Is a $250 "3080" even possible?

[Fasauceome]

Another day, another video covering the "leaks" from AMD hardware in my feed. I hadn't considered this before, but the prices are so sketch they don't even seem realistic, and neither does the power consumption. 150 watts for performance at the 1080 ti mark? $250 for 8GB of GDDR6 and a GPU that can handle that gaming performance? I feel like AMD would have to be burning money for this to be possible. I could be wrong, so if I am, what would have to be true for these leaked prices to be accurate?

[Fasauceome]

1 minute ago, OnyxArmos said:

I'll always stick with Nvidia, no matter what AMD comes out with

Well that's a rather stubborn approach. Personally I'd rather have whatever gives the best value, no point in sticking up for a soulless company.

[DVA]

Maybe they are breaking even do try to take over the market? If prices are accurate than it seems like a desperate move, but a good one at that. 

I can assure you, that even you have noticed the increasing amount of AMD builds and people suggesting AMD over Intel almost every time now. 

[Fasauceome]

Just now, DVA said:

Maybe they are breaking even do try to take over the market? If prices are accurate than it seems like a desperate move, but a good one at that. 

I can assure you, that even you have noticed the increasing amount of AMD builds and people suggesting AMD over Intel almost every time now. 

Every time profit margins of tech hardware are mentioned, it's always noted how slim they are. This isn't breaking even, this is definitely losing money. GDDR6 is the most expensive vram aside from HBM, so I really don't see AMD pulling this price point off.

[Azerafel]

I have difficulty believing it but it would be AMD that does it if anyone makes a gpu that is capable of that and costs that little in the next year or two.

[Fasauceome]

Just now, OnyxArmos said:

Nvidia graphics cards look sexy af tho bro

I love the Vega Frontier edition cooler style, but performance wise, blowers are bad compared to more fans, and when it comes to looks, AIBs use the same shrouds, so your average strix 1080 will look the same as your average strix Vega 64

[Azerafel]

Just now, OnyxArmos said:

Nvidia graphics cards look sexy af tho bro

Vega reference cards are an attractive look, albeit not insane performance or value.

[Fasauceome]

2 minutes ago, Azerafel said:

I have difficulty believing it but it would be AMD that does it if anyone makes a gpu that is capable of that and costs that little in the next year or two.

Keyword being "if"

[DVA]

1 minute ago, fasauceome said:

Every time profit margins of tech hardware are mentioned, it's always noted how slim they are. This isn't breaking even, this is definitely losing money. GDDR6 is the most expensive vram aside from HBM, so I really don't see AMD pulling this price point off.

Sometimes you gotta lose money to make money. Take the initial loss and then rake in the profit when you control most of the market. It wouldn't be as big as Nvidia, but I'm sure it'll make AMD happy enough to say they even control it. 

[Princess Luna]

[Tristerin]

3 minutes ago, DVA said:

Maybe they are breaking even do try to take over the market? If prices are accurate than it seems like a desperate move, but a good one at that. 

I can assure you, that even you have noticed the increasing amount of AMD builds and people suggesting AMD over Intel almost every time now. 

 

2 minutes ago, fasauceome said:

Every time profit margins of tech hardware are mentioned, it's always noted how slim they are. This isn't breaking even, this is definitely losing money. GDDR6 is the most expensive vram aside from HBM, so I really don't see AMD pulling this price point off.

My 2 cents:

 

They made a ton of money off Mining boom, which gave them expendable income for the first time in a long time.  The scare NVIDIA is having with stocks plummeting (not really a scare but it is if they took out a bunch of loans over the last 2 years).  If these prices are real, its in order to have Market Share.

 

My company did the same thing about 3 years ago.  We dropped our pricing on Titanium to the point where we were sometimes strapping hundred dollar bills on shipments in the customers favor.  We now are back into healthy margins and we have 30% more market share.  Long term.

[Kevin Fuller]

1 minute ago, DVA said:

Sometimes you gotta lose money to make money. Take the initial loss and then rake in the profit when you control most of the market. It wouldn't be as big as Nvidia, but I'm sure it'll make AMD happy enough to say they even control it. 

I mean RTX was a pretty big flop, so maybe AMD is taking the opportunity

[Zando_]

Just now, fasauceome said:

I love the Vega Frontier edition cooler style, but performance wise, blowers are bad compared to more fans, and when it comes to looks, AIBs use the same shrouds, so your average strix 1080 will look the same as your average strix Vega 64

Facts. Can also confirm the Vega FE blower cooler is damn sexy and performs quite well *if* you don't mind ramping the fans up and having it be pretty darn noisy (I assume not a problem if you're a pro and you just up the fan speeds and leave it overnight to render, but my PC is in my room). I stuck a Heatkiller IV on mine tho, equally sexy and once I get my loop done it should run much cooler and quieter. 

[DVA]

Just now, Tristerin said:

 

My 2 cents:

 

They made a ton of money off Mining boom, which gave them expendable income for the first time in a long time.  The scare NVIDIA is having with stocks plummeting (not really a scare but it is if they took out a bunch of loans over the last 2 years).  If these prices are real, its in order to have Market Share.

 

My company did the same thing about 3 years ago.  We dropped our pricing on Titanium to the point where we were sometimes strapping hundred dollar bills on shipments in the customers favor.  We now are back into healthy margins and we have 30% more market share.  Long term.

Exactly what I was saying, if you have a larger portion of the market in the long-run than the short-term loss is totally worth it. Most companies, if not all, lose money before they really start to make larger profits. You also build loyal customers and get free advertising via word of mouth, which is the most effective out of all forms of advertising. 

[aisle9]

8 minutes ago, fasauceome said:

Another day, another video covering the "leaks" from AMD hardware in my feed. I hadn't considered this before, but the prices are so sketch they don't even seem realistic, and neither does the power consumption. 150 watts for performance at the 1080 ti mark? $250 for 8GB of GDDR6 and a GPU that can handle that gaming performance? I feel like AMD would have to be burning money for this to be possible. I could be wrong, so if I am, what would have to be true for these leaked prices to be accurate?

Where are you getting 1080 Ti from? The "leaks" I've seen on the RX 3080 peg it in the GTX 1080/2070 range. The TDP does seem a bit optimistic given the Vega 64 requirement for 260W, but Navi is a whole new die, and AMD may have solved a lot of its power draw woes with it.

 

The GDDR6 does seem unrealistic. I wonder if we're going to get a cut-down 4GB version, or an 8GB GDDR5/5X version at the lower price point, with the 8GB GDDR6 version being upclocked and priced significantly higher to compensate.

[Fasauceome]

Just now, aisle9 said:

Where are you getting 1080 Ti from? The "leaks" I've seen on the RX 3080 peg it in the GTX 1080/2070 range. The TDP does seem a bit optimistic given the Vega 64 requirement for 260W, but Navi is a whole new die, and AMD may have solved a lot of its power draw woes with it.

 

I just saw a vid that claims "Vega 64 + 15%" which is what really made me scoff at the price tag and power draw.

[Azerafel]

6 minutes ago, fasauceome said:

Keyword being "if"

Yeah.

The other thing to keep in mind is a lot of startups try to take over the market by losing money but grabbing lots of market "space" if you will with the idea that they'll make money later. Amazon is a good example, they only started making money in the past year or two iirc.

 

Dunno, these navi "leaks" seem too good to be true but /shrug

[Zando_]

3 minutes ago, Azerafel said:

Vega reference cards are an attractive look, albeit not insane performance or value.

In games, sure, only about equal with a 1080. In render applications it's a beast, especially in blender cycles, it'll beat a 1080 Ti by 20% or so. I picked up my Vega FE used for $405, so not a bad deal overall, and new Vega 64s are going for $400 and perform the same (just lose the option of signed drivers and 8GB of HBM2). 

2 minutes ago, OnyxArmos said:

 ... ? This ? 

 

Sorry bro but nah

Looks much better in person, though as per usual it's subjective. I personally love the minimalist styling and nice brushed aluminum finish (is actual aluminum too). 

[aisle9]

1 minute ago, fasauceome said:

I just saw a vid that claims "Vega 64 + 15%" which is what really made me scoff at the price tag and power draw.

There are sources I trust, and sources I don't. Any source that makes a claim like that well ahead of the product even being announced is one I don't trust.

 

That's really what it comes down to. We're getting preliminary leak figures, and those have been horribly inaccurate in the past. I hope AMD pulls it off, because I just bought a 4K Freesync monitor and I'd love to use it to its full potential, but I choose to remain skeptical until we see a few trustworthy YouTubers (looking at you, Tech YES City and Hardware Unboxed) do some testing of off-the-shelf retail samples.

[Mira Yurizaki]

Historical trends would point out that there is no time in history that a GPU in the midrange category managed to catch up to the top-end of the previous generation in one go. While I'm not ruling out the possibility that it could happen, I'm not holding my breath that it will.

 

EDIT: Well, I take the "no time" part back, since the GeForce4 Ti 4200 did match the GeForce3 500. But no time sense as far as I can tell.

 

10 minutes ago, Tristerin said:

They made a ton of money off Mining boom, which gave them expendable income for the first time in a long time.  The scare NVIDIA is having with stocks plummeting (not really a scare but it is if they took out a bunch of loans over the last 2 years).  If these prices are real, its in order to have Market Share.

My company did the same thing about 3 years ago.  We dropped our pricing on Titanium to the point where we were sometimes strapping hundred dollar bills on shipments in the customers favor.  We now are back into healthy margins and we have 30% more market share.  Long term.

The problem I see with this approach is people will be expecting it from then on. If AMD can't bring amaze-balls performance for cheap again, they'll lose whatever confidence the customer had in them overnight. Besides that, loss leaders need something else to bolster sales and recoup the lost revenue. AMD has almost nothing else on the consumer end they could charge, directly or indirectly, to make up for the loss in revenue.

[Shahnewaz]

Short answer: Why not.

A little less short: As a consumer you shouldn't be hoping for higher prices on future products. That's plain retarded. Hell, if they offered a 3080 for three fiddy I'd take it without complaining.

[nick name]

The only way I could imagine AMD getting prices that low would be incredible yields on their GPU dies.  And I am assuming their chiplet design would help with that, but who knows how much.  

 

Also, I can understand trying to gain market share, but when you're talking about consumer GPUs you're usually not expecting folks to be frequent purchasers.  By that I mean a customer will buy one and then not buy another for a few or five years.  If AMD is trying to change that behavior with lower prices then it might work out, but probably not in the way a company that sells materials/consumables would see.  

[17030644]

possible, but not likely

 

it just doesn't make any sense, AMD wants to compete with nvidia, not to give away money for no reason. They don't have to lower the price at all

[Azerafel]

5 minutes ago, Shahnewaz said:

Short answer: Why not.

A little less short: As a consumer you shouldn't be hoping for higher prices on future products. That's plain retarded. Hell, if they offered a 3080 for three fiddy I'd take it without complaining.

not a matter of hoping for higher or lower prices (I think we all would love to see these leaks turn out to be true), it's more a matter of whether this is even possible for AMD.

[nick name]

26 minutes ago, OnyxArmos said:

I'll always stick with Nvidia, no matter what AMD comes out with

This guy is also a reason why AMD might price so aggressively.