Jump to content
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...
Pio Soesetio

i7 8750h - Power Limit Throttling - Low TDP Even though cooling is capable

Recommended Posts

Posted · Original PosterOP

I recently bought an ASUS TUF FX504 with an i7 8750h. The first time i ran cinebench (cpu) it has a 900+ score. Note that the first time i run cinebench i don't have any programs like intel xtu, throttlestop, cpuz, etc, just brand new out of the box with nothing installed. The next time i run it came out with only 750 ish score. I monitored the cpu and it was only running at 2.2 Ghz. This was n't caused by thermal throttling, because the cpu's temperatures were really low, only 55-60 celsius under full load. I opened intel xtu and noticed that it has a power limit throttling. And in throttlestop it shows that one of its limits is PL2. I tried undervolting the cache and the cpu core which resulted in an increase to the cpu frequency to 2.5-2.6 Ghz when running cinebench. Same case like before, thermals are not a problem, still hitting 55-60 celsius. Undervolting the cpu cache increases the cpu frequency, while the core clock doesn't do much, but i can only do it until a certain point. The power limit throttling is still there and i think it is the one that is causing the cpu frequency to be so low. Another thing that i noticed is that when the cpu is running all cores at 100% load, the pacakge tdp is only 25W despite the rated tdp at 45W. Changing the package power limit also didn't help. I changed it to 70W but it only reaches a max of 25W TDP when running cinebench. Btw, the cpu can still run up to 4 Ghz in daily tasks where the cpu load is pretty low. Please help me out. 

Capture1.PNG

Capture11.PNG

Capture11111.PNG

Capture123213.PNG

1123.PNG

12312321.PNG

1232142145.PNG

Capture.PNG

1231245124.PNG

Link to post
Share on other sites

Let me tell you why. That model has a crap cooling. It has firmware throttling set at a fairly low temp. Since you've tried undervolting, there's nothing you can do (don't undervolt core voltage too much). You can't change the PL1 limit too (firmware lock).


PMs only for laptop recommendations (for now)

 

My daily driver: Lenovo Legion Y530 [REVIEW]

Spoiler

Intel Core i5-8300H Nvidia GTX1050Ti 2GB LP156WFG-SPB2 144Hz IPS 16GB 2666MHz DDR4 RAM (2x8GB) Samsung PM981 256GB+Seagate 1TB 5400RPM

Check out my blog here

Check out my older laptop reviews here

Laptop ODMsClevo, Tongfang, Quanta

 

My Phone: Xiaomi Mi 9 Lite (Blue colour, protected with XUNDD hard case)

Spoiler

SDM710 6GB RAM 128GB ROM 6.39" AMOLED 4030mAh+18W fast charge microSD+3.5mm

48MP Sony IMX586 rear (AI triple camera) 32MP Samsung S5KGD1 front

MIUI 10 (haven't upgrade to MIUI 11) Android 9 (waiting for Android 10)

Link to post
Share on other sites

It's a brand new machine as far as I'm aware. Wait for a BIOS update and pray. :P


S.K.Y.N.E.T. Reborn

i7-8750H | 32GB DDR4 2666 | 6GB GTX 1060 | 15.6" 1080P 144Hz IPS Panel | 256GB Phison M.2 SSD | 500GB Samsung 840 Pro SSD1TB Western Digital NVMe SSD | Intel Wireless-AC 9560

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted · Original PosterOP
9 hours ago, ZM Fong said:

Let me tell you why. That model has a crap cooling. It has firmware throttling set at a fairly low temp. Since you've tried undervolting, there's nothing you can do (don't undervolt core voltage too much). You can't change the PL1 limit too (firmware lock).

You sure about the crap cooling? Look at the temps... it's only reaching around 60 degrees at stress test. The temps are the same when not undervolted. When it is undervolted, the core frequency increases but the tdp doesn't reduce or increase. and playing games (using both gpu and cpu), the temps never reach 70 celsius on the gpu and the cpu still stays around 60 degrees.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted · Original PosterOP
7 hours ago, Imglidinhere said:

It's a brand new machine as far as I'm aware. Wait for a BIOS update and pray. :P

Yeah hopefully there's a bios update

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted · Original PosterOP
9 hours ago, ZM Fong said:

Let me tell you why. That model has a crap cooling. It has firmware throttling set at a fairly low temp. Since you've tried undervolting, there's nothing you can do (don't undervolt core voltage too much). You can't change the PL1 limit too (firmware lock).

Cant the PL2 limit be changed? The thing that limits the processor is the PL2.

Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, Pio Soesetio said:

Look at the temps... it's only reaching around 60 degrees at stress test

This is because the clock speeds are low

28 minutes ago, Pio Soesetio said:

Cant the PL2 limit be changed? The thing that limits the processor is the PL2.

Cannot, firmware lock


PMs only for laptop recommendations (for now)

 

My daily driver: Lenovo Legion Y530 [REVIEW]

Spoiler

Intel Core i5-8300H Nvidia GTX1050Ti 2GB LP156WFG-SPB2 144Hz IPS 16GB 2666MHz DDR4 RAM (2x8GB) Samsung PM981 256GB+Seagate 1TB 5400RPM

Check out my blog here

Check out my older laptop reviews here

Laptop ODMsClevo, Tongfang, Quanta

 

My Phone: Xiaomi Mi 9 Lite (Blue colour, protected with XUNDD hard case)

Spoiler

SDM710 6GB RAM 128GB ROM 6.39" AMOLED 4030mAh+18W fast charge microSD+3.5mm

48MP Sony IMX586 rear (AI triple camera) 32MP Samsung S5KGD1 front

MIUI 10 (haven't upgrade to MIUI 11) Android 9 (waiting for Android 10)

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm experiencing the same thing on my Razer Blade 15. No matter how cool I keep the cpu I get power limit throttling. I'm thinking only a bios update could fix this.

Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Firebat246 said:

Razer Blade 15

Same issue: bad cooling


PMs only for laptop recommendations (for now)

 

My daily driver: Lenovo Legion Y530 [REVIEW]

Spoiler

Intel Core i5-8300H Nvidia GTX1050Ti 2GB LP156WFG-SPB2 144Hz IPS 16GB 2666MHz DDR4 RAM (2x8GB) Samsung PM981 256GB+Seagate 1TB 5400RPM

Check out my blog here

Check out my older laptop reviews here

Laptop ODMsClevo, Tongfang, Quanta

 

My Phone: Xiaomi Mi 9 Lite (Blue colour, protected with XUNDD hard case)

Spoiler

SDM710 6GB RAM 128GB ROM 6.39" AMOLED 4030mAh+18W fast charge microSD+3.5mm

48MP Sony IMX586 rear (AI triple camera) 32MP Samsung S5KGD1 front

MIUI 10 (haven't upgrade to MIUI 11) Android 9 (waiting for Android 10)

Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, ZM Fong said:

Same issue: bad cooling

No, as OP said.. even when the temps are in check across the board.. there is power limit throttling. You should not be getting throttled down if you are sitting at 70c on the CPU. Bad cooling=Not the issue. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

In the Turbo Power Limits window, it shows that TDP Level Control is checked and this is set to 1.  Try setting that to 0.  I think HWiNFO can show what TDP Level the CPU is currently running in.  TDP Level 1 is the low power level so you definitely do not want to be in that.  This setting can be set in multiple locations within the CPU.  ThrottleStop does not have access to all of these locations so you might be screwed.  

 

When Speed Shift is enabled, there is no need to use the Set Multiplier or SpeedStep options.  Both of these are ignored when Speed Shift is enabled. 

 

There is also no need to check the Clock Modulation setting unless you see a number less than 100.0 in the Mod column or in the TS Log File.  I do not think this throttling method is being used anymore.  Intel has created new power based throttling methods that laptop manufacturers love to use.  An 8750H is a wonderful CPU in theory but when limited to only 25 Watts, it is kind of a joke.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Firebat246 said:

No, as OP said.. even when the temps are in check across the board.. there is power limit throttling. You should not be getting throttled down if you are sitting at 70c on the CPU. Bad cooling=Not the issue. 

I think you don't understand here. Because it has a bad cooling, there is firmware set inside that limits the power draw. Low clocks=Low temps


PMs only for laptop recommendations (for now)

 

My daily driver: Lenovo Legion Y530 [REVIEW]

Spoiler

Intel Core i5-8300H Nvidia GTX1050Ti 2GB LP156WFG-SPB2 144Hz IPS 16GB 2666MHz DDR4 RAM (2x8GB) Samsung PM981 256GB+Seagate 1TB 5400RPM

Check out my blog here

Check out my older laptop reviews here

Laptop ODMsClevo, Tongfang, Quanta

 

My Phone: Xiaomi Mi 9 Lite (Blue colour, protected with XUNDD hard case)

Spoiler

SDM710 6GB RAM 128GB ROM 6.39" AMOLED 4030mAh+18W fast charge microSD+3.5mm

48MP Sony IMX586 rear (AI triple camera) 32MP Samsung S5KGD1 front

MIUI 10 (haven't upgrade to MIUI 11) Android 9 (waiting for Android 10)

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted · Original PosterOP
53 minutes ago, unclewebb said:

ThrottleStop does not have access to all of these locations so you might be screwed.  

 

So where can i change that?

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted · Original PosterOP
2 hours ago, ZM Fong said:

This is because the clock speeds are low

Which means that the clock speed can and should be higher because the temps are still low. But that doesn't happen because of power limits.

Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, Pio Soesetio said:

Which means that the clock speed can and should be higher because the temps are still low. But that doesn't happen because of power limits.

With higher clocks the temps will become higher too. The main issue here is the cooling, it's one of the worst cooling design I've ever seen. Not capable of handling a 8750H. If you don't believe what I said then I'll leave this thread.


PMs only for laptop recommendations (for now)

 

My daily driver: Lenovo Legion Y530 [REVIEW]

Spoiler

Intel Core i5-8300H Nvidia GTX1050Ti 2GB LP156WFG-SPB2 144Hz IPS 16GB 2666MHz DDR4 RAM (2x8GB) Samsung PM981 256GB+Seagate 1TB 5400RPM

Check out my blog here

Check out my older laptop reviews here

Laptop ODMsClevo, Tongfang, Quanta

 

My Phone: Xiaomi Mi 9 Lite (Blue colour, protected with XUNDD hard case)

Spoiler

SDM710 6GB RAM 128GB ROM 6.39" AMOLED 4030mAh+18W fast charge microSD+3.5mm

48MP Sony IMX586 rear (AI triple camera) 32MP Samsung S5KGD1 front

MIUI 10 (haven't upgrade to MIUI 11) Android 9 (waiting for Android 10)

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted · Original PosterOP
14 minutes ago, ZM Fong said:

With higher clocks the temps will become higher too. The main issue here is the cooling, it's one of the worst cooling design I've ever seen. Not capable of handling a 8750H. If you don't believe what I said then I'll leave this thread.

Yes cooling is not the best but it can still be pushed higher. I've seen other laptops that will hit higher clock speeds even though at the cost of hitting 85-95 celsius. But this just can't. I would rather see my cpu hit 85 celsius but with a higher clock speed rather than just being limited to 2.7 Ghz even though it's not hot. I'm just looking for a solution so that i can break through that power limit throttling and reach higher clock speeds even though it will run hotter. And you can leave if you want. Ik it's cooling's not the best but the cpu could still run better with that cooling solution.

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Pio Soesetio said:

I'm just looking for a solution so that i can break through that power limit throttling and reach higher clock speeds even though it will run hotter.

There's no solution for that. Firmware locked. See Notebookcheck and Ultrabookreview reviews for more info.


PMs only for laptop recommendations (for now)

 

My daily driver: Lenovo Legion Y530 [REVIEW]

Spoiler

Intel Core i5-8300H Nvidia GTX1050Ti 2GB LP156WFG-SPB2 144Hz IPS 16GB 2666MHz DDR4 RAM (2x8GB) Samsung PM981 256GB+Seagate 1TB 5400RPM

Check out my blog here

Check out my older laptop reviews here

Laptop ODMsClevo, Tongfang, Quanta

 

My Phone: Xiaomi Mi 9 Lite (Blue colour, protected with XUNDD hard case)

Spoiler

SDM710 6GB RAM 128GB ROM 6.39" AMOLED 4030mAh+18W fast charge microSD+3.5mm

48MP Sony IMX586 rear (AI triple camera) 32MP Samsung S5KGD1 front

MIUI 10 (haven't upgrade to MIUI 11) Android 9 (waiting for Android 10)

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted · Original PosterOP
28 minutes ago, ZM Fong said:

There's no solution for that. Firmware locked. See Notebookcheck and Ultrabookreview reviews for more info.

link pls

Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, unclewebb said:

In the Turbo Power Limits window, it shows that TDP Level Control is checked and this is set to 1.  Try setting that to 0. 

Did you try changing that setting in ThrottleStop yet?  Did you try HWiNFO yet to monitor for this? 

 

Intel calls this cTDP or configurable TDP.  It allows individual manufacturers to easily lower the TDP power limit below the 45 Watt rated limit.  When pressed hard, the CPU will throttle back its speed so it does not exceed this lower TDP value.  This throttling is power related, not temperature related.  

 

Your screenshot also shows that Asus lowered the thermal throttling temperature from the Intel rated 100°C to 88°C so I will not be surprised if they also lowered the power limit.  As a consumer, sometimes problems like this are impossible to solve.  The only solution is to put the laptop back in the box and tell Asus that they can have it back.  Its performance does not live up to its appearance.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted · Original PosterOP
On 6/5/2018 at 10:42 PM, unclewebb said:

Did you try changing that setting in ThrottleStop yet?  Did you try HWiNFO yet to monitor for this? 

 

Intel calls this cTDP or configurable TDP.  It allows individual manufacturers to easily lower the TDP power limit below the 45 Watt rated limit.  When pressed hard, the CPU will throttle back its speed so it does not exceed this lower TDP value.  This throttling is power related, not temperature related.  

 

Your screenshot also shows that Asus lowered the thermal throttling temperature from the Intel rated 100°C to 88°C so I will not be surprised if they also lowered the power limit.  As a consumer, sometimes problems like this are impossible to solve.  The only solution is to put the laptop back in the box and tell Asus that they can have it back.  Its performance does not live up to its appearance.  

yes I have tried changing it to 0 in throttlestop and nothing seems to happen. What should i monitor in HWINFO

Link to post
Share on other sites

just a thought. From XTU make your

 

Core Voltage:1,100V

Processor Core IccMax: take slider all the way to the right

Turbo Boost Short Power Max: Disable

Turbo Boost Power Max: 60W

Turbo Boost Power Time Window: 96 sec

 

And run the benchmark test lets see the results

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted · Original PosterOP
9 hours ago, gQx said:

just a thought. From XTU make your

 

Core Voltage:1,100V

Processor Core IccMax: take slider all the way to the right

Turbo Boost Short Power Max: Disable

Turbo Boost Power Max: 60W

Turbo Boost Power Time Window: 96 sec

 

And run the benchmark test lets see the results

how do i disable turbo boost short power max?

edit : nevermind, found it

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted · Original PosterOP
9 hours ago, gQx said:

just a thought. From XTU make your

 

Core Voltage:1,100V

Processor Core IccMax: take slider all the way to the right

Turbo Boost Short Power Max: Disable

Turbo Boost Power Max: 60W

Turbo Boost Power Time Window: 96 sec

 

And run the benchmark test lets see the results

Capture.thumb.PNG.3f39b9e0812718eed41e9c2d8fcddaac.PNG12.thumb.PNG.25f4ab7a1702204bfc9f7805d72249c9.PNG1.thumb.PNG.c15d22aa26ffa85dc842bb34bb41f123.PNG

Link to post
Share on other sites

I forgot to mention about reducing offset voltage these are my settings and cpu wont go below 3.88GHz while temperature doesnt exceed 82-83C and no throttling. I use both xtu and throttlestop at the same time I didnt try using just one yet sorry. cinebench 1237 

xtu.jpg

throt1.jpg

t2.jpg

Adsız.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×