Does Windows Sonic for headphones with virtual surround 7.1 actually provide a better experience

[Shammikit]

Have u felt any improvement in experience with Windows Sonic for headphones with virtual surround 7.1 on? I personally didnt feel any difference. Is there any other service like this that u use and have felt a difference, like Dolby Atmos for example. Would also like to know if these service give a competitive edge in online gaming. I play Rainbow Six Siege and having gud audio to determine enemy location is very helpful. Thanks for sharing ur experience.  

[Tigerleon]

I almost never use Virtual surround. Also I don't know if you meant that you are using both 7.1 virtual surround and windows sonic at the same time?? Because that doesn't work.

Anyways. I never use virtual surround since it makes the game audio crappy sounding. And I can hear better where footsteps are without surround. So either it is your headphones having a bad stereo imaging or it is tricking you. 

[Tigerleon]

Now I am not saying it wont help one bit for competetive play or whatever. But it is different for everybody. It does not really help me anyways.

[rice guru]

The best upgrade to audio you can get is the Headphone that makes the most difference. For siege look for a different application like hesuvi you can apply other formats that may work much better for your ears and the game. Personally the sound design for siege and my headphones are good enough that I really don't need virtual surround sound to get a great experience sound wise so I cant really help beyond that.

[Shammikit]

7 minutes ago, Tigerleon said:

I almost never use Virtual surround. Also I don't know if you meant that you are using both 7.1 virtual surround and windows sonic at the same time?? Because that doesn't work.

Anyways. I never use virtual surround since it makes the game audio crappy sounding. And I can hear better where footsteps are without surround. So either it is your headphones having a bad stereo imaging or it is tricking you. 

can u even turn on the built in 7.1 without turning on something like windows sonic? for me the 7.1 checkbox is grayed out when i have windows sonic unselected.

[geo3]

The only virtual surround solution I've heard where I was able to actually discern the direction the sound was coming was with the Sennheiser GSX 1000 even then the effect was fairly meh. Everything else sounds like your listening inside a tin box. 

[Tigerleon]

3 hours ago, Shammikit said:

can u even turn on the built in 7.1 without turning on something like windows sonic? for me the 7.1 checkbox is grayed out when i have windows sonic unselected.

Just get a good pair of headphones. I always recommend the DT 770 pros 80ohm because they have good imaging and probably one of the best soundstages for a closed back headphone I've listened to.

[an actual squirrel]

5 hours ago, Tigerleon said:

I almost never use Virtual surround. Also I don't know if you meant that you are using both 7.1 virtual surround and windows sonic at the same time?? Because that doesn't work.

Anyways. I never use virtual surround since it makes the game audio crappy sounding. And I can hear better where footsteps are without surround. So either it is your headphones having a bad stereo imaging or it is tricking you. 

With regular stereo audio, there is only information for left and right directions. When you use virtual surround, you are using the principles of spatial hearing (interaural level difference, interaural time difference, hrtf) to have more directional information in the audio mix, so that objects in the game world are more accurately represented in the audio.

 

Furthermore, if a game incorrectly assumes front facing speakers for headphone users, then moving objects won't have their sounds updated properly as they reach the side. This problem is not possible with surround sound because it has a specified speaker layout and more channels to cover the area.

 

No matter how good the soundstage of a headphone is, it cannot fix these problem, which are going to be inherent to the stereo audio mix. The only solution is going to be to replace the mix with a better one by using virtual surround sound on the surround sound mix.

[Tigerleon]

56 minutes ago, an actual squirrel said:

 

 

No matter how good the soundstage of a headphone is, it cannot fix these problem

I didn't say it could but "good" headphones that has these properties are better than virtual surround. Also games often use HRTF so you don't have to use surround yourself.

[an actual squirrel]

1 hour ago, Tigerleon said:

Also games often use HRTF so you don't have to use surround yourself.

Imo, the important thing is to never play in plain stereo. If the game gives you the option for hrtf, use it. If you have to use virtual surround sound on the surround sound from the game, do that. If the game supports windows spatial sound, you can get good results with the windows 10 stuff (sonic for headphones, atmos for headphone). 

 

If you look at some of the most popular multiplayer shooters right now - Fortnite, Apex Legends, Valorant, rainbow six siege, these don't support hrtf. Call of duty Warzone supports win10 spatial sound. Only CSGO, Overwatch, and PUBG have hrtf options built in.

[The Flying Sloth]

23 minutes ago, an actual squirrel said:

 -snip-

And to be honest it's silly to not have binaural stereo baked into more games, humans hear in stereo and you can emulate all the interaural differences and spectral pinnae cues extremely easily with modern technology. It would literally be one plugin that you can drag and drop into any game engine, it's not that hard.

 

Stick in an option to disable it if you use speakers and voila, you have yourself completely realistic surround sound exactly as the human ears and brain expect it.

[rice guru]

17 hours ago, The Flying Sloth said:

And to be honest it's silly to not have binaural stereo baked into more games, humans hear in stereo and you can emulate all the interaural differences and spectral pinnae cues extremely easily with modern technology. It would literally be one plugin that you can drag and drop into any game engine, it's not that hard.

 

Stick in an option to disable it if you use speakers and voila, you have yourself completely realistic surround sound exactly as the human ears and brain expect it.

honestly with how good devs are getting with sound design as well  just look at siege if you just add a program to make it better it would help literaly the thousands of players I play with that just have garbage setups immensely. whose headphones just cant handle the sound demands of the game. 

[an actual squirrel]

I think the problem with headphone gaming discourse in general is that people fetishize headphone choice, but don't appreciate the power of binaural audio/the limitations of standard stereo audio. And I think the way headphone enthusiasts talk about soundstage has genuinely confused people. Good headphones are not going to magically put in accurate spatial information that the digital audio itself wasn't carrying.

 

 

[The Flying Sloth]

6 hours ago, rice guru said:

honestly with how good devs are getting with sound design as well  just look at siege if you just add a program to make it better it would help literaly the thousands of players I play with that just have garbage setups immensely. whose headphones just cant handle the sound demands of the game. 

I wasn't kidding when I said it was just a plugin you drag into the project either, it's literally on the Valve Github page for Unity, UE4, C and Fmod.