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Triple Radiator Placement - Its not all about the Airflow

Hello fellow PC Enthusiasts!

I decided to share my experience with you guys concerning Radiator placement in a Custom Waterloop. Ive been searching a pretty long time now but every1 is just talking about a single Radiator or an AIO, and i havent found any information regarding multiple Radiators inside a "standard" ATX case.
Im currently running a 3600X compared with a Vega 64 (LC BIOS) in a single loop, which we all know is a pretty power hungry and hot graphics card.

 

Case: Fractal R6

Watercooling Parts:
Phobya DC12-400 Pump

Alphacool Radiators

EKWB Supremacy Evo CPU Block
Aquacomputer Kryographics Vega 64 Waterblock.

At first i was running this configuration:
280x40 Radiator intake Front

360x30 Radiator exhaust Top

1x140 Fan exhaust Back

Temperatures under full load (CPU+GPU) after 25min:
CPU - 78°C
GPU Hotspot - 93°C

Water - almost 50°C

Pump Speed - 1200 RPM

Fan Speed Top - 1350 RPM

Fan Speed Front - 1000 RPM.

 

I stopped the workload because the Water Temperature reached 50°C.
 

From all ive seen this is the "standard" or most common configuration if you run a dual Radiator setup. Since we all care about Airflow, we seek to have a little positive pressure inside the case so we can minimize dust buildup. In this scenario i was a bit on the negative side regarding pressure. But it was ok.

But after seeing those Temperatures i wondered: Why is my Water Temperature increasing that much with 640mm Radiator surface?
I talked to a Physician at my University and he told me that the Top Radiator will have almost no impact on cooling because of the front mounted Radiator. Because of the small delta between Water Temperature and the Air Temperature that is coming out of the Front radiator AND going through the Top Radiator, the cooling performance will be significant lower.

I then decided to do another Test configuration:
2x 140mm Fan intake Front

1x 140mm Fan intake Bottom

360x30 Radiator exhaust Top

140x30 Radiator exhaust Back

 

Temperatures under full load (CPU+GPU) after 25min:

CPU -  ~68°C
GPU Hotspot - 79°C

Water - 42°C

Pump Speed - 1200 RPM
Fan Speed Top - 1300 RPM
Fan Speed Exhaust - 900 RPM.
Air pressure inside the case is stabilized. With a little smoke test i could not detect any gaps sucking Air inside the case.

But still - im not very pleased with those numbers.

I now ordered another 360x30 Radiator and will try following:

2x 140mm Fan intake Bottom

1x 140x30 exhaust Back

1x 360x30 exhaust Top

1x 360x30 exhaust Front

 

I know that i will be highly on the negative side regarding Case pressure, but its a sacrifice im willing to take to lower my Component temperatures especially the GPU Temperature.


I will update this thread once the parts have arrived and i installed them.
For now i just wanted to share my experience so far, and tell you that a front mounted radiator is not always the best way to go if you run multiple Radiators inside your case.

I will update this thread with new numbers once i get the parts.

Edit: spelling.
 

CPU: Ryzen 5 3600X | GPU: Vega 64   | RAM: 32 GB G.Skill Trident Z | Storage:  Samsung 850 / Corsair MP510  | Mainboard: ASUS X570 Prime Pro | Case: Fractal Define R6 | PSU: Corsair RM750i  | Cooling: Custom Waterloop

 

 

 

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What is your ambient temp?  If its say, 20c (70f) in your room like most people, than you are not pushing that 20-30c air (as it heats up past first radiator, no way the air is hitting 50c post intake rad) fast enough out of the case before it super heats.  I did not have the results you are having with triple radiators.  But I also went with 10x Static Pressure fans in push/pull so the air doesn't have time to heat up inside the case. (and a 200mm side intake fan)

 

I think you are having an airflow issue in your case.  Im using a CM HAF XM (High Air Flow)

 

EDIT - so yeah, I just looked at your case.  That's a front intake nightmare.  Put a radiator in on top of that (reducing CFM greatly of the fans) and you may as well not have a front intake.  Poor airflow due to poor case design for loop/front intake.  Im positive you would find completely different results in a case designed with better airflow in mind.  

 

So I have to contest your title as being quite inaccurate.  It is about airflow

 

 

Current in process build: Project Odyssey - Build Logs - Linus Tech Tips

Workstation Laptop: Dell Precision 7540, Xeon E-2276M, 32gb DDR4, Quadro T2000 GPU, 4k display

Ryzen Rig 3: ASRock B450m Pro4, Ryzen 5 3600, ARESGAME River 5 CPU cooler in push/pull, EVGA RTX 2060 KO, 16gb (2x8) 3600mhz TeamGroup T-Force RAM, ARESGAME AGV750w PSU, 1tb WD Black SN750 NVMe Win 10 boot drive, 3tb Hitachi 7200 RPM HDD, Fractal Design Focus G Mini custom painted.  Lenovo 27" 1080p 60hz placeholder monitor, generic mouse, generic keyboard.  Still a work in progress

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2060 video card benchmark result - AMD Ryzen 5 3600,ASRock B450M Pro4 (3dmark.com)

Ryzen Rig 2: ASrock B450 Pro4, Ryzen 7 1700 @ 4.2ghz all core 1.4vCore, AMD R9 Fury X w/ Swiftech KOMODO waterblock, Custom Loop 2x240mm + 1x120mm radiators in push/pull 16gb (2x8) 3600mhz V-Color Skywalker (or 4x8gb DDR4 2666mhz for large tasks), Corsair HX850 PSU, 250gb Samsun 960 EVO NVMe Win 10 boot drive, 500gb Samsung 840 EVO SSD, 512GB TeamGroup MP30 M.2 SATA III SSD, SuperTalent 512gb SATA III SSD, CoolerMaster HAF XM Case.  Zalman K600S keyboard, Zalman ZM-GM1 mouse, Viotek GN24C 24" 1080p 144hz curved and Hannspree HF207 as 2nd monitor

https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/37004594?

Ryzen Rig 1: ASUS B350-PRIME ATX, Ryzen 7 1700, Sapphire R9 Fury Tri-X Nitro 4gb HBM, 16gb (2x8) 3200mhz V-Color Skywalker, ANTEC Earthwatts 750w PSU, MasterLiquid Lite 120 AIO cooler in Push/Pull config as rear exhaust, 250gb Samsung 850 Evo SSD, Patriot Burst 240gb SSD, Cougar MX330-X Case.  Zalman K600S keyboard, Zalman ZM-GM1 mouse, Acer XF270HU 2560x1440 144hz IPS monitor

https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/37628874?

Dell OptiPlex 3040 MFF: Dell 0MGK50 A02, i3-6100T, 2x4gb DDR3 1600, Team Group 120gb SSD, 500gb Seagate 7mm HDD attached storage, Windows 10 Pro, Logitech K400+, USB Wifi adapter all vesa mounted to the back of a 37" 1080p TV 

Linux Box: Toshiba Laptop, i7 620M, NVS graphics, 4gb ram tinker toy at the moment.  Running Manjaro XFCE at the moment.

Home Security: ZOSI 8 channel CCTV (4 used at this time, 1080p) DVR H.265+, 3tb HGST Enterprise HDD, ASUS monitor for display

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31 minutes ago, Tristerin said:

What is your ambient temp?  If its say, 20c (70f) in your room like most people, than you are not pushing that 20-30c air (as it heats up past first radiator, no way the air is hitting 50c post intake rad) fast enough out of the case before it super heats.  I did not have the results you are having with triple radiators.  But I also went with 10x Static Pressure fans in push/pull so the air doesn't have time to heat up inside the case. (and a 200mm side intake fan)

 

I think you are having an airflow issue in your case.  Im using a CM HAF XM (High Air Flow)

 

EDIT - so yeah, I just looked at your case.  That's a front intake nightmare.  Put a radiator in on top of that (reducing CFM greatly of the fans) and you may as well not have a front intake.  Poor airflow due to poor case design for loop/front intake.  Im positive you would find completely different results in a case designed with better airflow in mind.  

 

So I have to contest your title as being quite inaccurate.  It is about airflow

 

 

Ambient Temperature 23°C. im also using High Pressure Fans (Arctic P12/P14 PWM PST) for Radiators and Airflow Fans (Fractal Dynamic X2 GP14) as intake Fans.

Im quite confused because of the front intake. If the front intake was closely to not having one at all, why was the top radiator heating up so heavily?

CPU: Ryzen 5 3600X | GPU: Vega 64   | RAM: 32 GB G.Skill Trident Z | Storage:  Samsung 850 / Corsair MP510  | Mainboard: ASUS X570 Prime Pro | Case: Fractal Define R6 | PSU: Corsair RM750i  | Cooling: Custom Waterloop

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Stuttgart said:

Ambient Temperature 23°C. im also using High Pressure Fans (Arctic P12/P14 PWM PST) for Radiators and Airflow Fans (Fractal Dynamic X2 GP14) as intake Fans.

Im quite confused because of the front intake. If the front intake was closely to not having one at all, why was the top radiator heating up so heavily?

The front of the case is a wall, with side vents to allow air in, which is heavily restricting the CFM capability of the fans (I only use Arctic P12s in my loops also btw).  Then you put in a radiator, reducing the overall CFM greatly of the fan and now you are barely allowing air into the front of the case.

 

When you removed the FURTHER restricted airflow by removing the front radiator your case could "breath" better.  In your original setup I am positive if you just removed the side panel you would note that it has cooler air to push through the radiators available, thus lowering the water temp by a significant margin.

Current in process build: Project Odyssey - Build Logs - Linus Tech Tips

Workstation Laptop: Dell Precision 7540, Xeon E-2276M, 32gb DDR4, Quadro T2000 GPU, 4k display

Ryzen Rig 3: ASRock B450m Pro4, Ryzen 5 3600, ARESGAME River 5 CPU cooler in push/pull, EVGA RTX 2060 KO, 16gb (2x8) 3600mhz TeamGroup T-Force RAM, ARESGAME AGV750w PSU, 1tb WD Black SN750 NVMe Win 10 boot drive, 3tb Hitachi 7200 RPM HDD, Fractal Design Focus G Mini custom painted.  Lenovo 27" 1080p 60hz placeholder monitor, generic mouse, generic keyboard.  Still a work in progress

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2060 video card benchmark result - AMD Ryzen 5 3600,ASRock B450M Pro4 (3dmark.com)

Ryzen Rig 2: ASrock B450 Pro4, Ryzen 7 1700 @ 4.2ghz all core 1.4vCore, AMD R9 Fury X w/ Swiftech KOMODO waterblock, Custom Loop 2x240mm + 1x120mm radiators in push/pull 16gb (2x8) 3600mhz V-Color Skywalker (or 4x8gb DDR4 2666mhz for large tasks), Corsair HX850 PSU, 250gb Samsun 960 EVO NVMe Win 10 boot drive, 500gb Samsung 840 EVO SSD, 512GB TeamGroup MP30 M.2 SATA III SSD, SuperTalent 512gb SATA III SSD, CoolerMaster HAF XM Case.  Zalman K600S keyboard, Zalman ZM-GM1 mouse, Viotek GN24C 24" 1080p 144hz curved and Hannspree HF207 as 2nd monitor

https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/37004594?

Ryzen Rig 1: ASUS B350-PRIME ATX, Ryzen 7 1700, Sapphire R9 Fury Tri-X Nitro 4gb HBM, 16gb (2x8) 3200mhz V-Color Skywalker, ANTEC Earthwatts 750w PSU, MasterLiquid Lite 120 AIO cooler in Push/Pull config as rear exhaust, 250gb Samsung 850 Evo SSD, Patriot Burst 240gb SSD, Cougar MX330-X Case.  Zalman K600S keyboard, Zalman ZM-GM1 mouse, Acer XF270HU 2560x1440 144hz IPS monitor

https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/37628874?

Dell OptiPlex 3040 MFF: Dell 0MGK50 A02, i3-6100T, 2x4gb DDR3 1600, Team Group 120gb SSD, 500gb Seagate 7mm HDD attached storage, Windows 10 Pro, Logitech K400+, USB Wifi adapter all vesa mounted to the back of a 37" 1080p TV 

Linux Box: Toshiba Laptop, i7 620M, NVS graphics, 4gb ram tinker toy at the moment.  Running Manjaro XFCE at the moment.

Home Security: ZOSI 8 channel CCTV (4 used at this time, 1080p) DVR H.265+, 3tb HGST Enterprise HDD, ASUS monitor for display

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22 minutes ago, Tristerin said:

The front of the case is a wall, with side vents to allow air in, which is heavily restricting the CFM capability of the fans (I only use Arctic P12s in my loops also btw).  Then you put in a radiator, reducing the overall CFM greatly of the fan and now you are barely allowing air into the front of the case.

 

When you removed the FURTHER restricted airflow by removing the front radiator your case could "breath" better.  In your original setup I am positive if you just removed the side panel you would note that it has cooler air to push through the radiators available, thus lowering the water temp by a significant margin.

Ah now i get it. But i also tried removing the front door with my first setup and it lowered temps by only 4°C...

CPU: Ryzen 5 3600X | GPU: Vega 64   | RAM: 32 GB G.Skill Trident Z | Storage:  Samsung 850 / Corsair MP510  | Mainboard: ASUS X570 Prime Pro | Case: Fractal Define R6 | PSU: Corsair RM750i  | Cooling: Custom Waterloop

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Stuttgart said:

Ah now i get it. But i also tried removing the front door with my first setup and it lowered temps by only 4°C...

I think your testing is awesome and Im going to follow this thread to see your results, btw

 

4c after heat soak?  (heat soak is the hottest your loop gets under full load) or only 4c after starting a fresh cycle of ambient temp'd benchmarks vs door on?

 

(have to go into a project, will be back to forum later!)

Current in process build: Project Odyssey - Build Logs - Linus Tech Tips

Workstation Laptop: Dell Precision 7540, Xeon E-2276M, 32gb DDR4, Quadro T2000 GPU, 4k display

Ryzen Rig 3: ASRock B450m Pro4, Ryzen 5 3600, ARESGAME River 5 CPU cooler in push/pull, EVGA RTX 2060 KO, 16gb (2x8) 3600mhz TeamGroup T-Force RAM, ARESGAME AGV750w PSU, 1tb WD Black SN750 NVMe Win 10 boot drive, 3tb Hitachi 7200 RPM HDD, Fractal Design Focus G Mini custom painted.  Lenovo 27" 1080p 60hz placeholder monitor, generic mouse, generic keyboard.  Still a work in progress

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2060 video card benchmark result - AMD Ryzen 5 3600,ASRock B450M Pro4 (3dmark.com)

Ryzen Rig 2: ASrock B450 Pro4, Ryzen 7 1700 @ 4.2ghz all core 1.4vCore, AMD R9 Fury X w/ Swiftech KOMODO waterblock, Custom Loop 2x240mm + 1x120mm radiators in push/pull 16gb (2x8) 3600mhz V-Color Skywalker (or 4x8gb DDR4 2666mhz for large tasks), Corsair HX850 PSU, 250gb Samsun 960 EVO NVMe Win 10 boot drive, 500gb Samsung 840 EVO SSD, 512GB TeamGroup MP30 M.2 SATA III SSD, SuperTalent 512gb SATA III SSD, CoolerMaster HAF XM Case.  Zalman K600S keyboard, Zalman ZM-GM1 mouse, Viotek GN24C 24" 1080p 144hz curved and Hannspree HF207 as 2nd monitor

https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/37004594?

Ryzen Rig 1: ASUS B350-PRIME ATX, Ryzen 7 1700, Sapphire R9 Fury Tri-X Nitro 4gb HBM, 16gb (2x8) 3200mhz V-Color Skywalker, ANTEC Earthwatts 750w PSU, MasterLiquid Lite 120 AIO cooler in Push/Pull config as rear exhaust, 250gb Samsung 850 Evo SSD, Patriot Burst 240gb SSD, Cougar MX330-X Case.  Zalman K600S keyboard, Zalman ZM-GM1 mouse, Acer XF270HU 2560x1440 144hz IPS monitor

https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/37628874?

Dell OptiPlex 3040 MFF: Dell 0MGK50 A02, i3-6100T, 2x4gb DDR3 1600, Team Group 120gb SSD, 500gb Seagate 7mm HDD attached storage, Windows 10 Pro, Logitech K400+, USB Wifi adapter all vesa mounted to the back of a 37" 1080p TV 

Linux Box: Toshiba Laptop, i7 620M, NVS graphics, 4gb ram tinker toy at the moment.  Running Manjaro XFCE at the moment.

Home Security: ZOSI 8 channel CCTV (4 used at this time, 1080p) DVR H.265+, 3tb HGST Enterprise HDD, ASUS monitor for display

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A bit weird that temps are so bad with that much radiator space, but in general I do agree that all radiators should be set to exhaust, doing so dropped my fluid temperatures close to 10 degrees too.

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2 hours ago, Tristerin said:

I think your testing is awesome and Im going to follow this thread to see your results, btw

 

4c after heat soak?  (heat soak is the hottest your loop gets under full load) or only 4c after starting a fresh cycle of ambient temp'd benchmarks vs door on?

 

(have to go into a project, will be back to forum later!)

Thank you! Im very curious about my final numbers aswell....
4C after fresh cycle...

1 hour ago, For Science! said:

A bit weird that temps are so bad with that much radiator space, but in general I do agree that all radiators should be set to exhaust, doing so dropped my fluid temperatures close to 10 degrees too.

Its damn weird, especially the fact that if im playing non demanding games like CSGO or League of Legends @ 144FPS im getting water Temps 4°C above ambient. But as soon as im playing Mordhau or CoD and my GPU is under full load, temps rise above 40°C....

CPU: Ryzen 5 3600X | GPU: Vega 64   | RAM: 32 GB G.Skill Trident Z | Storage:  Samsung 850 / Corsair MP510  | Mainboard: ASUS X570 Prime Pro | Case: Fractal Define R6 | PSU: Corsair RM750i  | Cooling: Custom Waterloop

 

 

 

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For starters as some have already pointed out, closed front panels are bad for airflow, perhaps consider modding it.

 

I would go with:

 

3x 120 fan front intake,

360 rad Top exhaust (remove dust filer)

280 rad Bottom exhaust exhaust.(remove dust filter)

140 fan intake rear (get a dust filter)

Run pump at max speed

Tune fans for noise:performance as needed.

 

If ur interested ,This is how i run my Enthoo Primo airflow btw.

Spoiler

image.jpeg.9964f950c9cfa7eeebda5df9d4bf4645.jpeg

It has a rad mount and vents on the 'motherboard tray side' panel towards the front, hence the 2 red arrows there.

The 4 red arrow at the bottom are push/pull on a 240 monsta rad.

Red = Radiator 120mm exhaust

Blue = non rad 140mm intake

White blocks =  Simple foam dividers to ensure warm and fresh air cannot easily recirculate.

 

The 'normal' rear 120/140mm fan placement is not used due to my reservoir placement.

 

System pics

Spoiler

Rads have since had the fans replaced with NF-A12x25

image.thumb.jpeg.f5434009cad701b4f1481ace07d1036b.jpeg

image.thumb.jpeg.ec1bd14167ee77a48f2193f81c772655.jpeg

 

 

 

 

CPU: Intel i7 3930k w/OC & EK Supremacy EVO Block | Motherboard: Asus P9x79 Pro  | RAM: G.Skill 4x4 1866 CL9 | PSU: Seasonic Platinum 1000w | VDU: Panasonic 42" Plasma |

GPU: Gigabyte 1080ti Gaming OC w/OC & Barrow Block | Sound: Asus Xonar D2X - Z5500 -FiiO X3K DAP/DAC - ATH-M50S | Case: Phantek Enthoo Primo White |

Storage: Samsung 850 Pro 1TB SSD + Samsung 850 Evo 256GB SSD | Cooling: XSPC D5 Photon 270 Res & Pump | 2x XSPC AX240 White Rads | NexXxos Monsta 80x240 Rad P/P |

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Nice Build!

I tried removing all parts that will block airflow as good as i could. So i removed the Front Door & the Dust filter. I also removed the bottom Dust filter, but i dont think that made too much of a difference.

With 3x 140mm intake Fans running at full speed im achieving 37-38°C Water temperature under full load, continues to rise slowly after 20 minutes. Theres literally nothing blocking airflow from the 2 front intake fans. GPU reaching 80°C as Hotspot Temperature also, which is quite weird. I will recheck thermal compound&pads when the new parts arrive.

I really dont know if this has anything to do with airflow anymore. For me it seems like my Radiator surface is not enough to handle the vega compared with the 3600x....
Before i was running a i7 4770k overclocked to 4.3Ghz and a 1060 with EKWB Fullblock on it and i never passed 33°C water temp, with only one 360 radiator.


Here are my HWInfo Stats:

HWInfo.JPG.7eb5d2f582d2d813589b1e2d11fc6c87.JPG

Here a picture of my Build:
RyzenBuild.thumb.jpeg.36f139240f6a17689d1a58b229db62f9.jpeg


 

On 5/7/2020 at 7:33 PM, SolarNova said:

For starters as some have already pointed out, closed front panels are bad for airflow, perhaps consider modding it.

 

I would go with:

 

3x 120 fan front intake,

360 rad Top exhaust (remove dust filer)

280 rad Bottom exhaust exhaust.(remove dust filter)

140 fan intake rear (get a dust filter)

Run pump at max speed

Tune fans for noise:performance as needed.

 

If ur interested ,This is how i run my Enthoo Primo airflow btw.

  Hide contents

image.jpeg.9964f950c9cfa7eeebda5df9d4bf4645.jpeg

It has a rad mount and vents on the 'motherboard tray side' panel towards the front, hence the 2 red arrows there.

The 4 red arrow at the bottom are push/pull on a 240 monsta rad.

Red = Radiator 120mm exhaust

Blue = non rad 140mm intake

White blocks =  Simple foam dividers to ensure warm and fresh air cannot easily recirculate.

 

The 'normal' rear 120/140mm fan placement is not used due to my reservoir placement.

 

System pics

  Hide contents

Rads have since had the fans replaced with NF-A12x25

image.thumb.jpeg.f5434009cad701b4f1481ace07d1036b.jpeg

image.thumb.jpeg.ec1bd14167ee77a48f2193f81c772655.jpeg

 

 


 

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 5 3600X | GPU: Vega 64   | RAM: 32 GB G.Skill Trident Z | Storage:  Samsung 850 / Corsair MP510  | Mainboard: ASUS X570 Prime Pro | Case: Fractal Define R6 | PSU: Corsair RM750i  | Cooling: Custom Waterloop

 

 

 

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What is the front panel of your case? Open, glass, or mesh? 

 

My setup is: one 360 x 30 rad at front for cpu, one 360 x 30 at top for gpu. The GPU and CPU loop are

parallel, taking advantage of the D5 pump. One indepedent 140mm fan as rear exhaust.

Fan choice? Regular coolermaster fan, not capable of generating high static pressure (only 2.32 mm), but enough for thin rads.

Even setting fixing rate at around 850 rpm, after 90 min of CODMW game play, the coolant temp peaked at 42 cecius at 45 min; no future raise. 

My case is a cooler master H500P. Not a liquid cooled friendly case (but however have top internal ventilation), the front panel is mesh: some dust resistance, but massive merit over glass in terms of intake.  

 

By theory, we model how heat dissipate from radiator into a force convective heat transfer: the dissipation power are codetermined by a heat transfer coefficient, temperature difference ( exponent may apply at great gradient) and Surface area.  Most research shows that high RH(humidity) level result in lower coefficient; increasing fluid flow rate will also increase coefficient; the return diminishes. 

If the radiator is too thick for the air flow to move pass, the coefficient greatly reduced; nature convection dominates the force convection. Higher static pressure fan or push pull config will ensure the force convection. 

In addition higher intake air flow also result in cooler air being feed into the case. Despite more heat is brought in the case from the front rad, it is less significant than the increment of air flux. 

 

In practical, my thought includes: to remove front / top panels, to leave a wider gap between the reservoir and the front rad, to reconfig a parallel loop.

 

IMG_20200507_122747.JPG

IMG_20200507_122756.JPG

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5 hours ago, PowerBaller said:

What is the front panel of your case? Open, glass, or mesh? 

 

My setup is: one 360 x 30 rad at front for cpu, one 360 x 30 at top for gpu. The GPU and CPU loop are

parallel, taking advantage of the D5 pump. One indepedent 140mm fan as rear exhaust.

Fan choice? Regular coolermaster fan, not capable of generating high static pressure (only 2.32 mm), but enough for thin rads.

Even setting fixing rate at around 850 rpm, after 90 min of CODMW game play, the coolant temp peaked at 42 cecius at 45 min; no future raise. 

My case is a cooler master H500P. Not a liquid cooled friendly case (but however have top internal ventilation), the front panel is mesh: some dust resistance, but massive merit over glass in terms of intake.  

 

By theory, we model how heat dissipate from radiator into a force convective heat transfer: the dissipation power are codetermined by a heat transfer coefficient, temperature difference ( exponent may apply at great gradient) and Surface area.  Most research shows that high RH(humidity) level result in lower coefficient; increasing fluid flow rate will also increase coefficient; the return diminishes. 

If the radiator is too thick for the air flow to move pass, the coefficient greatly reduced; nature convection dominates the force convection. Higher static pressure fan or push pull config will ensure the force convection. 

In addition higher intake air flow also result in cooler air being feed into the case. Despite more heat is brought in the case from the front rad, it is less significant than the increment of air flux. 

 

In practical, my thought includes: to remove front / top panels, to leave a wider gap between the reservoir and the front rad, to reconfig a parallel loop.

 

IMG_20200507_122747.JPG

IMG_20200507_122756.JPG

 

 

I really appreciate your approach here, but i dont know if i want to follow your parallel design when you get 42° coolant temps with 2x360 radiators and good airflow. I mean, im using only one 360 and a 140 with almost none airflow at front and i get 42°C.

Looking at your GPU i wonder why you placed another outlet right above the inlet? I mean, its a straight hole at this point and, correct me if im wrong,  there wont be much water running through the GPU Block at all?


I dont know what hardware you are running, but maybe an rtx 2080 and an i9? Your TDP is not as high as mine, and you have the exact same water temperatue with more radiator space. Bro, there is something wrong with this.

 

 

CPU: Ryzen 5 3600X | GPU: Vega 64   | RAM: 32 GB G.Skill Trident Z | Storage:  Samsung 850 / Corsair MP510  | Mainboard: ASUS X570 Prime Pro | Case: Fractal Define R6 | PSU: Corsair RM750i  | Cooling: Custom Waterloop

 

 

 

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FYI, i get 42 after playing 90 min of CODMW, with only 30% duty load (fixed regardless of temp. Hardware is OC 9700K at all 5.2, and OC 2080 TI at 2150mhz.
 

1 hour ago, Stuttgart said:

Looking at your GPU i wonder why you placed another outlet right above the inlet?

This is exactly why this loop is parallel. Some Cold liquid enter the GPU block and leave with the heat, the rest head into the CPU block without any thermal exchange with the GPU. I can assigned dedicated radiators to cool CPU coolant and GPU coolant almost independently , before they converge atop of the reservoir.


Doing a loop like it negates the shortcoming of D5 pump somehow. D5 pump moves a lot of fluid at low pressure. Splitting them draw out more potential of the pump.

 

after all. Its just imperial talk. Insufficient data for mine statement to be analytical.

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I am going to purchase a water temp reading device.  Im curious as after 3 hours of COD Warzone into way to early this a.m. my average CPU temp (it leverages all 16 threads, 1.4vCore) my CPU temp is 43c and GPU (on air but I have tons of airflow 10x 120mm 1x200mm in the case) at around 45c when we ended last night.  My water temp is likely very low but Im curious what it is.  I took a screenshot before exiting with that data but apparently you have to copy paste it immediately or use F12 in that game from what Im reading.

Current in process build: Project Odyssey - Build Logs - Linus Tech Tips

Workstation Laptop: Dell Precision 7540, Xeon E-2276M, 32gb DDR4, Quadro T2000 GPU, 4k display

Ryzen Rig 3: ASRock B450m Pro4, Ryzen 5 3600, ARESGAME River 5 CPU cooler in push/pull, EVGA RTX 2060 KO, 16gb (2x8) 3600mhz TeamGroup T-Force RAM, ARESGAME AGV750w PSU, 1tb WD Black SN750 NVMe Win 10 boot drive, 3tb Hitachi 7200 RPM HDD, Fractal Design Focus G Mini custom painted.  Lenovo 27" 1080p 60hz placeholder monitor, generic mouse, generic keyboard.  Still a work in progress

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2060 video card benchmark result - AMD Ryzen 5 3600,ASRock B450M Pro4 (3dmark.com)

Ryzen Rig 2: ASrock B450 Pro4, Ryzen 7 1700 @ 4.2ghz all core 1.4vCore, AMD R9 Fury X w/ Swiftech KOMODO waterblock, Custom Loop 2x240mm + 1x120mm radiators in push/pull 16gb (2x8) 3600mhz V-Color Skywalker (or 4x8gb DDR4 2666mhz for large tasks), Corsair HX850 PSU, 250gb Samsun 960 EVO NVMe Win 10 boot drive, 500gb Samsung 840 EVO SSD, 512GB TeamGroup MP30 M.2 SATA III SSD, SuperTalent 512gb SATA III SSD, CoolerMaster HAF XM Case.  Zalman K600S keyboard, Zalman ZM-GM1 mouse, Viotek GN24C 24" 1080p 144hz curved and Hannspree HF207 as 2nd monitor

https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/37004594?

Ryzen Rig 1: ASUS B350-PRIME ATX, Ryzen 7 1700, Sapphire R9 Fury Tri-X Nitro 4gb HBM, 16gb (2x8) 3200mhz V-Color Skywalker, ANTEC Earthwatts 750w PSU, MasterLiquid Lite 120 AIO cooler in Push/Pull config as rear exhaust, 250gb Samsung 850 Evo SSD, Patriot Burst 240gb SSD, Cougar MX330-X Case.  Zalman K600S keyboard, Zalman ZM-GM1 mouse, Acer XF270HU 2560x1440 144hz IPS monitor

https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/37628874?

Dell OptiPlex 3040 MFF: Dell 0MGK50 A02, i3-6100T, 2x4gb DDR3 1600, Team Group 120gb SSD, 500gb Seagate 7mm HDD attached storage, Windows 10 Pro, Logitech K400+, USB Wifi adapter all vesa mounted to the back of a 37" 1080p TV 

Linux Box: Toshiba Laptop, i7 620M, NVS graphics, 4gb ram tinker toy at the moment.  Running Manjaro XFCE at the moment.

Home Security: ZOSI 8 channel CCTV (4 used at this time, 1080p) DVR H.265+, 3tb HGST Enterprise HDD, ASUS monitor for display

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UPDATE: the parts arrived and i nstalled them.

 

As you can see on the Photo, im now running an 360 rad top + 360 rad front + 140 rad bottom (mainly because i had room for it inside the case and i didnt want to put it on the shelf for no reason).
 

Spoiler

ryzenbuild2.thumb.jpeg.4c559414bdc2c1703010ded446e5c605.jpeg


At first i went for this configuration:

360 Top Rad exhaust

360 Front Rad exhaust (door closed + dust filter removed)

140 Rad Bottom intake


Fan speeds & Pump speed remained unchanged

Results:
Bad. i got the same temperatue (42°C Water, but seemed stable) under load. The only positive thing was my GPU temperatue as you can see below (most likely because of cleaning and reapplying pads + thermal compound).

Spoiler

hwinfo2.JPG.4966da35d44b7169f99439f7c7f566c7.JPG


Another negative sideeffect of this configuration:
Getting warm radiator air straight to the face. This was horrible, seriously. Whenever i was sitting in front of my PC i got airflow right into my face. It was so bad that i had to switch the front fans to intake again...

So i now went back to this configuration:
360 Top exhaust

360 Front intake

140 Bottom intake

Results:
Well, with the front door closed + dust filter installed im getting 40°C Water temperature. GPU+CPU Temps unchanged. But i got rid of the airflow around my face, so thats a huge win for me.

Front door closed + dust filter removed gives me about 39°C, 1°C improvement.

Front door opened + dust filter removed gives me 36°C, 4°C improvement.

Fan speeds + Pump speed unchanged ofc.

So, time for bottom line then:

I guess i was wrong. Airflow does matter. But i guess thats sometimes the result of testing, theres a chance that you might be wrong :/ 
I'll stick to the current configuration with 2x intake and 1x exhaust radiator. Its almost silent and the GPU temps are fine with this configuration. And i also learned that the Fractal Design R6 is simply not made for custom watercooling loops 🤷‍♂️

So thats it i guess


 

CPU: Ryzen 5 3600X | GPU: Vega 64   | RAM: 32 GB G.Skill Trident Z | Storage:  Samsung 850 / Corsair MP510  | Mainboard: ASUS X570 Prime Pro | Case: Fractal Define R6 | PSU: Corsair RM750i  | Cooling: Custom Waterloop

 

 

 

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On 5/8/2020 at 10:03 PM, PowerBaller said:

-snip-

IMG_20200507_122756.JPG

Mmmmmm Klipsch.  

AMD Ryzen 3900X  |  Fractal Design S36 360 AIO w/6 Corsair SP120L fans  |  Asus Crosshair VII WiFi X470  |  G.SKILL TridentZ 3600CL15 2x8GB @ 3800MHz 14-16-14-14-34  |  EVGA 1070 Ti SC GAMING ACX 3.0 Black w/NZXT Kraken G12 Cooler  |  Samsung 970 EVO M.2 NVMe 500GB - Boot Drive  |  Samsung 850 EVO SSD 1TB - Game Drive  |  Seagate 1TB HDD - Media Drive  |  EVGA 650 G3 PSU | Thermaltake Core P3 Case 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hmm .. did anyone try 2 intake rads config and only fans for exhaust? I guess a bit bigger case would be needed with the option to put one of the rads bottom. Also as i said in the thread i opened earlier (didn't see this one), i'd really love to see a config with 1 rad intake front and 1 intake rear, bottom intake filtered fans only and top exhaust with 3x120/140 fans? What i'm most interested in is the timetable - how long it takes for each config to reach peak temps.

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2 minutes ago, QuantumSingularity said:

Hmm .. did anyone try 2 intake rads config and only fans for exhaust? I guess a bit bigger case would be needed with the option to put one of the rads bottom. Also as i said in the thread i opened earlier (didn't see this one), i'd really love to see a config with 1 rad intake front and 1 intake rear, bottom intake filtered fans only and top exhaust with 3x120/140 fans? What i'm most interested in is the timetable - how long it takes for each config to reach peak temps.


I havent tried 2 intake rads and 1 exhaust rad for a specific reason:
Hot Air inside the case unable to escape.
Since my Vega 64 runs pretty hot compared with the 3600X, water temperature reaching 45°C was no rarity. Thinking about those hot air temperatues around my VRMs and SSDs made absolutely no sense to me, so i didnt bother trying at all.

When it comes to time for peak temps:
With my all exhaust configuration it took the system a little bit longer to reach peak temps (they were a bit higher though), but also massively longer to cool down.
With a all in configuration i would suggest that it would longer to reach peak temps and significantly reduce cool down time, but all for a big tradeoff: hot air inside the case.

 

CPU: Ryzen 5 3600X | GPU: Vega 64   | RAM: 32 GB G.Skill Trident Z | Storage:  Samsung 850 / Corsair MP510  | Mainboard: ASUS X570 Prime Pro | Case: Fractal Define R6 | PSU: Corsair RM750i  | Cooling: Custom Waterloop

 

 

 

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The water reaching 45 degrees doesn't mean that the air around the rad will be at that temp also. And i was talking about 2 rad config on purpose - 2 rads as intake i think might produce the same flow as 2 sides exhaust with fans only. Did you try that?

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I have 3 x Alphacool X-Flow radiators with 2 (420 - front & 240 - bottom) set as intake and a 360 - top as exhaust in a Phanteks 719 (formally Luxe 2). Plus, I have 2 extra side-mounted 140mm fans set as exhaust. These are cooling a 9900k running 1.32V 5GHz all cores and 2 x 1080TI's with the blocks running parallel (Phanteks distribution plate) and a D5 pump set to a 40% PWM signal. Even in peak of an Aussie summer, I haven't seen the coolant go over 43°C during long stress testing sessions.

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And for scientific purposes would you be able to stuck a thermometer in the case somewhere to tell us what the temperature of the circulating air inside actually is? Like somewhere around the RAM stick maybe?

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  • 3 weeks later...

Always run the pump at maximum speed if you can't hear it. It lowers load temperature by up to 3-4 C. On my 10900X @ 5 GHz, it's the difference between throttling and sustained 5 GHz under load.

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