PSA: A reminder on why you should maintain copies of movies

[Lady Fitzgerald]

13 minutes ago, Fullmental said:

I've ripped known Cinavia discs and they still run on Plex just fine. Literally never had an issue. And if for some reason *you* do, just try some google-fu. It's not hard to find a solution.

Well, maybe not all of us have your superior google-fu. Care to share how you did it?

[Drak3]

19 minutes ago, Fullmental said:

I've ripped known Cinavia discs and they still run on Plex just fine. Literally never had an issue. And if for some reason *you* do, just try some google-fu. It's not hard to find a solution.

Plex isn't a bluray player.

[mr moose]

56 minutes ago, RorzNZ said:

You can look at Aubrey De Gray's Seven signs of ageing:

1) Extracellular Junk

2) Intracellular Junk

3) Sensescent cells

4) Extracellular crosslinks

5) Cell loss

6) Mitochondria DNA

7) 

Cheers

44 minutes ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

Always remember the older you get, the sooner you bloody well die (brownie points to the first person who tells what song that comes from without looking it up).

No brownie points for me.

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, mr moose said:

Cheers

No brownie points for me.

I actually had a large detailed explanation and 7) was telomerase activity, but LTT bugged out and I lost it all. 

 

For a TLDR:

Real signs of ageing is free radical damage and DNA damage, as well as epigenetic factors as above.

 

Aches and pains are not caused by ageing and often can be cured simply by a good diet and appropriate physiotherapy.

 

Doctors treat ageing as a disease, symptomaticially, but it is not.

 

By utilizing caloric restriction, you can live longer, and by using resveratrol. By doing this, living to over 100 is certainly possible and a lifetime extension of 65% has been achieved in rodent and primate populations. This is by regulating the pathway of autophagy.

 

 

[Fullmental]

22 minutes ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

Well, maybe not all of us have your superior google-fu. Care to share how you did it?

Not without breaking the forum rules, no. But there is a DVD software tool that is quite Fabulous at it.

[Fullmental]

17 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Plex isn't a bluray player.

That's kind of the point dude, instead of buying a digital license you can rip your own blurays and have digital access to them.

[mr moose]

2 minutes ago, RorzNZ said:

Aches and pains are not caused by ageing and often can be cured simply by a good diet and appropriate physiotherapy.

 

When the fancy neuro doctor withe  the bow tie officially diagnoses my back pain (after both an MRI and a CT scan) as degenerative and tells me its ageing, it goes against the precepts of scientific reasoning to just pretend he doesn't know what he is talking about. 

[Drak3]

11 minutes ago, Fullmental said:

That's kind of the point dude, instead of buying a digital license you can rip your own blurays and have digital access to them.

I basically said exactly that earlier in this thread.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, mr moose said:

When the fancy neuro doctor withe  the bow tie officially diagnoses my back pain (after both an MRI and a CT scan) as degenerative and tells me its ageing, it goes against the precepts of scientific reasoning to just pretend he doesn't know what he is talking about. 

If back pain is ageing then why doesn’t everyone who gets old, also get back pain? He was probably just using it as a replacement term. Doctors are taught to treat the symptoms because there is no treatment for the cause, much like palliative care, if it were a disease.

 

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

4 hours ago, Fullmental said:

Not without breaking the forum rules, no. But there is a DVD software tool that is quite Fabulous at it.

Actually, you answered my question. And I have the same software (nice hint). However, even as good as that software is, even it can't remove Cinavia infections from all Blurays or DVDs. Each movie has to be separately uninfected by the software developer before its users can do so and the developers haven't caught up yet (and I doubt they ever will get caught up if only due to the sheer volume of newly infected movies coming out).

[vanished]

On 2018-09-12 at 6:01 PM, Curufinwe_wins said:

Yay DRM... so much fun. Not clearly anti-consumer or anything. 

 

Anyways. Side topic, a good HEVC encode of 720p video of noticeably better than DVD quality runs around 1GB. 1080p from BluRay of indistinguishable quality, runs around 3-4GB. Stock is 4/32.

I find that hard to believe for a few reasons...

1. It's generally accepted that streaming video isn't of the same quality as a BluRay, and yet, even streamed video is more than twice the quality you're recommending:
   • I know Amazon video streams 1080p content at about ~6.8 GB per hour iirc (it's 6 point something for sure), which would make a typical movie 9 - 10 GB, not 3 - 4
   • YouTube recommends ~16 Mbit for 1440p content, which works out to about 7 GB per hour (pretty much same as Amazon).  I know from experience that when downscaled to 1080p, you can definitely notice the difference in quality between 1080p, 1440p, and 4K content just because of the bitrate (provided it's a "dense" enough scene for it to really matter)
2. If you can get quality indistinguishable from a BluRay in just 3 - 4 GB, why even bother with BluRay in the first place?  DVDs can handle that and much more already so it would seem rather pointless, and yet, they did make them.

On 2018-09-12 at 7:40 PM, Dan Castellaneta said:

Didn't Titanfall also use 5.1 channel mixes for the audio, though? PCM 16-bit 44.1kHz stereo audio doesn't take up that much space, but 5.1 channel audio of that kind most definitely will.

It's still really very little compared to video.  See the post I made above:

Spoiler

On 2018-09-12 at 7:24 PM, Ryan_Vickers said:

• uncompressed 1080p 24 fps stream: 1920 * 1080 * 24 * 3 = 149299200 bytes / s (~142 MB/s)
• uncompressed 8 channel (7.1) 24 bit 192 kHz audio (way higher quality than any movie I'm aware of): 192000 * 24/8 * 8 = 4608000 bytes / s (~4.39 MB/s)
• Compressed 1080p video stream: anywhere from 15 to 50 Mbit/s generally
• Compressed audio stream: usually 96 kbit/s per channel, maybe as high as 160, so maybe 1.25 Mbit/s for 8 of them.

 

[Curufinwe_wins]

38 minutes ago, Ryan_Vickers said:

I find that hard to believe for a few reasons...

1. It's generally accepted that streaming video isn't of the same quality as a BluRay, and yet, even streamed video is more than twice the quality you're recommending:
   • I know Amazon video streams 1080p content at about ~6.8 GB per hour iirc (it's 6 point something for sure), which would make a typical movie 9 - 10 GB, not 3 - 4
   • YouTube recommends ~16 Mbit for 1440p content, which works out to about 7 GB per hour (pretty much same as Amazon).  I know from experience that when downscaled to 1080p, you can definitely notice the difference in quality between 1080p, 1440p, and 4K content just because of the bitrate (provided it's a "dense" enough scene for it to really matter)
2. If you can get quality indistinguishable from a BluRay in just 3 - 4 GB, why even bother with BluRay in the first place?  DVDs can handle that and much more already so it would seem rather pointless, and yet, they did make them.

It's still really very little compared to video.  See the post I made above:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

CPU encoded HEVC (for some godawful unknown reason NVEC and similar is larger file size than H.264) in my personal side by side testing of downcoding from Blu-Ray sources is 1/3-1/4 the size of H.264 at the same quality (about 1/2-1/3 the size of VP9). 

 

So I'm really talking about something like a 10-16 GB h.264 video. Is that much better? Unfortunately x.265 is way more computational demanding to encode and decode which is why it isn't used (the royalty argument is... to put it lightly... bullshit.)

 

The thing to note is that youtube/amazon/netflix (though less on netflix) almost all have to serve the lowest common denominator. They don't run (or recommend running) their encodings at high quality if that means video encoding is 10-100x slower than on the "high speed variants". The situation is even worse for decoding, and thus they tend to use even less efficient storage containers, and encoding settings that way.

 

 

Side note on Blu-ray implementations... a ludicrous amount of space is dedicated to oversampled, poorly compressed audio. Example, Avatar's release spends just under 5 GB on audio. Sensible settings for that dropped it down to like 300 MB (a lossless full length flac album generally is less than 300 MB, and limiting yourself to loss-less is stupid).

 

 

Example results from one of my HEVC encode at these sorts of low bitrates:

 

Side by side against the blu-ray I didn't see any noticeable softening or artifacts, but that could be my particular combination of eyes, tv, and player.

 

 

EDIT 2: The first tenant of downmixing like this... Go as low as you can without YOU perceiving loss. Obviously results vary based on perception. If you zoom in on the third image, you can see some in the dark spots around Mr. PR's face. But at any reasonable distance, I'm cool with it.

[Misanthrope]

18 hours ago, mr moose said:

I think it is the other way around, I think the younger generations, who seem to have entitlement issues, are the ones who can't go five minutes without knowing what happens next on what ever crap show it is they are watching.   That is after all one of  the main arguments I hear for pirating (distribution).  Most older people I know don't give a fuck, if they aren't happy with the content on the box or the content on netflix they turn it of and go play golf or go to the bar.

Well sure "millennials" are certainly sort of like that. But I am talking about kids being born on 2010ish so to clarify I bit more into the future: kids that just have almost no formative reference of the "tv show" format on any way and just gravitate towards streaming content and such from a fairly young age already.

 

So in hindsight I should have clarified this was more of a Dad perspective because I am talking kids, like actual kids not teens or people in their 20s who grew up in a more transitional phase in between the old forms of entertainment and the new ones. They're not "streaming natives" even if slightly more receptive to the concept it's not all they know like it's going to happen for the next generation in 10-20 years.

[IAmAndre]

Last month I was no longer able to access a movie I had downloaded on Netflix because it was no longer part of their catalogue. This really sucks because I could at least be able to watch the stuff I had already downloaded.

[Okjoek]

So wait, I don't understand. Don't people just torrent stuff? Like... For free?

[Franck]

On 9/12/2018 at 6:54 PM, Cyberspirit said:

Too bad everything on Spotify is encrypted.

That must suck though. I feel like they should be able to just keep the stuff up for those who purchased it.

Being encrypted means nothing. It's not encrypted anymore when it goes through the audio module of you device.

 

Everything you can see or hear can be recorded.

[Technous285]

7 hours ago, Franck said:

Being encrypted means nothing. It's not encrypted anymore when it goes through the audio module of you device.

 

Everything you can see or hear can be recorded.

Ahh yes, the Analogue Hole. MAFIAA (MPAA+RIAA) are oh-so-keen on trying to patch that out (and failing at doing so).

[Kamina]

This will happen to our steam games one day.

 

Also why piracy is important. It's a digital archive.

[Lady Fitzgerald]

I do not condone actual piracy (stealing content instead of paying for it) for any reason but there are no valid excuses for not maintaining backups of all data. Sadly, we are often forced to illegally break DRM to backup our lawfully acquired data.

[mr moose]

16 hours ago, Kamina said:

This will happen to our steam games one day.

 

Also why piracy is important. It's a digital archive.

I heard a rumour that steam have some sort of system in place for that eventuality.  Something to do with a patch or update that allows you to play all games offline.  I can't help but wonder about the multiplayer online games though. 

[AdmiralMeowmix]

"four movie rentals" ah yes that totally makes up for all the money he spent on those movies, so he can RENT some other movies for a short time. Sure he'll probably just download them now but man that's an idiotic and stupid compensation for what would be considered theft if someone just broke into your house and stole your movies because their company no longer owned the right to sell them so you can't own them anymore.

[kirashi]

On 9/13/2018 at 5:49 AM, The Benjamins said:

Why can't you create physical media and have it work in a blu ray player, I can easily. 

On 9/13/2018 at 5:52 AM, Drak3 said:

Cinavia.

On 9/13/2018 at 6:02 AM, The Benjamins said:

I never knew about this, so if I RIP a BD then it will never play back on a BD player again?

Well with a abundance of smart TVs, and TV boxes you can easily play back a RIP over DLNA, usb or other means. (I have a plex server)

On 9/13/2018 at 6:05 AM, Drak3 said:

The original BD will. Copies are very unlikely to, but some don't use Cinavia.

On 9/13/2018 at 4:10 PM, Lady Fitzgerald said:

Well, maybe not all of us have your superior google-fu. Care to share how you did it?

On 9/13/2018 at 4:34 PM, Fullmental said:

Not without breaking the forum rules, no. But there is a DVD software tool that is quite Fabulous at it.

I see what you did there @Fullmental  DVDFab can strip Cinavia protection* from most titles. Talking about this doesn't directly violate the forum CoC as long as your country legally allows backups of physical media you already own, and you stick to using it for that purpose, of course.

 

That being said, I actually believe that DVDFab replaces the audio via a downloaded copy of the uncompressed track they probably acquired via a theatre that supplies an audio feed / connection without Cinavia protection for those with disabilities or hearing problems. Why do I think this? Because DVDFab requires an internet connection the entire time you're ripping a supported Cinavia protected* DVD or BluRay, and appears to download an uncompressed audio track that can be larger than the original audio on the BluRay according to the following review from a few years ago.

https://www.myce.com/review/dvdfab-cinaviaremoval-hd-review-78133/

 

DVDFab probably acquires the audio tracks separately by way of actual, real people with recording devices that plug into these feeds in the theatres that provide them, who then provide DVDFab with copies of the audio tracks after the fact, hoping that the particular theatre they visited doesn't have Cinavia baked into the audio feed they recorded. Another theory I have is that even if they can only get a copy of the audio track with Cinavia protection* they might just work on cleaning up the audio in a laboratory, which can take some time to do before it's ready.

 

Either way, this explains why DVDFab may not support the "removal" of Cinavia protection* from movies until they have a "clean" copy of the audio to supply during a physical DVD or BluRay rip.

 

*the words protection or protected in this context should be replaced with hindrance or inconvenience because Cinavia only inconveniences consumers who've legally paid for a license to consume a movie or TV show by making it more difficult to format-shift the content so the consumer can watch it whenever, wherever, and on whatever device they prefer, just as all forms of Digital Rights Management does. And the MPAA and RIAA wonder why people still don't like them. /r/hmmm

[kokakolia]

On 2018-09-12 at 4:52 PM, Dan Castellaneta said:

There's a reason I buy physical DVDs and CDs.

Not only DVDs and CDs, but pirated content as well. Because all too often movies and albums get out of print because nobody buys them anymore. 

[Drak3]

10 hours ago, kirashi said:

I actually believe that DVDFab replaces the audio via a downloaded copy of the uncompressed track they probably acquired via a theatre that supplies an audio feed / connection without Cinavia protection

They replace the track, but with audio that has been editted to try to remove the Cinavia watermark, or reduce its signature so that it doesn't trigger.

 

It doesn't always work.

[Commodus]

On 9/16/2018 at 9:54 AM, mate_mate91 said:

-snip-

First, Apple didn't delete the movie.  There's been a lot of conjecture that mostly stems from people looking for an excuse to hate on the company.  It's actually a regional issue that stems from the person in question moving countries and switching regional settings in such a way that he lost access.  You can pin that on the movie studios, not Apple.

 

Second, declaring yourself a cheapskate and leech is nothing to be proud about.  You're not sticking it to Apple, you're just stealing.