Convert a HP Z400 to gaming?

[Nena Trinity]

Budget (including currency): 

Country: Norway

Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: Gaming

Other details (existing parts lists, whether any peripherals are needed, what you're upgrading from, when you're going to buy, what resolution and refresh rate you want to play at, etc): I am considering replacing my secondary PC or upgrade it, so new parts cost about 4000-6000 more or less depending on cpu and board or I can buy a used workstation with Xeon 6-core, 12GB RAM, 380GB SSD comes with Windows 10 Pro the issue is A most use adapter for GPU or B most have adapter to make a standard PSU work with the OEM motherboard... I can even recycle my wifi and my USB card it seems, any reason I should not spent 2900,- on a used workstation?  

[jaslion]

Skip on the z400 as well it's 10 years old and won't be much better than your secondary system.

[Nena Trinity]

Just now, jaslion said:

Skip on the z400 as well it's 10 years old and won't be much better than your secondary system.

I believed 6-cores would be a upgrade even for the FX-8370 and even more so with the Athlon X4 880K minus massive lack of USB3 ports which at least I can get two 3.1 ports with my expansion card...

[jaslion]

1 minute ago, Nena360 said:

I believed 6-cores would be a upgrade even for the FX-8370 and even more so with the Athlon X4 880K minus massive lack of USB3 ports which at least I can get two 3.1 ports with my expansion card...

What 6core? Basically the best cpu available for that platform will only match your fx at best. I do not advice this generation of xeons. Also why the need for a secondary system? You could just upgrade your main system and move that hardware down to the secondary rig as well a fx 8370 and gtx 970 are a much better match than a fx + vega 56.

[Nena Trinity]

1 minute ago, jaslion said:

What 6core? Basically the best cpu available for that platform will only match your fx at best. I do not advice this generation of xeons. Also why the need for a secondary system? You could just upgrade your main system and move that hardware down to the secondary rig as well a fx 8370 and gtx 970 are a much better match than a fx + vega 56.

Well the 970 is used on a low res monitor that is 75hz and basic math I did on it its like pairing a GTX 1070 with the Athlon currently... So yeah you advice against it huh? Well better look at new hardware then. (also he has 5 more doubt he will sell all if I change my mind not to late LMAO) 

[jaslion]

1 minute ago, Nena360 said:

Well the 970 is used on a low res monitor that is 75hz and basic math I did on it its like pairing a GTX 1070 with the Athlon currently... So yeah you advice against it huh? Well better look at new hardware then. (also he has 5 more doubt he will sell all if I change my mind not to late LMAO) 

Your way of thinking is a bit flawed.

 

Your gtx 970 is very much so being held back by the athlon as well it's not a strong cpu. So basically giving that a better cpu would allow it to perform better. So no it's not performing like a gtx 1070 as a not bottlenecked 1070 would perform better but with that cpu it would pretty much perform the same.

 

This is why I'm advising to move to a new cpu on you main rig as that will give you a lot more performance on your vega 56 and then move the fx 8370 to the secondary system.

[mariushm]

Not worth it.

Minimal performance increase so not worth spending the money.

 

If you currently have the system on your profile with fx-8370 ... that's a decent cpu that can still keep up. You'd want at least a 1600 AF / 2600 / 3300x from AMD to get a significant performance increase over what you have, considering you'd have to change motherboard and ram as well.

 

// and low res monitor with 75hz ... that sounds like a monitor with vga input where for compatibility reasons the display processor can support up to 75 hz input signal from the vga.

However, the number of updates per second on the screen will still be 60 Hz ... so often you'd be better off keeping the refresh rate to 60 Hz because you get better signal quality through vga cable.

 

[Fasauceome]

If you get a Xeon W3680 or W3690, you can upgrade using throttlestop on the Z400 motherboard

 

But only with those two CPUs unfortunately. However if you did get those it would have some quite nice performance. There are some diehard X58 users like @Zando Bob that would have some helpful hints

[Nena Trinity]

Just now, jaslion said:

Your way of thinking is a bit flawed.

 

Your gtx 970 is very much so being held back by the athlon as well it's not a strong cpu. So basically giving that a better cpu would allow it to perform better. So no it's not performing like a gtx 1070 as a not bottlenecked 1070 would perform better but with that cpu it would pretty much perform the same.

 

This is why I'm advising to move to a new cpu on you main rig as that will give you a lot more performance on your vega 56 and then move the fx 8370 to the secondary system.

The issue there is the case is to small, plus the most CPU demanding game Battlefield 5 ran smooth on FX + Vega 56 on 1080p maximum preset. The thing I wanna do with the Secondary rig is to take advantage of the 75hz screen to the fullest.

[Nena Trinity]

13 minutes ago, mariushm said:

Not worth it.

Minimal performance increase so not worth spending the money.

 

If you currently have the system on your profile with fx-8370 ... that's a decent cpu that can still keep up. You'd want at least a 1600 AF / 2600 / 3300x from AMD to get a significant performance increase over what you have, considering you'd have to change motherboard and ram as well.

 

// and low res monitor with 75hz ... that sounds like a monitor with vga input where for compatibility reasons the display processor can support up to 75 hz input signal from the vga.

However, the number of updates per second on the screen will still be 60 Hz ... so often you'd be better off keeping the refresh rate to 60 Hz because you get better signal quality through vga cable.

 

It's currently using a HDMI to DVI adapter, the resolution is 1280x1024.

[Nena Trinity]

3 hours ago, jaslion said:

Your way of thinking is a bit flawed.

 

Your gtx 970 is very much so being held back by the athlon as well it's not a strong cpu. So basically giving that a better cpu would allow it to perform better. So no it's not performing like a gtx 1070 as a not bottlenecked 1070 would perform better but with that cpu it would pretty much perform the same.

 

This is why I'm advising to move to a new cpu on you main rig as that will give you a lot more performance on your vega 56 and then move the fx 8370 to the secondary system.

 

3 hours ago, mariushm said:

Not worth it.

Minimal performance increase so not worth spending the money.

 

If you currently have the system on your profile with fx-8370 ... that's a decent cpu that can still keep up. You'd want at least a 1600 AF / 2600 / 3300x from AMD to get a significant performance increase over what you have, considering you'd have to change motherboard and ram as well.

 

// and low res monitor with 75hz ... that sounds like a monitor with vga input where for compatibility reasons the display processor can support up to 75 hz input signal from the vga.

However, the number of updates per second on the screen will still be 60 Hz ... so often you'd be better off keeping the refresh rate to 60 Hz because you get better signal quality through vga cable.

 

 

3 hours ago, Fasauceome said:

If you get a Xeon W3680 or W3690, you can upgrade using throttlestop on the Z400 motherboard

 

But only with those two CPUs unfortunately. However if you did get those it would have some quite nice performance. There are some diehard X58 users like @Zando Bob that would have some helpful hints

I double checked the math and lowest upgrade kits I can make is about 5200 with Ryzen 3 3300X(not in stock right now) or higher I also looked at a B460 Intel board that at the very least let me recycle my wifi card but then I most buy new cooler... So yeah this makes me wonder still bad deal for 2900,- the only issue about the used PC is I would have to get a adapter for the PSU to work...

[mariushm]

11 minutes ago, Nena360 said:

 

 

I double checked the math and lowest upgrade kits I can make is about 5200 with Ryzen 3 3300X(not in stock right now) or higher I also looked at a B460 Intel board that at the very least let me recycle my wifi card but then I most buy new cooler... So yeah this makes me wonder still bad deal for 2900,- the only issue about the used PC is I would have to get a adapter for the PSU to work...

If you're restricting yourself to Norway that may be the case.

But you should be able to easily order components from anywhere in EU, so you have Amazon UK and other places.

Here for example, around 230 uk pounds or around 2600 nok give or take 100 or so for the differences in VAT between uk and norway... and add 5-10 euro for shipping.

3300x seems to be around 40 pounds more, for something like less than 5% difference in performance... not worth it at the moment, as you can overclock the 3100 a bit and you'll get it to 3300x levels of performance.

 

PCPartPicker Part List

Type	Item	Price
CPU	AMD Ryzen 3 3100 3.6 GHz Quad-Core Processor	£95.99 @ CCL Computers
Motherboard	ASRock B450M Pro4-F Micro ATX AM4 Motherboard	£69.01 @ CCL Computers
Memory	Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16 Memory	£64.98 @ Amazon UK
	Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts
	Total	£229.98
	Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-06-06 15:50 BST+0100

 

[Nena Trinity]

5 minutes ago, mariushm said:

If you're restricting yourself to Norway that may be the case.

But you should be able to easily order components from anywhere in EU, so you have Amazon UK and other places.

Here for example, around 230 uk pounds or around 2600 nok give or take 100 or so for the differences in VAT between uk and norway... and add 5-10 euro for shipping.

3300x seems to be around 40 pounds more, for something like less than 5% difference in performance... not worth it at the moment, as you can overclock the 3100 a bit and you'll get it to 3300x levels of performance.

 

PCPartPicker Part List

Type	Item	Price
CPU	AMD Ryzen 3 3100 3.6 GHz Quad-Core Processor	£95.99 @ CCL Computers
Motherboard	ASRock B450M Pro4-F Micro ATX AM4 Motherboard	£69.01 @ CCL Computers
Memory	Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16 Memory	£64.98 @ Amazon UK
	Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts
	Total	£229.98
	Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-06-06 15:50 BST+0100

 

Amazon refuses to ship here anything that is phones or computer parts,tough it seems they are willing to sell us coolers... Ok umm how about i5-10500, ASUS PRO B460M-C/CSM, Crucial DDR4-2400 (4x4) & Cryorig C7 CPU cooler for total of 5632nok pros I can recycle my PCI wifi card, con is need new cooler... Doesn't help most Ryzen is out of stock LMAO (3700x is in stock LMAO) 

[jaslion]

4 minutes ago, Nena360 said:

Amazon refuses to ship here anything that is phones or computer parts,tough it seems they are willing to sell us coolers... Ok umm how about i5-10500, ASUS PRO B460M-C/CSM, Crucial DDR4-2400 (4x4) & Cryorig C7 CPU cooler for total of 5632nok pros I can recycle my PCI wifi card, con is need new cooler... Doesn't help most Ryzen is out of stock LMAO (3700x is in stock LMAO) 

Don't get a board with pci just to keep your wifi card. You are overpaying for a pretty bad board. Just get a super cheap usb wifi adapter. The i5 is also not recommended and a ryzen 3600 is a better option. Just wait till they are back in stock.

[Nena Trinity]

3 minutes ago, jaslion said:

Don't get a board with pci just to keep your wifi card. You are overpaying for a pretty bad board. Just get a super cheap usb wifi adapter. The i5 is also not recommended and a ryzen 3600 is a better option. Just wait till they are back in stock.

I personally believe the 3300X and i5-10600K looks like the 2 best deals, mainly since i5 has no ccx and can probably be paired with cheap budget RAM with less issues. Or am I wrong? Also I love the green board it looks neat even found matching RAM kit!

[jaslion]

1 minute ago, Nena360 said:

I personally believe the 3300X and i5-10600K looks like the 2 best deals, mainly since i5 has no ccx and can probably be paired with cheap budget RAM with less issues. Or am I wrong? Also I love the green board it looks neat even found matching RAM kit!

I heavily advice you against getting that board. It's not a good board and much much better can be had for the same price. The 3600 is a direct competition to the i5. The 3300x is a more budget gaming cpu. Got a website somewhere where I can configure something togheter?

[Nena Trinity]

4 minutes ago, jaslion said:

Don't get a board with pci just to keep your wifi card. You are overpaying for a pretty bad board. Just get a super cheap usb wifi adapter. The i5 is also not recommended and a ryzen 3600 is a better option. Just wait till they are back in stock.

What exactly makes the board so terrible? Its promoted as reliable and stable, even self repairing BIOS... 

[Nena Trinity]

1 minute ago, jaslion said:

I heavily advice you against getting that board. It's not a good board and much much better can be had for the same price. The 3600 is a direct competition to the i5. The 3300x is a more budget gaming cpu. Got a website somewhere where I can configure something togheter?

Komplett.no is my go to shop... Also M-ATX best but ITX if last resort!

[jaslion]

This is 4400 and better then anything you've suggested. Then get a cheap usb wifi adapter and you are good to go.

[mariushm]

Doesn't even have to be usb plenty of cheap pci-e x1 wireless cards.

 

And also again speaking of Amazon ... i was saying amazon.co.uk , NOT amazon.com ... there's also amazon.de or amazon.fr if you can manage the language differences.

There's also 3rd party sellers that may ship to Norway.

[Nena Trinity]

1 minute ago, jaslion said:

This is 4400 and better then anything you've suggested. Then get a cheap usb wifi adapter and you are good to go.

Some others on this forum told me that board had terrible VRM and I should go for the TUF model with a 3300X maximum...

[mariushm]

Just now, Nena360 said:

Some others on this forum told me that board had terrible VRM and I should go for the TUF model with a 3300X maximum...

Even the shittiest A320 based motherboard can handle a 65w TDP cpu like 3300x.

Yeah that motherboard is not great, because it doesn't have heatsinks on the vrm, so it should not be used with anything more than a 8 core cpu... but it would be fine with a 4 core cpu.

 

[jaslion]

5 minutes ago, Nena360 said:

Some others on this forum told me that board had terrible VRM and I should go for the TUF model with a 3300X maximum...

It's fine up till 8 cores. yes it's not great but the site doesn't offer a good selection of boards. You can go on amazon.co.uk however as those do deliver to norway.

[Nena Trinity]

12 minutes ago, mariushm said:

Even the shittiest A320 based motherboard can handle a 65w TDP cpu like 3300x.

Yeah that motherboard is not great, because it doesn't have heatsinks on the vrm, so it should not be used with anything more than a 8 core cpu... but it would be fine with a 4 core cpu.

 

OK I see...

8 minutes ago, jaslion said:

It's fine up till 8 cores. yes it's not great but the site doesn't offer a good selection of boards. You can go on amazon.co.uk however as those do deliver to norway.

Well it's probably due to Covid 19, then again Proshop.no might have better stuff but the website is kinda messy and delivery is much longer also again probably due to covid.