What can be done about Asus continuing to seal their M.2 heatsink screws with Loctite red?

[StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws]

I currently had to return my Z490 board to have the retailer remove one screw that was attached too strongly for me, not realizing that there were two more underneath for the bottom M.2 slot, but while I was able to remove them I found Loctite RED on one of them, which is meant to be used to make permanent unbreakable bonds. On a previous Asus Z390 I was fully unable to remove the screws on the M2 heatsink even after cooking it on the hob to weaken any glue, and using pliers to grip and open a screw.

 

Firstly here is a picture of Loctite red used on a current M.2 heatsink screw on my Azus Z490:

 

 

Here is a photo of the screws on my Asus Z390 that would not come off even after cooking them, even with pliers / rubber band / all the solutions and tricks found online:

 

 

Also I sent both these photos as uploads to Imgur and direct image links to Asus support as part of a letter threatening to make a small court claim - so they complained to Imgur and had my images removed, as though I didnt still have them in my sent messages outbox.

 

Here on Reddit is my current thread trying to discuss this:

 

By simply googling 'Asus M.2 Screw Stuck', you can easily find possibly over a hundred cases of this, most of which are on ROG forums:

 

https://www.google.com/search?client=opera&hs=0zF&sxsrf=ALeKk02bhegfmtWudp3i1CF6lV7FhiIqaw%3A1590728993543&ei=IZnQXurcIIWU1fAPt8KaqAQ&q=asus+m.2+screw+stuck&oq=asus+&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMggIABCRAhCLAzIKCAAQFBCHAhCLAzIKCAAQFBCHAhCLAzIFCAAQiwMyBwgAEEMQiwMyBQgAEIsDMgUIABCLAzoFCAAQgwE6AggAOgoIABCDARAUEIcCUKTqM1j_7jNgxvkzaABwAHgAgAFaiAHTApIBATWYAQCgAQGqAQdnd3Mtd2l6uAED&sclient=psy-ab

 

Other than making a small court claim myself which I will be doing and it only costs me £35 to do so, I cannot make or afford, and I doubt anyone else is going to, a full civil litigation of any kind to stop Asus in particular from using the RED version of Loctite on their M.2 heatsink screws. I've had a Gigabyte Z390 in between my 2 Asus boards and every screw came off with ease and only used Loctite blue, as I am sure is the case with all the other non Asus brands. However from my personal experience, non Asus boards do not overclock my CPU or Ram anywhere near as well, so I have to continue to struggle with my M.2 cover screws having permanently sealing loctite RED on them. 

 

The retailers of these products typically simply claim 'you are the only customer that has had this issue, so therefore it must be a user error', the current retailer only helped because I told them about the problem before ordering, but they weren't able to remove the screws before sending me the board because of coronavirus.

[SansVarnic]

IMO send feedback to ASUS feedback link?

[StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws]

6 minutes ago, SansVarnic said:

IMO send feedback to ASUS feedback link?

I've already fully exhausted complaining to Asus about this for over 8 months since having the issue on my Z390 board - all they do is say some variant of 'We have no contract with you, take it up with the retailer', and the retailers claim 'you are the only customer with this problem so therefore it is a user error and no RMA'.

 

I already had to escalate my Z390 issues to trading standards to get a refund, and now am already about to make a small claim via the court.

[The_russian]

21 minutes ago, StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws said:

I've already fully exhausted complaining to Asus about this for over 8 months since having the issue on my Z390 board - all they do is say some variant of 'We have no contract with you, take it up with the retailer', and the retailers claim 'you are the only customer with this problem so therefore it is a user error and no RMA'.

 

I already had to escalate my Z390 issues to trading standards to get a refund, and now am already about to make a small claim via the court.

I know this isn't the answer you are looking for but if you keep having problems with ASUS boards and not others, and you think you have exhausted all options with getting them to change their practices, then why don't you buy a board not made by ASUS? They aren't the only ones that make good motherboards. 

[AcidFuchsin]

Sounds like you're on a mission, probably not much is going to change your mind anymore.

 

However, according to the manufacturer (Henkel), threads with Red Loctite can be unbonded by heating the assembly to 290 °C which will melt (or destroy, dunno) the glue. Cooking your SSD (Edit: it's about a heatsink, not an SSD; my bad) on the hob will surely not have gone to that temperature, you're as likely to have melted all the solder on the board before realizing the screw was hot enough.

 

I suggest using a soldering iron to spot heat the screw to a sufficient temperature. That should do it.

 

You're right that ASUS shouldn't be using red Loctite. Blue should be adequate to ensure it doesn't come apart over time.

[StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws]

2 hours ago, The_russian said:

I know this isn't the answer you are looking for but if you keep having problems with ASUS boards and not others, and you think you have exhausted all options with getting them to change their practices, then why don't you buy a board not made by ASUS? They aren't the only ones that make good motherboards. 

I already did this too, I tried a gigabyte Z390 rated for 4400+ ram, and it wouldnt overclock my ram at all.

 

Same ram kit:

 

Asus Z390 - 4000 CL18 1.48v

 

Gigabyte Z390 - 3400 CL16 no boot, 3300 CL16 boot but instant errors, 3200 CL 16 (rated stock setting) boot and works but eventual BSOD with 'memory management' issue.  

 

Asus Z490 - 4133 CL17 1.45v.

 

So actually yes, at least when it comes to overclocking Asus are the only valid option. Also regardless of whether I choose a different brand doesnt resolve the issue of Asus sealing their M.2 heatsink screws with Loctite red.

 

Also previously I bought an MSI Godlike board for whatever socket the I7 5820 / 6850 were, and it cost £450. It stopped booting in less than 6 months, and the error code shown was also being reported all over MSI's forums from loads of people with equally 'high end' MSI boards, but just like Asus now, they never accepted it, looked into it or did anything about it at all, and I already made the decision then to not use non Asus boards again. At least once I've managed to get the screws off on an Asus board, it then isnt even 10% as crap as a Gigabyte or MSI one for long term use.

[StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws]

1 hour ago, AcidFuchsin said:

Sounds like you're on a mission, probably not much is going to change your mind anymore.

 

However, according to the manufacturer (Henkel), threads with Red Loctite can be unbonded by heating the assembly to 290 °C which will melt (or destroy, dunno) the glue. Cooking your SSD (Edit: it's about a heatsink, not an SSD; my bad) on the hob will surely not have gone to that temperature, you're as likely to have melted all the solder on the board before realizing the screw was hot enough.

 

I suggest using a soldering iron to spot heat the screw to a sufficient temperature. That should do it.

 

You're right that ASUS shouldn't be using red Loctite. Blue should be adequate to ensure it doesn't come apart over time.

 

And how would putting a soldering iron to the screw not damage the rest of / surrounding parts of the board? Why exactly should I even need to do this? Why should Asus be using Loctite red on M.2 heatsink screws in the first place? What does it take to get them to stop?

[SpaceGhostC2C]

6 minutes ago, StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws said:

I already did this too, I tried a gigabyte Z390 and it wouldnt overclock my ram at all.

(...)

So actually yes, at least when it comes to overclocking Asus are the only valid option.

*Tries one other board

> Asus is the only option

 

It's pretty much a fact that good and bad products can be found in everyone's lineup when it comes to motherboard manufacturers.

 

 

6 minutes ago, StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws said:

Also regardless of whether I choose a different brand doesnt resolve the issue of Asus sealing their M.2 heatsink screws with Loctite red.

It does and it doesn't. Companies that don't sell products don't make them for very long. It won't necessary change their screw practices unless they identify that as the reason for not selling, though, which probably won't happen.

Also, it would have to be a company policy in the first place: if these are mistakes at the production line and/or QC failures, then there won't even be a policy to be changed.

[StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws]

3 minutes ago, SpaceGhostC2C said:

*Tries one other board

> Asus is the only option

 

 

*Doesnt read the rest of the post

>Jumps to conclusions.

 

Also each manufacturer typically only makes a SINGLE mini ITX board per generation. If the other brands dont work then yes, Asus is the only option if thats the only one that works once the M.2 slots are accessible.

 

Also why is it so offensive to you and others that I am using an Asus motherboard?

[SpaceGhostC2C]

1 minute ago, StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws said:

*Doesnt read the rest of the post

True, you haven't.

[StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws]

5 minutes ago, SpaceGhostC2C said:

True, you haven't.

If only 1% of Asus users experience this problem and therefore stop buying Asus boards, that isn't going to do anything at all either to solve the problem

 

So how about trying to suggest something that might actually work as per the tread topic instead of simply stating inaccurate conjectures?

[AcidFuchsin]

28 minutes ago, StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws said:

 

And how would putting a soldering iron to the screw not damage the rest of / surrounding parts of the board? Why exactly should I even need to do this? Why should Asus be using Loctite red on M.2 heatsink screws in the first place? What does it take to get them to stop?

Because a soldering iron puts heat in a very small spot, in contrast to "cooking" the entire piece. You'd heat up the part that needs to be heated way before getting anything of the surrounding parts to any damaging temperatures. It's basically the whole point of a soldering iron...

 

Why you should need to do this? You're the one insisting on using those ASUS products that come with the red Loctite. I'm trying to help you with a current problem, not with doing the impossible.

 

Your third question, reread the last sentence of my previous post.

 

Your last question: probably nothing that you can realistically do. Really want a suggestion? Buy the company and change the production. There, solved. You asked for it.

 

You might want to reconsider your attitude towards people helpfully replying to your thread. You haven't given them any money, so you can't possibly feel entitled to anything from them. Rage against ASUS as much as you want for all I care. Curious how far it'll get you. Imo, it's a case of vote with your wallet.

[Curious Pineapple]

Things get hot, expand, contract, screws fall out. Thats what Loctite is used for.

[Kilrah]

40 minutes ago, Curious Pineapple said:

Things get hot, expand, contract, screws fall out. Thats what Loctite is used for.

Yes but you don't use red in this case.

 

1 hour ago, StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws said:

If only 1% of Asus users experience this problem and therefore stop buying Asus boards, that isn't going to do anything at all either to solve the problem

 

So how about trying to suggest something that might actually work as per the tread topic instead of simply stating inaccurate conjectures?

RMA the board over and over until you get one that doesn't have red. It will cost them each time and they'll eventually look into why. 

[Curious Pineapple]

2 minutes ago, Kilrah said:

Yes but you don't use red in this case.

 

RMA the board over and over until you get one that doesn't have red. It will cost them each time and they'll eventually look into why. 

Are they actually meant to be user removable?

[Kilrah]

Well, maybe it makes sense to someone to sell a board with an m.2 slot you can't use, but...

 

Read the topic maybe?

[Dedayog]

Loctite red = for shit you don't want to ever come apart

 

Loctite blue = for shit you don't want coming apart unless you make it come apart

 

Asus screwed up with this.  Hope you find a solution.  This type of stuff shies me away from a company for long time. 

[XHD600X]

Built 2 similar system with the same board. Also had red loctite, found it a little odd but didn't think any of it. From my automotive experience (I have encountered many many bolts with loctite/rusted bolts etc.) I ditched the screwdriver I was using and grabbed my small socket wrench with the right bit for it. Came loose without a hitch after that!

[StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws]

7 hours ago, Curious Pineapple said:

Are they actually meant to be user removable?

Are M.2 slots meant to be usable? If I buy a board with 2 M.2 slots and have 2 M.2 drives, am I meant to be able to install them?

 

Hmmmm, this is really very hard to understand! Lemme check the manual real quick .....

 

Ok I checked the manual (again):

 

 

Step 4 was the screw that I couldn't get off and already sent the board back to the retailer to ask them to remove it. One of the two screws in step 13 was then the one that I found that had loclite red, but fortunately somehow it still came off easily. This time. The 2 M.2s slots are on each side of the daughterboard, and the integrated sound is on the rest of that board, a rather clever design, except they always seal it all down with loctite red!

[StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws]

37 minutes ago, XHD600X said:

Built 2 similar system with the same board. Also had red loctite, found it a little odd but didn't think any of it. From my automotive experience (I have encountered many many bolts with loctite/rusted bolts etc.) I ditched the screwdriver I was using and grabbed my small socket wrench with the right bit for it. Came loose without a hitch after that!

 

Can you advise me on what kind of wrench and how to find one with micro phillips heads? Currently I bought a T Bar handle with such ends.

 

Or ideally are there wrenches / handles that will already work with my 1/4 inch bits:

 

 

I ordered this one: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07GZPGMPF/ref=ppx_od_dt_b_asin_title_s00?ie=UTF8&th=1

 

Because it seems it will work with both the screw bits and the nut bits too.

[XHD600X]

I'd use something like this

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bahco-SL25-Socket-Piece-Drive/dp/B000Y8XCA8/ref=sr_1_6?dchild=1&keywords=socket+wrench&qid=1590769739&sr=8-6

 

There is a special socket in there where you can use your bits too. I use an expensive snap on one, but this should more than suffice your needs.

[IkeaGnome]

3 hours ago, Dedayog said:

Loctite red = for shit you don't want to ever come apart

 

Loctite blue = for shit you don't want coming apart unless you make it come apart

 

Asus screwed up with this.  Hope you find a solution.  This type of stuff shies me away from a company for long time. 

Forgot about the gold ole green. 

Also, @StopLoctiteOnM.2Screwsbe happy they are using it the way they are and not using primer or the curing agent. If you think just red is bad wait till you come across properly used Loctite...

[dizmo]

It honestly just sounds like you've been unlucky twice. I've never heard of anyone having this issue. 

 

Shit happens. Like others have said, if you're having problems with them, move on to something else. 

[BlueChinchillaEatingDorito]

10 hours ago, AcidFuchsin said:

Sounds like you're on a mission, probably not much is going to change your mind anymore.

Don't think there was any doubt of that considering his name is "StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws". It's like op created this account solely for this one thing. 

[StopLoctiteOnM.2Screws]

36 minutes ago, dizmo said:

It honestly just sounds like you've been unlucky twice. I've never heard of anyone having this issue. 

 

Shit happens. Like others have said, if you're having problems with them, move on to something else. 

 

I've never heard of anyone that has had a PSU die so I suppose it never happens.

 

https://www.google.com/search?client=opera&q=asus+m.2+screws+stuck&sourceid=opera&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

 

Just because you are personally ignorant of something as such doesnt mean that it isnt happening. Moving onto something else doesnt stop the issue happening, and as I already said I tried it and other brands have worse problems than this.