Signal App to Australia: You tried to ban cryptography? How cute! Good Luck with the ban!

[Brooksie359]

2 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

They've banned stuff in the past in hopes to stop criminals, with no effect on meaningful crime rates.

The measure seems more like them trying to make it easier to catch criminals rather than stop their activity. 

[Drak3]

45 minutes ago, Brooksie359 said:

The measure seems more like them trying to make it easier to catch criminals rather than stop their activity. 

Isn't the whole point of catching criminals to stop them?

 

Not that either will happen, all that will really happen is that law abiding citizens are being criminalized.

[bcredeur97]

5 hours ago, Turretgaming said:

thats about the same as the usa trying to regulate bitcoin. good luck cause we dont know who made bitcoin and who says they will listen and on top of that how can you enforce it on something that has no physical entity

although unknown satoshi guy made Bitcoin, it is open source, and is actively developed by people. He actually hasn't contributed to it in a very long time, just kinda disappeared as far as we know

Of course you or I could make changes, but it would have to be accepted by everyone. If someone proposed a change that affected improved privacy with no downsides, then most likely it would be implemented.

 

The US will go after the major exchanges and regulate them. but then people would probably just use P2P exchanges like Bisq, Paxful, etc

[yian88]

crypto-gate,  5G-gate  incoming

[Syntaxvgm]

3 hours ago, AluminiumTech said:

Bit extreme don't you think

well their anti encryption law that guarantees a 2 year minimum for individual developers that either dont help the government hide a back door or tell their employer that they were made to do it (even if they get fired for it) is a bit extreme but these retards did it. 

[AngryBeaver]

1 hour ago, Drak3 said:

Isn't the whole point of catching criminals to stop them?

 

Not that either will happen, all that will really happen is that law abiding citizens are being criminalized.

Well Australia did start out as a penal colony. Apparently they still feel it is lol.

 

I would hope that these idiots get voted out of office after this. If I was a major company I would pull my products from Australia and then put some money into a campaign to remove these people. Then again the political system in most countries is corrupt in one way or another. They all want to protect and maintain their power... so it might not even work. I think that if enough big players pulled out of the country though that changes would be made.

 

How is this going to work with people protected by the GDPR? Maybe trump will build a wall around Australia and make them pay for it.

[Thaldor]

But only Australian laws apply in Australia, not the laws of physics, logic or even the laws of mathematics. So, if Australian laws say that encryption must be decrypted the company can and must do it!

/s

[Dabombinable]

This is like their attempt at banning websites used often for piracy. An attempt that never affected those who had changed the DNS server they used.

[Fnige]

6 hours ago, asus killer said:

Recently i was hearing the us congress vs google, and there was some old guy complaining to google ceo about is apple phone, he had to answer apple was a differente company 

Both just as bad

[Trik'Stari]

10 hours ago, Turretgaming said:

thats about the same as the usa trying to regulate bitcoin. good luck cause we dont know who made bitcoin and who says they will listen and on top of that how can you enforce it on something that has no physical entity

They can make regulations concerning businesses and banks that accept bitcoin.

 

Which, potentially, could kill bitcoin or any other crypto currency.

[ZacoAttaco]

To be honest, I had to educate myself to understand why everyone was so upset about this. Now that I understand the consequences I agree that companies should force the hand of the government and essentially boycott Australia. I'm really surprised that there is no one with technical knowledge guiding the government's decision making. Baffling.

[Trixanity]

2 hours ago, ZacoAttaco said:

To be honest, I had to educate myself to understand why everyone was so upset about this. Now that I understand the consequences I agree that companies should force the hand of the government and essentially boycott Australia. I'm really surprised that there is no one with technical knowledge guiding the government's decision making. Baffling.

Because they don't listen to technical experts and quite frankly don't want to listen to them because it goes against their wishes. This is what you call a political decision. The act of moving forward with policy that experts disagree on. Sometimes even what the general population disagree on. You force it through because that's what you want or what your friends with money and power want.

[NeuesTestament]

16 hours ago, Brooksie359 said:

I mean even if they did try and sue unless they are somehow in Australia they could simply ignore it. 

It is not that easy. I would assume that Australia has treaties with the United States concerning the executions of judgments in that country. So they might be still able to get to them.

[mr moose]

3 hours ago, ZacoAttaco said:

I'm really surprised that there is no one with technical knowledge guiding the government's decision making. Baffling.

There is, contrary to what sells popular news articles on the web and all the rhetoric about politicians being "retarded" with technology, they have very good IT specialists who inform them of what they can and can't do with technology, they also know the repercussions of certain laws and how to craft laws to achieve the desired results.

[leadeater]

17 minutes ago, mr moose said:

There is, contrary to what sells popular news articles on the web and all the rhetoric about politicians being "retarded" with technology, they have very good IT specialists who inform them of what they can and can't do with technology, they also know the repercussions of certain laws and how to craft laws to achieve the desired results.

You mean politicians are for the post part figure heads and mostly just hold accountability for the portfolios they look after? That behind them are the people that actually do the work and tend to not change between elections.

 

I dislike a lot of politicians which makes me glad that they really don't actually do much of the actual policy drafting.

[mr moose]

3 minutes ago, leadeater said:

You mean politicians are for the post part figure heads and mostly just hold accountability for the portfolios they look after? That behind them are the people that actually do the work and tend to not change between elections.

 

I dislike a lot of politicians which makes me glad that they really don't actually do much of the actual policy drafting.

Yep, with the exception of Turnbull, who actually has a lot of experience in the tech industry.

[Jito463]

On 12/17/2018 at 9:03 AM, asus killer said:

Recently i was hearing the us congress vs google, and there was some old guy complaining to google ceo about is apple phone, he had to answer apple was a differente company 

After hearing Hank Johnson say he was afraid Guam would tip over from too many troops stationed there (without a trace of irony in his voice), I'd believe almost anything you said about them.

[mr moose]

4 hours ago, Jito463 said:

After hearing Hank Johnson say he was afraid Guam would tip over from too many troops stationed there (without a trace of irony in his voice), I'd believe almost anything you said about them.

I was pointed to that by someone here, It blew me away.  I have since found out that someone holding a council position has asked what the council intends to do about  bluewaffle.   We have had a few dumb comments in our parliament (one of our less intelligent ministers argued we should print more money to fund social services ),  I really hope it's just a scale thing and there aren't too many over there.

[vorticalbox]

On 12/17/2018 at 1:19 PM, BananaInSandals said:

Those old bureaucrat buffoons everywhere really need to get they heads out of their ass holes. They're still trying to view everything as one single entity. Their view of various products is no longer true against everything. In the past, yes, there were only a handful of telecommunication companies and you can regulate the hell out of them. But most of the stuff nowadays on the internet is dispersed with no clear center. You can't just pull out your willy and try to slap on everyone's face like the "good old days"... 

Well this is what happens when you have older politicians that have no idea how any of this works.

[Dabombinable]

3 minutes ago, vorticalbox said:

Well this is what happens when you have older politicians that have no idea how any of this works.

Politicians having no idea how technology works seems to be a global problem. And they have no real excuse either when I know of people in their 60's and 70's who can use computers right back from the age of punch cards, all the way through to Windows 10, without any issues at all.

[vorticalbox]

2 minutes ago, Dabombinable said:

Politicians having no idea how technology works seems to be a global problem. And they have no real excuse either when I know of people in their 60's and 70's who can use computers right back from the age of punch cards, all the way through to Windows 10, without any issues at all.

Using a computer is a lot lower bar than understand how fundamental parts of the internet works and what effects a change will have.

[Dabombinable]

4 minutes ago, vorticalbox said:

Using a computer is a lot lower bar than understand how fundamental parts of the internet works and what effects a change will have.

And a lot of older/long term politicians seem to have trouble with even that.

[MrCupHolder]

On 12/18/2018 at 5:45 PM, ZacoAttaco said:

To be honest, I had to educate myself to understand why everyone was so upset about this. Now that I understand the consequences I agree that companies should force the hand of the government and essentially boycott Australia. I'm really surprised that there is no one with technical knowledge guiding the government's decision making. Baffling.

One wonders how much you educated yourself. If you did it properly you'd have know that experts were brought in to advise the govt on this. Can't help that whilst those experts were speaking all the politicians put the fingers in their ears and just went la la la la until they stopped speaking.

On 12/18/2018 at 9:16 PM, mr moose said:

they also know the repercussions of certain laws and how to craft laws to achieve the desired results.

Trouble is as I understand it right now the law is so vague that no-one's too sure on exactly what it means.

 

One thing for sure is though that no-one will now trust IT products coming out of Australia to not have a back door in it and that will likely kill any export of IT products from Australia.

 

On 12/18/2018 at 6:12 AM, AngryBeaver said:

I would hope that these idiots get voted out of office after this. If I was a major company I would pull my products from Australia and then put some money into a campaign to remove these people. Then again the political system in most countries is corrupt in one way or another. They all want to protect and maintain their power... so it might not even work. I think that if enough big players pulled out of the country though that changes would be made.

 

How do you vote them out when a considerable number of both sides of parliament voted for it? You've got to have one or the other party running the Govt (Well you don't, but good luck trying to get the whole country to vote a minor party in).

I challenge you to find a politician with which you agree 100% on their view of all govt policies. If you can find one it's probably yourself.

 

I do agree with you however that if enough big players blocked their website to Austalians it would bring about change.

I don't think it would take too many either. 

Imagine if Cisco, Juniper, HP, Dell, Lenovo, IBM, ASUS, Microsoft all stopped sending hardware, and then if Google, Facebook and Microsoft all blocked access to their website from Australia?

I think that would be enough to get the Govt listening. I mean that's a good chunk of both PC Hardware and Network hardware companies right there and then several major online services. How long do you think it would take?

 

[AngryBeaver]

@MrCupHolder when I say vote them out i don't mean one side over the other. I mean vote in people who are younger and more educated on these matters.

 

There is literally no reason for them to need access to this information. In the states we have problems with convictions on the innocent due to what is used against them. People have been convicted for having a dream on killing someone... then many years later get released because new evidence proves it wasnt them all along. 

 

I mean what it two coworkers are joking around about hating their job and wishing the place burned down... then two weeks later some accident causes just that. Now they end up facing criminal charges for something they didnt do, but a random private conversation that the government intercepted gets them convicted.

 

My private life should be just that. The government has no business snooping in it. Now I risk my right being violated anytime my data passes through Australia. The bip corps need to put their foot down about this issue. If not I am sure more and more governments would love more access to our personal lives.

[DrMacintosh]

On 12/17/2018 at 5:05 AM, Turretgaming said:

how can you enforce it on something that has no physical entity

The IRS when they send you a collection letter