Is every Samsung B Die the same?

[redcan0]

Hi everyone, I want to buy a Samsung B die kit. I was looking at the kits in B Die Finder to choose the cheapest B Die ram out of all. https://www.newegg.com/global/tr-en/g-skill-16gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820232483?Description=F4-3600C17D-16GTZR&cm_re=F4-3600C17D-16GTZR-_-20-232-483-_-Product

 

I found this as the cheapest RGB B Die ram which doesn't really have the frequency and timings for a actual B die but it says B Die Guaranteed in B Die finder.

 

So my question is if every B Die is the same on B Die finder.

 

Like what is the difference between a Trident Z Neo 3200 MHz CL14 and a 3700 CL17 if they are both B Die. Can they both overclock to the same frequency and timings at the same voltaje?

 

Thanks.

 

[Mateyyy]

No, they're not all the same.

[redcan0]

1 minute ago, Mateyyy said:

No, they're not all the same.

How can I get a nice kit? Is there a trick for it?

Or is it all luck.

[Letgomyleghoe]

luck, and paying for a  better bin, ie higher speed, lower latency.

Micron E dies are just as good if not better than samsung-b dies

[redcan0]

2 minutes ago, Letgomyleghoe said:

luck, and paying for a  better bin, ie higher speed, lower latency.

Micron E dies are just as good if not better than samsung-b dies

I can get Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer RGB that has Micron Rev E Die for very cheap should I go with that?

 

I really want a good B Die though its so fun experimenting with

 

Do you have any thoughts on the ram link I gave?

[Letgomyleghoe]

1 minute ago, redcan0 said:

I can get Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer RGB that has Micron Rev E Die for very cheap should I go with that?

 

I really want a good B Die though its so fun experimenting with

 

Do you have any thoughts on the ram link I gave?

that G.SKILL kit is not good b-die, if it is b-die at all, as someone who owns a kit of ram with b-die, you're not always guaranteed a good oc. 

[redcan0]

4 minutes ago, Letgomyleghoe said:

that G.SKILL kit is not good b-die, if it is b-die at all, as someone who owns a kit of ram with b-die, you're not always guaranteed a good oc. 

Then should I just stick with Micron E Die? I have a friend who achieved 3600 MHz CL14-24-24-42 at 1.5V with the Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer RGB ram he has a Ryzen 5 3600.

 

I have a R5 3600 too and I can get the same ram for very cheap I assume that makes more sense then. The other B Die kits are very expensive except that specific G Skill one.

[Letgomyleghoe]

it usually makes more sense to go with micron e's over cheap b-die

 

so yes

[Mateyyy]

44 minutes ago, redcan0 said:

How can I get a nice kit? Is there a trick for it?

Or is it all luck.

The cheapest, good Samsung B-die will probably be 3200 CL14, though you may find 4000-4400 CL18-19 for a similar price.

24 minutes ago, redcan0 said:

I can get Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer RGB that has Micron Rev E Die for very cheap should I go with that?

 

I really want a good B Die though its so fun experimenting with

 

Do you have any thoughts on the ram link I gave?

Rev-E is good if you're not going for the tightest timings. It clocks really high, while not being as heavy on the memory controller. Rev-B is pretty similar in that regard too.

18 minutes ago, redcan0 said:

Then should I just stick with Micron E Die? I have a friend who achieved 3600 MHz CL14-24-24-42 at 1.5V with the Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer RGB ram he has a Ryzen 5 3600.

Wow, those timings are roough, lol

[redcan0]

2 minutes ago, Mateyyy said:

The cheapest, good Samsung B-die will probably be 3200 CL14, though you may find 4000-4400 CL18-19 for a similar price.

Rev-E is good if you're not going for the tightest timings. It clocks really high, while not being as heavy on the memory controller. Rev-B is pretty similar in that regard too.

Wow, those timings are roough, lol

I found a guy selling the Trident Z Neo 3200 MHz CL14 B Die for very cheap and used (about 115$). However he did not reply to my message since 2 days so that made me so upset. Now I also can get the Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer RGB that has Rev E. Die for 85$ unused. Probably will go with that thanks everyone.

 

BTW I am planning to use the Crucial ram at 1.5V too for 3600 MHz CL14. Will 1.5V harm the ram in the long term?

[xg32]

23 minutes ago, redcan0 said:

Then should I just stick with Micron E Die? I have a friend who achieved 3600 MHz CL14-24-24-42 at 1.5V with the Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer RGB ram he has a Ryzen 5 3600.

 

I have a R5 3600 too and I can get the same ram for very cheap I assume that makes more sense then. The other B Die kits are very expensive except that specific G Skill one.

stock performance it's largely 3-4 settings: cl14 3200 cl15 3600/cl19 4400 (they are mostly the same) and cl14 3600/3800 (slightly better, binned version of the lower skus), these are just the 3 SKUs that i use depending on the build, there is def more.

 

As for the overclocking capabilities of each, it's silicon lottery, i've seen the cl14 3200 this bf for 95usd, the cl15 3600 kits for 125usd, and most recently cl14 3600/3800 for 150usd.

 

B-die doesn't always clock the highest but for entry level overclocks it's the best, Rev-E is pretty fun with intel chips, or if you REALLY know what ur doing on zen.

[Guest]

You want Micron Rev E for high clocks. (going for 4000mhz and up)

Most Samsung B-Die is really flexible and scales well with voltage.

If you're under 4000mhz, get the samsung B-die kit. 

This part number is a decent price, B-Die. 

3600mhz CL 16-16-16-36 XMP.

I have the red version, does 4000mhz CL16 on Intel IMC. 

F4-3600C16D-16GTZSW

 

And no, there's really not a better kit unless it's B-Die same speed but tighter latency like CL15. 

[Mateyyy]

4 minutes ago, redcan0 said:

BTW I am planning to use the Crucial ram at 1.5V too for 3600 MHz CL14. Will 1.5V harm the ram in the long term?

Rev-E will probably be okay at 1.5V, though you could stick to 1.45V to be extra safe if you wanted to. Maybe someone who's got more experience with Rev-E could chime in on that.

 

I think you'll have a fairly hard time getting CL14 on Rev-E (or at least the subtimings will be crap).

I'd try seeing how far the FCLK on your Ryzen 3600 goes, probably somewhere in the 1866-1933MHz range, setting your memory to that (so for 1900MHz FCLK you're looking at 3800MT/s or MHz effective on the memory) and then tightening down the timings. Keep in mind that subtimings are just as important as primaries, so don't just focus on getting the CAS latency low and then leaving everything else on auto.

[redcan0]

5 minutes ago, ShrimpBrime said:

You want Micron Rev E for high clocks. (going for 4000mhz and up)

Most Samsung B-Die is really flexible and scales well with voltage.

If you're under 4000mhz, get the samsung B-die kit. 

This part number is a decent price, B-Die. 

3600mhz CL 16-16-16-36 XMP.

I have the red version, does 4000mhz CL16 on Intel IMC. 

F4-3600C16D-16GTZSW

 

And no, there's really not a better kit unless it's B-Die same speed but tighter latency like CL15. 

The Part Number you gave is not RGB

RGB is a must in my build.

Anything over 125 USD is out of my budget.

I mean I was planning to not go for above 3733 MHz due to zen 2 going to 2:1 FCLK when 3733 is exceeded.

[redcan0]

3 minutes ago, Mateyyy said:

Rev-E will probably be okay at 1.5V, though you could stick to 1.45V to be extra safe if you wanted to. Maybe someone who's got more experience with Rev-E could chime in on that.

 

I think you'll have a fairly hard time getting CL14 on Rev-E (or at least the subtimings will be crap).

I'd try seeing how far the FCLK on your Ryzen 3600 goes, probably somewhere in the 1866-1933MHz range, setting your memory to that (so for 1900MHz FCLK you're looking at 3800MT/s or MHz effective on the memory) and then tightening down the timings. Keep in mind that subtimings are just as important as primaries, so don't just focus on getting the CAS latency low and then leaving everything else on auto.

I tried my FCL Frequency max I could achieve was 1900

 

As I said my friend with E Die did 3600 MHz at 14-24-24-42 which is pretty bad subtimings but its not terrible.

[Mateyyy]

Just now, redcan0 said:

I tried my FCL Frequency max I could achieve was 1900

Then I'd run 3800MHz on the memory, and tighten down the timings as far as they go.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, redcan0 said:

The Part Number you gave is not RGB

RGB is a must in my build.

Anything over 125 USD is out of my budget.

I mean I was planning to not go for above 3733 MHz due to zen 2 going to 2:1 FCLK when 3733 is exceeded.

Yeah, but you want everything for cheap as possible. 

In reality, you pay more for fast B-Die and then pay more on top of that for RGB.

 

Wants cake and eat it? Must shell out the dollars. 

[redcan0]

Just now, Mateyyy said:

Then I'd run 3800MHz on the memory, and tighten down the timings as far as they go.

Alright, Thanks a lot. What If I go for 4600 MHz or something around there on Ryzen?

Will I just lose performance due to the FCLK being 2:1 instead of 1:1?

[Guest]

Here's B-die with RGB part number.

+ 30$ for colors

F4-3600C16D-16GTZN

[Mateyyy]

Just now, redcan0 said:

Alright, Thanks a lot. What If I go for 4600 MHz or something around there on Ryzen?

Will I just lose performance due to the FCLK being 2:1 instead of 1:1?

By the time you get to a combination of frequency and timings that will make up for the massive latency penalty you get by not having the FCLK synced to the MCLK/UCLK, you'll be looking at voltages that I wouldn't call safe for 24/7 use.

[redcan0]

1 minute ago, ShrimpBrime said:

Here's B-die with RGB part number.

+ 30$ for colors

F4-3600C16D-16GTZN

Thank you. So the thing is I live in Turkey and there isn't 1 single B Die ram sold here even if I pay 200 dollars+. So I am trying to get something from amazon or Newegg. But the thing is the shipping cost and taxes is like 50 dollars itself. In reality my budget without any shipping and taxes is like 180 USD

But I have to get something around the 125-130 Range so that I can also afford the shipping and taxes. Otherwise I will have to get the E Die from my local store

[xg32]

7 minutes ago, redcan0 said:

Alright, Thanks a lot. What If I go for 4600 MHz or something around there on Ryzen?

Will I just lose performance due to the FCLK being 2:1 instead of 1:1?

to quote 2 of the most prolific overclockers on youtube, going beyond 1:1 on zen is just "dumb" (they went ahead and did it anyway for fun), and the voltages are unsafe for 24/7 use, people running SOC 1.19v at 1900/3800 are already pushing the limits with 4 sticks.

 

For RGB kits, just go with the one @ShrimpBrime, there are like 3 bins that are better but if you want RGB that's what you'd need to sacrafice to fit your budget. If you live overseas, chances are you'll have to buy local or buy cheaper kits.

[Guest]

Just now, redcan0 said:

Thank you. So the thing is I live in Turkey and there isn't 1 single B Die ram sold here even if I pay 200 dollars+. So I am trying to get something from amazon or Newegg. But the thing is the shipping cost and taxes is like 50 dollars itself. In reality my budget without any shipping and taxes is like 180 USD

But I have to get something around the 125-130 Range so that I can also afford the shipping and taxes. Otherwise I will have to get the E Die from my local store

OH!! well shit, should have said that in the first place.... Or I just misunderstood the whole thing I guess.

 

Micron would be the next best thing.

The SK Hynix, some modules can be a real pain in the butt to work with and some won't even run their XMP ratings without intervention.

 

[redcan0]

3 minutes ago, ShrimpBrime said:

OH!! well shit, should have said that in the first place.... Or I just misunderstood the whole thing I guess.

 

Micron would be the next best thing.

The SK Hynix, some modules can be a real pain in the butt to work with and some won't even run their XMP ratings without intervention.

 

I will have to go with Micron then. B Die is too expensive for my situation. 

 

I currently have a Samsung C Die kit (Adata D60G) which is awful and I am trying to replace it. And I also have a Hynix CJR on my other rig which is actually pretty good but not as good as E Die.

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, redcan0 said:

Alright, Thanks a lot. What If I go for 4600 MHz .....

You'd be buying a top end board for that frequency. 500$ ++ US.

3600mhz is fine. 

 

Gotta think of that jump from default. 

It's not about going from 3200mhz to 3600mhz...

It's going from 2133mhz to 3200mhz or 2133mhz to 3600mhz. 

That is your real world measurement. So 3200mhz to 3600mhz isn't a real big leap.