AMD really going to shortchange Radeon VII and Vega consumers of RIS?

[Halonan]

In a recent article(s) there is talk of RIS (Radeon Image Sharpening) not being supported on the Vega family of products. Reference: https://www.pcgamesn.com/amd/vega-radeon-image-sharpening

 

Is this really an issue, or is it just being sensationalized? AMD developers have their hands pretty full at the moment, but I cannot imagine them denying a software feature to a Flagship card like the Radeon VII.

 

Any thoughts?

[Streetguru]

10 minutes ago, Halonan said:

 

It has a different media encoder compared to navi/polaris, will likely be added later.

https://www.pcgamesn.com/amd/vega-radeon-image-sharpening?fbclid=IwAR0gl71XiSTfWhb87DonXAozt-RJEdWAzBR2AEjEtuDItEDoqb_9BDGtgDE

[emosun]

raise your hand if you even knew this was a feature and if your monitor doesn't already have a sharpness setting

[Streetguru]

1 minute ago, emosun said:

raise your hand if you even knew this was a feature and if your monitor doesn't already have a sharpness setting

Ima just take a guess that upscaling from the GPU is better than some monitor/TV upscaling.

[emosun]

1 minute ago, Streetguru said:

Ima just take a guess that upscaling from the GPU is better than some monitor/TV upscaling.

there is no good upscaling , upscaling has been my thing for the past 5 years lol.

there only so many ways to blur and average the stair steps before it ends up looking just like every other upscale method

[Streetguru]

1 minute ago, emosun said:

there is no good upscaling , upscaling has been my thing for the past 5 years lol.

there only so many ways to blur and average the stair steps before it ends up looking just like every other upscale method

I dunno man, it looks pretty good to me, i have an RX 5700 and a 4k display.
 

 

[emosun]

1 minute ago, Streetguru said:

I dunno man, it looks pretty good to me, i have an RX 5700 and a 4k display.

I imagine if you didn't upscale or restore video for a living then sure w/e , add some cheap unsharp mask to it while we're at it thats what the kids these days want right

[Streetguru]

1 minute ago, emosun said:

I imagine if you didn't upscale or restore video for a living then sure w/e , add some cheap unsharp mask to it while we're at it thats what the kids these days want right

If you upscale like 720p or 1080p to 4k, then ya it's always going to look bad.

But if you start at 1440p or 80% of 4k where you get a good deal more performance, then upscale, the difference isn't going to be much.

But I can just run all of my games at 4k 60fps anyways.

[emosun]

2 minutes ago, Streetguru said:

But if you start at 1440p or 80% of 4k where you get a good deal more performance, then upscale, the difference isn't going to be much

similar to how upscaling a 240p video to 241p also seems to not show much difference.

try upscaling standard def to 4k , thats where the real challenge comes in

[justpoet]

Who cares?  Vega arch cards aren't the current generation and were never marketed with any of these features.  I'm sure it would be nice to add the features to prior gen cards, but that may not be doable with a 5 minute code back port.  In a perfect world, sure…but this isn't…and I'd much rather see OpenCL and other driver issues fixed on Navi, their currently available for sale cards.

[Halonan]

3 hours ago, justpoet said:

Who cares?  Vega arch cards aren't the current generation and were never marketed with any of these features.  I'm sure it would be nice to add the features to prior gen cards, but that may not be doable with a 5 minute code back port.  In a perfect world, sure…but this isn't…and I'd much rather see OpenCL and other driver issues fixed on Navi, their currently available for sale cards.

The anniversary edition Radeon VII just became available for sale in May, we aren't talking about a card that someone bought years ago. Spending 7 bills on a card only to have support drop on it this quick would be pretty piss poor.  Especially since they are giving the feature to legacy Polaris cards from previous generations. While I agree with your comment about OpenCL, I don't think someone should have to buy a new card every 6 months to stay current.  I asked the question because it does not seem likely that AMD would do this, as it doesn't fit in their "fine wine" philosophy and felt like the website I referenced was stirring the pot.

[Zando_]

23 minutes ago, huilun02 said:

Was Vega advertised with RIS?

Are you getting shortchanged at all?

What else do you think AMD owes you? A blowjob?

^ As a Radeon VII owner I don't feel shortchanged at all, I was never told RIS was a thing when I bought the card, I don't expect it now. It'd be awesome if they added it, but that's a plus and not a promised feature. Also side note, Radeon VII and the Vega 56/64/FE are all Vega, RVII is just 2nd gen Vega.

 

Just now, Halonan said:

The anniversary edition Radeon VII just became available for sale in May, we aren't talking about a card that someone bought years ago. Spending 7 bills on a card only to have support drop on it this quick would be pretty piss poor.  Especially since they are giving the feature to legacy Polaris cards from previous generations. While I agree with your comment about OpenCL, I don't think someone should have to buy a new card every 6 months to stay current.  I asked the question because it does not seem likely that AMD would do this, as it doesn't fit in their "fine wine" philosophy and felt like the website I referenced was stirring the pot.

Drop support? What do you mean, this was never a supported feature, all the features supported on the RVII still get updates.

[Halonan]

25 minutes ago, huilun02 said:

Was Vega advertised with RIS?

Are you getting shortchanged at all?

What else do you think AMD owes you? A blowjob?

We are on a tech site, and the most intelligent thing you can say is blowjob?  No wonder you didn't understand what I was asking.  The topic at hand is not that the Radeon VII or Vega was or was not advertised with this new feature.  I was asking if the claim sounded credible.  And I purchased a graphics card 3 months ago, for 700.00, I wouldn't spend that on a blowjob, or a product that I thought they would drop support for in such a short amount of time. 

[Halonan]

8 minutes ago, Zando Bob said:

^ As a Radeon VII owner I don't feel shortchanged at all, I was never told RIS was a thing when I bought the card, I don't expect it now. It'd be awesome if they added it, but that's a plus and not a promised feature. Also side note, Radeon VII and the Vega 56/64/FE are all Vega, RVII is just 2nd gen Vega.

 

Drop support? What do you mean, this was never a supported feature, all the features supported on the RVII still get updates.

Zando, 

 

To be clear.  I am not bitching.  I am a proud owner of a Radeon VII, and a 3900x.  The articles (There are 5 of them if you google RIS Radeon VII) are making these claims. The words "short-changed" and "Poor Vega… AMD has skipped a generation and enabled Radeon Image Sharpening on Polaris" these are not my opinions.  I was inquiring whether or not anyone thought there was any validity to the claims they were making.  For content creation and light gaming, I don't think there is a better setup than what I am running.  At least not for me.

[Zando_]

8 minutes ago, Halonan said:

Zando, 

 

To be clear.  I am not bitching.  I am a proud owner of a Radeon VII, and a 3900x.  The articles (There are 5 of them if you google RIS Radeon VII) are making these claims. The words "short-changed" and "Poor Vega… AMD has skipped a generation and enabled Radeon Image Sharpening on Polaris" these are not my opinions.  I was inquiring whether or not anyone thought there was any validity to the claims they were making.  For content creation and light gaming, I don't think there is a better setup than what I am running.  At least not for me.

All I'm seeing is " “AMD will gauge end user reception and demand for Radeon Image Sharpening,” says AMD in response to our questions about future Vega support, “and will consider adding support for additional Radeon RX graphics cards in the future.” "

Basically they want to see if people use it a lot, then they may add it to Vega. If they don't no sweat, we weren't promised it in the first place. If they do then that'll be pretty cool. My main beef is the use of "shortchange" in the title, we were never promised this so how is it shortchanging?

[Halonan]

1 minute ago, huilun02 said:

Ok then this is the most official source of news right now

https://community.amd.com/thread/240955#comment-2918677

 

It would be great if Vega gets the feature. Alas customers can only blame themselves for taking AMD's record of generosity for granted.

Thank you for the link.  There was a call to petition AMD about it on Reddit, and I was just asking to find out if the concerns were all smoke and mirrors. I created this forum account tonight because I curious whether or not this was even a valid issue. AMD's developers are busy enough right now. It seems all the media is abuzz with complaints about 25-50 megahertz on Ryzen or Vega not getting RIS.  It felt like a smear campaign. I just wanted to ask others in a forum that is usually very informative. Now, looking at the other work the author of that post has written, it is probably click-bait.

 

[ryao]

Wasn’t this added to Reshade?

 

https://www.dsogaming.com/news/modder-has-ported-amds-new-image-sharpening-to-reshade-allowing-all-nvidia-amd-gamers-to-use-it/

 

By the way, I have never liked the halo effect of sharpening. Having seen videos of Radeon Image Sharpening on YouTube, I wonder if the compression is affecting the quality because I do not believe that I am seeing the improvements that the commentators seem to like. All I see are halo effects that appear to hurt as much as the sharpening helps. The post processed result does not look better to me.

[GoldenLag]

1 hour ago, Halonan said:

as it doesn't fit in their "fine wine" philosophy

AMD doesnt have a finewine philosophy. thats made up by the userbase as a way to simplify AMD`s more difficult job of optimizing drivers and the cards usually (GCN) having more compute oriented focus making them hold up for longer. not to mention the allways poor launch drivers. 

[Master Disaster]

5 hours ago, Halonan said:

We are on a tech site, and the most intelligent thing you can say is blowjob?  No wonder you didn't understand what I was asking.  The topic at hand is not that the Radeon VII or Vega was or was not advertised with this new feature.  I was asking if the claim sounded credible.  And I purchased a graphics card 3 months ago, for 700.00, I wouldn't spend that on a blowjob, or a product that I thought they would drop support for in such a short amount of time. 

We are on a tech site yet you don't seem to be able to grasp the difference between dropping support and not backporting a feature that was never advertised.

 

The 2 things are not even close to the same thing.

[Halonan]

9 hours ago, Master Disaster said:

We are on a tech site yet you don't seem to be able to grasp the difference between dropping support and not backporting a feature that was never advertised.

 

The 2 things are not even close to the same thing.

No they are not. That is correct. Take the time to read the whole thread instead of attempting to bring off topic negativity to the table. I didn't write the article. I asked if it had validity.

 

While driver support is still broken on Radeon VII, it is adequate for the things I do. Overclockers like Der8auer have stated that the card has more potential than the drivers allow.  But, that is not the topic I asked about.

 

Approximately 48 hours ago a few articles were published that stated Vega owners were being hung out to dry. I felt like that was a pretty harsh take on the subject. It incited a petition on Reddit that is still going strong. Talking to others in this thread has eased any concerns I may have had. The Navi lineup is the priority right now and if they do backport RIS, it'll be a nice bonus.

[Master Disaster]

1 hour ago, Halonan said:

No they are not. That is correct. Take the time to read the whole thread instead of attempting to bring off topic negativity to the table. I didn't write the article. I asked if it had validity.

 

While driver support is still broken on Radeon VII, it is adequate for the things I do. Overclockers like Der8auer have stated that the card has more potential than the drivers allow.  But, that is not the topic I asked about.

 

Approximately 48 hours ago a few articles were published that stated Vega owners were being hung out to dry. I felt like that was a pretty harsh take on the subject. It incited a petition on Reddit that is still going strong. Talking to others in this thread has eased any concerns I may have had. The Navi lineup is the priority right now and if they do backport RIS, it'll be a nice bonus.

Vega simply isn't a great architecture and that's coming from an ex Vega 64 owner. It's power hungry, hot and inefficient.

 

One thing to remember is AMD didn't try to hide any of this stuff, all the information was available through reviews and benchmarks so anybody who did buy it should have known exactly what they were getting into.

 

Also RDNA doesn't mean AMD will stop working on GCN, in fact AMD are usually very good about providing long term support for their hardware.

 

Lastly Radeon VII was always a niche product, again AMD didn't try to hide this.

 

People who bought it got what they paid for, whether it was worth the price depends on personal situation. I never accept this fallacy when people believe that a new product somehow invalidates or devalues the previous generation. It's upto you to do your research and decide if a product is right for you or not.

 

It's also worth mentioning that it's possible RIS isn't fully done through software, maybe RDNA has hardware onboard that makes RIS possible which would make backporting it impossible.

[Master Disaster]

On 9/15/2019 at 3:04 AM, Halonan said:

In a recent article(s) there is talk of RIS (Radeon Image Sharpening) not being supported on the Vega family of products. Reference: https://www.pcgamesn.com/amd/vega-radeon-image-sharpening

 

Is this really an issue, or is it just being sensationalized? AMD developers have their hands pretty full at the moment, but I cannot imagine them denying a software feature to a Flagship card like the Radeon VII.

 

Any thoughts?

https://www.amd.com/en/support/kb/release-notes/rn-rad-win-19-9-2

Quote

Radeon Software Adrenalin 2019 Edition 19.9.2 Highlights

Support For

• Borderlands 3
  • Up to 16% FPS improvement on the Radeon™ RX 5700 graphics card running Radeon™ Software Adrenalin 2019 Edition version 19.9.2 vs. 19.9.1 drivers.^RS-312
• Radeon Image Sharpening
  • Now available on Radeon RX 590, Radeon RX 580, Radeon RX 570, Radeon RX 480 and Radeon RX 470 series desktop graphics products for DirectX®12 and Vulkan® applications.

Fixed Issues

• With v-sync enabled FPS may be locked to 30 on some displays set to 75hz refresh rates.
• System instability may be experienced on some Radeon RX 5700 series graphics system configurations when watching video content in a web browser.
• Audio for clips captured by Radeon ReLive may be corrupted or garbled when desktop recording is enabled.
• Radeon Settings may list core clocks as not available with some Radeon RX 5700 series graphics system configurations.
• Enabling Enhanced Sync may cause game, application or system crashes on Radeon RX 5700 series graphics products.

Known Issues

• Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice™ may exhibit texture corruption during later parts of the game.
• Toggling HDR may cause system instability during gaming when Radeon ReLive is enabled.
• Discord™ may experience an application hang on Radeon RX 5700 series graphics products when HW acceleration is enabled.
• Display artifacts may be experienced on some 75hz display configurations on Radeon RX 5700 series graphics system configurations.
• Call of Duty®: Black Ops 4 may experience stutter on some system configurations.
• Open Broadcasting Software™ may experience frame drops or stutter when using AMF encoding on some system configurations.
• HDMI® overscan and underscan options may be missing from Radeon Settings on AMD Radeon VII system configurations when the primary display is set to 60hz.
• Stutter may be experienced when Radeon FreeSync is enabled on 240hz refresh displays with Radeon RX 5700 series graphics products.
• AMD Radeon VII may experience elevated memory clocks at idle or on desktop.

Footnotes

• RS-312 - Testing conducted by AMD Performance Labs as of September 12th, 2019 on Borderlands 3 (DirectX® 12 at ‘Badass’ Presets) at 1080p resolution. Performance may vary based on resolution and settings.

Still no Vega support  though.

[GamerDude]

Good news! AMD has brought RIS to VEGA GPU's at last! Download and install Adrenalin 19.3.3, I just installed it and RIS tab shows up in AMD control panel, I actually knew AMD was working on RIS for VEGA, was told by a beta tester, but sworn to silence as he was under NDA.

https://www.amd.com/en/support