(UPDATED - Claim has been removed) The Linux Gamer's response video to LTT got claimed by Fullscreen

[SansVarnic]

37 minutes ago, Randy R said:

I have mixed feelings over floatplane, but I do like the way they are developing it, hopefully it won't have this crazy content match scheme that prevents people who are new from creating videos.

Floatplane was not and is not designed to contend with YT. It was devised and is being designed with the idea to replace what was lost with Vessel.

I fail to understand how people continue to miss this. Linus has been saying this since day one of the launch.

[HibernatingPlank]

yeah it wasn't anything to do LMG or LTT, all fullscreen

[zdemigod]

I just hope this ends as fast as possible, I really prefer Linus way of just focusing on what he does and resolving things in private. Too much online outrage these days. I have lost sense of importance since now everything is terrible, outrageous, disastrous, shouldn't be allowed nor permitted. 

[The Benjamins]

5 hours ago, VegetableStu said:

I don't think I hear them repeating this recently ._. so if all the new users hear of floatplane and hasn't watched any older video that mentions it...

 

also like people needs to be subscribed to floatplane and manually added to the secret subforum to see the subtitle, lol ._.

floatplane is no longer tied to the forums, and it is all runned on its own site, buy its own comapny. 

https://www.floatplane.com

 

The videos are only embedded on the forums now.

[The Benjamins]

1 hour ago, VegetableStu said:

that i know of, but is the subscriber community/board still here? o_o or it's youtube-style commenting?

it has YouTube style commenting, but I don't think users get notified on replies.

 

LTT video discussion is usually better on the forums anyways.

[Rohith_Kumar_Sp]

12 hours ago, VegetableStu said:

explain?

 

[Mauker]

On 2/15/2019 at 10:29 AM, rcmaehl said:

It is a Multi Channel Network or MCN. Here's a brief summary of what they do by The Game Theorists. They used to do a TON more and were REQUIRED if you wanted to make money. Now-a-days they're not and can be up to shady stuff.
 

 

I am shocked by this video. I don't have words to describe how angry it made me feel. This wasn't simply a misunderstanding, it is just criminal.

[forgotusername]

On 2/15/2019 at 12:02 PM, LinusTech said:

We have noticed a significant uptick in copyright claims in the last couple of weeks, though, with some of them being in really really old content which suggests youtube has made some kind of change to ContentID and we've been trying to figure out how to address it.

Here is an idea: Does YouTube allow you to OPT OUT of Content ID? If not, can you choose to "do nothing and just notify you" by DEFAULT when Content ID detects something?

[KWelz]

36 minutes ago, forgotusername said:

Here is an idea: Does YouTube allow you to OPT OUT of Content ID? If not, can you choose to "do nothing and just notify you" by DEFAULT when Content ID detects something?

Why would a content creator do this?  They need to protect their IP and branding.  

 

[Talldata]

41 minutes ago, forgotusername said:

Here is an idea: Does YouTube allow you to OPT OUT of Content ID? If not, can you choose to "do nothing and just notify you" by DEFAULT when Content ID detects something?

 

4 minutes ago, KWelz said:

Why would a content creator do this?  They need to protect their IP and branding.  

 

Not having Monetisacion on at all would be the only way to do that.

[SpaceGhostC2C]

6 minutes ago, KWelz said:

Why would a content creator do this?  They need to protect their IP and branding.  

 

Opting out completely would probably be a bad idea, but not having automatic claims on automatically flagged content could work just fine. It all boils down to (a) how sensitive is the algorithm (that is, how many false positives it generates, and how many true positives slip by), (b) how manageable it is for copyright owners to manually review flagged videos, and (c) how manageable is to flagged youtubers to appeal the claim.

If the algorithm errs on the side of false negatives, and it's easy for false positives to contest the claims, it may be best to leave it all in auto. On the other hand, if the algorithm is overzealous and it's hard for false positives to contest the claims, full automation could quickly become a channel killer (not in the 3 strikes sense, but in the starve sense ). At the same time, whether manual review is feasible depends on the difficulty for copyright holders to review flags manually (time needed per video times how many videos are flagged).

You may think that the copyright holder wouldn't internalize the cost of abundant false positives, however hard they may be on the victims, but it could also be damaging to their brand if, let say, contentID starts flagging anything with a computer in it as LMG's (or anyone else's for that matter).

 

Judging by the information provided by Linus, The Linux Gamer, and others, the current situation in terms of those 3 axes seems to be: (a) the algorithm has become more prone to false positives, (b) contesting claims is rather easy and quick although it may also be hard and slow depending on who you ask (?), (c) uncertain, but the (suspected) changes in the algorithm may increase the burden of manually reviewing flagged videos. I don't know enough to tell what's the current false positive rate, nor whether a relatively big channel gets 2 flags a month or 200 a day.

 

Finally, whatever you do with flagged videos you still need, or may want, to address copyright violations not captured by the algorithm. 

Ideally, you don't want to waste man hours checking pure re-uploads, nor auto-claim videos with high probability of falling into fair use, but again that would require the bot to accurately make those distinctions for you.

[Yuxxian]

And of course the people raising all hell before fully knowing the situation are clamming up shut now...

[EauRougeFlatOut]

On 2/15/2019 at 12:02 PM, LinusTech said:

This is an excellent explanation of how these things work. 

 

I'd like to add that as long as the creator who gets the automated claim disputes it in a timely manner, there is no lost revenue during the period while it was "claimed". 

 

I've been down at IBM Think for the last couple of days and this thread is the first I'm hearing of this issue.. Aaaand it's already resolved. 

 

So, as far as I can tell, everything is working as it should...ish

 

We have noticed a significant uptick in copyright claims in the last couple of weeks, though, with some of them being in really really old content which suggests youtube has made some kind of change to ContentID and we've been trying to figure out how to address it.

 

We are generally pretty supportive of the creation of derivative works by our community and we want to make sure that they aren't being algorithmically claimed, but this change has caused other issues for us too. I woke up the other morning to a handful of claims made against Tech Quickie by LTT... Can't have that. 

 

I'm sure this will be resolved, but it's probably going to take some time for youtube to get their crap in order, as usual. 

I have to commend Linus for how he handles these things, and I agree with what was said in the video.

 

I also have to add a personal admission/apology to Linus for my own past behavior on the forum. I very harshly criticized LTT for running this video a year and a half ago, a criticism to which Linus responded directly in a very similar drama-response-webcam-address. And while I stand by my negative opinion of the video itself, and from a channel quality standpoint I wish LTT never uploaded it, I jumped to conclusions and roasted Linus with totally conjectory statements - even while respecting Linus enormously for how far he went as a person since I started watching, for how far he's taken LTT with the talent he's brought on along the way, and for the many instances he demonstrated personal integrity that I admire. I was too willing to see LTT as a big machine that had essentially taken on a mind of its own and was no longer a direct extension of Linus's ideal content creation platform. I had no basis for reaching that conclusion except that LTT had grown and its content had changed accordingly. I should have either communicated with Linus directly or have shut up.

 

I was wrong to have said what I said, and I regretted it as soon as Linus read my comment in his video response. As time has gone on I've become more and more careful to moderate my initial reaction to new information before running off with my own (or others') flawed assumptions, to give the benefit of the doubt, and to talk to people directly before making judgments in drama-laden situations like this. It makes life better and easier for everyone.

[ross06187]

this is not drama.  This is just YouTube  administration (unless someones Chanel got nuked i do not care)  Love you @LinusTech but pleas don't beat a dead horse its not befitting, that I felt was  unnecessary and more drama to me and pitch forks of the internet than some random claims.

[Thermy]

Personally, I'm not a fan of reaction videos. Maybe it's just me, but I don't find them to be very entertaining at all, and only sometimes can be marginally informative. In fact, more often than not, I've found them to be more indicative of the creator's lack of inspiration or originality when it comes to content creation in general.

 

To me, they are just a cheap method for somebody to put "something" on their channel, just to have something "new" on it, because they can't think of anything else to do at the moment, or aren't close to completing better content (reaction content is one of the easiest things to do.)

[Emily Young]

1 hour ago, ross06187 said:

this is not drama.  This is just YouTube  administration (unless someones Chanel got nuked i do not care)  Love you @LinusTech but pleas don't beat a dead horse its not befitting, that I felt was  unnecessary and more drama to me and pitch forks of the internet than some random claims.

I think in this case, there's a lot of people conflating automated Content ID matches with manual claims or DMCA takedowns, particularly when using language like "slander". While it's not worth arguing with the folks carrying the pitchforks, it is worth preventing more pitchforks from popping up by making the truth known.

 

Now, is Linus right to start pointing at things like EU law? Maybe, maybe not. It's a theory, one that seems to coincide with the increase in false ID matches. But is it YouTube or is it Fullscreen? Something must have tweaked to make it more sensitive, but YouTube doesn't really tell anyone anything when they tweak things like that, and as Linus mentioned on WAN show, our relationship with Fullscreen is... Very hands-off. It seems some calls will need to be made.

 

With all that said, I don't think the answer to this drama is to start pointing fingers at each other and screaming from the rooftops that so and so is being unfair, be that creators who have been affected or us getting the heat for it. It should be clear at this point that it wasn't an intentional change on our part, nor were the reports that claims were being made fake or malicious. To be clear, things could have been handled far better and I think everyone has a right to be upset about it, but I think the way to move forward is to accept that and get to the bottom of what happened and how to prevent it from continuing.

 

EDIT: Well, I think there's one that's becoming malicious, but that could just be drama milking. Don't hate the player, etc etc.

[Talldata]

14 minutes ago, GabenJr said:

I think in this case, there's a lot of people conflating automated Content ID matches with manual claims or DMCA takedowns, particularly when using language like "slander". While it's not worth arguing with the folks carrying the pitchforks, it is worth preventing more pitchforks from popping up by making the truth known.

 

Now, is Linus right to start pointing at things like EU law? Maybe, maybe not. It's a theory, one that seems to coincide with the increase in false ID matches. But is it YouTube or is it Fullscreen? Something must have tweaked to make it more sensitive, but YouTube doesn't really tell anyone anything when they tweak things like that, and as Linus mentioned on WAN show, our relationship with Fullscreen is... Very hands-off. It seems some calls will need to be made.

 

With all that said, I don't think the answer to this drama is to start pointing fingers at each other and screaming from the rooftops that so and so is being unfair, be that creators who have been affected or us getting the heat for it. It should be clear at this point that it wasn't an intentional change on our part, nor were the reports that claims were being made fake or malicious. To be clear, things could have been handled far better and I think everyone has a right to be upset about it, but I think the way to move forward is to accept that and get to the bottom of what happened and how to prevent it from continuing.

Makes sense.

[Anambot]

Just looked at Carey's live stream and the chats are still going on about it, and many defending still that Linus should apologize. Is soooooo drama.. Yes misinformation is big in this drama.

On second comment, what is up-tube dot com, is it a copy of youtube? because it runs all the LTT videos.

[FezBoy]

Tbh tho, how would they fix this?  If they got rid of the content ID system, they would be opening themselves up to all kinds of lawsuits and crap, and it would be near impossible to make an AI that can discern between a violation and fair use.

 

The only way I could think of is to employ an enormous team of manual checkers, like Facebook's, as described in this episode of Radiolab.  Even this, in my opinion, wouldn't work very well.  Facebook's system is for checking if a post breaks their ToS (ie. nudes, graphic violence), which is a fairly simple, fast decision for somebody to make.  Copyright on YT, on the other hand, would require the checker to watch a lot of the video, critical thinking for edge cases, and would need the checkers to be well educated on what's a violation and what's not.

 

I highly recommend that you listen to the Radiolab episode, it is really interesting and informative: https://www.wnycstudios.org/story/post-no-evil

[IdortMasterRace]

Go to 16:52. He gets a prank call, he immediately hangs up and says "well, it seems we've got some fans of Linus", and then goes on to say "if you are on that side of the argument, then you are with those people who are doing that". He seriously needs help, this isn't normal.

[leadeater]

5 hours ago, GabenJr said:

I think in this case, there's a lot of people conflating automated Content ID matches with manual claims or DMCA takedowns, particularly when using language like "slander". While it's not worth arguing with the folks carrying the pitchforks, it is worth preventing more pitchforks from popping up by making the truth known.

I blame the timing of all this, as in a blame Vox and The Verge. This would have been a non event a week or so ago, people are jumping to this assumption due to the recent case in which a copyright strike was issued to take down videos. I honestly believe that is the only reason people are pitchforking right now, because they don't understand the Youtube copyright systems and they have a recent event to draw from and assuming it's the same situation.

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

4 hours ago, leadeater said:

This would have been a non event a week or so ago, people are jumping to this assumption due to the recent case in which a copyright strike was issued to take down videos. 

i honestly did not know about that. i only posted this topic because i thought the claim thing with The Linux Gamer was unfair and it needed to be resolved...

[leadeater]

1 hour ago, firelighter487 said:

i honestly did not know about that. i only posted this topic because i thought the claim thing with The Linux Gamer was unfair and it needed to be resolved...

I was mostly referring to the waves of people pitchforking online, in youtube comments, twitter, youtube response videos etc.

[Rohith_Kumar_Sp]

7 hours ago, VegetableStu said:

while i go watch this, have you considered the other side of the story?

What I posted is the other side is the story. 

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

2 hours ago, leadeater said:

I was mostly referring to the waves of people pitchforking online, in youtube comments, twitter, youtube response videos etc.

oh that makes sense. whenever something happens people automatically grab pitchforks before reading past the headline...