[Update] Google to be fined 5 billion dollars by the EU for breaching Antitrust laws

[mark_cameron]

2 minutes ago, mr moose said:

Again, there is a difference between blocking Amazons customers from youtube and blocking a specific use of youtube by amazon.  I'd like to see where youtube was outright banned as opposed to just blocked in certain apps like the MS one was.

They removed the ability to access YouTube from the web, by Amazon Fire devices.

 

It wasn't even a specific application.

 

Forgetting that these are Amazon Fire customers not Google's customers.

 

Its clearly designed to drive Amazon Fire customers away from the device and get it negative reviews.

[mr moose]

7 minutes ago, mark_cameron said:

They removed the ability to access YouTube from the web, by Amazon Fire devices.

 

It wasn't even a specific application.

 

Forgetting that these are Amazon Fire customers not Google's customers.

 

Its clearly designed to drive Amazon Fire customers away from the device and get it negative reviews.

Quote

Echo Show and Fire TV now display a standard web view of YouTube.com and point customers directly to YouTube's existing website.

You can still view youtube on firetv, you just need to use a browser app like firefox to do so.

Amazon and google are having a tiff and I bet you a shiny internet dollar that there is more to this story. 

[mark_cameron]

2 minutes ago, mr moose said:

You can still view youtube on firetv, you just need to use a browser app like firefox to do so.

Amazon and google are having a tiff and I bet you a shiny internet dollar that there is more to this story. 

Yeah. Probably Google legal, saying "NO you can't do that we'll get sued by the Competition Authorities"

[mr moose]

5 minutes ago, mark_cameron said:

Yeah. Probably Google legal, saying "NO you can't do that we'll get sued by the Competition Authorities"

Maybe.

[Jito463]

7 hours ago, mark_cameron said:

I see very little independent thinking in people in America. The land of the free/Breitbart the home of the brave/Bonespurs.

 

They tend to hear something from a politician and to them it becomes fact.

 

Which they then regurgitate on the internet.

So, ignoring that not everyone in America is a Trump supporter - and ignoring that not even every Trump supporter likes all that Trump does - you're still content to spew the ridiculous notion that Americans are primarily brain-dead zombies with no thought of our own, save for what we're told to think.  Duly noted.  I see there's no point in continuing this discussion any further.  I guess I'll go meander around looking for some brains to devour.  That is what zombies do, after all.

 

9 hours ago, mr moose said:

I'm 42, I was selling internet when you were 8 years old.    In fact I was building, selling and repairing PC's before you even knew what TCP/IP was.  Don't assume you know everything because have an opinion.

 

For your information, netscape was bought out by AOL and the core people behind it essential birthed Firefox from it's ashes.

I'm just a year behind you.  I remember buying Netscape Communicator Suite from the store (for $89.99 if I recall correctly) back in the day. 

 

Yes children, we used to buy our web browsers, they weren't always free.  Another major driving force behind the death of Netscape due to IE.  Why pay for something you get essentially for free with the OS?

[asus killer]

6 minutes ago, Jito463 said:

 I remember buying Netscape Communicator Suite from the store (for $89.99 if I recall correctly) back in the day. 

 

Yes children, we used to buy our web browsers, they weren't always free. 

and that's mainly why it failed, competition was free.

[mark_cameron]

1 hour ago, Jito463 said:

So, ignoring that not everyone in America is a Trump supporter - and ignoring that not even every Trump supporter likes all that Trump does - you're still content to spew the ridiculous notion that Americans are primarily brain-dead zombies with no thought of our own, save for what we're told to think.  Duly noted.  I see there's no point in continuing this discussion any further.  I guess I'll go meander around looking for some brains to devour.  That is what zombies do, after all.

 

Explain what is happening there, otherwise.

[Jito463]

14 minutes ago, mark_cameron said:

Explain what is happening there, otherwise.

What's to explain?  I don't know what misconceptions you have, and frankly I don't care enough to find out.  I just take exception to you making blanket statements about an entire people, that you seemingly have little to no understanding of.  If I were to hazard a guess, I'd say that you were probably dealing with a small subset of people, and are attributing your interaction with them to an entire populace.

[mark_cameron]

6 minutes ago, Jito463 said:

What's to explain?  I don't know what misconceptions you have, and frankly I don't care enough to find out.  I just take exception to you making blanket statements about an entire people, that you seemingly have little to no understanding of.  If I were to hazard a guess, I'd say that you were probably dealing with a small subset of people, and are attributing your interaction with them to an entire populace.

Well I guess this kind of proves my point.

 

People under discussion will blindly believe Google, because they won't take the time to learn that what Google is doing in Europe is illegal. As it harms European consumers.

 

As I previously said. FTC were going to act on this themselves in 2013, but due to lobbying the executive branch in the US, were unable to act. The EU isn't afraid to act to regulate its markets to prevent anti-competitive practices.

[Drak3]

Maybe we should just build a prpverbial wall around the EU and deny them access to goods and services from the US. Ya'know, the ones that hurt them so.

 

It's for their own good, because apparently they're not smart enough to figure out that they don't need smartphones.

[Tech Enthusiast]

19 minutes ago, mark_cameron said:

People under discussion will blindly believe Google, because they won't take the time to learn that what Google is doing in Europe is illegal. As it harms European consumers.

1

Being a European consumer myself, how does Google harm me?

All I see is the court ruling being a harmful action for me tbh. Nothing positive can happen as a result.

 

If Google just pays up and removed Google Apps from the Google OS, then I have to reinstall them all every time I buy a new device.

And that is the BEST case.

 

What if the companies, that get the OS for free after all, simply alter them to only allow their Browser from being used.

THAT is fine according to the EU law. Samsung could just force me to use their craptastic "internet" App on my Galaxy.   

 

So I would have to decide if I buy a Galaxy because I love Galaxy devices, even tho I also want to use Chrome.

Sure, this might be the worst case, but the truth will likely be somewhere in the middle. And I seriously dislike the idea of that. 

 

Or, you know... Google could just stop developing Android at all. At least the open source, free version. Making the smartphone companies pay for the OS. I am quite sure that won't be good for them, or us. Either one would have to eat the costs. We, as the devices get more expensive, or they would have a smaller margin, leading to less competition that can enter the market. 

 

Google offering the OS for free, but making sure the apps that belong to the OS still remain there (optionally!), was the best possible way for the customers AND for competition.

Usually, I don't buy into PR crap, but this time around they are truly on point here. Google made competition easier to be had, not harder. And the EU ruling will negatively affect that in some way or the other.

[ItsMitch]

Why is politics bullshit being brought up in my thread? Piss off with your trump, wall fuckery. 

[Tech Enthusiast]

1 minute ago, mark_cameron said:

Anti-competitive practices ultimately lead to - poorer consumer choice and then consequentially higher consumer prices.

 

This has been proven time and again. Which is why there is global agreements prohibiting anti-competitive trade practices.

 

That is how Google is hurting you.

 

Its restricting your choice, and making you pay more for it.

You did not answer my question:

How does it hurt me? Apart from law speak that, in my eyes, does not fit this case at all. Like... at all.

 

What you keep chanting is law crap that is obviously not working as it should in this case.

They are targeting a "practice" that HELPS competition and HELPS the consumer. They are hurting me, not Google. All Google does "to me" is install a few apps that i can just freely uninstall as I see fit. Unlike the bloatware other companies put on my phone.

[mark_cameron]

1 minute ago, Rattenmann said:

You did not answer my question:

How does it hurt me? Apart from law speak that, in my eyes, does not fit this case at all. Like... at all.

 

What you keep chanting is law crap that is obviously not working as it should in this case.

They are targeting a "practice" that HELPS competition and HELPS the consumer. They are hurting me, not Google. All Google does "to me" is install a few apps that i can just freely uninstall as I see fit. Unlike the bloatware other companies put on my phone.

Its making you pay more for something you could get cheaper elsewhere.

 

It doesn't help competition.

 

Thats what the regulators have found.

[Tom is a Door]

US on the other hand trying to get people to pay more to these giant corps. How much money do need jesus

[Drak3]

51 minutes ago, Jito463 said:

*sigh*

 

/ignored

I'm with you on that one.

[LAwLz]

I see a lot of anti-EU comments in this thread, but I'd like to remind everyone that the US has fairly similar laws, and in the 90's the US went even further than the EU when they published Microsoft for bundling IE with Windows. 

 

The US wanted to break to break up Microsoft into two companies when it was discovered all the anti-competitive shit they were doing. 

[Sakkura]

 

[asus killer]

27 minutes ago, LAwLz said:

I see a lot of anti-EU comments in this thread, but I'd like to remind everyone that the US has fairly similar laws, and in the 90's the US went even further than the EU when they published Microsoft for bundling IE with Windows. 

 

The US wanted to break to break up Microsoft into two companies when it was discovered all the anti-competitive shit they were doing. 

as i recall the judge's sentencing went for a lot of things, then it almost all got overturned a few years later. That's why the EU later slapped Microsoft with it's own lawsuit and fine and only then did Microsoft stop bundling IE

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Microsoft_Corp.

http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-13-196_en.htm

 

So things have changed very little, the US is a joke at imposing competition on this big companies. Too much influence and corruption. In the US companies can get away with murder. The EU has to do all the work. Australia comes up with some measures as far as i'm aware and that's it.

[Drak3]

43 minutes ago, asus killer said:

Too much influence and corruption.

Just as much corruption in the EU when it comes to corporate affairs. It's just easier for the EU to steal money under the guise of " the consumers," because otherwise corpoorations have no reason to give them money.

44 minutes ago, asus killer said:

The EU has to do all the work

Stepping on corporate rights, such as bundling one's own software and offering it as a final product, must be real hard work.

[Mihle]

This will affect companies like Samsung or LG or whatever the most if Google change its practices, not consumers directly.

 

Anti competative and stuff isn't just about companies vs consumers, it's also about some companies vs other companies. 

 

If I remember right, Samsung was one of those that complained to EU about this.

[Drak3]

1 minute ago, Mihle said:

This will affect companies like Samsung or LG or whatever the most if Google change its practices, not consumers directly.

No, it won't. The only thing to come of this is Google losing $5bil. Everything else will remain unchanged.

[asus killer]

5 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Just as much corruption in the EU when it comes to corporate affairs. It's just easier for the EU to steal money under the guise of " the consumers," because otherwise corpoorations have no reason to give them money.

Stepping on corporate rights, such as bundling one's own software and offering it as a final product, must be real hard work.

there is corruption everywhere, literally, still in this topic the facts speak for themselves. This does not need to be a US vs EU war is everyone sticks to the facts. They are US companies, if the US acted the EU wouldn't have to.

[Mihle]

1 minute ago, Drak3 said:

No, it won't. The only thing to come of this is Google losing $5bil. Everything else will remain unchanged.

Depends if Google changes it practices or just continue as they have done and risk another fine.

[asus killer]

3 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

No, it won't. The only thing to come of this is Google losing $5bil. Everything else will remain unchanged.

come on i just presented you the Internet Explorer case, and you say nothing changes. There is also the GPDR that changed a lot for the all world not just EU, as there is similar cases from Australia (steam). It may it may not. That statement makes no sense.