Windows 10 Redesign Imminent - "Sun Valley" Slated for 2021

[wall03]

1 minute ago, SansVarnic said:

Lol there are always bugs. The fast version is buggier. But the slow version is more polished. Personally I haven't had much issue with either.

my second problem:

 

they get more of my data.

 

i'm gunna do it anyway!

[SansVarnic]

Just now, wall03 said:

my second problem:

 

they get more of my data.

 

i'm gunna do it anyway!

I would hate to say duh but it's kind of a thing when you are testing the os on your system, it gives better diagnostic information that way for the developers to see whats happening and why.

[RejZoR]

32 minutes ago, SansVarnic said:

Lol there are always bugs. The fast version is buggier. But the slow version is more polished. Personally I haven't had much issue with either.

I actually haven't had any major issues with Windows in general. Sure there are dumb things happening here and there like with anything or it's bad by design, but not problems as in "unexpected" things happening. Those are actually super rare despite all the complaining by people. At least these days. It was a bit more rocky when Windows 10 launched...

[thechinchinsong]

Windows 10 makes me want to buy a Mac every single day I use it. Maybe then I'll only need to log into Windows for my games.

[narrdarr]

A better integration of setting and control panel would be nice

 

Not sure why nvidia and microsoft fight over who is responsible for dithering but wish windows would add an additional display setting for it.

 

File explorer has gotten better, but its still the probably one of the worst parts of windows. 

 

As for the ui changes; who cares. It's a annoyance at best. But really they should just give a library of ui kits to select from.

 

[Murasaki]

As usual im very skeptical about it. But atleast I hope they make it more unified and not add more to the mishmash of designs left from past OSes.

[Trik'Stari]

At least we have a good heads up to disable automatic updates in everyway possible before they botch this.

 

24 minutes ago, narrdarr said:

A better integration of setting and control panel would be nice

 

Not sure why nvidia and microsoft fight over who is responsible for dithering but wish windows would add an additional display setting for it.

 

File explorer has gotten better, but its still the probably one of the worst parts of windows. 

 

As for the ui changes; who cares. It's a annoyance at best. But really they should just give a library of ui kits to select from.

Unify it into one menu, and call it Control Panel, instead of having a useless settings menu that gives you no real control at all.

 

In other words, just get rid of the settings menu entirely.

[Master Delta Chief]

19 hours ago, NotTheFirstDaniel said:

You're not dealing with just Microsoft. You're dealing with the thousands of win32 software developers that don't like change. Nothing Microsoft can do will change that. So, they have to take the migration slow, they're forced to do it.

Again, not an excuse for a large corp like Microsoft. Just because so many devs don't like change, doesn't mean that MS has to lag every single time behind. With that kind of mentality, there won't be any kind of proper improvement. If MS can give the devs enough time as well as the necessary resources to them, it can mitigate these sorts of problems.  

[Donut417]

19 minutes ago, Master Delta Chief said:

Just because so many devs don't like change,

 Its not necessarily the devs. Its the corporations that the devs work for don't want to invest the money. They say if you peel back the layers of the reservation software used by the airlines, you will find a system that was originally built in the 70s I believe. Corporations only like making money, they dont want to spend it. If the software works for what they are doing, then thats what they use. Companies dont like changing things. 

 

My employer for example. Id assume most places that pick order and ship to customers use some kinda of hand scanners and such to keep track of things. We use paper tickets, we have a warehouse copy and a customer copy (Put in as the packing slip). We pick the order and take it to a table for someone to check and pack it. Most places picking, checking and packing is all done by the same person. While the company could probably save a few errors on things getting sent out wrong with using some form of technology they choose to do it the old fashioned way, why? Because it works for the most part. 

 

Microsoft makes lot of money off its enterprise users. Which is why they cater to them so much. I mean look, they were still writing updates for XP for the US Navy, because the Navy agreed to pay them a boat load of cash. 

 

[Nowak]

22 hours ago, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

Was it really though? If you thought Windows 10 was a catastrophe, the world should've ended when Vista came out. 

Correction: when Windows Me came out.

[LAwLz]

On 10/30/2020 at 10:39 PM, Master Delta Chief said:

I don't know and even if that were the case, I think there's a way to actually accomplish that. It's no excuse for a large corporation like Microsoft to be unable to fix their Settings app. If they put in the right resources with the right people, than it can be done. 

It's a slow and painful process because window is a mess and not even Microsoft understands how it works. 

Migrating underlying structural problems that were built 20 years ago is no easy task not even with the near limitless resources Microsoft has. 

 

On 10/30/2020 at 11:13 PM, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

You mean Android? Yea. 

Google is actually doing a lot of really big and hard technical and cooperative changes necessary to make android better. 

Microsoft are doing some changes to windows too, but to me the changes seems more "simple" and "maintenance" like. Probably because windows is no longer. Microsoft's favorit child. Azure and office is. 

[LAwLz]

19 hours ago, SansVarnic said:

All I see here is hype.

If you want to know what is happening in Windows UI development join the Windows Insider Program, you get to see all planned updates as they are developed, community tested, and eventually axed or deployed.

 

*edit

You even get to give your own feedback on the same developments or give your own suggestions on future developments.

Sending feedback to Microsoft is completely and utterly useless. 

The only time something happens from user feedback is if it's some stupid and minor improvement like "please add this type of calendar to the calculator app" or if it's something Microsoft already planned to add.

 

If it's feedback that goes against Microsoft's already existing plans then the feedback gets sent to the trash can. 

They were literally locking suggestions that they didn't agree with during the old feedback hub days. Things like "add transparency back" were locked. 

Remember that data deleting bug in one of the updates? It was reported by multiple people months before the update was pushed out to everyone. 

 

Microsoft does not give two shits about customer feedback or bug reports. 

[Donut417]

1 minute ago, LAwLz said:

Microsoft does not give two shits about customer feedback or bug reports. 

Thats why Windows is no longer my primary OS. 

[StDragon]

16 hours ago, yian88 said:

A return of the Windows 8 METRO DESIGN hell yeah i cant wait. /s

That's exactly what it is. Tiny fonts, no clear lines of delineation, flat, and over all poor information density. The most inefficient use of screen real estate you can image. 

 

This is what happens when form is given priority over function. Never let your graphic designers replace good UI science.

[Orange1]

2 hours ago, Donut417 said:

Thats why Windows is no longer my primary OS. 

Yeah its time to move to Linus but I just to lazy, free W10 for a year or so now. Wont activate, wont pay. I think Linus with VM for W10 to play games.

[Donut417]

Just now, Orange1 said:

Yeah its time to move to Linus but I just to lazy, free W10 for a year or so now. Wont activate, wont pay. I think Linus with VM for W10 to play games.

I moved to MacOS. I do run Linux on my server though. 

[Orange1]

Damn I cant believe I typed Linus and twice non the less, should have been Linux.

 

 

[NotTheFirstDaniel]

7 hours ago, Master Delta Chief said:

Again, not an excuse for a large corp like Microsoft. Just because so many devs don't like change, doesn't mean that MS has to lag every single time behind. With that kind of mentality, there won't be any kind of proper improvement. If MS can give the devs enough time as well as the necessary resources to them, it can mitigate these sorts of problems.  

Microsoft doesn't have a grab hold of all their app developers like Apple does, and remember one of Microsoft's goals with Windows is backwards compatibility. There's stuff from Windows 98 and Me that Microsoft has tip toed around to make work in the current version of Windows 10. Hell, Windows 32-bit can run 16-bit apps natively. I've seen videos of people running Windows 1.0 software.

 

If they're willing to cut support for all APIs from Windows 8 and below, you'll have a much modern and lightweight OS overnight. But, one reason why businesses love Windows is because they know they can leave their decade old programs on their, not have them updated, and be assured that it will most likely work.

3 hours ago, LAwLz said:

-snip-

Ever since like Windows 8.1, and more popularly with Windows 10, when Microsoft started relying on users instead of their own trained QA testers, the quality control of Windows went sharply downhill. Windows Me's and Windows Vista's problems were mainly due to drivers and poor application support at launch. Both haven't been giant clusterfucks like Windows 10 has been for the past 5 years.

 

The lead WaaS/Windows Insider lady at the time bragged about the fact that they had user submitted feedback, at the same time the deleting files thing happened.

 

I'm telling you, once both Microsoft and Apple stopped relying on in-house testing, both of their softwares became unusable buggy disasters.

[Mark Kaine]

8 hours ago, Donut417 said:

Companies dont like changing things. 

*smart companies yes 

[Mark Kaine]

1 hour ago, NotTheFirstDaniel said:

one of Microsoft's goals with Windows is backwards compatibility. There's

I don't believe this myth at all, I have a whole box of games that don't run on win 10 because Microsoft has decided the drm used in them is a "security risk" but after some research it turns out that doesn't seem to be true, they just don't support it full stop. 

 

(securom etc) 

Spoiler

According to Microsoft's Boris Schneider-Johne, Windows 10 deliberately doesn't support some variants of SecuROM used on games released between 2003 and 2008. This is because SecuROM is so "deeply embedded in your system" that it becomes a security risk, potentially forming an entry point for malware and other viruses.

Compatibility my ass lol.

[WhitetailAni]

They should just make Windows 11 be Windows 10 but with ReFS not NTFS, fix dark mode, and make it so you can emulate every previous OS, making compatibility easy.

Except it's Microsoft so you'll have:
Windows 11 Home: Windows 10 + ReFS + minor bug fixes

Windows 11 Pro: Windows 10 + ReFS + moderate bug fixes + XP emulation and Vista emulation.

Windows 11 Pro Max: Windows 10 + ReFS + major bug fixes + XP, Vista, 7, 8, 8.1, ME, and Windows 98 emulation.

Windows 11 Enterprise: Windows 10 + ReFS + major bug fixes + all Microsoft Windows OS emulation.

Windows 11 Enterprise Pro: Windows 10 + ReFS + major bug fixes + all Microsoft OS emulation, including MS-DOS.

Windows 11 Enterprise Pro Max: Windows 10 + ReFS + major bug fixes + all Microsoft OS emulation and macOS emulation.

Windows 11 Bob Edition: Windows 11 Enterprise Pro Max + the ability to use the sudo command in PowerShell.

[StDragon]

12 minutes ago, ragnarok0273 said:

They should just make Windows 11 be Windows 10 but with ReFS not NTFS,

ReFS is geared towards large data storage. Also, it's not boot-able nor does it support features that an OS would need to make it boot-able. I'm not sure if that's an intrinsic limitation, or just not coded in yet.

 

NTFS (New Technology File System) has been around a long time and has been updated with newer revisions. As far as a journaling file system is concerned, it's mature. That said however, I'd rather MS support OpenZFS.

[Bombastinator]

2 hours ago, Mark Kaine said:

I don't believe this myth at all, I have a whole box of games that don't run on win 10 because Microsoft has decided the drm used in them is a "security risk" but after some research it turns out that doesn't seem to be true, they just don't support it full stop. 

 

(securom etc) 

  Reveal hidden contents

According to Microsoft's Boris Schneider-Johne, Windows 10 deliberately doesn't support some variants of SecuROM used on games released between 2003 and 2008. This is because SecuROM is so "deeply embedded in your system" that it becomes a security risk, potentially forming an entry point for malware and other viruses.

Compatibility my ass lol.

Win10 ate my monitor for that matter.  I tried to rollback to 8.1, but apparently the rollback capacity is a myth too.  I can’t make it work anyway. 

[DeScruff]

On 10/29/2020 at 2:08 PM, NotTheFirstDaniel said:

I thought the control panel couldn't be migrated due to issues with older apps that have calls to control.exe

That shouldn't stop the settings app from having the full functionality of control panel.
You can have 2 tools that do the same thing, it be the sensible thing to do, rather then having the user flip back and forth between a half baked tool, and one that had functionality gratuitously ripped out.

[jagdtigger]

45 minutes ago, DeScruff said:

that had functionality gratuitously ripped out.

This is what i dont get, you still need it for compatibility, might as well just leave it alone. Its not like it takes up a ton of space.......