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some US students required to retake e-exams because receiving servers did not accept submissions in HEIF

2 minutes ago, Evanair said:

Screw up a major deadline (AP Exams are major) and lose a client, yes you would be fired. Doesn't matter if you're day 1 or day 365, you're still gone.

Nope. That is much rarer and in some places illegal so yea, not a thing in most cases. Also see the edit. Firing someone while having not given them the instructions required is going to get YOU in trouble not THEM. It doesn't matter if 99% of your other employees got the instructions if the 1% didn't and you fire them because of it, still your fault not theirs so good luck defending that legally, you wont.

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9 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Nope. That is much rarer and in some places illegal so yea, not a thing in most cases. Also see the edit. Firing someone while having not given them the instructions required is going to get YOU in trouble not THEM. It doesn't matter if 99% of your other employees got the instructions if the 1% didn't and you fire them because of it, still your fault not theirs so good luck defending that legally, you wont.

Depends on where you live - I live in an At-Will state, meaning they can fire you for any reason - unless protected by law.

Your job, as an employee or student, is to get specific work in by a certain deadline.  Seeing how most of the people successfully submitted work, it wasn't offline or unavailable, then the burden is on the worker to meet that deadline. Unless you're dead or dying, there is little excuse in the business world when deadlines are mandatory and cost millions to a company.

As for the edit, all I did was add the conversation with the boss, you responded before that part went live. 

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Just now, Evanair said:

it wasn't offline or unavailable, then the burden is on the worker to meet that deadline.

But the work was completed, the employers systems was preventing the completed work from being submitted and you failed that persons by not giving them the required instructions. Because unless you can show they did not do the work and did received the instructions so good luck with that opinion, as an employer you will end up in an employer dispute and without some actual evidence to back yourself winning isn't on the cards.

 

Employees have gotten people killed and still not been fired, because the employer holds ultimate responsibility for everything and without evidence of direct negligence it's actually the employers fault.

 

3 minutes ago, Evanair said:

As for the edit, all I did was add the conversation with the boss, you responded before that part went live. 

I know, doesn't invalided the point or excuse you from ignoring the issue already laid out in the topic and comments in the thread either.

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On 5/22/2020 at 9:47 PM, LAwLz said:

When I went to college we had to submit everything in whatever format the teacher or professor instructed us to use. Usually PDF.

It was out job to follow the directions the teacher instructed us with, not the teacher's job to adopt to whatever the students wanted to use.

 

 

 

Anyway, it's hard to blame anyone for this really.

Blame Apple? They are just using the best image format we got for when you take photos, and they have made a really good job of abstracting it away from end users. Seems like a lot of people in this thread haven't heard of HEIF. Here is a post I made about it 3 years ago when I go over why HEIC is awesome.

 

Blame the students? I think a lot of them aren't technologically literate enough to understand what image formats even is, and tech companies have done their best to make sure they don't have to know about it either.

 

Blame the server software? Well HEIC is a pretty rare format, and on top of rarely being used it is also riddled with patents. It's also a new format. You can't expect websites to update their software whenever a new format gets mildly widely adopted. Especially not during a pandemic where the general attitude is "don't make a bunch of changes. Let's just keep things running for now". Besides, HEIC is a pretty cancerous format in terms of patents. Not even Apple's own Safari browser supports it. Literally none of the popular browsers, on any platform, supports HEIC. Not iOS Safari, not MacOS Safari, not Chrome, not Edge, not Firefox. No browser supports it.

 

We are in a very special situation right now where everyone has to think on their feet to find solutions to new problems. The solutions (like "allow students to take upload pictures of their homework since they can't be at school") might not be perfect since they haven't been tested or thoroughly planned out.

And the whole thing could've been avoided if the damn developers actually tested it with an iPhone.

Whoever made this app, or webpage or whatever it was is at fault here, for not actually conducting a real world test before deploying at such a massive scale

 

And it's not a new format that was introduced September of last year. It's been available for years. Asking students to reqrite their exam is unfair, but there's really no other solution for it at this point

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On 5/22/2020 at 3:04 PM, elfensky said:

Honestly this is ridiculous. I think something like 60% or 70% of US College students use Apple, it's hugely popular in the US. How on earth can you not support the primary codec of your own userbase o.O?

 

edit: 80%!

Well, I kind of see this as a life lesson.

Apple won't allow you to do what you want, how you want it. They decide on how stuff is being done.

People defend it,... people get screwed over for it on their exams.

 

Straight out life lesson: Defend bullshit and you will pay for it. 😉

After all: the students knew which file formats were supported. If they only accepted 8bit files, students would have to upload old school 8 bit files.

Read the question, answer and act accordingly. That simple.

 

"But I am using ApPlE!" is not a valid excuse for not reading your exam questions and instructions. It does however explain the outcome to a certain extend.

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5 minutes ago, leadeater said:

But the work was completed, the employers systems was preventing the completed work from being submitted and you failed that persons by not giving them the required instructions. Because unless you can show they did not do the work and did received the instructions so good luck with that opinion, as an employer you will end up in an employer dispute and without some actual evidence to back yourself winning isn't on the cards.

Part of their work was turning in the assignment.  Your job isn't just to get XYZ project done, but also get it to the employer.  It does the employer no good if it's still on your laptop at home.

Your job, being an at-will employee in a non-union job is at will.  They can fire you because they don't like you, because of the car you drive, because of any number of reasons not related to race, national origin, religion, sex, disability and a few others here in California.  Failing to do your full job isn't a protected class.  Sure you CAN sue, but you'll lose. 

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On 5/22/2020 at 3:51 PM, GatioH said:

AP student here, CB warned us numerous times about this, and communicated this to our teachers as well. Even if you ignored the warnings, you didn’t fail the exam because of this. You get to retake it in June.

This is the point.

Usually you even have a message WHILE UPLOADING that only file formats [insert List here] are supported.

 

It is actually kind of sad that they are allowed to redo this, even tho they clearly ignored warnings left, right and center. You should fail a degree if you are failing such simple tasks. What company is gonna take people that are not able to upload a file as requested?

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8 minutes ago, Evanair said:

Part of their work was turning in the assignment.  Your job isn't just to get XYZ project done, but also get it to the employer.  It does the employer no good if it's still on your laptop at home.

Right so you are going to ignore the part where after a simple mistake in file format locks up the website preventing further attempts to upload the completed test or that the site broke in that way in the first place and had no measures to ensure only correct formats would be accepted.

 

All you are doing is blame shifting for something where there is actually fault and failure by the provider. It doesn't actually matter here if the students ignored the instructions, or even got them too late as claimed, because the provided systems was flawed. If it wasn't and had been tested correctly then you could have easily failed these students but since there was actually a problem out of the control of the student and also unable to prove or disprove whether or not the instructions were received they get to re-take the test.

 

So no, if the employer has a broken ass system and you fire them because of it and the employee can show that and has evidence of it it's not going to end well for the employer. And I literally do not care about this 'At will' thing because that is EXTREMELY rare for the percentage of population of the entire world. Just because you live somewhere with awful employment laws doesn't make it a good argument, you just have bad employment law which is actually irrelevant here anyway.

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3 minutes ago, leadeater said:

So no, if the employer has a broken ass system and you fire them because of it and the employee can show that and has evidence of it it's not going to end well for the employer. And I literally do not care about this 'At will' thing because that is EXTREMELY rare for the percentage of population of the entire world. Just because you live somewhere with awful employment laws doesn't make it a good argument, you just have bad emplacement law which is actually irrelevant here anyway.

AP Exams designed for and used at US based colleges.  As the entire US is at-will employment, with some states putting some restrictions through local laws, this applies within the United States as do the AP exams.  Unless you're an exempt employee and/or under contract or part of a union, you generally are an at will employee within the country AP exams are set to cover.

For your example of a screwed up system, the system was flawed if you failed to follow instructions. As per previous posts from people that ARE part of this, they did receive many warnings. Part of any job is understanding how to correctly operate the things you are required to use - Obviously some people can't follow simple instructions. 

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6 minutes ago, Evanair said:

they did receive many warnings

And the people that didn't?

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On 5/22/2020 at 10:40 PM, TetraSky said:

When you make a new "standard" and don't actually tell anybody about it... This sort of shit happens.
I also didn't know about this new file format for picture. I sure never came across it and apparently most/all major web browsers don't support it either(including Apple's own)... How is anyone supposed to know this "obscure" format that only one company used/supported and even went out of their way to convert it to jpeg when sending to a PC because they know full way that this shit ain't gonna work anywhere?

At my school we use Moodle, Omnivox (with Léa) and Teams. Plenty of different ways to turn in our work. Usually, if an exam needs pictures, we're told to make a word document, put the pictures in and convert it to a PDF for ease of use/format. 

 

It sucks that the students have to retake the exam because of a technicality... but at least they are given a second chance and if what @GatioH said is true, then it is the responsibility of the students because they should've been warned repeatedly. While it is possible that some schools/teachers didn't bother warning them, I kinda doubt they weren't told one way or another and they just didn't give a flip.

 

One, Apple using HEIF and HEVC was not a secret as you make it out to be. They had their whole 100" display light up with these two words back when they introduced it.

 

Second, it's not a standard developed by them. It's a standard supported by many companies and can be used by anyone.

 

Third, it's the IT department's job to know about these things and make sure their app doesn't break because of these new standards. And besides, its not something tht was introduced few months back. Apple's been using it for years and so do many high end android devices

 

Fourth, if the developed had tested their damn app with any reasonably any iPhone (which is not an uncommon device) from the past 4 years, they would've found the issue.

 

So no, stop blaming the "obscure" standard for this. It's 100% percent the developers, and the board (who didnt even bother to test it) fault here

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6 minutes ago, Evanair said:

For your example of a screwed up system, the system was flawed if you failed to follow instructions

No it was flawed. Your exact example here can be used too, everyone who made it should all be fired correct? It was critically flawed and easily evidenced so fire them all right?

 

These are basic issues in a website or system and should have been found through industry standard testing, which clearly wasn't done. My perspective of both working in IT, and for a university for that matter, is that some actually basic things weren't done correctly and blaming failure to follow instructions is just a poor excuse. It's still a system with easily preventable flaws in it that should been found and wasn't.

 

If they had the forethought to create and send out those instructions that just makes it all the worse, knowing your system doesn't support the file format but failing to test what happens if it's tired anyway, incompetence at it's finest. 

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3 minutes ago, Evanair said:

https://apcoronavirusupdates.collegeboard.org/students/taking-ap-exams/tips-avoiding-problems

Last I checked, this is pretty obvious and spelled out with step-by-step instructions.  It's one of three MAJOR links on the "Updates for AP Students" page, which is the main landing page.  

Ok now your evidence that every student did received this before the test and were correctly notified? Because btw I know the instructions existed, that's not what I said.

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2 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Ok now your evidence that every student did received this before the test and were correctly notified? Because btw I know the instructions existed, that's not what I said.

It's on their website.  The burden of research is on the student - a website is acceptable from of announcement to the public, especially considering it's also the portal used for access. 

BTW I'm not saying the people who coded this thing shouldn't be held accountable as well - the fact that there was no error thrown is bad coding and they should be fired as well.  Because this was a known issue, and a warning issued prior to submission, then it's on the students to do the proper research.  That's part of the responsibility of being an adult. 

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5 minutes ago, Evanair said:

It's on their website.  The burden of research is on the student - a website is acceptable from of announcement to the public, especially considering it's also the portal used for access. 

Not good enough. Having a page on a site doesn't mean anyone was actually adequately notified at all. Burden is on the provider to actually properly communicate, burring instructions on a page somewhere on a site is not good enough.

 

Also may I ask how you found that page? Go to https://www.collegeboard.org/ and then click through all the links you find there on the Exam information and help links and tell me how long it takes you to find that page. It's one thing to already know about it but do that as a person who didn't know before hand this was an issue.

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2 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Not good enough. Having a page on a site doesn't mean anyone was actually adequately notified at all. Burden is on the provider to actually properly communicate, burring instructions on a page somewhere on a site is not good enough.

 

Also may I ask how you found that page? Go to https://www.collegeboard.org/ and then click through all the links you find there on the Exam information and help links and tell me how long it takes you to find that page. It's one thing to already know about it but do that as a person who didn't know before hand this was an issue.

2 Clicks - Main Menu - AP Students. If you have an account it brings you straight to the students page with a warning.  

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7 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Not good enough. Having a page on a site doesn't mean anyone was actually adequately notified at all. Burden is on the provider to actually properly communicate, burring instructions on a page somewhere on a site is not good enough.

I'm going to end our discussion here.  We both have different views about how much is a student's responsibility and what they should and should not be expected to do.  Both are so different it will only end in more and more arguing. And I highly doubt either of us will change each others minds.

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1 minute ago, Evanair said:

I'm going to end our discussion here.  We both have different views about how much is a student's responsibility and what they should and should not be expected to do.  Both are so different it will only end in more and more arguing. And I highly doubt either of us will change each others minds.

It's not that I won't change my mind, that has nothing to do with it from what I'm pointing out. Expecting people to do something while not actually providing clear and timely instructions is not good enough so simply having a nice bash at people without evidencing anything just falls on deaf ears. People are complaining they didn't get notified about the instructions so without actually showing good evidence this was done and adequately doesn't mean much.

 

When we want to communicate something important through to our students we email them, put a notification banner on the top of the e-Learning platform website, put up posters on notification boards, send the information to lecturers to communicate to students etc. If it involves enrolling students then similar is done while also passing on the information to schools so they can provide it through to their students directly, as well as having it on relevant websites to them.

 

Of course students have a responsibility but if providers make next to no effort to communicate then I'm not going to blame anyone but them in that type of situation.

 

Nobody is perfect so points along those lines are just asinine, everything is a two way street. Balance of evidence sways debate.

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On 5/22/2020 at 6:33 PM, MageTank said:

This is giving me weird flashbacks to 6th grade when my teacher asked us to write a summary of Beowulf and asked us to double-space it. At the time, I did not have Microsoft Office, but our school provided all of the students with computers that had OpenOffice pre-installed, so I used that instead and enabled it's "automatic double spacing" option. Sadly this did not translate well for my teacher who opened it on his ancient copy of Microsoft Word and he ended up failing my paper over it. Bad times...

That's why you should always hand stuff over in PDF.

It's the industry standard, and whatever program you open it with, it will always look the same and render correctly.

 

If I was a teacher, I'd just not allow anything that wasn't a PDF. It solves all issues with compatibility. If the students can't figure out how to create a PDF out of whichever format they are using when doing the exam, then they can contact me or Google.

 

 

  

23 hours ago, Kisai said:

Yes, but Windows 10 doesn't ship with the HEIF codec. The best way to describe it is that HEIF is a MPEG container for images, and the image is compressed using the hardware HEVC (h.265) codec. So no web software or web browser will support it unless it already has h.265 support.

A few small corrections.

1) HEIF can actually contain other formats as well. It doesn't have to be HEVC. HEIC on the other hand, is the always (if correctly formatted) a HEVC encoded image inside a HEIF container.

2) HEVC isn't a "hardware codec". It can be, and is, implemented in software in several places. This might not be what you implied with "hardware codec", but I don't want anyone getting confused.

3) Browser can support HEIF without having to support HEVC, and a browser can support HEVC without supporting HEIF (for example Internet Explorer).

 

  

23 hours ago, Kisai said:

The same problem exists with using WebP. WebP is the exact same idea but using the VP8 codec. Since the decoders for both HEIF and WebP are excessively overkill, it comes at a large expense to embedded devices and free software.

Now I am not following you. What do you mean by "excessively overkill" and what "large expense" are you talking about for embedded devices and free software?

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16 hours ago, DrMacintosh said:

How is HEIC pretty rare if every iPhone takes photos in that format? 
 

The College Board gets no sympathy from me. They are a for profit company that scavenges hundreds off of high school students. They can afford to implement HEIC conversion or pay to use it natively.

 

And yes, Safari does support HEIC. 
https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT207022

Because even on iOS HEIC is rarely used. Basically, as soon as you want to do something with your image on iOS, it gets converted. Wanna upload your picture somewhere? iOS will convert it for you to JPEG in the background.

Lots and lots of images are saved with HEIC, but in the grand scheme of things it's actually a pretty rare format compared to let's say JPEG. Not just because HEIC images gets converted pretty much whenever they are used for anything, but also because it's not used by large services. And iOS isn't even all that big of a platform overall. Windows and Android dwarfs it in terms of usage globally.

 

Also, it doesn't seem like College Board is a for profit company. The first sentence about it on Wikipedia is "The College Board is an American not-for-profit organization [...]"

 

And no, Safari does not support HEIC. At least not from what I know. The article you linked does not specify that Safari supports it either. OS support is not the same as support in a browser. For example my Windows install supports HEVC but neither Chrome nor Firefox on my PC does. The word "safari" is not

even mentioned anywhere in that article.

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24 minutes ago, LAwLz said:

 

  

A few small corrections.

1) HEIF can actually contain other formats as well. It doesn't have to be HEVC.

2) HEVC isn't a "hardware codec". It can be, and is, implemented in software in several places. This might not be what you implied with "hardware codec", but I don't want anyone getting confused.

3) Browser can support HEIF without having to support HEVC, and a browser can support HEVC without supporting HEIF (for example Internet Explorer).

 

  

Now I am not following you. What do you mean by "excessively overkill" and what "large expense" are you talking about for embedded devices and free software?

1) The format the iPhone uses is HEVC inside a HEIF container. Nothing else. You're needlessly nitpicking.

2) It uses the hardware codec on the iPhone. Sure you can do it in software, but the battery life will be cut short. That's why this codec exists.

 

On Windows there is no hardware codec, like Quicksync, NVenc_h265, and AMD_VCE all support some variation on doing it on the GPU. 

 

But by comparison, zmbv, tga, bmb, pcx, tiff, gif and so forth use simple lossless techniques and their decompression libraries, zlib, lzo, lzw can be implemented with small headers, or even just 10 lines of C in the case of RLE in PCX and BMP. 

 

HEIF uses the already existing H265 encoder to create images and H265 decoder to decompress it, if you don't have it in hardware, the libraries to do so are excessively large and overkill.

 

libx265 is 16MB http://rpmfind.net/linux/RPM/rpmfusion/free/el/updates/7/x86_64/x/x265-libs-2.9-3.el7.x86_64.html

 

libvpx is 1.4MB http://rpmfind.net/linux/RPM/centos/7.8.2003/x86_64/Packages/libvpx-1.3.0-5.el7_0.x86_64.html

 

Plus there are license issues to deal with HEIF/HEVC.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Efficiency_Video_Coding#Patent_holders

Quote

As of April 2019, the MPEG LA HEVC patent list is 164 pages long

 

For reference, zlib is 185KB

http://rpmfind.net/linux/RPM/centos/7.8.2003/x86_64/Packages/zlib-1.2.7-18.el7.x86_64.html

lzo is 165KB

http://rpmfind.net/linux/RPM/centos/7.8.2003/x86_64/Packages/lzo-2.06-8.el7.x86_64.html

lz4 336KB

http://rpmfind.net/linux/RPM/centos/7.8.2003/x86_64/Packages/lz4-1.7.5-3.el7.x86_64.html

lzw (giflib) is 90KB

http://rpmfind.net/linux/RPM/centos/7.8.2003/x86_64/Packages/giflib-4.1.6-9.el7.x86_64.html

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3 hours ago, RedRound2 said:

And it's not a new format that was introduced September of last year. It's been available for years. Asking students to reqrite their exam is unfair, but there's really no other solution for it at this point

Adding support for HEIC is not an easy task. It's not a technical difficulty (although image formats are notoriously hard to get people to implement), it's legally difficult. It's also a format pretty much only used by Apple. Sorry but the world does not, and should not, revolve around supporting something just because one company want it to be the standard. Especially not when it's a bad standard at that.

 

Imagine if software like this had to support all the various file formats companies want to be standard. It would basically be a full time job for someone to just add support to an ever growing list of formats.

 

Also, let's not forget what I said earlier. We are currently in a pandemic. The general attitude and idea is to not fuck with things. A lot of things are (and should be) in maintenance mode. It's easy to have 20/20 hindsight and go "well they should have implemented this earlier" but since it wasn't necessary before nobody did it. Now that it is necessary, it's a terrible idea to start going in and changing the fundamental code of your production critical software at a time where upkeep is more crucial than ever before.

I repeat, you do not want to make changes to these kinds of systems during a time where staff is limited (because of the pandemic, and the ones that are working are busy with other stuff) and when upkeep is more important than ever (because all of a sudden students has to use the system more than ever).

Even IF they knew about this issue, it would be a bad idea to fix it at this time. And that's assuming they did know about it since this is actually quite the edge case (one platform doing one type of submission which has alternatives, fails).

 

I don't think the people blaming the software has much insight or experience with:

1) Software in general.

2) Working during a pandemic.

3) CCB

4) Software testing

 

It's always easy to have 20/20 hindsight. It's a lot harder to execute hastily scrambled together fixes to unexpected issues flawlessly.

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10 hours ago, LAwLz said:

Adding support for HEIC is not an easy task. It's not a technical difficulty (although image formats are notoriously hard to get people to implement), it's legally difficult. It's also a format pretty much only used by Apple. Sorry but the world does not, and should not, revolve around supporting something just because one company want it to be the standard. Especially not when it's a bad standard at that.

Is there currently any other widely adopted alternative? I've converted most of my videos to HEVC using handbrake for multiple years now and even some of high end android phones use HEVC/HEIF. It's high time we switch to a more efficient format. If not HEIF/HEVC then something else tha's better. Apple will follow suit.

Quote

Imagine if software like this had to support all the various file formats companies want to be standard. It would basically be a full time job for someone to just add support to an ever growing list of formats.

No, we're talking about one format that used in one of the most common phones.

Quote

 

Also, let's not forget what I said earlier. We are currently in a pandemic. The general attitude and idea is to not fuck with things. A lot of things are (and should be) in maintenance mode. It's easy to have 20/20 hindsight and go "well they should have implemented this earlier" but since it wasn't necessary before nobody did it. Now that it is necessary, it's a terrible idea to start going in and changing the fundamental code of your production critical software at a time where upkeep is more crucial than ever before.

I repeat, you do not want to make changes to these kinds of systems during a time where staff is limited (because of the pandemic, and the ones that are working are busy with other stuff) and when upkeep is more important than ever (because all of a sudden students has to use the system more than ever).

Even IF they knew about this issue, it would be a bad idea to fix it at this time. And that's assuming they did know about it since this is actually quite the edge case (one platform doing one type of submission which has alternatives, fails).

 

I don't think the people blaming the software has much insight or experience with:

1) Software in general.

2) Working during a pandemic.

3) CCB

4) Software testing

This all bullshit. You don't need to rewrite the fundamental code for any of this. Just add a functionality. And the IT sector/software sector is the least affected industry after this pandemic because work from home turns out to not change much for these companies (as evidenced by a lot of companies shifting to permanaent work from home like google and facebook)

 

Testing with the most commonly used phone is also not a herculean taks like you make it out to be. The company who took contract for this couldve easily widescale tested this new functionality. And any code written that intervenes too much with other unrelated functionalities, that requires you to test the other parts to, is just bad code. 

 

Pandemic is not an excuse to sit, relax and take a holiday while getting paid. Far from it. I work in electronics and software software I have done loads of full scale testing during this pandemic. So has the rest of the company and we frquently communicate to decide changes and discuss procedures. So, no, this is just a poor excuse for bad software. And schools and boards are known for this sort of crap

 

And I see how you gave in to your bias with that last point above without knowing anything about me or what I do. I can easily reflect it back to you as you don't seem to understand how software coding generally works or how unaffected the industry is overall

Quote

It's always easy to have 20/20 hindsight. It's a lot harder to execute hastily scrambled together fixes to unexpected issues flawlessly.

Any reasonably informed software developer should've known about the new formats. If not, should've found out before by testing. Again stop justifying some crap that could've been easily avoided if they had actually competent enough to work in their field

 

EDIT: Two seconds of googling and I found a libraries that help you convert HEIF to JPEG with python

https://github.com/david-poirier-csn/pyheif

If the format is HEIF -> then convert elif jpg continue - nothing groundbreaking about this logic.

If it can be done in Python, I'm sure there is way to do it in react or NodeJs as well. Or worst case, do the conversion process at the backend

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1 hour ago, RedRound2 said:

Any reasonably informed software developer should've known about the new formats. If not, should've found out before by testing. Again stop justifying some crap that could've been easily avoided if they had actually competent enough to work in their field

 

EDIT: Two seconds of googling and I found a libraries that help you convert HEIF to JPEG with python

https://github.com/david-poirier-csn/pyheif

i kinda want to approach the "solutions already exist" bent with caution, considering the weird dynamic of tech administration of some number of educational institutions everywhere ._. especially with organisations who value absolute stability over research into incremental updates (at the very least)

 

i mean heck, even windows 10 has a HEVC/HEIF codec pack, but that depends on the systems running a flavor of W10 in the first place (so there's two levels of pushpack, so to speak, over there). and that's even if the servers are based off windows, i'm not sure what it's like for servers operating on linux distros

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Newegg

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