd i5 trades blows with the E5-2697 v2, which is a 12/24 CPU with almost the same boost-clock as the e5-1620v3. What i'm trying to say is, i'm not sure that the 4 extra HT cores would actually yield higher FPS than than having 4cores at a much higher frequency. That being said, i can see how the 4 HT cores of the e5 will easily give it the edge over the i5 as soon as you do something outside of gaming (or have a ton of stuff open in the background while gaming).

Long story short, i'm gonna stick with the e5. Personally i think the i5 would perform slightly better after OC, but the hassle of getting it stable and the 4 missing HT cores are drawbacks that i think outweigh the (possibly?) better performance.

Thanks

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29 minutes ago, xayok11355 said:

I'm honestly not convinced that a 4/8 cpu with a (substantially) lower clock speed will outperform an OC'd i5 4670k.
Also that video you posted if kind of funny. The title says "BETTER CPU THAN I7", yet out of 7 games that were tested, 5 out of them the i7 clearly won, 1 of them the e5 did and one of them was 0.2fps difference, so i'd call that a draw honestly.

If we take a look at GamerNexus video for example, i5-4690k, we can see that the OC'd i5 trades blows with the E5-2697 v2, which is a 12/24 CPU with almost the same boost-clock as the e5-1620v3. What i'm trying to say is, i'm not sure that the 4 extra HT cores would actually yield higher FPS than than having 4cores at a much higher frequency. That being said, i can see how the 4 HT cores of the e5 will easily give it the edge over the i5 as soon as you do something outside of gaming (or have a ton of stuff open in the background while gaming).

Long story short, i'm gonna stick with the e5. Personally i think the i5 would perform slightly better after OC, but the hassle of getting it stable and the 4 missing HT cores are drawbacks that i think outweigh the (possibly?) better performance.

Thanks

It won’t in absolutely everything.  Lots of stuff though.  Ghz isn’t absolutely everything.  It’s a lot, but not everything.

The first is thread numbers.  A 4/8 cpu can manage 8 threads without extra overhead.  A 4/4 cpu can only manage 4 threads without extra overhead.  Way way back in the day they had single core CPUs.  They ran at over 5 ghz even.  They pitted them against dual thread CPUs running at 2.4ghz and they lost.  By a lot.  
 

The other thing to look at is IPC Instructions Per Clock.  A 4670k has 2014 era IPC so for some things it runs up to 50% slower than a new CPU with modern IPC clock for clock.  This was one of the things about the AMD intel thing.  AMD had really good IPC so they could have a chip running at 3.6ghz beat a chip running at over 4ghz.  Ghz still mattered though, so the intel chip when OCed enough would still beat the AMD chip.

Edited by Bombastinator

Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

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True, i did not take IPC into account. However, both chips i mentioned are from the same year, so i'm not sure if they differ in IPC? Are there generally any differences in IPC between server and consumer grade CPU's? From my understanding, the e5 1620 is basically an i5/i7 from the same era in terms of structure, and just slightly modified, so i guess there wouldn't be any difference?

I can definitely see how having more cores/threads is gonna benefit most stuff today. IIRC back when Intel launched Haswell, the general consensus was that the i5 is the best gaming CPU, because games wouldn't benefit from the extra threads of an i7. I haven't actually kept myself updated in this regard, but i'm gonna assume newer games make much better use of all the cores/threads, seeing as how Ryzens outperform the i5 lineup (or does this come down to IPC?)

Thanks

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1 minute ago, xayok11355 said:

True, i did not take IPC into account. However, both chips i mentioned are from the same year, so i'm not sure if they differ in IPC? Are there generally any differences in IPC between server and consumer grade CPU's? From my understanding, the e5 1620 is basically an i5/i7 from the same era in terms of structure, and just slightly modified, so i guess there wouldn't be any difference?

I can definitely see how having more cores/threads is gonna benefit most stuff today. IIRC back when Intel launched Haswell, the general consensus was that the i5 is the best gaming CPU, because games wouldn't benefit from the extra threads of an i7. I haven't actually kept myself updated in this regard, but i'm gonna assume newer games make much better use of all the cores/threads, seeing as how Ryzens outperform the i5 lineup (or does this come down to IPC?)

Thanks

In this case it doesn’t.  The overclock ability of the i5 could make the chip faster than the e1650 in some things.  It would have to be a good overclock though.  With them both sitting not overclocked the e1650 is faster.  Is it possible that with enough overclock you could get the 4670k to run some stuff faster than the e1650? Sure.  Not a whole lot though, and the problem the 4670k runs into is if it hits a need for more than 4 threads it starts creating overhead.  Most modern games are 6 thread, because that’s what jaguar1 had available for games.  That means that running those games the 4670k will have 2 threads worth of overhead all the time where the e1650 won’t.   This is what killed the 5ghz single core chips and made the 2.4ghz duos crush them.

Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

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Very interesting. Thanks a lot for these informations, i wasn't aware of that. I had already settled on the e5, and i can see now that it's generally the much better choice anyways.

Thanks for all the help everyone :).

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