Help for ghetto LC build

[DukeOfDream]

I've always been a diy kind of person and i had to have a second chance on Liquid cooling... My first attempt was back in 2006 with a Thermaltake BigWater 745 kit that i installed on my Pentium 4... That had a defective block and after 1 or 2 weeks it leaked and burned my motherboard and gpu. Ever since i've been wanting to try again but i was too afraid of something like this happening again. Until now i guess So i went on aliexpress and bought a couple of blocks for my Hp Z600 workstation(yeah i know its old and lame but its kinda decent and it only costed me about 300 euro including 48gb of ram but without the gpu) that uses 2x Xeon X5570 4core/8thread 3.33ghz cpus(so 8 cores/16 threads total) and a Asus Strix DCIII 390x gpu(i plan on adding the gpu to the loop at some point too). So i used a block that seems identical to the one from Jayz video here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qo9m0KJrIy4

 

I got myself a low-amp 12v pump that states 370l/ph, got a radiator that you would find inside an air-conditioner, stripped it, cleaned it and added it to the loop. It's about 1440mm as i was planning to use it as a passive system without any fans.

 

I put it all together and now i have the following problem. My CPU1 hits just shy of 70 degrees under full load (running cpu burn test from FurMark). The 2nd CPU however is at 10 degrees more on idle and under load it stabilizes to around 98-101 degrees. The pipes are not hot at all and they all seem to have good flow without any air trapped inside. However i cannot check inside the block since its not clear colored pvc. Using distilled water as the liquid...

 

Got it apart, checked the thermal paste for good contact and everything seems normal. Well in theory it makes kinda sense since the water gets hot from the 1st CPU and then goes to the 2nd but according to most  people it should not have a 30+ degree margin

 

Now i'm not sure if this matters at all but the loop order is as follows: Pump sucking water from the reservoir, feeds it to the 1st CPU, then goes to the 2nd one, then  goes to the radiator then back in the reservoir...Like i mentioned the pipes and the radiator are not getting hot at all...They all seem to be at about room temperature. there is however a difference of about 7 to 10 degrees from the inlet pipe of the radiator to the outlet pipe...

 

Anyone got any ideas? Since its my first loop in 13 years i'm really confused here

 

Here's a pic of the inside if it helps at all....

 

 

[Bitter]

I have a similar issue with a single X3470 pushing ~300W when OC'd to 4Ghz under P95 torture test. It's an issue with not enough surface area for the water to pickup the heat. You need a stronger CPU block, what's the inside of the AE blocks look like?

 

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32920170323.html

Is that them? Those are pretty terrible.

[DukeOfDream]

Thanks for replying man. You see the thing is that Jay got similar temps to me using the same block an a 4.9 ghz 8700k with a 360mm radiator... so makes no sense to get there on a 95W TDP CPU (not overclocked since it has a locked HP bios) with more than 3 times the radiator surface...There's got to be something i'm missing here..

Here's some pics from the inside of the block...

 

Edit: Forgot to mention that my idle temps are in the 45-50s on both CPUS which is also a bit strange since im at a 26 degree room and the radiator is nothing over 30 degrees at the output pipe...

[Bitter]

Those are not 95W in reality, Intel doesn't measure TDP in the real world. I have a G1820 Celeron that's 53W TDP according to Intel. According to Intel XTU software it's 20W TDP in the real world. It goes the other way too, I have a desktop socketed Mobile i7 that Intel says is 47W TDP, but in the real world it'll hit more like 70W. Intel TDP is rated at base clock not turbo, and I think without AVX workload, and some unrealistic LLC setting. So maybe if you disable turbo and run a non AVX workload you might be near 95W, in reality you're probably closer to 150W. If I under volt my X3470 I can get it DOWN to almost 130W which is still substantially more than what Intel states. At auto volts it's a solid 160-170W CPU all day long!

[DukeOfDream]

So you're saying its normal to have one cpu at 70 degrees and the other at 100 using a loop like this?

[Bitter]

With those CPU blocks, probably as good as it'll get but it's not normal at all. You're just not able to transfer the heat from the CPU into the water well enough with the load those CPU's are presenting.

[DukeOfDream]

So my Cpu's are creating more heat than a 8700k at 4.9 ghz? Jeez

[Tristerin]

I have 3 of those blocks (2 see through and 1 of the blacks) - those are great blocks for the price, and the size of the copper plate is basically the same all around.  I push a massive OC on that same block in my RR2 in my sig at 600mm radiator space in push/pull with fans.  My temps are fantastic.  What is the voltage you are pushing those CPUs at?  Any OC?  

 

Either way you have a heat soak in my opinion.  You aren't cooling the liquid off very much so its not able to pick up heat off the blocks efficiently.  To test this, place a box fan on the radiator and try again?

 

 

[DukeOfDream]

9 minutes ago, Tristerin said:

I have 3 of those blocks (2 see through and 1 of the blacks) - those are great blocks for the price, and the size of the copper plate is basically the same all around.  I push a massive OC on that same block in my RR2 in my sig at 600mm radiator space in push/pull with fans.  My temps are fantastic.  What is the voltage you are pushing those CPUs at?  Any OC?  

 

Either way you have a heat soak in my opinion.  You aren't cooling the liquid off very much so its not able to pick up heat off the blocks efficiently.  To test this, place a box fan on the radiator and try again?

 

 

Voltages and overclock are locked since this is an enterprise workstation system...So we are talking about a stock system with a stated TDP of 95W x2(since we have 2 CPUs). The thing is that like i said the radiator is not getting hot at all...it sits at about 30-35 degrees in a 26 degree room Could it be that the top cpu block has some kind of air trapped inside that im not able to see?

[Tristerin]

2 minutes ago, DukeOfDream said:

Voltages and overclock are locked since this is an enterprise workstation system...So we are talking about a stock system with a stated TDP of 95W x2(since we have 2 CPUs). The thing is that like i said the radiator is not getting hot at all...it sits at about 30-35 degrees in a 26 degree room Could it be that the top cpu block has some kind of air trapped inside that im not able to see?

Potentially, you can shake your system around (slowly) and rotate etc.  Make sure you have a radiator, or reservoir mounted higher than the blocks so that air gets trapped in those.  

 

Why not test the box fan, see if its heat soak?

[DukeOfDream]

5 minutes ago, Tristerin said:

Potentially, you can shake your system around (slowly) and rotate etc.  Make sure you have a radiator, or reservoir mounted higher than the blocks so that air gets trapped in those.  

 

Why not test the box fan, see if its heat soak?

Actually both the radiator and the reservoir are placed under the desk and the pc is on top of the desk :/ But I made sure to suck from the outlet of the radiator hard for some time till i was getting a constant water flow without any air... I could try to tilt it at the side? I will also test with a fan but seeing the temp on the radiator itself is so low, I don’t think it will have any difference... The 370 liters per hour that the pump is doing is enough? Maybe this is a low flow situation? 

 

Thanks for giving me pointers!

[Tristerin]

Just now, DukeOfDream said:

Actually both the radiator and the reservoir are placed under the desk and the pc is on top of the desk  But I made sure to suck from the outlet of the radiator hard for some time till i was getting a constant water flow without any air... I could try to tilt it at the side? I will also test with a fan but seeing the temp on the radiator itself is so low, I don’t think it will have any difference... The 370 liters per hour that the pump is doing is enough? Maybe this is a low flow situation? 

 

Thanks for giving me pointers!

Maybe, my aliexpress pumps are 500 l/h.  Someone can correct me if I am wrong but a low flow is fine if you have cool enough incoming water as it has time to transfer the heat from the block into the water.  Your radiator size is overkill (me likey) and Jayz showed that you can keep stuff very close to ambient with enough rad space (size of a box fan) but he used a box fan.  Not sure how well passive works in a (his room was 20c, same as mine) similar environment I just have no personal knowledge of that.

 

I think Linus just did a video where he used no radiator and just a homemade shitty block and pump/res combo, where over time the water hit like 70c (they used a water color changing chemical reactant).  Try a fan lol

[DukeOfDream]

8 minutes ago, Tristerin said:

Maybe, my aliexpress pumps are 500 l/h.  Someone can correct me if I am wrong but a low flow is fine if you have cool enough incoming water as it has time to transfer the heat from the block into the water.  Your radiator size is overkill (me likey) and Jayz showed that you can keep stuff very close to ambient with enough rad space (size of a box fan) but he used a box fan.  Not sure how well passive works in a (his room was 20c, same as mine) similar environment I just have no personal knowledge of that.

 

I think Linus just did a video where he used no radiator and just a homemade shitty block and pump/res combo, where over time the water hit like 70c (they used a water color changing chemical reactant).  Try a fan lol

Will do  Thanks again for the support!

[Tristerin]

1 minute ago, DukeOfDream said:

Will do  Thanks again for the support!

Good luck!  Id like to see a full pic of the loop - sounds awesome!

[DukeOfDream]

3 minutes ago, Tristerin said:

Good luck!  Id like to see a full pic of the loop - sounds awesome!

Not that awesome as it sounds but I will get you some pics of it tomorrow  I’m telling you, it’s as ghetto as it gets  

[Tristerin]

1 minute ago, DukeOfDream said:

Not that awesome as it sounds but I will get you some pics of it tomorrow  I’m telling you, it’s as ghetto as it gets  

My first loop, behold, Dwight (clear version of that block) my HP Pro 6300 that I wanted to mod to hell for fun.  It has everything it could possibly have lol:

 

[DukeOfDream]

Does it do the job? Then it’s fine by me  by the wat I see you have a gpu block there that only covers the gpu and not the memory/vrm Is this something I should try or go for a board specific one? Since those 390x’s go really hot  

[Tristerin]

4 minutes ago, DukeOfDream said:

Does it do the job? Then it’s fine by me  by the wat I see you have a gpu block there that only covers the gpu and not the memory/vrm Is this something I should try or go for a board specific one? Since those 390x’s go really hot  

I have aluminum heat sinks (double sided adhesive thermal tape) on the memory, VRMs and VRM Control (double stacked on the controller) and use the passive airflow to keep it cool, no issues like this (R7 260X 2gb) - this is the PC that runs my living room entertainment lol

 

EDIT - also, this is a mixed metals loop with antifreeze, its an aluminum CPU block being held down by a block strap

[DukeOfDream]

I could buy another one of those cpu blocks and try to make it fit... It’s not gonna give me any overclocking headroom but at least it’s gonna keep this freaking thing of a card at a decent temp

[Bitter]

Wait, I assumed that the whole setup was on the same plane. How much pump head are you trying to overcome? (how high are you trying to pump water) It very well could be flowing almost nothing if you're trying to push water several feet AND through TWO blocks AND through a very long radiator path, you mentioned it's an AC heat exchanger? Is it a cross flow or is it a big long single tube with a bunch of fins? If it's a long single tube that can be a HUGE restriction in flow because of all the U bends. I think you need to check your flow rate at outlet of the last CPU block. How long does it take to fill a 1 liter container? How much coolant is actually in the loop? Whats your reservoir size?

[DukeOfDream]

30 minutes ago, Bitter said:

Wait, I assumed that the whole setup was on the same plane. How much pump head are you trying to overcome? (how high are you trying to pump water) It very well could be flowing almost nothing if you're trying to push water several feet AND through TWO blocks AND through a very long radiator path, you mentioned it's an AC heat exchanger? Is it a cross flow or is it a big long single tube with a bunch of fins? If it's a long single tube that can be a HUGE restriction in flow because of all the U bends. I think you need to check your flow rate at outlet of the last CPU block. How long does it take to fill a 1 liter container? How much coolant is actually in the loop? Whats your reservoir size?

i used the container that came with the distilled water as a reservoir(drilled holes to it)... it was 4 liters at first, I spilled some trying to get the air out of the loop so now my guess is it’s just over 3 liters in the reservoir... I will do a test about how long it takes to fill a 1lt container and I will let you know 

[DukeOfDream]

Final Update. Came out that STUPID me had forgot to take off the protective film from the copper block on the second CPU. I mean how silly was that? Temps are normal now never exceeding 70c under full load with no fans used on the radiator. I also used this block to add my 390x to the loop: https://www.amazon.com/Cooling-Cooler-Copper-Waterway-Component/dp/B07KZVQMNC?SubscriptionId=1EC7DSZRM78JXNV7CNG2&tag=picclick0f-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B07KZVQMNC
 

Now i just need to add some heatsinks on my VRM's and vram chips on the GPU. Ordered a bunch of different small heatsinks and some universal nvme heatsinks to try out. Running the card a bit downclocked until then

So total cost was about 39.41€ for the 2CPU+1GPU blocks, 4.46€ for the 12v 370l/h pump, 5€ for 10 meters of hose, 1€ for the distilled water(also used the plastic can as a reservoir) and a scraped a/c unit (the indoor one) that  i used as my radiator. So that brings the total to just shy of 50€ for watercooling the whole pc not that bad, right?

 

Thanks everyone for helping me out on this

 

Cheers!