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Nvidia misses Revenue estimate - Huang says AMD to blame

Speakerator
18 minutes ago, VegetableStu said:

 

Nvidia who are Intel
Who like Intel to be AMD
Who do AMD like they're Nvidia
Who do Nvidia like they're Intel

What

ƆԀ S₱▓Ɇ▓cs: i7 6ʇɥפᴉƎ00K (4.4ghz), Asus DeLuxe X99A II, GT҉X҉1҉0҉8҉0 Zotac Amp ExTrꍟꎭe),Si6F4Gb D???????r PlatinUm, EVGA G2 Sǝʌǝᘉ5ᙣᙍᖇᓎᙎᗅᖶt, Phanteks Enthoo Primo, 3TB WD Black, 500gb 850 Evo, H100iGeeTeeX, Windows 10, K70 R̸̢̡̭͍͕̱̭̟̩̀̀̃́̃͒̈́̈́͑̑́̆͘͜ͅG̶̦̬͊́B̸͈̝̖͗̈́, G502, HyperX Cloud 2s, Asus MX34. פN∩SW∀S 960 EVO

Just keeping this here as a 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̌̅̒̾̈́̆͌̌̾̎̽̐̅̏́̈̔͛̀̋̃͊̒̓͗͒̑͒̃͂̌̄̇̑̇͛̆̾͛̒̇̍̒̓̀̈́̄̐͂̍͊͗̎̔͌͛̂̏̉̊̎͗͊͒̂̈̽̊́̔̊̃͑̈́̑̌̋̓̅̔́́͒̄̈́̈̂͐̈̅̈̓͌̓͊́̆͌̉͐̊̉͛̓̏̓̅̈́͂̉̒̇̉̆̀̍̄̇͆͛̏̉̑̃̓͂́͋̃̆̒͋̓͊̄́̓̕̕̕̚͘͘͘̚̕̚͘̕̕͜͜͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͝͠ͅS̷̢̨̧̢̡̨̢̨̢̨̧̧̨̧͚̱̪͇̱̮̪̮̦̝͖̜͙̘̪̘̟̱͇͎̻̪͚̩͍̠̹̮͚̦̝̤͖̙͔͚̙̺̩̥̻͈̺̦͕͈̹̳̖͓̜͚̜̭͉͇͖̟͔͕̹̯̬͍̱̫̮͓̙͇̗̙̼͚̪͇̦̗̜̼̠͈̩̠͉͉̘̱̯̪̟͕̘͖̝͇̼͕̳̻̜͖̜͇̣̠̹̬̗̝͓̖͚̺̫͛̉̅̐̕͘͜͜͜͜ͅͅͅ.̶̨̢̢̨̢̨̢̛̻͙̜̼̮̝̙̣̘̗̪̜̬̳̫̙̮̣̹̥̲̥͇͈̮̟͉̰̮̪̲̗̳̰̫̙͍̦̘̠̗̥̮̹̤̼̼̩͕͉͕͇͙̯̫̩̦̟̦̹͈͔̱̝͈̤͓̻̟̮̱͖̟̹̝͉̰͊̓̏̇͂̅̀̌͑̿͆̿̿͗̽̌̈́̉̂̀̒̊̿͆̃̄͑͆̃̇͒̀͐̍̅̃̍̈́̃̕͘͜͜͝͠͠z̴̢̢̡̧̢̢̧̢̨̡̨̛̛̛̛̛̛̛̛̲͚̠̜̮̠̜̞̤̺͈̘͍̻̫͖̣̥̗̙̳͓͙̫̫͖͍͇̬̲̳̭̘̮̤̬̖̼͎̬̯̼̮͔̭̠͎͓̼̖̟͈͓̦̩̦̳̙̮̗̮̩͙͓̮̰̜͎̺̞̝̪͎̯̜͈͇̪̙͎̩͖̭̟͎̲̩͔͓͈͌́̿͐̍̓͗͑̒̈́̎͂̋͂̀͂̑͂͊͆̍͛̄̃͌͗̌́̈̊́́̅͗̉͛͌͋̂̋̇̅̔̇͊͑͆̐̇͊͋̄̈́͆̍̋̏͑̓̈́̏̀͒̂̔̄̅̇̌̀̈́̿̽̋͐̾̆͆͆̈̌̿̈́̎͌̊̓̒͐̾̇̈́̍͛̅͌̽́̏͆̉́̉̓̅́͂͛̄̆͌̈́̇͐̒̿̾͌͊͗̀͑̃̊̓̈̈́̊͒̒̏̿́͑̄̑͋̀̽̀̔̀̎̄͑̌̔́̉̐͛̓̐̅́̒̎̈͆̀̍̾̀͂̄̈́̈́̈́̑̏̈́̐̽̐́̏̂̐̔̓̉̈́͂̕̚̕͘͘̚͘̚̕̚̚̚͘̕̕̕͜͜͝͠͠͝͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͝͝͝ͅͅͅī̸̧̧̧̡̨̨̢̨̛̛̘͓̼̰̰̮̗̰͚̙̥̣͍̦̺͈̣̻͇̱͔̰͈͓͖͈̻̲̫̪̲͈̜̲̬̖̻̰̦̰͙̤̘̝̦̟͈̭̱̮̠͍̖̲͉̫͔͖͔͈̻̖̝͎̖͕͔̣͈̤̗̱̀̅̃̈́͌̿̏͋̊̇̂̀̀̒̉̄̈́͋͌̽́̈́̓̑̈̀̍͗͜͜͠͠ͅp̴̢̢̧̨̡̡̨̢̨̢̢̢̨̡̛̛͕̩͕̟̫̝͈̖̟̣̲̖̭̙͇̟̗͖͎̹͇̘̰̗̝̹̤̺͉͎̙̝̟͙͚̦͚͖̜̫̰͖̼̤̥̤̹̖͉͚̺̥̮̮̫͖͍̼̰̭̤̲͔̩̯̣͖̻͇̞̳̬͉̣̖̥̣͓̤͔̪̙͎̰̬͚̣̭̞̬͎̼͉͓̮͙͕̗̦̞̥̮̘̻͎̭̼͚͎͈͇̥̗͖̫̮̤̦͙̭͎̝͖̣̰̱̩͎̩͎̘͇̟̠̱̬͈̗͍̦̘̱̰̤̱̘̫̫̮̥͕͉̥̜̯͖̖͍̮̼̲͓̤̮͈̤͓̭̝̟̲̲̳̟̠͉̙̻͕͙̞͔̖͈̱̞͓͔̬̮͎̙̭͎̩̟̖͚̆͐̅͆̿͐̄̓̀̇̂̊̃̂̄̊̀͐̍̌̅͌̆͊̆̓́̄́̃̆͗͊́̓̀͑͐̐̇͐̍́̓̈́̓̑̈̈́̽͂́̑͒͐͋̊͊̇̇̆̑̃̈́̎͛̎̓͊͛̐̾́̀͌̐̈́͛̃̂̈̿̽̇̋̍͒̍͗̈͘̚̚͘̚͘͘͜͜͜͜͜͜͠͠͝͝ͅͅͅ☻♥■∞{╚mYÄÜXτ╕○\╚Θº£¥ΘBM@Q05♠{{↨↨▬§¶‼↕◄►☼1♦  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Wait, are they seriously blaming the competition, for failing to predict that crypto was going to fail(which anyone with half a brain did years ago) and over-manufacturing GPUs that weren't as efficient/cheap as what AMD was offering? Not to mention the release of ASIC machines that are much better than GPUs.
Nvidia only has themselves to blame here. They've grown too big for their britches if they think AMD is to blame for their missed revenue.

As for gaming, of course they will lose money there as well, their new GPUs are overpriced and no one is willing to buy outdated hardware when they know the new stuff from both AMD and Nvidia (2060) is right around the corner.

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Where does AMD come in to Nvidia's loss. 

 

-no new GPU performance gain worth buying

-crypto crash

-used GPU market flooded to all hell

 

Three things enough to hurt both Nvidia and AMD. 

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I mean, if AMD doesn't exist then everyone would have to buy Nvidia.

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5 hours ago, firelighter487 said:

tbh i've stopped caring about business practices. i'll use the product that is best for my usecase. 

Pretty much this. Anyway all of them act like a$$.

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"They made more GPUs than us, so we had to one up them and make more GPUs without considering where the demand was from and this is not our fault"

 

Ye no

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So, basically the reason why NVIDIA didn't make shareholders happy enough is because AMD exists. Well, thank fucking god for that. It's why we're hoping for AMD to kick NVIDIA in the balls after all this time so things get rebalanced a bit.

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6 hours ago, Trixanity said:

Our cards are so much better than AMD's and consumers only want our product but because they're producing more cards for crypto we're selling less gaming cards because we sell the majority of the cards on the market and gamers want our cards. WHAT!?

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When you make higher-quality products, but your main competitor has hit the mainstream market better, and you can't argue against that, this is what happens.

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So, where did he blame AMD for poor sales?

The linked sources only show an explanation on why the inventory is as full as it is. Inventory as in "whatever the vendors have in their warehouses" and not "what Nvidia has in their warehouse".

 

Basically it reads as if he said that the vendor inventory is full of AMD cards and not full of NVidia cards.

That is pretty much the opposite of what is being discussed here,... he does not blame AMD for poor Nvidia sales, but claims the full inventory of vendors is mostly made up of AMD cards that don't sell since AMD pushed the 580 for mining like crazy and now can't sell it because gamers don't buy it.

 

Just check out his explanation about the 1060 being the nr 1 selling card, while the 580 is nr 24.

Makes so much more sense that way, then if he would seriously blame AMD for NVidia stock.

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14 minutes ago, Tech Enthusiast said:

Inventory as in "whatever the vendors have in their warehouses" and not "what Nvidia has in their warehouse".

Jensen did say '

Quote

Because it’s not just my inventory. It’s AMD’s inventory as well. I think the part that we didn’t estimate was the amount of inventory that they put into the channel.

As representative of Nvidia, 'his' inventory will be Nvidia's inventory. Otherwise it won't match 'AMD's inventory' following it either.

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Quote

Huang: Take a moment — let me just — the 1060 is the number one selling GPU in the world, and the 580 is the number 24. The gaming demand is such that the 580 demand is relatively small.

I refuse to believe the mainstream RX580 is number 24, fuck off jensen

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click bait title

 

first this sounds to me like him blaming the middle man, the vendor, for holding too many of amds product

which I can easily believe, they know when their shipments are coming in many weeks in advance

with mining crave they prolly held on to things to drive price up(my tinfoil hat) instead of letting them just sell, then it became a flooded channel so pushing anything was tough even at msrp

 

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5 hours ago, D13H4RD said:

I don't know.

 

Sure, AMD made a good push during the crypto fad, but as a whole, AMD still has a tiny sliver of the GPU market.

 

They could be a factor in this, but I don't think it's everything

Market share means little, the issue is the projections for Nvidia were based on stock numbers that included AMD GPU's,  but because AMD has/had a lot of GPUs in channel stock the number was so over inflated it meant the projections were off enough to upset the average shareholder.

 

4 hours ago, huilun02 said:

Spoilt crybaby Huang pointing fingers at aunt Lisa

You didn't understand what was being said, he's not blaming AMD for his stock not selling, he's saying because the channel (vendors) have a lot of AMD stock and market analysts don't separate brands in said channel stock,  as a result they are attributing over stock to nvidia which is actually AMD's.  That is why the stock predictions for Nvidia weren't met.  Apparently things like this are common.

 

3 hours ago, TetraSky said:

Wait, are they seriously blaming the competition, for failing to predict that crypto was going to fail(which anyone with half a brain did years ago) and over-manufacturing GPUs that weren't as efficient/cheap as what AMD was offering? Not to mention the release of ASIC machines that are much better than GPUs.
Nvidia only has themselves to blame here. They've grown too big for their britches if they think AMD is to blame for their missed revenue.

As for gaming, of course they will lose money there as well, their new GPUs are overpriced and no one is willing to buy outdated hardware when they know the new stuff from both AMD and Nvidia (2060) is right around the corner.

No, they are blaming the analysts for not accounting between AMD and nvidia stock at vendors,  which artificially inflates the nvidia numbers way more in this case.

1 hour ago, RejZoR said:

So, basically the reason why NVIDIA didn't make shareholders happy enough is because AMD exists. Well, thank fucking god for that. It's why we're hoping for AMD to kick NVIDIA in the balls after all this time so things get rebalanced a bit.

That is correct, but it did it for the wrong reasons, AMD is supposed to do that because they are actually producing something people want and not flooding the vendors with stock causing artificial spikes in stock numbers.

28 minutes ago, Jurrunio said:

Jensen did say '

As representative of Nvidia, 'his' inventory will be Nvidia's inventory. Otherwise it won't match 'AMD's inventory' following it either.

But not nvidias inventory in nvidias own warehouse, it's inventory of their stock in the channel.  He is explaining how that stock is counted as just GPU's rather than separating them into AMD and NVidia.  which when used to gauge either AMD or Nvidia gives an erroneous figure.

Grammar and spelling is not indicative of intelligence/knowledge.  Not having the same opinion does not always mean lack of understanding.  

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34 minutes ago, S w a t s o n said:

I refuse to believe the mainstream RX580 is number 24, fuck off jensen

Maybe youre one of the few people who bought one and didnt use it for crypto?

 

And this threads title is fake news clickbait. He didnt say that.

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27 minutes ago, mr moose said:

-snip-

Are you telling me people didn't read the article, or at least understand it before posting <insert negative opinion about Nvidia> because Nvidia is <insert negative descriptor>? 

 

Oh my God noooo waaaayy

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8 minutes ago, Arika S said:

Are you telling me people didn't read the article, or at least understand it before posting <insert negative opinion about Nvidia> because Nvidia is <insert negative descriptor>? 

 

Oh my God noooo waaaayy

I know I know,  people trip over themselves to have a thing to say without actually thinking ab9out what it is they are saying.

 

The amusing thing about the internet is that things like this and TDP and (insert any other common narrative) get so quickly accepted and repeated, is that they will be the "new" old wives tales in 2050.  By then  kids will rolling their eyes at a lot of these guys reminding them that stock/TDP/etc was a flawed assumption from an era when you had to install a physical GPU with your hands.   Back when everything was simply and you had no idea how it really worked.

 

 

Grammar and spelling is not indicative of intelligence/knowledge.  Not having the same opinion does not always mean lack of understanding.  

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I really want to say Nvidia is pricing itself too high is the problem but it doesn't seem the high end is where they are having problems selling their products... 

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While the explanation is bad... the logic is actually 100% spot on.... and too many of the comments are "nvidia is being a whiny bitch".

 

 

Look... if AMD has a far better cryptocurrency card than Nvidia at the same market value, you'd expect crypto sales to be dramatically better for AMD. Which we already know they were. Suppose both companies have product lead-times that are roughly similar, so they have say 30 days production rates accounted for at any moment.

 

Now suppose everyone's crypto dries up, AMD has a metric ass-load of product they now need to dump into the general market... which drops the price and makes the 1060 dramatically less competitive.

 

Now in addition to the dried up excess crypto stock nvidia itself has, it has disproportionately more excess gaming stock it didn't sell because its competitor also chose/had to dump an assload of product.

 

Of course, you'd expect that nvidia would be faster responding to price so that they could keep the user share... but if they are more concerned about long-term profit than short term fluctuations, it doesnt make financial sense for them to let their own pricing free fall then have to raise it dramatically once the inventory is re-exhausted.

 

Additionally, it is self-evident that neither maker was really prepared for the crypto crash otherwise both wouldnt have had so much excess inventory.

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1 hour ago, Amazonsucks said:

Maybe youre one of the few people who bought one and didnt use it for crypto?

 

And this threads title is fake news clickbait. He didnt say that.

Yea no, polaris in 480 and 580 and now 590 are very popular cards even for gaming. Mainstream is the highest volume segment. It was devoured for crypto but guess what it's still AMD's most popular card for gaming

 

Also, he said "best selling gpu in the world", not just for gaming. He's lying to you

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6 minutes ago, S w a t s o n said:

Yea no, polaris in 480 and 580 and now 590 are very popular cards even for gaming. Mainstream is the highest volume segment. It was devoured for crypto but guess what it's still AMD's most popular card for gaming

 

Also, he said "best selling gpu in the world", not just for gaming. He's lying to you

Very popular =/= best selling...

 

AMD has what a 20% dGPU market share?

 

Supposing Polaris 10 was 80% of their sales, and supposing the 1060 is only 30% of Nvidias sales... Nvidia would still sell 50% more 1060s for gaming than AMD sold Polaris 10. (.8*.2 vs .8*.3).

 

 

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Just now, Curufinwe_wins said:

Very popular =/= best selling...

 

AMD has what a 15-20% GPU market share?

 

Supposing Polaris 10 was 80% of their sales, and supposing the 1060 is only 30% of Nvidias sales... Nvidia would still sell 50% more 1060s for gaming than AMD sold Polaris 10. (.8*.2 vs .8*.3).

 

 

Didnt say best selling, I'm saying he lying about it being 24th, but thanks for playing

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7 minutes ago, S w a t s o n said:

Didnt say best selling, I'm saying he lying about it being 24th, but thanks for playing

Good thing you clarified that now, instead of the comment. Someone might take that out of context just like you did the OP phrasing.

 

So remember how for like hmmm 75%+ of the 580's lifespan in the gaming market it was basically unbuyable? It isnt very hard to imagine that it is all the way down at 24.

 

I mean look at the steam hardware survey. Obviously not comprensive or perfectly accurate...  but the 580 is all the way down at #40.... #40.... until you pull out some actual data that says he's lying, I'm rather inclined to disbelieve you based on the evidence.

 

https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/videocard/

 

 

EDIT: 38TH

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1 minute ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

Good thing you clarified that now, instead of the comment. Someone might take that out of context just like you did the OP phrasing.

 

So remember how for like hmmm 75% of the 580's lifespan in the gaming market it was basically unbuyable? It isnt very hard to imagine that it is all the way down at 24.

 

I mean look at the steam hardware survey. Obviously not comprensive or perfectly accurate...  but the 580 is all the way down at #40.... #40.... until you pull out some actual data that says he's lying, I'm rather inclined to disbelieve you based on the evidence.

 

https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/videocard/

 

Quote

Huang: Take a moment — let me just — the 1060 is the number one selling GPU in the world, and the 580 is the number 24

There's no out of context here, he later talks about his market share in gaming but here is just stating the number one selling gpu in the world and the 24th gpu in the world.

He's lying about the 24th gpu in the world

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2 minutes ago, S w a t s o n said:

There's no out of context here, he later talks about his market share in gaming but here is just stating the number one selling gpu in the world and the 24th gpu in the world.

He's lying about the 24th gpu in the world

And like you didnt clarify what comment you meant he was lying about, you don't know if the context is within the gaming channel. In the entire interviews context, it certainly seems to me that is what ranking he is talking about.

 

And again even if this was the case... "Very popular" -> rank #38 in steam hardware survey.

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1 minute ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

And like you didnt clarify what comment you meant he was lying about, you don't know if the context is within the gaming channel. In the entire interviews context, it certainly seems to me that is what ranking he is talking about.

 

And again even if this was the case... "Very popular" -> rank #38 in steam hardware survey.

No it's not, if you read the interview they talk about crypto a bunch too, just stop. The steam hardware survey is not an indicator if a card is the 24th most sold gpu in the world when we're talking about a card like the 580 and you know it. It's disengenious to even seperate the 580 from the 480. Which 1060 was jensen talking about 3gb or 6gb? There's ambiguity here but no that much that he can make that claim.

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