Understanding Cooling/Budget Shopping

[Loveandpower]

Hello guys,

 

So...long story short my computer is about 5-6 years old and I have started to do some minor upgrades. I plan to purchase a budget graphics card (possibly a RX 570) and one thing I want to consider with this purchase is also some "budget fans" that while "not the best in the world" will do what they need to do. 

I am not looking to do 'extreme gaming" or anything like that. I mostly play Grand Theft Auto V at like 1920x1080 or 720P ( I do on the rare occasion stream as well) That is the main reason for the upgrade. My CPU is still perfect for streaming the games I play so not really worried about that. 

Anyway I am getting off topic... my fans well...yeah as you can imagine in a prebuilt had your basic fans. I have two issues: 

1) I don't really understand the whole cooling system thing. I have took a PC (my PC in particular) apart several times so I am comfortable working with it) How should cooling be done? Is there a specific "direction" the  fans are supposed to be ?  Etc. All of the fans from my own research indicate that I have 120MM fans (three of them). I currently have one stock fan in the back, one in the front of the case, and one on the side panel. 

I am interested in purchasing maybe either 3 or possibly even 5 new fans and redoing the cooling system entirely utilizing those. 

 

2) I don't even know where to start really. My budget is likely going to be $75 MAYBE $100 for all the fans max. More I put into the fans less I have for the graphics card. Not wanting to spend more than $200 for both projects. 

[Zando_]

With a normal case, you put 2 or 3 fans in the front and one in the back for clean aiflow in the front and out the back of the case (point the CPU cooler exhaust out the back if it's an air tower, usually out the top for any AIO bigger than 120mm). 

What's the full spec of the rig you're running right now? Your money may be better spent places other than fans. 

[Loveandpower]

CPU: FX 8320 
GPU: Currently integrated graphics … ATI Radeon 3000 

Motherboard: GA-78LMT-USB3  (I don't know the Version sorry but I know it's not the newest one)
Memory: Stock ADATA 16GB memory like 1866 or something. 

 

I HAD a AMD Radeon 7850 for a GPU but I speculate it got too hot or something (again assuming due to temps as my system has been getting extremely hot at times.) 

So essentially...one day I heard this noise and then started to smell like a burnt smoke smell or something. … Couple of weeks after that the graphics card started having some serious issues where it caused my PC to constantly restart. 

 

I can't even have the card in the system anymore as it basically makes the system unusable sadly. I started to monitor my temps more frequently via speedfan and here are the current results as I am typing this: 

 

Fan 1: 12RPM

Fan 2: 3013 RPM

Fan 3: 0 RPM

Fan 1: 4245 RPM

Fan 2: 0 RPM

Fan 3: 0 RPM

Fan 4: 0 RPM

Fan 5: 0 RPM

 

Temp1: 43C

Temp2: 70C

Temp3: 81C

HDD: 39C

Core: 58C

 

Should be noted if I am doing something heavy for the system the Temp 2 and Temp 3 gets to almost 100C easily. Generally my system crashes/reboots or whatever at that temperature also though. 

 

I mean as I am not a huge gamer beyond Grand Theft Auto V, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect 2 + 3, and a couple of other small games I am not looking for anything fancy. 

 

I don't really care if it has RGB, if it is loud , etc. I am more concerned about performance for the buck within in my budget. 

 

Whatever is decided...I hopefully want to try snag a decent deal  on Black Friday/Cyber Monday or at the latest a Christmas present. 

[WoodenMarker]

What case and fans are you currently using?

Make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

[Loveandpower]

13 hours ago, WoodenMarker said:

What case and fans are you currently using?

Make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

Not entirely sure on the case model as it is a iBUYPOWER branded case. Looks similar to a MicroATX case commonly used by NZXT in the 2012-2013 year. 

As far as the fans...I misspoke. I took two of the three off today and looked for a model # *couldn't find one). They are AZZA 120mm fans. Two of the fans are clear with blue RGB and one is just your basic black AZZA fan. 

[WoodenMarker]

7 hours ago, Loveandpower said:

Not entirely sure on the case model as it is a iBUYPOWER branded case. Looks similar to a MicroATX case commonly used by NZXT in the 2012-2013 year. 
As far as the fans...I misspoke. I took two of the three off today and looked for a model # *couldn't find one). They are AZZA 120mm fans. Two of the fans are clear with blue RGB and one is just your basic black AZZA fan. 

The fans probably aren't very good but they should be sufficient if the case uses mesh instead of solid panels in front of the fans. 

The 8320 stock cooler is rather loud so replacing the cooler will probably fix the noise issues. 

If you're not sure what the name of the case is, please post some photos of it so we might identify it or measure the distance between the socket and side panel to see how much clearance is available for a new cooler. 

Where are you shopping / located?

[Loveandpower]

 

5 hours ago, WoodenMarker said:

The fans probably aren't very good but they should be sufficient if the case uses mesh instead of solid panels in front of the fans. 

The 8320 stock cooler is rather loud so replacing the cooler will probably fix the noise issues. 

If you're not sure what the name of the case is, please post some photos of it so we might identify it or measure the distance between the socket and side panel to see how much clearance is available for a new cooler. 

Where are you shopping / located?

I will likely be purchasing from Newegg. What makes you think it is the cpu cooler going faulty? I've noticed after heavy resources are used the  entire motherboard is  fairly hot versus  just that central  area. 

 

Don't actually know if you can tell anything from this old picture. 

[Loveandpower]

Guess I should rephrase that somewhat now that I think about it. 

I would have no issue replacing the cpu cooler, case fans, and the gpu guess I just need to consider boosting my budget a little. If I was to say boost the budget from $200 to like $250-$275 do you guys think you could help me crunch some product suggestions? 

 

I assume the cooler is going to need paste applied to it as well which is something I have never personally done before but from watching multiple videos in the past of LTT doing it just more or less a small little dot. 

 

I was aiming to  purchasing something like maybe a 8GB video card. (RX 570/80 possibly?) From what I've read and been told in the past  AMD tends to run a little cooler than Intel products. 

But as far as case fans + cpu cooler pretty lost as far as  what to  get and what to look for when shopping. If I am going to need some kind of  paste a  recommendation on that would be nice too as I am pretty sure there are  several "kinds" of that. 

[WoodenMarker]

On 9/6/2019 at 4:01 AM, Loveandpower said:

I will likely be purchasing from Newegg. What makes you think it is the cpu cooler going faulty? I've noticed after heavy resources are used the  entire motherboard is  fairly hot versus  just that central  area. 

Don't actually know if you can tell anything from this old picture. 

Newegg ships internationally. Can you be more specific? Which country?

 

The cpu cooler doesn't need to be faulty for it to be noisy. The 8320 stock cooler loud even when working properly. 

Is it the same as this case here? https://www.amazon.com/iBuyPower-Gamer-Power-AM699-Desktop/dp/B009O7XGGA/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8#customerReviews

I'm having trouble finding the name of the case and the clearance available for the cooler. Can you measure the distance between the socket and side panel? Cryorig has a pretty cool printable tool for measuring: http://www.cryorig.com/depthchecker.php?fbclid=IwAR1XmKBCuLFZPf-O0RAV66b_Z9BvTUEDTg7OP_ZlhU3fN1hY_60ubmA13AM

On 9/6/2019 at 4:48 AM, Loveandpower said:

I assume the cooler is going to need paste applied to it as well which is something I have never personally done before but from watching multiple videos in the past of LTT doing it just more or less a small little dot. 

From what I've read and been told in the past  AMD tends to run a little cooler than Intel products. 

A dot of paste works fine and most coolers come with decent paste. 

AMD and Intel both have hotter and cooler running cpus. It's better to look at individual products instead of generalizing brands that feature large selections of different products. 

[Loveandpower]

14 hours ago, WoodenMarker said:

Newegg ships internationally. Can you be more specific? Which country?

 

The cpu cooler doesn't need to be faulty for it to be noisy. The 8320 stock cooler loud even when working properly. 

Is it the same as this case here? https://www.amazon.com/iBuyPower-Gamer-Power-AM699-Desktop/dp/B009O7XGGA/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8#customerReviews

I'm having trouble finding the name of the case and the clearance available for the cooler. Can you measure the distance between the socket and side panel? Cryorig has a pretty cool printable tool for measuring: http://www.cryorig.com/depthchecker.php?fbclid=IwAR1XmKBCuLFZPf-O0RAV66b_Z9BvTUEDTg7OP_ZlhU3fN1hY_60ubmA13AM

A dot of paste works fine and most coolers come with decent paste. 

AMD and Intel both have hotter and cooler running cpus. It's better to look at individual products instead of generalizing brands that feature large selections of different products. 

 

That is indeed the case!  Do not have a ruler currently will stop by the store tonight and pick up one. Considering the side panel will have case fans as well do you need measurements took away for those fans as well? Would had been awesome if I could get a NH cooler in there but with it being a mATX board I somehow doubt it will work. 

 

 

[WoodenMarker]

8 hours ago, Loveandpower said:

That is indeed the case!  Do not have a ruler currently will stop by the store tonight and pick up one. Considering the side panel will have case fans as well do you need measurements took away for those fans as well? Would had been awesome if I could get a NH cooler in there but with it being a mATX board I somehow doubt it will work. 

The side panel fans look like 120mm's but you can measure to be sure. That being said, they might be removed to make way for a taller cooler. 

You can measure the length of the fan or the screw hole distance to find out the fan size. https://www.quietpc.com/support#question27

The motherboard size isn't really an issue. The location of the ram slots, ram height, socket, and cooler clearance available in the case are what determines if a cooler fits. 

[Loveandpower]

On 9/9/2019 at 1:55 AM, WoodenMarker said:

The side panel fans look like 120mm's but you can measure to be sure. That being said, they might be removed to make way for a taller cooler. 

You can measure the length of the fan or the screw hole distance to find out the fan size. https://www.quietpc.com/support#question27

The motherboard size isn't really an issue. The location of the ram slots, ram height, socket, and cooler clearance available in the case are what determines if a cooler fits. 

yes they are 120mm fans 

So I measured  the distance as instructed on that site from the cpu to the side panel today. It appears to be about 6.5 inches in total. Probably wouldn't be very comfortable trying to fit anything too close to that into the case. (Maybe stop at 6 or 6.2 inches) The grooves  go slightly  on the  inside and so  don't want it to be directly  touching the  case  side. 

[WoodenMarker]

58 minutes ago, Loveandpower said:

yes they are 120mm fans 
So I measured  the distance as instructed on that site from the cpu to the side panel today. It appears to be about 6.5 inches in total. Probably wouldn't be very comfortable trying to fit anything too close to that into the case. (Maybe stop at 6 or 6.2 inches) The grooves  go slightly  on the  inside and so  don't want it to be directly  touching the  case  side. 

Alright, let's go with 6.2in or 152mm to be safe. 

Which country are you shopping from?

[Loveandpower]

8 hours ago, WoodenMarker said:

Alright, let's go with 6.2in or 152mm to be safe. 

Which country are you shopping from?

USA, east coast to be more exact. I mainly shop at Newegg but not against  Wal-Mart(if Wal-Mart retail item)  , BestBuy, PCMall etc.  Anything besides used parts, craigslist that sort thing, or ebay/amazon really. 

[SImoHayha]

I say get a CPU cooler off of amazon, there is one for 35$ which is the Hyper 212 EVO which is a great budget CPU cooler https://www.amazon.com/Cooler-Master-Hyper-Direct-Contact/dp/B005O65JXI 



GPU you can probably purchase second hand and used some of those GTX cards and AMD cards are dirt cheap on ebay you can easy get a RX 560 for 80$ or 60$ depending on how the biddings go and what deals are currently going on. 

https://www.ebay.com/b/AMD-Radeon-RX-560-Computer-Graphics-Cards/27386/bn_110678901

I think maybe you might also need another PSU unit, it sounds odd that you're system gets unstable once a GPU gets added to it, might be a weak PSU. I wouldn't want to purchase a 2nd hand PSU unless its on this list of PSU's 

https://www.gamingscan.com/psu-hierarchy/

 

[Loveandpower]

@Ramamataz

 

 

This is the PSU I have. I purchased it new from Newegg back in early 2017. 

https://www.newegg.com/seasonic-s12ii-series-s12ii-620-bronze-620w/p/N82E16817151096?Item=N82E16817151096

Is there anyway I could test to see if it is my PSU. My PSU may still be under the warranty I purchased with it so if I need to RMA it would be good to know for definite. 

Edit: from looking at the specs on that site you posted it appears to be a Tier 4 which ( I assume) is decent. 

[WoodenMarker]

10 hours ago, Loveandpower said:

USA, east coast to be more exact. I mainly shop at Newegg but not against  Wal-Mart(if Wal-Mart retail item)  , BestBuy, PCMall etc.  Anything besides used parts, craigslist that sort thing, or ebay/amazon really. 

The Choten is a good option that would also better cool the motherboard components. https://pcpartpicker.com/product/Nkvbt6/scythe-choten-tuf-gaming-alliance-5117-cfm-cpu-cooler-scct-1000tuf

If you have more to spend, the DRTF is more expensive but is an excellent cooler if you're looking into oc'ing a more power hungry cpu in the future: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/Y27CmG/be-quiet-cpu-cooler-bk020

If you'd prefer to save money to get a better graphics card, the Iori is a decent alternative: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Scythe-SCIOR-1000-IORI-Intel-AMD-Universal-Processor-Cooling-Unit-Heatsink-Fan/47313075

3 hours ago, Loveandpower said:

Is there anyway I could test to see if it is my PSU. My PSU may still be under the warranty I purchased with it so if I need to RMA it would be good to know for definite. 

Hard to tell for sure without using the psu with a different system or testing with another known working psu and trying to recreate the issue. 

[Loveandpower]

@WoodenMarker

What are the  dimensions  for that first Scythe Choten? Not the best at conversions but that's under  6 inches right? That would seem like an ideal one for sure. 

 

Can you suggest some case fans for me as well please? I will likely be replacing my current stock ones as I still personally feel they aren't totally  operating as they should or at least  1 of them isn't. Will likely purchase 3-5 fans depending on the cooler unit I get. 

And I want to thank all of you for helping so far I am  probably  going to  be  buying   in the next couple of days as well  considering the  graphics card  I've been eyeballing just went on sale. 

[WoodenMarker]

5 hours ago, Loveandpower said:

What are the  dimensions  for that first Scythe Choten? Not the best at conversions but that's under  6 inches right? That would seem like an ideal one for sure.

Can you suggest some case fans for me as well please? I will likely be replacing my current stock ones as I still personally feel they aren't totally  operating as they should or at least  1 of them isn't. Will likely purchase 3-5 fans depending on the cooler unit I get. 

They're all well under 6in / 152mm. I wouldn't recommend them otherwise. 

The tallest of the 3 is the DRTF which is 131mm tall. 

What makes you think the case fans aren't operating well?

3-5 case fans is a bit excessive especially when the money can be spent on a better graphics card instead.

[Loveandpower]

They are the stock Azza 120mm fans. 

 

One of the fans I know has a crack in it and when you spin it it only spins for a seconds. I've observed how it operates and it doesn't seem to spin that fast ( no matter of location or if I control it manually via software) 

One of the other fans while it performs almost average it does seem to have times where it doesn't spin as it should under heavy load almost like a stutter if you will. 

The other case fan seems to be operating fine.  

[WoodenMarker]

8 minutes ago, Loveandpower said:

They are the stock Azza 120mm fans. 

One of the fans I know has a crack in it and when you spin it it only spins for a seconds. I've observed how it operates and it doesn't seem to spin that fast ( no matter of location or if I control it manually via software) 
One of the other fans while it performs almost average it does seem to have times where it doesn't spin as it should under heavy load almost like a stutter if you will. 
The other case fan seems to be operating fine.  

Have you tried tweaking the fan settings? Does raising the fan speed to 100% make them spin? If so, find the setting it takes for them to start up and set that as the minimum fan speed. If the speed is set too low, the fan might not get enough power to spin up. 

2-3 case fans should be plenty for cooling. I'd use the rear exhaust and side panel mounts as intake. 

 

Make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

[Loveandpower]

@WoodenMarker

 

Currently the two good fans are intake ( pushing air  in to cool) 

the bad fan has been  the exhaust. I have  exhaust  in the  front  panel as with a poor cpu cooler I needed the extra flow in the back. With me getting a larger cpu cooler here are my thoughts 

1)  Exhaust  in the back 

2) Intake  on the side (if room after cpu cooler)

3) Intake fan/fans  from top of case 

4) Intake on front panel

 

I have attempted to set the minimum already to 100% and that did not resolve the issue. 

[WoodenMarker]

4 minutes ago, Loveandpower said:

Currently the two good fans are intake ( pushing air  in to cool) 
the bad fan has been  the exhaust. I have  exhaust  in the  front  panel as with a poor cpu cooler I needed the extra flow in the back. With me getting a larger cpu cooler here are my thoughts 
1)  Exhaust  in the back 

2) Intake  on the side (if room after cpu cooler)

3) Intake fan/fans  from top of case 

4) Intake on front panel

I have attempted to set the minimum already to 100% and that did not resolve the issue. 

The front panel fans are mainly for cooling drives which generally don't require much active airflow. The more effective fans for cooling the cpu and graphics card are the rear and side panel fans. 

The top of the case should be exhaust if you want to use fans there. Downdraft coolers exhaust air out the sides and take in air from above the cooler. 

Try using the good fans for side panel intake / rear exhaust and either remove the bad ones or use them for top exhaust. 

[Loveandpower]

@WoodenMarker

 

Apologies for the second tag I forgot to mention something earlier. I can't remember if it was you or the other community member who mentioned it but you  had mentioned something about a power supply possibly being faulty. The reason I don't (personally) believe it is the power supply is because the graphics card ( AMD Radeon 7850) you can plug it in and it will recognize the  basic Microsoft display adapter driver but if you try to  update the driver at all it just starts crashing the computer/restarting it constantly. 
 

I installed the graphics card with just the basic Microsoft display adapter driver with windows 10  and took a look at  dxdiag. It was saying even in there like  code 18 or code 43 or something  I forget exact code. It said something about the  7800 series card wasn't working right and needed to reinstall the driver. Under DXDIAG it didn't even show  it as the  7800 series but as ATOMBIOS with 8.123mb of  video memory  (which is of course incorrect a 7850 has  2gb) 

 

I've even gone as far as to watch how LTT put thermal compound on their gpu and  gave my gpu a good cleaning with new compound added etc and it still gave same issue which leads me to believe it is the card is bad entirely. 

[WoodenMarker]

1 minute ago, Loveandpower said:

leads me to believe it is the card is bad entirely. 

Sounds about right. 

It wasn't me who mentioned it btw. You're referring to @Ramamataz who replied earlier in this thread.