Suggestions for our iMac Pro repair

[jscobee]

Nothing to see here. Move along.

[orbitalbuzzsaw]

6 hours ago, Theguywhobea said:

Take the internals out, make a new enclosure for them, and mount them to the back of a regular monitor.

or you could just build a hackintosh?

[Drak3]

LM and watercool the fucker, and turn it into a custom desk PC.

[DrMacintosh]

34 minutes ago, DocSwag said:

Question: what US and Canadian laws is it that Apple exactly is breaking by refusing to repair the iMac Pro? I tried doing a quick search for some but couldn't find any, so I was just curious if manufacturers are obligated to offer repair services for their devices.

They are not in this case. 

 

LTT opened the device, modified it, broke it, and went to Apple expecting them to fix it because “they are willing to pay.” 

 

And in doing so they voided their warranty and any entitlement to a repair direct from Apple. 

 

Linus uses a pretty bad analogy with cars in the video. He left out the details of what they did to the machine before they broke it. Those details just so happen to be why the product can be denied servicing. 

[NSManiac]

6 hours ago, GabenJr said:

Hey guys, so the video is up and we're turning to you. Apple can't help us, AASPs aren't really getting the parts, either - What can we do? Let us know!

It would be interesting to see you file a class action suit against Apple Inc. In your case its actual damage to a part, but what if that part was defective? Hard to believe it can’t even be sourced from the manufacturer (Apple) 

 

Just sue them so we can some videos - LTT GOES TO COURT! 

[bluefin02]

Hi,

 

I own a 3rd party Apple Repair company.   We buy/sell and repair all Apple Laptops and Desktops, right down to the component level.   I am 100% sure we could fix this, but the video on youtube does not explain whats wrong, do you have more info?  Does the unit boot?   Does the unit boot without display? 

 

If the unit was in front of me, this is where I would start:

 

1) Measure voltage with the power cable plugged in, to see if the SMC is getting power.  Attempt a power on and see what kind of voltage I get on the PSU.   If this is not correct, thats our first problem.   We can attach an external power supply to drive the voltage into the motherboard, to see if the PSU is the issue.

 

2) After we get trickle power, we are looking for a boot and chime next.  If we don't get a chime, we need to test the power rails on the motherboard, again not an issue.   Once we finally do get a chime, we need to see if the LCD has an image.   If the LCD does not, we need to check the CPU and or GPU.

 

3) Once we get an image on the screen, we need to see how the unit boots.

 

4) If there is still no image on the LCD, we need to check the voltage driven to the LCD connector, cross check it with normal backlight voltages, etc.    We need to check the LCD ribbon via diode mode to see if the cable is good.   We need to check the LVDS connector on the LCD for the same.  

 

Finally, if it is determined some components are bad and a simple board repair isn't the solution, we need to be able to find a supplier for the actual parts, which may be difficult this early in production.    We do have connections from direct suppliers overseas, but would need to know more info to hassle them right now.

 

Tossing parts is expensive and not a guaranteed solution, unless you know what you are doing.   Testing this at the component level is the only way to fix this machine.  

 

Finally, I do see why Apple is having an issue repairing this.  The unit was disassembled (from what it seems), which is an instant void of warranty.   To be able to diagnose what is wrong on a voided unit, they must have a trained tech for this unit, which they probably don't have accessible yet.   Since Apple has no clue about component level repairs, dishing out boards and/or Displays, PSU's on a new unit is worthless to them, for something that is now voided.

 

Let me know if you need some help.   I'm 100% sure we can fix it, I'm not 100% sure we can obtain the parts needed to fix this (if parts are needed).

[DrMacintosh]

2 minutes ago, RSHEWETT said:

It would be interesting to see you file a class action suit against Apple Inc. In your case its actual damage to a part, but what if that part was defective? Hard to believe it can’t even be sourced from the manufacturer (Apple) 

 

Just sue them so we can some videos - LTT GOES TO COURT! 

I doubt even Saul Goodman would want to represent them for that.....

 

Parts can be sourced, it’s just that their repair programs are currently all in place to be able to fix something like this. 

 

A further debuff is applied to LTT because of what they did to the Mac before they broke it. 

 

If the Mac failed or just shattered on its own they would be in a pretty good position to get it serviced/replaced/whatever, and would be in the right to complain that Apple would not service it if that is how that scenario were to play out....but they opened it, tinkered with it, and broke it themselves. Causing the situation they are in right now. 

[DrMacintosh]

4 minutes ago, bluefin02 said:

snip

Sounds like a good lead to me! 

[OTG]

1 minute ago, DrMacintosh said:

They are not in this case. 

 

LTT opened the device, modified it, broke it, and went to Apple expecting them to fix it because “they are willing to pay.” 

 

And in doing so they voided their warranty and any entitlement to a repair direct from Apple. 

 

Linus uses a pretty bad analogy with cars in the video. He left out the details of what they did to the machine before they broke it. Those details just so happen to be why the product can be denied servicing. 

Legality has almost nothing to do with this.  

As a company that wants to retain customers, Apple should at least pretend to give half a damn about keeping those customers happy.  

Even if they're legally in the clear, it's a pretty retarded move.  

Let's bring this back to cars because why not: if you tinker with your new BMW, and fry the main computer, or strip a bunch of bolts on the engine block, do you know what BMW will say when you bring it in to get fixed?  "Of course, will that be cash or credit?"  Maybe even give you a free rental while they replace the parts you broke.  

Doing this to ANY paying customer is idiotic, but doing it to a customer that has a fairly large online presence and fanbase is actually kinda funny.  

I was considering another mac to replace my 2009 Macbook, but this incident makes it pretty obvious that despite the charms of OSX, this isn't a company that I want to give money to.  I really doubt I'm the only person who feels this way.  

 

That's of course disregarding that Apple may, in fact, be violating consumer protection laws in both the US and Canada.  
 

[DocSwag]

17 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

They are not in this case. 

 

LTT opened the device, modified it, broke it, and went to Apple expecting them to fix it because “they are willing to pay.” 

 

And in doing so they voided their warranty and any entitlement to a repair direct from Apple. 

 

Linus uses a pretty bad analogy with cars in the video. He left out the details of what they did to the machine before they broke it. Those details just so happen to be why the product can be denied servicing. 

That makes sense. I believe Apple should've prepared themselves to offer repairs for the product, but it doesn't seem like they're doing anything inherently illegal here.

[DrMacintosh]

2 minutes ago, OTG said:

I really doubt I'm the only person who feels this way.  

You aren’t, but I think LTT needs a little course in personal responsibility here. 

 

Sure it it would be nice if Apple serviced the Mac. But it would also be nice if LTT didn’t go inside a machine explicitly designed not to be opened and broke it. 

 

And according to LTT, Apple does not have programs set up to handle this kind of stuff anyway at the moment. If this was an issue covered in warranty I have no doubts they would get a new machine because of the fact that Apple does not have their programs set up yet. 

 

But this isnt an in warranty issue, LTT did almost literally everything to void their warranty and as a result are put on the back burner as they should be. 

 

As for your decision to not buy a new Mac, good for you. Vote with your wallet. Don’t buy from companies you don’t feel comfortable supporting. 

 

Hopfully you find a machine you like. 

[Maddhawk]

Call Louis Rossman and see if he can help. You even did a video with him in the past attempting BGA resoldering.

 

[Blademaster91]

10 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

They are not in this case. 

LTT opened the device, modified it, broke it, and went to Apple expecting them to fix it because “they are willing to pay.” 

And in doing so they voided their warranty and any entitlement to a repair direct from Apple. 

Linus uses a pretty bad analogy with cars in the video. He left out the details of what they did to the machine before they broke it. Those details just so happen to be why the product can be denied servicing. 

Except that Apple refusing to repair it even when Linus was willing to pay is inexcusable, and the excuse of there needing to be a "pro" repair technician that Apple doesn't even have organized right when these machines break for a fancier high spec'ed imac is also ridiculous. Also being a "pro" machine means it should be allowed to be user serviceable,upgrading the ram is hardly "modifying" it.

41 minutes ago, demonofelru said:

Honestly this is not the big deal you are making it out to be. Your car analogy is horrible, you didn't drop it coming out of the store, you opened it and broke it. Try buying a new car messing with the alternator breaking it, then asking for a repair, you will likely encounter the same exact scenario. This is a VERY common thing with new cars, your analogy is just making Apple's argument stronger, despite you using a faulty analogy in your favor. That being said, yeah it doesn't look great, and I can understand the frustration, but you come off privileged as well.

A better car analogy is like buying a brand new car you drive it off the lot, a rock hits your windshield and cracks it. The car dealer says nope and won't honor the repair of replacing your windshield even if you're willing to cover the cost outside of any insurance. Apple is being petty and doesn't want to cover the cost of pretty much giving them a new machine.

[DrMacintosh]

3 minutes ago, DocSwag said:

That makes sense. I believe Apple should've prepared themselves to offer repairs for the product

Yes. Apple defienlty dropped the ball by not having customer service lanes already in place by the time the iMac Pro was released, but they technically are not doing anything wrong. It’s just upsetting and tbh I get why LTT is frustrated....but I also see why Apple won’t directly repair the Mac at this point in time. 

 

 

[Reizephyr]

I'm not sure why is this happening, but I work for an authorized service provider, and I'm certified on iMac Pro so no idea why they tell you that, if you want me I can help you to get the parts and the iMac repair. As a matter of fact, we received the cerfication videos last month, I haven't personally worked on any yet, but I will be happy to help you, to figured out.

[OTG]

Just now, DrMacintosh said:

You aren’t, but I think LTT needs a little course in personal responsibility here. 

 

Sure it it would be nice if Apple serviced the Mac. But it would also be nice if LTT didn’t go inside a machine explicitly designed not to be opened and broke it. 

 

And according to LTT, Apple does not have programs set up to handle this kind of stuff anyway at the moment. If this was an issue covered in warranty I have no doubts they would get a new machine because of the fact that Apple does not have their programs set up yet. 

 

But this isnt an in warranty issue, LTT did almost literally everything to void their warranty and as a result are put on the back burner as they should be. 

 

As for your decision to not buy a new Mac, good for you. Vote with your wallet. Don’t buy from companies you don’t feel comfortable supporting. 

 

Hopfully you find a machine you like. 

Responsibility?  They broke it, told Apple they broke it, tried to pay to have it repaired, and were told (essentially): "Piss off, we can't be bothered."  

NOBODY ever claimed that the warranty was even in play.  This is a matter of supporting your customers, especially customers that are able and willing to pay for repairs.  

Releasing a product, that many customers will be using to run businesses to earn a living, but being unable or unwilling to repair that product? 

Even now, fully five months after launch?  

Stupidly, blatantly, hilariously, unacceptable.  

[DrMacintosh]

7 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

Except that Apple refusing to repair it even when Linus was willing to pay is inexcusable,

If I were to take a 1080Ti, open it up, start doing component level tinkering, and in doing so broke the card, and turned around to Nvidia and said, “Fix it I’ll pay you” 

 

Would you expect Nvidia to accept that? Hell no they wouldn’t. 

 

7 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

A better car analogy is like buying a brand new car you drive it off the lot, a rock hits your windshield and cracks it. The car dealer says nope and won't honor the repair of replacing your windshield even if you're willing to cover the cost outside of any insurance.

That’s really a much worse analogy since insurance companies will replace windshields. They have to. Any deaths caused by a shattered windshield can and will make the insurance company pay big time as the driver can and will get off with minimal negative consequences with a good lawyer. 

 

LTT voided their “insurance” with everything they did to the Mac. 

7 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

Apple is being petty and doesn't want to cover the cost of pretty much giving them a new machine.

Because they shouldn’t have to cover the cost of LTTs deliberate actions. 

[DrMacintosh]

3 minutes ago, OTG said:

Responsibility?  They broke it, told Apple they broke it, tried to pay to have it repaired, and were told (essentially): "Piss off, we can't be bothered."  

Why should Apple cover for LTTs deliberate actions to mess with the machine and as a result broke it? 

 

4 minutes ago, OTG said:

This is a matter of supporting your customers, especially customers that are able and willing to pay for repairs. 

There is a difference between servicing a customer who has a issue caused by a faulty product. It’s another issue when the customer broke that product with deliberate action. 

 

Customers that are are entitled to a repair or replacement (those who have not voided their warranty) should get one. Customers who have broken their machines because of their own mistakes (LTT) they are going to have to either wait or find a 3rd party to help them. 

[Blademaster91]

1 minute ago, DrMacintosh said:

If I were to take a 1080Ti, open it up, start doing component level tinkering, and in doing so broke the card, and turned around to Nvidia and said, “Fix it I’ll pay you” 

 

Would you expect Nvidia to accept that? Hell no they wouldn’t. 

 

That’s really a much worse analogy since insurance companies will replace windshields. They have to. Any deaths caused by a shattered windshield can and will make the insurance company pay big time. 

 

LTT voided their “insurance” with everything they did to the Mac. 

Because they shouldn’t have to cover the cost of LTTs deliberate actions. 

I'm not sure about Nvidia directly though EVGA for example doesn't care as long as you can prove the card was defective before you took it apart.

Yeah that analogy is bad too though it should have been covered with Applecare or the existing 1 year warranty,especially for such an expensive computer that is now a paperweight. It doesn't make sense for Apple to make a enthusiast/pro level desktop that fits standardized hardware yet won't let you upgrade it, and it isn't their fault for accidentally breaking an incredibly fragile glass screen that Apple should have spare parts for.

 

[Decent60]

8 minutes ago, OTG said:

Responsibility?  They broke it, told Apple they broke it, tried to pay to have it repaired, and were told (essentially): "Piss off, we can't be bothered."  

NOBODY ever claimed that the warranty was even in play.  This is a matter of supporting your customers, especially customers that are able and willing to pay for repairs.  

Releasing a product, that many customers will be using to run businesses to earn a living, but being unable or unwilling to repair that product? 

Even now, fully five months after launch?  

Stupidly, blatantly, hilariously, unacceptable.  

It wasn't a "Piss off, we can't be bothered." it was a "sorry, we can't ship this store the parts" and that was probably due to the store not having any tech certified in it (Which the training was out in November).
It was also shortly after launch, so it is feasible that they don't have any "spare" parts for it, most companies would have just exchanged it. However, Linus never said if they went back or tried to contact the store again to see if they could repair it.
Just like that AASP that Ed said he knew, they didn't have a tech to order the part with either.

[AnonymousGuy]

 

2 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

I'm not sure about Nvidia directly though EVGA for example doesn't care as long as you can prove the card was defective before you took it apart.

Yeah that analogy is bad too though it should have been covered with Applecare or the existing 1 year warranty,especially for such an expensive computer that is now a paperweight. It doesn't make sense for Apple to make a enthusiast/pro level desktop that fits standardized hardware yet won't let you upgrade it, and it isn't their fault for accidentally breaking an incredibly fragile glass screen that Apple should have spare parts for.

 

Only AppleCare covers accidental damage, which they should have bought if they knew they were going to be doing this level of fuckery with this thing.

 

And the one time I've used AppleCare on my iPhone, they were fucking awesome.

[OTG]

1 minute ago, DrMacintosh said:

Why should Apple cover for LTTs deliberate actions to mess with the machine and as a result broke it? 

 

There is a difference between servicing a customer who has a issue caused by a faulty product. It’s another issue when the customer broke that product with deliberate action. 

 

Customers that are are entitled to a repair or replacement (those who have not voided their warranty) should get one. Customers who have broken their machines because of their own mistakes (LTT) they are going to have to either wait or find a 3rd party to help them. 

juanrga is that you?  Moonlighting?  

Sorry, you reminded me of a poster on some other forums.  

 

Anyhow.

Way to ignore everything that matters.  

Apple is not being asked to "cover" anything, merely to SELL replacement components (which are modular and mass-produced) at whatever markup they feel necessary.  

Third parties and even Apple's OWN REPAIR FACILITIES can't even get access to the components.  

It's incredible incompetence and mismanagement.

[PewlettHackard]

38 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

They are not in this case. 

 

LTT opened the device, modified it, broke it, and went to Apple expecting them to fix it because “they are willing to pay.” 

 

And in doing so they voided their warranty and any entitlement to a repair direct from Apple. 

 

Linus uses a pretty bad analogy with cars in the video. He left out the details of what they did to the machine before they broke it. Those details just so happen to be why the product can be denied servicing. 

 

Actually, that's wrong. In the United States they'd have broken the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act which prohibits, among other things, manufacturers from refusing service simply because someone else worked on it. 

[TechViper]

I am the Owner and Operator of Viper Tech & Repair and http://www.powerbookmedic.com/ is the source i use for IMac and macbook supplies, many of the Parts on this site are pulled from working machine. They have a grading scale for parts such as c,b,a,and refurb. c,b, and a are all OEM parts from what i believe, this will most likely be your best source for the parts you need. good luck Linus Team

[demonofelru]

9 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

 

A better car analogy is like buying a brand new car you drive it off the lot, a rock hits your windshield and cracks it. The car dealer says nope and won't honor the repair of replacing your windshield even if you're willing to cover the cost outside of any insurance. Apple is being petty and doesn't want to cover the cost of pretty much giving them a new machine.

That’s still a poor analogy.  It wasn’t damaged in a freak accident that could happen to anybody.  They serviced very explicitly non-user serviceable parts and messed up in the process.  It would be like a dealership telling you don’t replace your headlights, they’re not an easy thing to replace by normal people.  If you replace them and break something they are not liable.  

 

Now i get that when you would come back and say, “look I know I messed up, how much to fix what I did?” And they say, “no we can’t help you at all.”being frustrated.  I don’t buy Apple just doesn’t have the parts, and they are being petty.  I just think both sides are being very petty.

 

Again those analogies are only telling a slanted side towards his view though. The reality is much more nuanced, it’s not a rock hitting the car while in normal use.  His motherboard didn’t fry, or whatever failure/failures due to just using it like your analogy.