Windows 7 Hold out - Have to go Windows 10... Which version?

[Anomnomnomaly]

So I'm one of those W7 Pro holdouts, it's a great OS and I love it... Had to resort to all sorts of trickery to stop the forced W10 update a few years ago.

 

But building a new rig and I'm gonna have to go W10 if I want to make the most of the new gen CPU's... I don't like it, I hate the insidious data collection, I am not a product to be invaded and sold for some one else's profit. I don't do facebook/twitter/ig/ or any unencrypted and insecure messaging apps, I limit what data google can get (duckduckgo FTW)... and I've been watching so many tutorials on how to limit what W10 can harvest.

 

But which version should i get?

 

I'll be gaming and doing a little work on it (some rendering, photoshop... well gimping really.  and some architectural design software).. Watching movies and so forth too. Gaming will be in 1440p.

 

I can get a license through my work and would prefer to get Pro rather than home... is it worth it, can I still set 'home' to a metered connection to stop it downloading updates whenever it wants to? The pro version is gonna cost me more... but way cheaper than the £200 MS want... even the Home variant is peanuts compared to the £119 MS want.

 

I really hate having to install it...it makes my skin crawl. But W7 is EOL next Jan and I'll need 10 for gaming, and unless I dual boot with a linux distro and learn how to use it properly... I can't really see a choice.

 

I've already got my flash drive ready to install... I just need to let work know which license I want by tomorrow or I have to wait until Weds... and as parts finish arriving tomorrow, I want to build and install over my 3 days off. 

 

 

 

 

[kelvinhall05]

Just get home, I'd only get pro if you benefit from one of the few features it as over home, or if you can get it for the same price or cheaper than home.

[Enderman]

You should definitely NOT stop it from downloading updates, regardless of what version you get.

[Anomnomnomaly]

Just now, kelvinhall05 said:

Just get home, I'd only get pro if you benefit from one of the few features it as over home, or if you can get it for the same price or cheaper than home.

Basically, I can get Pro for £50 and home for £35 through a scheme my work does.. because I use my home rig for the odd work related tasks.... Considering MS want £119 and £219 in the UK... I can easily get pro and still save over have of what home costs.

 

I may not need 'ALL' of the extra features, but I'd probably need a few of them... I was certainly grateful for some of the extras in W7 Pro as I run a home network, as well as manage all of my families systems (my sister has a small business). So given a choice, I'd go pro everytime.

[kelvinhall05]

4 minutes ago, Anomnomnomaly said:

Basically, I can get Pro for £50 and home for £35 through a scheme my work does.. because I use my home rig for the odd work related tasks.... Considering MS want £119 and £219 in the UK... I can easily get pro and still save over have of what home costs.

 

I may not need 'ALL' of the extra features, but I'd probably need a few of them... I was certainly grateful for some of the extras in W7 Pro as I run a home network, as well as manage all of my families systems (my sister has a small business). So given a choice, I'd go pro everytime.

Then go pro.

[Anomnomnomaly]

1 minute ago, Enderman said:

You should definitely NOT stop it from downloading updates, regardless of what version you get.

It's not a question of stopping it from updating... but more about having control over 'when it updates'. I cannot allow any of my systems to decide to reboot and update without my express consent... Interrupting tasks that may be running can cost me a lot of time and money.

 

I'd much rather be able to have it update at shut down for example... I make sure I keep my systems up to date with security. But I help out friends who hate that it constantly updates when it feels like it, and resets all of their settings to revert to insidious data harvesting and/or installs software they don't want without permission. This is why I hate it, 50% of the people I know had it forced upon them without consent via upgrade and the other 50% wish they'd never agreed to it... and 100% wish they'd never got it at all. 

 

It's weird that MS converted me from getting their OS's from alternative sources into a paying customer with Vista and W7... and now seem intent on driving people back into considering alternatives.

 

Anyway.. rant over... cheers for everyone's advice. 

[Enderman]

4 minutes ago, Anomnomnomaly said:

It's not a question of stopping it from updating... but more about having control over 'when it updates'. I cannot allow any of my systems to decide to reboot and update without my express consent... Interrupting tasks that may be running can cost me a lot of time and money.

 

I'd much rather be able to have it update at shut down for example... I make sure I keep my systems up to date with security. But I help out friends who hate that it constantly updates when it feels like it, and resets all of their settings to revert to insidious data harvesting and/or installs software they don't want without permission. This is why I hate it, 50% of the people I know had it forced upon them without consent via upgrade and the other 50% wish they'd never agreed to it... and 100% wish they'd never got it at all. 

 

It's weird that MS converted me from getting their OS's from alternative sources into a paying customer with Vista and W7... and now seem intent on driving people back into considering alternatives.

 

Anyway.. rant over... cheers for everyone's advice. 

You can set active hours when the computer won't restart for updates, and it also alerts you when it needs to restart for updates so that you can choose a date and time to do it in like one or two weeks.

 

None of this requires Pro.

 

It also doesn't revert settings or install software.

[GoodBytes]

5 minutes ago, Anomnomnomaly said:

So I'm one of those W7 Pro holdouts, it's a great OS and I love it... Had to resort to all sorts of trickery to stop the forced W10 update a few years ago.
But building a new rig and I'm gonna have to go W10 if I want to make the most of the new gen CPU's... I don't like it,

You can install Windows 7 but you won't have any updates.

 

5 minutes ago, Anomnomnomaly said:

I hate the insidious data collection, I am not a product to be invaded and sold for some one else's profit. I don't do facebook/twitter/ig/ or any unencrypted and insecure messaging apps, I limit what data google can get (duckduckgo FTW)... and I've been watching so many tutorials on how to limit what W10 can harvest.

Simple,

 - Don't enable Cortana (disabled by default)

 - Don't use Edge, Stay with Firefox or anything else you want that doesn't connect to Google ecosystem

 - Disable "let app user advertising ID..."

 - Disable speech recognition (goes with Cortana)

 - Set to Basic Diagnostic data (this is what MS will collect: https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-10-feedback-diagnostics-and-privacy - In other words, but I'll let you read what it says for all the detail, but essentially: system specs (this is done to allow tracking of your hardware configuration with failure of Windows programs or updates so that Microsoft automated system can find relations and impose update blocks to limit user base from having issues, limiting damages, and of course, protect you from updates that cause issues until MS patches and can remove the block), OS features being used or not (this is to know where they should invest time and resources on and evaluate what feature that they drop to allow other ones to take place), and crash reports from OS updates and failing software)

 - Disable Activity History (this is to sync between devices one system activity to another, including Android phone such as what you were surfing on the PC or phone or other PC  and resume on either device)

 - Disable "Allow access to location on this device..." this is to disable "Find my device" feature (same feature as your smartphones)

 - Disable "suggestions" notifications feature

 - Don't link your account with a Microsoft account (this does not restrict you from using the Store to get free apps from there (ex: Spotify, Netflix, iTunes, paint.net, WhatsApp, Fitbit, Pandora, Plex, Kodi, etc... )

 

If I didn't miss anything, that should be it. It is all accessible via the Settings panels in Windows 10.

I don't mind offering assistance, just PM me whenever you are ready.

Program you see online that "limits" W10, pretty much does nothing more that is normally accessible to you, and as they are now less and less being updated with changes in each version of Windows 10, some of the option may not work anymore, so it all give you illusion of privacy. Theater apps, I like to call them.

 

 

5 minutes ago, Anomnomnomaly said:

But which version should i get?

Up to you. Get the edition that best fits your needs.

 

 

5 minutes ago, Anomnomnomaly said:

I really hate having to install it...it makes my skin crawl. But W7 is EOL next Jan and I'll need 10 for gaming, and unless I dual boot with a linux distro and learn how to use it properly... I can't really see a choice.

If you want to learn Linux, then just fire-up Windows Subsystem for Linux, and from the Microsoft Store app, you can get a distro. Currently you have Ubuntu, OpenSUSE, SUSE Leap, Kali Linux, Debian and a few others, some paying other free). Once setup, you can run Linux apps and command lines natively on the system.

Alternatively, you can get the Pro edition of Windows 10, fire up Hyper-V, and you have a quick setup to setup the VM environment for you, download and install Ubuntu.

 

Just ideas, beside dual boot.

[Wh0_Am_1]

Do you care about VMs?

 

[Anomnomnomaly]

Just now, Wh0_Am_1 said:

Do you care about VMs?

 

I've never really bothered to have a play with them before... It's one of those things I've always wanted to try. 

[Bananasplit_00]

I'd run Linux with a Windows machine emulated in it that you can boot when you need it. Is just go for the home key probably

[Wh0_Am_1]

5 minutes ago, Anomnomnomaly said:

I've never really bothered to have a play with them before... It's one of those things I've always wanted to try. 

Ok, you need Pro to properly support VMs, also do you care about Bitlocker? (an encryption algorithm that makes it far more difficult for hackers to steal the data on your drives if someone rips it out of your computer, and yes I know that they just discovered a crack for it, but they are working on it) P.S. there is also a built in remote desktop feature in Windows 10.

[GoodBytes]

17 minutes ago, Anomnomnomaly said:

It's not a question of stopping it from updating... but more about having control over 'when it updates'. I cannot allow any of my systems to decide to reboot and update without my express consent... Interrupting tasks that may be running can cost me a lot of time and money.

It only happens to people that ignores updates on purpose.

Set Active Hours to ones that best your needs, as mentioned by Enderman, you can set throttling of internet connection, you can pause updates by 7 days (current on Pro, but it looks like Microsoft will allow Home users to enjoy this feature starting with the next release, but no official announcement yet. So if you really want to be sure that during a period you have no distractions, then enable this. Know that Tuesday of the second week of the month is update Tuesday, like normal and expected from Microsoft since ages, and you can show a Windows 7 style message when an update is ready and your system needs to restart so that you can delay it)

 

 

17 minutes ago, Anomnomnomaly said:

I'd much rather be able to have it update at shut down for example... I make sure I keep my systems up to date with security. But I help out friends who hate that it constantly updates when it feels like it, and resets all of their settings to revert to insidious data harvesting and/or installs software they don't want without permission. This is why I hate it, 50% of the people I know had it forced upon them without consent via upgrade and the other 50% wish they'd never agreed to it... and 100% wish they'd never got it at all. 

Settings don't get reverted normally. Your friend has an issue that needs to be looked into.

As for your stats, nobody wants to update anything. Working in IT, so many people purposefully disable Windows updates, "because their system works", despite being infected, and even one client got a valid (verified myself by calling the ISP), with a warning of being cut off service due to DDOS attack that their system was doing. And no the e-mail didn't provide any "service'. It was just an e-mail that his service will be terminated because of exclusion detected by their system that his system is doing Denial of service attacks, and a link to the ISP terms and condition. I had to deal with all with the ISP that after clearing his system.  This kind of behavior is one of the big reasons why Microsoft now forces updates. Microsoft is tired of getting blamed for their system being infected via security issues already fixed by them, can't execute updates to its OS malware scan to remove attacks, can't do anything as updates are disabled.

 

 

17 minutes ago, Anomnomnomaly said:

It's weird that MS converted me from getting their OS's from alternative sources into a paying customer with Vista and W7... and now seem intent on driving people back into considering alternatives.

 

Anyway.. rant over... cheers for everyone's advice. 

The reality of things is that the media had fun with click-bait article and fearmonger, and miss understanding of the privacy policy that has been rewritten in plain English. No lawyer needed (this clearly back fired on them). Granted now, you can't disable telemetry completely while before you could. I am not going to deny this. But it is more like stuff like: "Files put in OneDrive will be stored on Microsoft servers to offer you the cloud service, 'cause that is what it does, and to comply with efforts to stop virus spreading and child pornography your data will be scanned" gets translated in people minds to "OMG Microsoft has access to all my files on my system!".

 

If you don't want Microsoft access to your information, don't use Microsoft services. Simple as that.

Again, granted as mentioned, you can't disable telemetry data, and for some people here, the information collected is viewed by them as "private", or possibly private (crash reports may contain private information), and I agree with options. I don't think the few having telemetry disabled will change anything for Microsoft analysis of data. All I am saying, is that the reality of things is that is it's not as bad as some make it sound.

 

 

[GoodBytes]

14 minutes ago, Wh0_Am_1 said:

Ok, you need Pro to properly support VMs, also do you care about Bitlocker? (an encryption algorithm that makes it far more difficult for hackers to steal the data on your drives if someone rips it out of your computer, and yes I know that they just discovered a crack for it, but they are working on it) P.S. there is also a built in remote desktop feature in Windows 10.

Actually, you can use any edition of Windows. Pro only gives you Hyper-V, Microsoft VM environment. But you can get third party ones like VMWare and VirtualBox

[Wh0_Am_1]

2 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

Actually, you can use any edition of Windows. Pro only gives you Hyper-V, Microsoft VM environment. But you can get third party ones like VMWare and VirtualBox

Yeah that's true.

[Delicieuxz]

For control over Windows Update in Windows 10, you'll need Pro, Enterprise, or LTSC.

 

Also, to natively have the Group Policy editor available, you'll need one of those same versions. Because Home doesn't natively have the Group Policy editor, I wouldn't get it. Home is a toy OS.

 

To reduce data-harvesting levels, I would get Enterprise or LTSC, as they have an option for a much lower level of data-harvesting than Pro does.

 

LTSC is like Enterprise except it doesn't have any UWP programs like Cortana, Edge, and Microsoft Store. So, if you know that you don't want those things, then LTSC can be even better than Enterprise.

 

Both Enterprise and LTSC are available for cheap through eBay.

 

3 hours ago, GoodBytes said:

You can install Windows 7 but you won't have any updates.

A person can have WU working in Windows 7 with new CPUs if they want to. They just have to install this patch: https://github.com/zeffy/wufuc