How to set up a drain valve with soft tubing in hard loop?

[Shai Hulud]

The answer to this may be really simple, I'm planning my rigid loop (first custom loop) and have most things figured out but am not sure how to do the drain valve. 

 

I'm using 10/14 PETG tubing. I gather I need...

 

a male-to-male connector plugged into a G1/4 hole at the low point in the reservoir (I'm using a distro plate so there's a suggested spot for this)

a ball valve connected to said connector

a stop plug on other end of ball valve

some soft tubing and a way to attach it to ball valve

 

The last part I'm a bit confused about which size soft tubing, what kind of fitting I need to attach it securely to the ball valve so I can use the soft tubing to drain. Or does it not matter? Any compression fitting on the soft tube would have G1/4 threads I guess? 

 

IDK, like I said I am a bit confused, rather not figure this out by trial and error

 

thanks

[HanZie82]

I will not be able to help you, beside this: Put a picture of the situation in the post as well.

Might help tremendously. (As i personally have no idea of how it fits al together even tho your nice explanation)

[Stahlmann]

I put my drain valve directly on a reservoir port. With a male-male adapter in between. You can see on the bottom right of this picture:

[Shai Hulud]

9 minutes ago, HanZie82 said:

I will not be able to help you, beside this: Put a picture of the situation in the post as well.

Might help tremendously. (As i personally have no idea of how it fits al together even tho your nice explanation)

Sure...I'll be using this front distro plate from EKWB, the bottom left plug is intended as a drain port, theres also possible drain ports on the inside but I was thinking put a ball valve on the front port, then somehow connect a soft tube to it when I need to drain the loop.

 

Just not sure what specific connector I need to connect the soft tube to the ball valve (which is connected to the drain port via a small male to male connector)

 

I dont strictly need the soft tube I guess but it might be harder to drain the loop without one

[tikker]

17 minutes ago, Shai Hulud said:

Just not sure what specific connector I need to connect the soft tube to the ball valve (which is connected to the drain port via a small male to male connector)

You can unscrew the little silver cap on the drain valve to reveal the thread. Then just get a piece of (spare) soft tubing with a compression fitting attached to it just like you would in a loop, screw that in where the silver cap was, put the tube in a container and open the valve (handle perpendicular to the valve = closed, parallel = open). I have a similar setup for my drain valve and have done it many times this way.

[Shai Hulud]

1 minute ago, tikker said:

You can unscrew the little silver cap on the drain valve to reveal the thread. Then just get a piece of (spare) tubing with a fitting attached to it just like you would in your loop, screw that in where the silver cap was, put the tube in a container and open the valve (handle perpendicular to the valve = closed, parallel = open). I have a similar setup for my drain valve and have done it many times this way.

Thanks this is what I was unsure about...

 

so I take it it doesn't matter what size soft tubing it is, just any soft tubing with any compression fitting will work?

[tikker]

18 minutes ago, Shai Hulud said:

Thanks this is what I was unsure about...

 

so I take it it doesn't matter what size soft tubing it is, just any soft tubing with any compression fitting will work?

Not exactly, you'll have to buy a fitting that has the correct thread for your valve and tubing with diameters that matches what the fitting was designed for.

[Shai Hulud]

2 minutes ago, tikker said:

Not exactly, you'll have to buy a fitting that has the correct thread for your valve and tubing with diameters that matches what the fitting was designed for.

So...like this fitting for instance, a Phanteks Glacier 10/13 soft compression

I get some 10/13 soft tube, attach to top of the nozzle, screw on the compression fitting, and the other end will screw into the ball valve? 

 

So the below Barrow valve uses the male/male connector to screw into the drain port, then I can connect the soft tube / fitting combo to the left side...?

 

What I'm asking is if the size of the tube and fitting matter (assuming they match each other). Like I could also do this with a 12/16 soft compression fitting and 12/16 soft tube?

 

Also I saw this type of "flat push type check valve" which I'm not entirely sure I understand how it works. But I mean I'd guess that you screw the male part into the drain port on the distro plate (or reservoir), connect a soft tube with connector to the right side when you want to drain it, then pull the right side of the check valve? 

 

[HM-2]

So I've got a distro plate and I used my rear outlet. I ran a 90 degree fitting off the distro with about 10cm of tubing with one of those Barrow drain ports on the end:

 

Like this

 

[Shai Hulud]

13 hours ago, HM-2 said:

So I've got a distro plate and I used my rear outlet. I ran a 90 degree fitting off the distro with about 10cm of tubing with one of those Barrow drain ports on the end:

 

Like this

 

I like this setup, I might do that instead, what I had had in mind was this but basically with the ball valve at the plate and the hose on other end.

 

What distro plate is that? Looks like a custom? I haven't seen any side plates that support D5 from the major manufacturers

 

I've thought about using a side plate but my mother board Asus Rog Zenith II Extreme Alpha is E-ATX and hangs over the side cable management things a bit so that the cables I'm using stick out over the side plate area. Could probably fix it with custom cables though

 

*I'm assuming that's an 011 Dynamic or XL, looks like it from that side

[For Science!]

21 hours ago, Shai Hulud said:

The answer to this may be really simple, I'm planning my rigid loop (first custom loop) and have most things figured out but am not sure how to do the drain valve. 

 

thanks

I think what's important is that het drain valve is not visible from the front, just like in real life its not a good look to have your drain port schlong hanging out in public. In my hard line custom loop I have a T-splitter with a ballvalve and then a angled fitting capped by a stop plug. When I need to drain the system I unscrew the stop plug, connect on some fitting with soft tubing (does not matter, as long as it is G1/4) into the angled fitting, and then open the ball valve to drain.

 

[HM-2]

3 hours ago, Shai Hulud said:

I like this setup, I might do that instead

I couldn't put the ball valve or or near the drain port purely because it impacts the pump housing and bracket. I did try. I'll probably run a bit more tubing off a compression fitting when I actually come to using it as it's probably a little short in reality but I didn't want unnecessary tubing in the case.

 

3 hours ago, Shai Hulud said:

What distro plate is that? Looks like a custom?

Yes, it's custom:

 

 

Based on the EKWB DDC flow order and port positions, but modified to use a D5 pump. It went through a few design iterations before reaching the point its currently at, I had a lot of help from a guy over in Malaysia called WvMech who makes custom distro plates, he did a lot of the design work for the pump housing and the like. Well worth a look as he's currently got a v2 of his O11D side distro which takes some design cues from this one but has a really cool angular look about it. He also does custom front distros with both one and two pumps.

 

https://www.facebook.com/WvMech/

 

D5 single pump front:

 

New D5 side distro design

 

Ironically even with the cost of the D5 the custom one was cheaper than the DDC 3.2 EKWB here in the UK.

IIRC the problem with the front distros is they can impact on radiator placement top and bottom due to the added width. I only have maybe 20mm from the end of my top and bottom rads (HWL GTS360 + GTX360 respectively) and the glass at the front.

 

3 hours ago, Shai Hulud said:

I've thought about using a side plate but my mother board Asus Rog Zenith II Extreme Alpha is E-ATX and hangs over the side cable management things a bit so that the cables I'm using stick out over the side plate area. Could probably fix it with custom cables though

I would potentially look at the option of getting a custom plate and routing the cables through it (IE CNC milling cut-outs for them, or drilling individual holes for the 24 pin, stripping off the connector and feeding them through the plate). Because of where the EATX boards overhang you might be able to get something that works well as you can potentially go both longer and wider, albeit not very much wider, with the distro than I did (my external dimensions match the EKWB ones except for being 5mm thicker).

 

To be honest there's a LOT of space above and below my distro which could have been utilised but hey ho.

 

3 hours ago, Shai Hulud said:

*I'm assuming that's an 011 Dynamic or XL, looks like it from that side

Yep, XL.

[Shai Hulud]

47 minutes ago, HM-2 said:

I couldn't put the ball valve or or near the drain port purely because it impacts the pump housing and bracket. I did try. I'll probably run a bit more tubing off a compression fitting when I actually come to using it as it's probably a little short in reality but I didn't want unnecessary tubing in the case.

 

Yes, it's custom. Based on the EKWB DDC flow order and port positions, but modified to use a D5 pump. It went through a few design iterations before reaching the point its currently at, I had a lot of help from a guy over in Malaysia called WvMech who makes custom distro plates, he did a lot of the design work for the pump housing and the like. Well worth a look as he's currently got a v2 of his O11D side distro which takes some design cues from this one but has a really cool angular look about it. He also does custom front distros with both one and two pumps.

 

https://www.facebook.com/WvMech/

 

D5 single pump front:

 

New D5 side distro design

 

Ironically even with the cost of the D5 the custom one was cheaper than the DDC 3.2 EKWB here in the UK.

IIRC the problem with the front distros is they can impact on radiator placement top and bottom due to the added width. I only have maybe 20mm from the end of my top and bottom rads (HWL GTS360 + GTX360 respectively) and the glass at the front.

 

I would potentially look at the option of getting a custom plate and routing the cables through it (IE CNC milling cut-outs for them, or drilling individual holes for the 24 pin, stripping off the connector and feeding them through the plate). Because of where the EATX boards overhang you might be able to get something that works well as you can potentially go both longer and wider, albeit not very much wider, with the distro than I did (my external dimensions match the EKWB ones except for being 5mm thicker).

 

To be honest there's a LOT of space above and below my distro which could have been utilised but hey ho.

 

Yep, XL.

I have an 011 XL also, here you can see how the board overhangs and the cables stick out a lot. I know I can get right angle SATA cables that would help a lot, not sure if I can get right angle power cables, or an adapter for the front panel USB.

 

Also my rtx 3090 is 11.5" long so will stick out some. I ordered a monoblock from Optimus for it. Who knows when ill get it, they said mid November so here's hoping. I haven't actually put in the 3090 yet though, I had wanted a 3080 ftw3 ultra gaming but only gpu I could get was the almost 2k 3090 ftw3 ultra gaming.

 

Where would I get a custom plate? I assume you mean the case plate where MB screws in? I don't know anything about CNC machining 

 

Both those distro plates from wvmech look nice. I was/am attracted to the EK panel because there are so many possible inlet and outlet ports it should make lining things up very easy and my setup is a little complicated...

 

Mainly because I bought this bitspower monoblock for the board (its updated from the photo but same layout),  so I can't just do cpu in cpu out, I guess you go plate to cpu in, cpu out to vrm in, vrm out to plate

 

Also not sure if I'm going to vertically mount gpu how that changes things, but I figure with the many different inlet / outlet ports on the EK block some combination would work

 

The EK block is overpriced though. And I dont love that big metal plate where they mount the pump

 

 

[Shai Hulud]

54 minutes ago, HM-2 said:

IIRC the problem with the front distros is they can impact on radiator placement top and bottom due to the added width. I only have maybe 20mm from the end of my top and bottom rads (HWL GTS360 + GTX360 respectively) and the glass at the front.

I found some videos using the EK front plate with dual 360mm top/bottom radiators. In the "First Time Hardline" video he talks about the top rad port being super close with the Coolstream PE, like it just *barely* fits. Bottom is a little tight with Coolstream XE. Those are 45/60mm respectively. I was thinking just do like 40mm top and 55mm bottom rads, or possibly using three thinner rads. I've seen photos of setup with the side rad used also but it probably has to be pretty thin due to the D5 placement. And it would make the loop a bit more complicated, but I assume I could just chain two rads together before going to the plate.

 

 

[HM-2]

I think a lot of the overhang issue could be addressed with custom cables like you say, or the use of 90 degree adapters. 

 

25 minutes ago, Shai Hulud said:

Where would I get a custom plate? I assume you mean the case plate where MB screws in?

I actually meant distro plate. I do have a custom motherboard plate/cover in mine too designed to make stuff look a bit cleaner but IIRC the company I got it from doesn't do one for EATX boards. What I was actually suggesting was an approach similar to those used by people like Alex Banks in their custom casemods where they route the cables through distro plates, for example (and I know that's actually through the wooden distro plate cover but still)

 

 

My next project will most likely be in a Cosmos C700 or In Win where I can take the entire middle of the case (IE the motherboard tray and everything attached to it) out entirely and replace it with a custom distro plate that everything else can be hung off.

 

30 minutes ago, Shai Hulud said:

Both those distro plates from wvmech look nice. I was/am attracted to the EK panel because there are so many possible inlet and outlet ports it should make lining things up very easy and my setup is a little complicated...

I'm pretty sure he would be open to tweaking port placement at your request. He certainly was with me. I think my custom order was about $250 including shipping and it took him literally three days including CAD and CNC time.

 

32 minutes ago, Shai Hulud said:

The EK block is overpriced though. And I dont love that big metal plate where they mount the pump

Oh it's absurdly overpriced. Nearly four hundred quid with the economies of scale they can accomplish is frankly daylight robbery when a custom shop can produce something of equal quality and performance in their own design for not much more than half as much.

 

36 minutes ago, Shai Hulud said:

I found some videos using the EK front plate with dual 360mm top/bottom radiators.

Yeah I think if you want to go with the EK front distro you are probably limited to EK rads. I know stuff like Hardware Labs tend to have larger end tanks...

[Shai Hulud]

58 minutes ago, HM-2 said:

I think a lot of the overhang issue could be addressed with custom cables like you say, or the use of 90 degree adapters. 

 

I actually meant distro plate. I do have a custom motherboard plate/cover in mine too designed to make stuff look a bit cleaner but IIRC the company I got it from doesn't do one for EATX boards. What I was actually suggesting was an approach similar to those used by people like Alex Banks in their custom casemods where they route the cables through distro plates, for example (and I know that's actually through the wooden distro plate cover but still)

 

 

My next project will most likely be in a Cosmos C700 or In Win where I can take the entire middle of the case (IE the motherboard tray and everything attached to it) out entirely and replace it with a custom distro plate that everything else can be hung off.

 

I'm pretty sure he would be open to tweaking port placement at your request. He certainly was with me. I think my custom order was about $250 including shipping and it took him literally three days including CAD and CNC time.

 

Oh it's absurdly overpriced. Nearly four hundred quid with the economies of scale they can accomplish is frankly daylight robbery when a custom shop can produce something of equal quality and performance in their own design for not much more than half as much.

 

Yeah I think if you want to go with the EK front distro you are probably limited to EK rads. I know stuff like Hardware Labs tend to have larger end tanks...

How do you drill acrylic? I'd have thought that would shatter it...

 

I can get the EK plate for $380 with shipping, wvmech front plate for $250 + $80 for a D5 pump = $330, so it's not as much a gap for me but still overpriced. I'm still tempted to go with a Barrow or Bykski plate which I can get for about $100, but they each have exactly one model for the 011 XL, and they're side plates you can mount a DDC to, but if I wanted to use a D5 I'd have to put it inline. EK just has such slick marketing all their stuff is too expensive IMO. 

 

I don't see why I couldn't go with different rads though. Quite a few companies make rads just as short as the EK Coolstream (XE is 400mm, PE is 393mm), like the Bykski cr-rd360rc-tk60 which is 395mm L x 60mm, I think Barrow rads are pretty short, Corsair Hydro XR7 is a nice option as it's both shorter and slightly shallower (395x55), and there are lots of 40mm rads. BarrowCH Chameleon Fish is 393mmx30mm if I wanted tons of clearance. Various Hardware Labs rads are < 400mm. Assuming the dimensions they provide are accurate I don't see why they wouldn't work anyway. 

 

Of course I'm not really sure which rads are the best. I know Hardware Labs are supposed to be good, but they all look pretty similar to me...need to cool about 1000W

 

 

 

 

[HM-2]

1 hour ago, Shai Hulud said:

How do you drill acrylic? I'd have thought that would shatter it...

Acrylic is actually quite easy to drill as long as you keep temperatures low to avoid melting, use plenty of lubrication and use a bit with a fairly shallow cutting angle. A lot of the CNC work you see in distro plates is basically variations on drilling, particularly when making the G1/4 ports or M4 screw holes which are usually just done via a deep drill then thread milled with a special bit.

 

1 hour ago, Shai Hulud said:

I can get the EK plate for $380 with shipping

Seems they're quite a lot cheaper in the US than in Europe then, the PC-O11D XL D5 PWM D-RGB is ~350eur which works out as nearly $420. 

 

1 hour ago, Shai Hulud said:

and they're side plates you can mount a DDC to, but if I wanted to use a D5 I'd have to put it inline.

If you're in the US, have you seen this guy? https://www.radikult-custom.com/

His plates are pretty cool and similar costs to the WvMech ones but they don't have many inlets or outlets which is a bit of a shame. Only 4 on the single pump XL so you won't get as clean a loop...

 

1 hour ago, Shai Hulud said:

I don't see why I couldn't go with different rads though.

You probably could, but the overall length isn't everything. You've got to take into account where the screw holes are. Some rads, particularly those that have end tanks and fittings at both ends, might be longer overall but these end tanks might protrude less than others. Then on the flip side you have stuff like the Hardware Labs SR-2 which is technically on 398mm long but has HUGE end tanks on one end to accommodate the multitude of different port locations.

 

Using EK gear is probably the best way to guarantee a good fit, as much as I would also suggest that they're also overpriced. The XE range are brilliant mind, but you can only fit one of those if you don't want to impede your top motherboard connectors.

[tikker]

On 10/22/2020 at 5:42 PM, Shai Hulud said:

I get some 10/13 soft tube, attach to top of the nozzle, screw on the compression fitting, and the other end will screw into the ball valve?

Yeah that'll work. The soft tubing size doesn't matter, as long as you match the thread between the fitting and the valve.

[Shai Hulud]

21 hours ago, HM-2 said:

Acrylic is actually quite easy to drill as long as you keep temperatures low to avoid melting, use plenty of lubrication and use a bit with a fairly shallow cutting angle. A lot of the CNC work you see in distro plates is basically variations on drilling, particularly when making the G1/4 ports or M4 screw holes which are usually just done via a deep drill then thread milled with a special bit.

 

Seems they're quite a lot cheaper in the US than in Europe then, the PC-O11D XL D5 PWM D-RGB is ~350eur which works out as nearly $420. 

 

If you're in the US, have you seen this guy? https://www.radikult-custom.com/

His plates are pretty cool and similar costs to the WvMech ones but they don't have many inlets or outlets which is a bit of a shame. Only 4 on the single pump XL so you won't get as clean a loop...

 

You probably could, but the overall length isn't everything. You've got to take into account where the screw holes are. Some rads, particularly those that have end tanks and fittings at both ends, might be longer overall but these end tanks might protrude less than others. Then on the flip side you have stuff like the Hardware Labs SR-2 which is technically on 398mm long but has HUGE end tanks on one end to accommodate the multitude of different port locations.

 

Using EK gear is probably the best way to guarantee a good fit, as much as I would also suggest that they're also overpriced. The XE range are brilliant mind, but you can only fit one of those if you don't want to impede your top motherboard connectors.

So I could drill a distro plate with a hand drill? I have a nice drill with a lot of different bits, but they're designed for wood and various metals. Not sure what I'd need for acrylic. With the Asus Rog Zenith II Extreme Alpha there's a ton of cords to route though... I mean there's three cables just for the CPU, the 24 pin MB cable, a couple cables for the 011 XL front panel, and 2 SATAs, and that's just the cables on the right side of the motherboard. I assume I could drill holes through the case also. Like those SSD trays where you can mount the side rad or a distro plate, there should be some space on the top and/or bottom but not sure how much.

 

On the other hand I'll have put about 10k into the system by the time I'm finished and am a bit hesitant to start going at things with a power drill. But...suppose if I ruin the case it's not that big a deal as it's one of the cheapest components.

 

Yeah 350 Euros is way too much for that plate. 380 USD is too much but the prices are a lot closer here between wvmech, radikult, and EK, which are the only options I'm aware where I can use D5 pumps. Bitspower and Bykski I think have some nice front panel cases for the 011D but not the XL. Bitspower did modify the plate for the XL but it looks pretty bad, they basically just added a shim at the bottom of the plate and plate cover. It also uses a weird "S1" pump whatever that is.

 

Bykski - $91 + shipping

And Barrow - $88 + shipping

 

These two are both quite tall and only accomodate 30mm rads I think. Bykski design looks very similar to EK side plate except wider and taller (423.6x144x31.5) but costs < half as much.

 

I think I'm going to go with EK front plate just because I know it will work with my setup and have a couple installation vids I can refer to, haven't seen much about the other plates. I do like the look of both wvmech front plate and radikult's "Dynamic Uno XL" but yeah just 4 ports so probably quite a bit harder for a noob like me.

[HM-2]

I think the Blyski above us shown with a 45mm top radiator. Certainly protrudes much further than my 30mm HardwareLabs. 

 

It also looks like it would do thicker lower rads than 30mm whereas the Barrow port placement is frankly bizarre. 

[Shai Hulud]

On 10/25/2020 at 2:13 PM, HM-2 said:

I think the Blyski above us shown with a 45mm top radiator. Certainly protrudes much further than my 30mm HardwareLabs. 

 

It also looks like it would do thicker lower rads than 30mm whereas the Barrow port placement is frankly bizarre. 

I think it's misleading because the plate is much longer than most. They release this as a kit as well as just the board, photos look the exact same, says part B-RD360-TN, which is a 30.5 mm rad. Could possibly fit a larger one but I'm pretty sure they use the same kit for the photos. They do make a similar side plate for the 011 that could probably be mounted to the XL with much larger rads.

 

Actually the kit is not a bad deal but motherboard support is limited to more popular sockets so I can't use it, costs like 400 to 500 usd + shipping