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Sauron

2018 macbook pro runs faster if you limit the cpu via software

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Posted · Original PosterOP

Further fueling the dumpster fire that the 2018 Macbook Pro is turning out to be, notebookcheck.net has discovered that by manually limiting power consumption you can actually get better performance.

 

Apparently, Apple elected to ONLY use temperature as a parameter for ramping up clock speeds, which results in the cpu not having enough time to cool down before trying to boost again. This leads to fluctuations that severely harm performance.

Quote

Apple removes all consumption limitations and the temperature is the only limiting factor for the CPU performance. The new processors add two more cores, so there is a lot of heat at high clocks, which cannot be dissipated effectively by the cooling solution. The clock has to be reduced as a result, and we start to see massive fluctuations after a few seconds of load. The clock will rise as soon as there is some thermal headroom, which results in high temperatures and so on.

 

The website then tried to limit power draw manually, using third party software tools.

Quote

Almost every other laptop manufacturer limits the power consumption of the CPU after a while (usually 28 seconds), and we tried just that with the new MacBooks as well. We use the Windows tool Intel XTU (freeware), where you can adjust the short-term maximum consumption as well as the long-term figure. There is also a tool for macOS called Volta (7-day trial), but the settings are much more limited. You can only deactivate the Turbo Boost completely or adjust the TDP, for example. The latter, however, is limited to the official TDP specification like 45 Watts on the 15-inch model, for instance. This is not ideal, but will suffice for our tests.

 

And lo and behold, they managed to get better and consistent performance out of the macbooks.

image.png.19c2930e8d46956ee5178dc4f6c804b4.pngimage.png.eac44e8c0917c69d0ba7c7e32679b0a4.png

                windows 10 without TDP adjustments                            windows 10 with fixed 45W settings

 

It's not a small increase either, they managed to get about 20% more performance in cinebench.

 

Quote

Apple's philosophy of removing all consumption limitations is clearly counterproductive for the current 2018 MacBook Pro systems. Even very short load periods of ~30 seconds result in massive clock fluctuations, which will affect the performance. We recommend the manual adjustment of the CPU consumption for both model, but the 15-inch MBP in particular. You still get the maximum Turbo Boost when a single core is stressed, and the performance is better and especially steadier under maximum load. We think Apple's engineers should have figured this out and a simple software update would solve the issue, but we know that the manufacturer from Cupertino does not like to admit these things

 

Personally I find this completely ridiculous - given the price they ask for these things this is an unforgivable engineering oversight and a display of either incompetence or contempt for Apple customers. What's even funnier is that it ends up performing slightly better under Windows thanks to better third party software (you can read more about this in the source, I couldn't copy the full table here because it's formatted in a weird way).

 

On the bright side, this looks like something that could be solved with a firmware update as soon as Apple starts giving a damn. In the meanwhile, if you bought one of these you can use Intel XTU (on windows, freeware) or Volta (on macOS, paid software) to get some of the performance you paid for.


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What is scaling and how does it work? Asus PB287Q unboxing! Console alternatives :D Watch Netflix with Kodi on Arch Linux Sharing folders over the internet using SSH Beginner's Guide To LTT (by iamdarkyoshi)

Sauron'stm Product Scores:

Spoiler

Just a list of my personal scores for some products, in no particular order, with brief comments. I just got the idea to do them so they aren't many for now :)

Don't take these as complete reviews or final truths - they are just my personal impressions on products I may or may not have used, summed up in a couple of sentences and a rough score. All scores take into account the unit's price and time of release, heavily so, therefore don't expect absolute performance to be reflected here.

 

-Lenovo Thinkpad X220 - [8/10]

Spoiler

A durable and reliable machine that is relatively lightweight, has all the hardware it needs to never feel sluggish and has a great IPS matte screen. Downsides are mostly due to its age, most notably the screen resolution of 1366x768 and usb 2.0 ports.

 

-Apple Macbook (2015) - [Garbage -/10]

Spoiler

From my perspective, this product has no redeeming factors given its price and the competition. It is underpowered, overpriced, impractical due to its single port and is made redundant even by Apple's own iPad pro line.

 

-OnePlus X - [7/10]

Spoiler

A good phone for the price. It does everything I (and most people) need without being sluggish and has no particularly bad flaws. The lack of recent software updates and relatively barebones feature kit (most notably the lack of 5GHz wifi, biometric sensors and backlight for the capacitive buttons) prevent it from being exceptional.

 

-Microsoft Surface Book 2 - [Garbage - -/10]

Spoiler

Overpriced and rushed, offers nothing notable compared to the competition, doesn't come with an adequate charger despite the premium price. Worse than the Macbook for not even offering the small plus sides of having macOS. Buy a Razer Blade if you want high performance in a (relatively) light package.

 

-Intel Core i7 2600/k - [9/10]

Spoiler

Quite possibly Intel's best product launch ever. It had all the bleeding edge features of the time, it came with a very significant performance improvement over its predecessor and it had a soldered heatspreader, allowing for efficient cooling and great overclocking. Even the "locked" version could be overclocked through the multiplier within (quite reasonable) limits.

 

-Apple iPad Pro - [5/10]

Spoiler

A pretty good product, sunk by its price (plus the extra cost of the physical keyboard and the pencil). Buy it if you don't mind the Apple tax and are looking for a very light office machine with an excellent digitizer. Particularly good for rich students. Bad for cheap tinkerers like myself.

 

 

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Many Windows laptops place power limits. 

 

It's apparently common for MacBooks to not have power limits 

 

Seems like it worked against them in this case......badly


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2 minutes ago, Sakkura said:

Courage™

Magical Courage


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44 minutes ago, VegetableStu said:

am I right to say undervolting makes the processor produce less heat? o_o and what of the power draw?

You are, AMDs GPUs are great at undervolting and in the case of laptops, everyone should just undervolt their CPUs. Skylake, kaby Lake and coffee lake are great at it and you can reduce your temperatures by 5-10 °C. 

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1 hour ago, VegetableStu said:

am I right to say undervolting makes the processor produce less heat? o_o and what of the power draw?

You are absolutely correct. 

 

Undervolting is a common thing for techies to do with their laptops as it reduces heat output and also gives the CPU slightly higher thermal headroom to turbo as a result, indirectly improving performance. 

 

Adding the power limit and undervolting should make the MacBook Pro perform better, especially since Coffee Lake undervolts extremely well. A fellow user has an 8750H and undervolted by -120mV, it scored 1250 on Cinebench R15 multi 


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Are the majority of Mac users technically inclined to do so?
How much knowledge for "tinkering" do Mac enthusiasts have? (Hardware/Software Enthusiasts that give a damn to do this)

*Genuine Q?

 

Some buyers,.. wouldn't even check Youtubes/follow-ups for the i9, purchase and head in the clouds figuring its working just fine.. cos it will. "Work" just fine, just not as fast as it should.


Maximums - Asus Z97-K /w i5 4690 Bclk @106.9Mhz * x39 = 4.17Ghz, 8GB of 2600Mhz DDR3,.. Gigabyte GTX970 G1-Gaming @ 1550Mhz

 

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6 minutes ago, SkilledRebuilds said:

Are the majority of Mac users technically inclined to do so?
How much knowledge for "tinkering" do Mac enthusiasts have? (Hardware/Software Enthusiasts that give a damn to do this)

*Genuine Q?

 

Some buyers,.. wouldn't even check Youtubes/follow-ups for the i9, purchase and head in the clouds figuring its working just fine.. cos it will. "Work" just fine, just not as fast as it should.

In the case of Mac power users, I think those are the people who care about such things. 

 

As for the ones who act hipster at the local Starbucks, probably not 


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Posted · Original PosterOP
13 minutes ago, SkilledRebuilds said:

Are the majority of Mac users technically inclined to do so?
How much knowledge for "tinkering" do Mac enthusiasts have? (Hardware/Software Enthusiasts that give a damn to do this)

*Genuine Q?

 

Some buyers,.. wouldn't even check Youtubes/follow-ups for the i9, purchase and head in the clouds figuring its working just fine.. cos it will. "Work" just fine, just not as fast as it should.

Since there's a gui program that "just works" and those buying an i9 probably need the extra performance I'd say they're fairly likely to actually do this - I don't think most would be willing to undervolt though.

9 minutes ago, D13H4RD2L1V3 said:

As for the ones who act hipster at the local Starbucks, probably not 

Those probably wouldn't even consider the 6000$ i9 model.


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What is scaling and how does it work? Asus PB287Q unboxing! Console alternatives :D Watch Netflix with Kodi on Arch Linux Sharing folders over the internet using SSH Beginner's Guide To LTT (by iamdarkyoshi)

Sauron'stm Product Scores:

Spoiler

Just a list of my personal scores for some products, in no particular order, with brief comments. I just got the idea to do them so they aren't many for now :)

Don't take these as complete reviews or final truths - they are just my personal impressions on products I may or may not have used, summed up in a couple of sentences and a rough score. All scores take into account the unit's price and time of release, heavily so, therefore don't expect absolute performance to be reflected here.

 

-Lenovo Thinkpad X220 - [8/10]

Spoiler

A durable and reliable machine that is relatively lightweight, has all the hardware it needs to never feel sluggish and has a great IPS matte screen. Downsides are mostly due to its age, most notably the screen resolution of 1366x768 and usb 2.0 ports.

 

-Apple Macbook (2015) - [Garbage -/10]

Spoiler

From my perspective, this product has no redeeming factors given its price and the competition. It is underpowered, overpriced, impractical due to its single port and is made redundant even by Apple's own iPad pro line.

 

-OnePlus X - [7/10]

Spoiler

A good phone for the price. It does everything I (and most people) need without being sluggish and has no particularly bad flaws. The lack of recent software updates and relatively barebones feature kit (most notably the lack of 5GHz wifi, biometric sensors and backlight for the capacitive buttons) prevent it from being exceptional.

 

-Microsoft Surface Book 2 - [Garbage - -/10]

Spoiler

Overpriced and rushed, offers nothing notable compared to the competition, doesn't come with an adequate charger despite the premium price. Worse than the Macbook for not even offering the small plus sides of having macOS. Buy a Razer Blade if you want high performance in a (relatively) light package.

 

-Intel Core i7 2600/k - [9/10]

Spoiler

Quite possibly Intel's best product launch ever. It had all the bleeding edge features of the time, it came with a very significant performance improvement over its predecessor and it had a soldered heatspreader, allowing for efficient cooling and great overclocking. Even the "locked" version could be overclocked through the multiplier within (quite reasonable) limits.

 

-Apple iPad Pro - [5/10]

Spoiler

A pretty good product, sunk by its price (plus the extra cost of the physical keyboard and the pencil). Buy it if you don't mind the Apple tax and are looking for a very light office machine with an excellent digitizer. Particularly good for rich students. Bad for cheap tinkerers like myself.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Sauron said:

Those probably wouldn't even consider the 6000$ i9 model.

Unless they have money to burn and wanna show off 

 

"Hey dudebros, I bought the new MacBook with the i9 processor. It's like the best laptop ever" 


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The Portable Station

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Samsung Galaxy Note8 SM-N950F

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7 minutes ago, D13H4RD2L1V3 said:

Unless they have money to burn and wanna show off 

 

"Hey dudebros, I bought the new MacBook with the i9 processor. It's like the best laptop ever" 

"But How bout dat Baseclock.....Bruh?"

 

"Whats a Baseclock, no mind,.. I've got the Turboclocks ammirite!!" High-5?

 

/wow. yet likely.


Maximums - Asus Z97-K /w i5 4690 Bclk @106.9Mhz * x39 = 4.17Ghz, 8GB of 2600Mhz DDR3,.. Gigabyte GTX970 G1-Gaming @ 1550Mhz

 

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Posted · Original PosterOP
15 minutes ago, AskTJ said:

Should've done that when they released it.

So far they haven't addressed the issue at all, this is a workaround a website found.


...is there a question here? 🤔

sudo chmod -R 000 /*

What is scaling and how does it work? Asus PB287Q unboxing! Console alternatives :D Watch Netflix with Kodi on Arch Linux Sharing folders over the internet using SSH Beginner's Guide To LTT (by iamdarkyoshi)

Sauron'stm Product Scores:

Spoiler

Just a list of my personal scores for some products, in no particular order, with brief comments. I just got the idea to do them so they aren't many for now :)

Don't take these as complete reviews or final truths - they are just my personal impressions on products I may or may not have used, summed up in a couple of sentences and a rough score. All scores take into account the unit's price and time of release, heavily so, therefore don't expect absolute performance to be reflected here.

 

-Lenovo Thinkpad X220 - [8/10]

Spoiler

A durable and reliable machine that is relatively lightweight, has all the hardware it needs to never feel sluggish and has a great IPS matte screen. Downsides are mostly due to its age, most notably the screen resolution of 1366x768 and usb 2.0 ports.

 

-Apple Macbook (2015) - [Garbage -/10]

Spoiler

From my perspective, this product has no redeeming factors given its price and the competition. It is underpowered, overpriced, impractical due to its single port and is made redundant even by Apple's own iPad pro line.

 

-OnePlus X - [7/10]

Spoiler

A good phone for the price. It does everything I (and most people) need without being sluggish and has no particularly bad flaws. The lack of recent software updates and relatively barebones feature kit (most notably the lack of 5GHz wifi, biometric sensors and backlight for the capacitive buttons) prevent it from being exceptional.

 

-Microsoft Surface Book 2 - [Garbage - -/10]

Spoiler

Overpriced and rushed, offers nothing notable compared to the competition, doesn't come with an adequate charger despite the premium price. Worse than the Macbook for not even offering the small plus sides of having macOS. Buy a Razer Blade if you want high performance in a (relatively) light package.

 

-Intel Core i7 2600/k - [9/10]

Spoiler

Quite possibly Intel's best product launch ever. It had all the bleeding edge features of the time, it came with a very significant performance improvement over its predecessor and it had a soldered heatspreader, allowing for efficient cooling and great overclocking. Even the "locked" version could be overclocked through the multiplier within (quite reasonable) limits.

 

-Apple iPad Pro - [5/10]

Spoiler

A pretty good product, sunk by its price (plus the extra cost of the physical keyboard and the pencil). Buy it if you don't mind the Apple tax and are looking for a very light office machine with an excellent digitizer. Particularly good for rich students. Bad for cheap tinkerers like myself.

 

 

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it's a high performance product it shouldn't be limited, if you do you might as well by a cheaper model. :P

 

Apple's reasoning is sound. They just shouldn't have used that CPU in such a small case, i'm curious to see who else if anyone uses it on a laptop and how it looks like. Probably shouldn't exist as a laptop CPU except for those high end gigantic gaming laptops, that are not very portable.


.

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5 minutes ago, Sauron said:

So far they haven't addressed the issue at all, this is a workaround a website found.

Only thing that has happened is Intel removing the Mac download for the resource monitor people have been using to check CPU temps 


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The Portable Station

Core i7 4700MQ | GT 750M | 16GB DDR3-1600 | 250GB 850 Evo | Windows 10 64-bit

 

Samsung Galaxy Note8 SM-N950F

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Posted · Original PosterOP
2 minutes ago, asus killer said:

it's a high performance product it shouldn't be limited, if you do you might as well by a cheaper model. :P

As it stands the cheaper model performs better, so...

1 minute ago, D13H4RD2L1V3 said:

Only thing that has happened is Intel removing the Mac download for the resource monitor people have been using to check CPU temps 

Oh wow


...is there a question here? 🤔

sudo chmod -R 000 /*

What is scaling and how does it work? Asus PB287Q unboxing! Console alternatives :D Watch Netflix with Kodi on Arch Linux Sharing folders over the internet using SSH Beginner's Guide To LTT (by iamdarkyoshi)

Sauron'stm Product Scores:

Spoiler

Just a list of my personal scores for some products, in no particular order, with brief comments. I just got the idea to do them so they aren't many for now :)

Don't take these as complete reviews or final truths - they are just my personal impressions on products I may or may not have used, summed up in a couple of sentences and a rough score. All scores take into account the unit's price and time of release, heavily so, therefore don't expect absolute performance to be reflected here.

 

-Lenovo Thinkpad X220 - [8/10]

Spoiler

A durable and reliable machine that is relatively lightweight, has all the hardware it needs to never feel sluggish and has a great IPS matte screen. Downsides are mostly due to its age, most notably the screen resolution of 1366x768 and usb 2.0 ports.

 

-Apple Macbook (2015) - [Garbage -/10]

Spoiler

From my perspective, this product has no redeeming factors given its price and the competition. It is underpowered, overpriced, impractical due to its single port and is made redundant even by Apple's own iPad pro line.

 

-OnePlus X - [7/10]

Spoiler

A good phone for the price. It does everything I (and most people) need without being sluggish and has no particularly bad flaws. The lack of recent software updates and relatively barebones feature kit (most notably the lack of 5GHz wifi, biometric sensors and backlight for the capacitive buttons) prevent it from being exceptional.

 

-Microsoft Surface Book 2 - [Garbage - -/10]

Spoiler

Overpriced and rushed, offers nothing notable compared to the competition, doesn't come with an adequate charger despite the premium price. Worse than the Macbook for not even offering the small plus sides of having macOS. Buy a Razer Blade if you want high performance in a (relatively) light package.

 

-Intel Core i7 2600/k - [9/10]

Spoiler

Quite possibly Intel's best product launch ever. It had all the bleeding edge features of the time, it came with a very significant performance improvement over its predecessor and it had a soldered heatspreader, allowing for efficient cooling and great overclocking. Even the "locked" version could be overclocked through the multiplier within (quite reasonable) limits.

 

-Apple iPad Pro - [5/10]

Spoiler

A pretty good product, sunk by its price (plus the extra cost of the physical keyboard and the pencil). Buy it if you don't mind the Apple tax and are looking for a very light office machine with an excellent digitizer. Particularly good for rich students. Bad for cheap tinkerers like myself.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Sauron said:

Oh wow

Yep. That's quite the knee-jerk reaction 


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The Portable Station

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Samsung Galaxy Note8 SM-N950F

Exynos 8895 ARM Mali G71 MP20 | 6GB LPDDR4 | 64GB Samsung NAND flash w/ UFS 2.1 dual-lane controller + 128GB SanDisk C10 UHS-I microSD | 6.3" 1440p "Infinity Display" AMOLED | Android Pie 9.0 w/ OneUI

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2 minutes ago, Sauron said:

As it stands the cheaper model performs better, so...

 

so it actually doesn't matter what you do. As it is the cheaper is a better option. If you limit it, the cheaper model is a better option :D


.

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2 minutes ago, asus killer said:

so it actually doesn't matter what you do. As it is the cheaper is a better option. If you limit it, the cheaper model is a better option :D

Both models improved when they're power limited 

 

Add in undervolting and they might actually perform far better than what they were out of the box 


The Workhorse

R7 3700X | RTX 2070 Super | 32GB DDR4-3200 | 512GB SX8200P + 2TB 7200RPM Barracuda Compute | Windows 10 Pro 64-bit

 

The Portable Station

Core i7 4700MQ | GT 750M | 16GB DDR3-1600 | 250GB 850 Evo | Windows 10 64-bit

 

Samsung Galaxy Note8 SM-N950F

Exynos 8895 ARM Mali G71 MP20 | 6GB LPDDR4 | 64GB Samsung NAND flash w/ UFS 2.1 dual-lane controller + 128GB SanDisk C10 UHS-I microSD | 6.3" 1440p "Infinity Display" AMOLED | Android Pie 9.0 w/ OneUI

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18 minutes ago, D13H4RD2L1V3 said:

Only thing that has happened is Intel removing the Mac download for the resource monitor people have been using to check CPU temps 

here you go ^_^

Intel® Power Gadget.dmg


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I see the soul that is inside

 

Making Windows Defender as good or even better than paid options

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Posted · Original PosterOP
4 minutes ago, avg123 said:

How many people here outraged about the macbook actually own a mac or was planning to buy the macbook? 

How many people would have asked this question if we weren't talking about an Apple product?


...is there a question here? 🤔

sudo chmod -R 000 /*

What is scaling and how does it work? Asus PB287Q unboxing! Console alternatives :D Watch Netflix with Kodi on Arch Linux Sharing folders over the internet using SSH Beginner's Guide To LTT (by iamdarkyoshi)

Sauron'stm Product Scores:

Spoiler

Just a list of my personal scores for some products, in no particular order, with brief comments. I just got the idea to do them so they aren't many for now :)

Don't take these as complete reviews or final truths - they are just my personal impressions on products I may or may not have used, summed up in a couple of sentences and a rough score. All scores take into account the unit's price and time of release, heavily so, therefore don't expect absolute performance to be reflected here.

 

-Lenovo Thinkpad X220 - [8/10]

Spoiler

A durable and reliable machine that is relatively lightweight, has all the hardware it needs to never feel sluggish and has a great IPS matte screen. Downsides are mostly due to its age, most notably the screen resolution of 1366x768 and usb 2.0 ports.

 

-Apple Macbook (2015) - [Garbage -/10]

Spoiler

From my perspective, this product has no redeeming factors given its price and the competition. It is underpowered, overpriced, impractical due to its single port and is made redundant even by Apple's own iPad pro line.

 

-OnePlus X - [7/10]

Spoiler

A good phone for the price. It does everything I (and most people) need without being sluggish and has no particularly bad flaws. The lack of recent software updates and relatively barebones feature kit (most notably the lack of 5GHz wifi, biometric sensors and backlight for the capacitive buttons) prevent it from being exceptional.

 

-Microsoft Surface Book 2 - [Garbage - -/10]

Spoiler

Overpriced and rushed, offers nothing notable compared to the competition, doesn't come with an adequate charger despite the premium price. Worse than the Macbook for not even offering the small plus sides of having macOS. Buy a Razer Blade if you want high performance in a (relatively) light package.

 

-Intel Core i7 2600/k - [9/10]

Spoiler

Quite possibly Intel's best product launch ever. It had all the bleeding edge features of the time, it came with a very significant performance improvement over its predecessor and it had a soldered heatspreader, allowing for efficient cooling and great overclocking. Even the "locked" version could be overclocked through the multiplier within (quite reasonable) limits.

 

-Apple iPad Pro - [5/10]

Spoiler

A pretty good product, sunk by its price (plus the extra cost of the physical keyboard and the pencil). Buy it if you don't mind the Apple tax and are looking for a very light office machine with an excellent digitizer. Particularly good for rich students. Bad for cheap tinkerers like myself.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, Sauron said:

How many people would have asked this question if we weren't talking about an Apple product?

If the HP yrhdheu4586y laptop or the Dell fhgfex77656 laptop had the same problem, nobody would even notice. There would be no "outrage" all over the internet. It seems it has become cool to hate on Apple by people who can never afford an apple product.

It is only news because it is apple.

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