Why don't we have an updated list of "recommended builds for $XXX in the "builds" section?"

[corrado33]

It seems to me that threads in the "New Builds section" are very.... very repetitive. Why don't we just have a constantly updated "Best builds for $700 (gaming/workloads/both), best builds for $1000(gaming/workloads/both), best builds for $1500, etc" thread? I'm sure many users that often post in that forum would volunteer to keep it updated. 

[Jurrunio]

updating each list per day will be tedious, compared to say, the PSU list which is fine with a monthly update

[Cereal5]

I would be more than happy to do something like this, if it would be pinned by one of the mods. However, the amount of people that actually read pinned messages before posting (in particular the one about what information to give when making a post) is clearly too small, given how many people say "I want a PC that plays CSGO at 1080p" and nothing else. Also, specific part selection would vary from user to user. I like EVGA and Corsair PSUs, other people like Seasonic and Cooler Master. I like G.SKILL and Corsair RAM, other people don't care.

1 minute ago, Jurrunio said:

updating each list per day will be tedious, compared to say, the PSU list which is fine with a monthly update

And yeah, this too. Prices can change at any point, and another piece of hardware might be a better deal for essentially the same product. This is one of the reasons why I always recommend people only ask for help when they're ready to buy all at once.

[corrado33]

4 minutes ago, Jurrunio said:

updating each list per day will be tedious, compared to say, the PSU list which is fine with a monthly update

I mean... hardware doesn't change THAT often. Maybe every major release or new platform. But otherwise the suggestions generally remain the same unless there's a heavily publicized sale on a particularly popular product. 

[JammyCreedog]

Linus released a video to youtube to that effect today.

[corrado33]

2 minutes ago, Cereal5 said:

I would be more than happy to do something like this, if it would be pinned by one of the mods. However, the amount of people that actually read pinned messages before posting (in particular the one about what information to give when making a post) is clearly too small, given how many people say "I want a PC that plays CSGO at 1080p" and nothing else. Also, specific part selection would vary from user to user. I like EVGA and Corsair PSUs, other people like Seasonic and Cooler Master. I like G.SKILL and Corsair RAM, other people don't care.

And yeah, this too. Prices can change at any point, and another piece of hardware might be a better deal for essentially the same product. This is one of the reasons why I always recommend people only ask for help when they're ready to buy all at once.

 

Actually, something that someone COULD do is parse pc part picker for prices and write a little program that picks the best/cheapest equally performing PC and any particular time, accounting for brand preferences and other things. 

[RAM555789]

3 minutes ago, corrado33 said:

I mean... hardware doesn't change THAT often. Maybe every major release or new platform. But otherwise the suggestions generally remain the same unless there's a heavily publicized sale on a particularly popular product. 

Prices can jump around a lot which is the problem, its not the parts that change that are the issue. One day one GPU might give you better value, then the next day its out of stock and prices have shot back up.

 

[Enderman]

4 minutes ago, corrado33 said:

I mean... hardware doesn't change THAT often.

The prices do.

[corrado33]

1 minute ago, Enderman said:

The prices do.

But I mean, the performance of parts doesn't change that often, so it wouldn't be hard to simply say "Buy a GTX 1060 or AMD's equivalent (I don't know AMD GPUS), whichever is cheaper."

[Enderman]

3 minutes ago, corrado33 said:

But I mean, the performance of parts doesn't change that often, so it wouldn't be hard to simply say "Buy a GTX 1060 or AMD's equivalent (I don't know AMD GPUS), whichever is cheaper."

It's not that simple.

Sometimes you don't want the cheapest card because of one issue or another.

Sometimes one GPU is available in one area and not another.

Sometimes there are sales that you need to go to a physical store for or mail in rebates that only apply to certain areas.

Some places have different taxes.

Some places have different currencies with fluctuating conversion.

Some places have very different pricing on different components.

 

[RAM555789]

It would also require too many pinned threads. One person might try gaming at 1080p at 60fps for $700, another might be trying to game at 1440p at 144fps for $2000, another person might be trying to game at 4k at 60fps for $1,750. There's many different situation to look at also with people wanting to record or stream.

[JammyCreedog]

Use case is the biggest wildcard I think for a thread like that.  Whats better for gaming is different from what would be better at CAD/Solidworks.  Some people really care about having a speedy ssd raid setup, while others are fine with mechanical only storage.

[Jurrunio]

1 hour ago, corrado33 said:

But I mean, the performance of parts doesn't change that often, so it wouldn't be hard to simply say "Buy a GTX 1060 or AMD's equivalent (I don't know AMD GPUS), whichever is cheaper."

even cards sharing the same GPU core can be vastly different. MSI 1080ti Gaming X, great card. 1080ti Armor, good watercooling conversion base and rubbish if used as is.

 

Also there's a problem of "how cheap an inferior product needs to be to be preferred over the premium version". 9700k for $20 more than the 8700k, of course the 9700k is better because you get good thermals out of the box, unlike 8700k which needs a delid to cool well. 9700k for $100 more? Hell no. And then there's graphics cards, Blower Vega 64, or basic 2 fan open cooler 1070ti for example, if they cost the same, then it's between "Freesync support" or "good cooler". Things just get more complex if the buyer has more use, since AMD enables more professional work feature than Nvidia on their consumer cards. 10 bit color for example, is completely impossible by Geforce cards but Radeons can do it sometimes (except in certain apps like Photoshop).

[corrado33]

1 minute ago, Jurrunio said:

even cards sharing the same GPU core can be vastly different. MSI 1080ti Gaming X, great card. 1080ti Armor, good watercooling conversion base and rubbish if used as is.

 

Also there's a problem of "how cheap an inferior product needs to be to be preferred over the premium version". 9700k for $20 more than the 8700k, of course the 9700k is better because you get good thermals out of the box, unlike 8700k which needs a delid to cool well. 9700k for $100 more? Hell no. And then there's graphics cards, Blower Vega 64, or basic 2 fan open cooler 1070ti for example, if they cost the same, then it's between "Freesync support" or "good cooler". Things just get more complex if the buyer has more use, since AMD enables more professional work feature than Nvidia on their consumer cards. 10 bit color for example, is completely impossible by Geforce cards but Radeons can do it sometimes (except in certain apps like Photoshop).

I suppose...

 

It's just that 90% of the builds in the forum are "8700k" Z370, 16 gigs 3000 MHz ram with 1070 or if they want to spend more it's Z390 w/ 9700k with 1080ti/rtx2080 or if you stream it's ryzen etc. It seems the answers are always the same.

[Jurrunio]

3 minutes ago, corrado33 said:

I suppose...

 

It's just that 90% of the builds in the forum are "8700k" Z370, 16 gigs 3000 MHz ram with 1070 or if they want to spend more it's Z390 w/ 9700k with 1080ti/rtx2080 or if you stream it's ryzen etc. It seems the answers are always the same.

Now you know it's far more thoughts behind the seemingly simple answers

[corrado33]

20 minutes ago, Jurrunio said:

Now you know it's far more thoughts behind the seemingly simple answers

I don't know, I think it's still pretty simple.

 

If you're buying new, there are really only maybe half a dozen decent choices of processors right now. Processors determine socket and therefore motherboard, of which we know don't really make a huge difference for 95% of us. Memory is memory. speed doesn't have a huge effect with intel, but it does with AMD. 16gb is recommended unless you're editing 8k video. Right now the gaming/workload&streaming line is split right down between intel and ryzen (intel for gaming, ryzen if you want to stream or have other multi core workloads). 

 

GPUs, while yes they can have slightly difference performance depending on manufacturer... but it's real slight and it's not going to absolutely kill a build if someone buys the "wrong" brand. I mean what, it may result in 2-3 fps difference between a good 1070 and a bad 1070? Again though, the process is simple. You said it yourself AMD offers more "workload" solutions, but can't compete with intel in the high end gaming market. The rest depends on resolution and refresh rate. 1080p 144 Hz or below? 1070 or better. Higher if you want to absolutely 100% guarantee 144 Hz in most games. 1440p? 1080 or higher, depending on games played and refresh rate. 

 

Everything else in the computer is preference. CPU cooler.... noctua vs dark rock pro vs 240mm AIO, personal choice. Fans? Personal choice. Storage? Personal choice. PSU? Consult the PSU list and buy the best you can afford. 

 

I just feel like a pretty simple flowchart could be made by someone more knowledgeable than me that would cover 85% of the threads on that forum. 

[Jurrunio]

2 minutes ago, corrado33 said:

I just feel like a pretty simple flowchart could be made by someone more knowledgeable than me that would cover 85% of the threads on that forum. 

Well, hope this thread shows that those more knowledgeable than you thought that it's a bad idea because the point of a custom built machine is flexibility, the way that it can fully match your needs. A recommend build list won't cut it.

[dizmo]

Horrible idea, mostly because there isn't a single "best build." There's lots of different ways to build a system, and the parts selection can vary from person to person depending on personal preference. Not only that, it varies from country to country as well.

[Canada EH]

2 hours ago, corrado33 said:

It seems to me that threads in the "New Builds section" are very.... very repetitive. Why don't we just have a constantly updated "Best builds for $700 (gaming/workloads/both), best builds for $1000(gaming/workloads/both), best builds for $1500, etc" thread? I'm sure many users that often post in that forum would volunteer to keep it updated. 

Would defeat the purpose of people just typing something up real quick and submit reply

[Spotty]

6 hours ago, Cereal5 said:

I would be more than happy to do something like this, if it would be pinned by one of the mods.

I'd be happy to collab if you wanted to do this. Might even get @Herman Mcpootis in as well if they're interested since that's their stomping ground.

I might do up a test thread tonight when I have some spare time and run it buy a few of the regulars and see if they have any feedback and see if it will be feasible to maintain. Will do it up and see if it I think it's a good idea to have or not... I've been meaning to write up something similar for a while in my test threads just so I can just copy and paste PCPP lists since 90% of the time it's the same thing I end up recommending anyway.

 

6 hours ago, Jurrunio said:

updating each list per day will be tedious, compared to say, the PSU list which is fine with a monthly update

Could just check prices on a weekly basis or when requested and just swap out things that are no longer available or might have had price changes. Might even be able to give general advice such as "Ryzen 2600 + a B450 motherboard" rather than saying "This specific motherboard".

[Spotty]

5 minutes ago, VegetableStu said:

do monthly, even ._. and then have a relative price difference for stepping up or down a few components

(and then let PCPP links (not embeds) do the price monitoring or dynamic lists)

 

PS: @ me if you do make that thread o_o

So far what I've got is making multiple lists (all in the one thread) for different purposes, ie. Low Budget Gaming 1080p 30fps. Then at the bottom of the list a "Also consider" list of other suitable components that are similarly priced as well as other general advise.
 

 

For example...

Quote

Low Budget Gaming (1080p 30fps) - $400

Last updated 17/12/2018

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

Type	Item	Price
CPU	AMD - Ryzen 3 2200G 3.5 GHz Quad-Core Processor	$89.00 @ Amazon
Motherboard	ASRock - B450M PRO4 Micro ATX AM4 Motherboard	$79.62 @ OutletPC
Memory	G.Skill - Ripjaws V Series 8 GB (2 x 4 GB) DDR4-2666 Memory	$59.99 @ Newegg
Storage	Crucial - MX500 250 GB 2.5" Solid State Drive	$42.99 @ Adorama
Storage	Western Digital - Caviar Blue 1 TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive	$44.85 @ OutletPC
Case	Deepcool - TESSERACT SW ATX Mid Tower Case	$35.98 @ Newegg Business
Power Supply	Corsair - CXM (2015) 450 W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply	$24.99 @ Newegg
	Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts
	Total (before mail-in rebates)	$417.42
	Mail-in rebates	-$40.00
	Total	$377.42
	Generated by PCPartPicker 2018-12-17 04:29 EST-0500

 

Also consider:

RAM: Any 2x4GB 2666MHz or higher kit (3000Mhz preferred if within budget). Consider 2x8GB 3000MHz for approximately $115 if within budget.
PSU: CoolerMaster Masterwatt 550W, Corsair TX550M, Be Quiet Pure Power 11 500W.

Storage: If you already have a HDD you can use, or don't require much storage, remove the HDD from the list to save ~$45. You can always add extra storage later on as needed.

 

But I'm open to changes... Just going to go through and do the bulk of it and then tweak it to see how it turns out.

 

Annoying PCPP lists are showing me one price, then it's showing a total before MIR that is different, then the total after MIR which is different again. My $750 entry gaming PC shows $750 on the PCPP website, but shows $800 before MIR, then $700 after MIR.... Build has a $100 price discrepancy due to the MIRs and the way PCPP shows them!

[Guest]

Reminds me of my pc gamer magazine days… for a couple of years the UK version included a min med and high build based on their own ( and prob others ) test results…

It was always good fun to read  

[Princess Luna]

Basically because we have people all over the world coming here and prices changes a hell lot from country to country, sometimes from state/province within a country even.

[Princess Luna]

6 minutes ago, VegetableStu said:

e

Deals and offers differ, supplying differs... there actually are cases I remember from examples here where Ryzen is actually more expensive for logistics issues like in Bangladesh and Lithuania... so it's really not optimal trying to standardize it to the entire world.

 

But at the end of the day it all falls down to exactly the first issue mentioned... it requires someone to actually go through at least PCPP (which mind you isn't great on most countries it supports let alone the ones it doesn't) once a week or maybe even shorter due to the special deals and update all the tiers constantly.

 

That's troublesome and tiresome specially when considering only one person the OP plus maybe the moderators? would be able to work on it.

 

End of the day it just works better as is where we go with what is available at the day at the residence of OP through each individual thread.

[Spotty]

 

17 minutes ago, Princess Cadence said:

But at the end of the day it all falls down to exactly the first issue mentioned... it requires someone to actually go through at least PCPP (which mind you isn't great on most countries it supports let alone the ones it doesn't) once a week or maybe even shorter due to the special deals and update all the tiers constantly.

Intention is to ignore any specials and go with parts that are good value at MSRP rather than updating it every day with new specials. 

I'll give it a go and see how much effort is required to maintain the list. If it's too much effort I'll just abandon it and we won't have lost anything. Hopefully I'll only need to update the lists of products go out of stock, are no longer available, if there's significant price shifts (ie. SSD price drops), or if there are new products released (ie. ryzen 2). We'll see how it goes...

 

It's not going to replace having people create their own threads and ask for help, but rather give someone who doesn't know anything about choosing PC parts a starting point to work with, and from that they can look at swapping out parts, things that are on special, etc. I would not recommend anyone pick a list off the thread and simply buy it. It's just more as a general guide and to help inspire them and show them what sort of systems are available at different price points.

 

As you mentioned earlier location is going to be an issue, and some things may not be available in their area, but it will at least give them an idea of "oh a Ryzen 2600 and 16gb of ram"

There's really not much more I can do to help with location, but I would still strongly recommend people create their own threads asking for help.