4000€+ gaming and streaming pc system theorycrafting(long post and thread)

PopsiclesInMyCellar · November 25, 2017

38 minutes ago, Halazar said:

Your use is a little different from mine, since I will be mainly just gaming and streaming and maybe a little bit of editing, and strangely you lean more towards intel than threadripper

1

I was only leaning towards Intel due to the minor fact that Mac virtual machines can only run on Intel processors. I have had to run Mac VMs in the past, so I thought this should be a requirement. However, I think I've totally scrapped that preference; the priority now is simply what processor will be the best for streaming/gaming simultaneously.

Back to your (our) issue, this article from Logical Increments I shared says "If you're on a tight budget, it makes more sense to game and stream from one PC, and get a faster GPU and CPU." which makes total sense, in my opinion. If you go the route of using two separate machines, the stream machine is super minimal (no graphics card required, very little RAM, etc). It makes sense to pay a little more for the one machine, as you just (apparently) need 4 extra cores to handle the streaming and streaming demands ZERO GPU work.

So, in short, it seems that streaming only needs about 4 more cores, and perhaps about 4GB more RAM--very minimal.

EDIT : Take a look at this for the 7900X vs 1950X: http://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i9-7900X-vs-AMD-Ryzen-TR-1950X/3936vs3932

Halazar · November 26, 2017

1 hour ago, PopsiclesInMyCellar said:

I was only leaning towards Intel due to the minor fact that Mac virtual machines can only run on Intel processors. I have had to run Mac VMs in the past, so I thought this should be a requirement. However, I think I've totally scrapped that preference; the priority now is simply what processor will be the best for streaming/gaming simultaneously.

Back to your (our) issue, this article from Logical Increments I shared says "If you're on a tight budget, it makes more sense to game and stream from one PC, and get a faster GPU and CPU." which makes total sense, in my opinion. If you go the route of using two separate machines, the stream machine is super minimal (no graphics card required, very little RAM, etc). It makes sense to pay a little more for the one machine, as you just (apparently) need 4 extra cores to handle the streaming and streaming demands ZERO GPU work.

Thats what I also was thinking; one VERY good machine > one good machine+one mediocre machine

But the suggestion of @brob about using one of those cases that can host 2 systems at once inside them is, to be honest... exciting but at the same time, still complicated; if the CPU is not good enough on the second system, how will I be able to stream + record? I need at least 8 cores, or a good gpu to use nvenc.

I tried to do a build with that dual-system case in mind;

Spoiler

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

I know its grossly overbudget and there could be alot of cuts but this is just the idea;
The 8700k for top gaming performance, with the 500gb ssd and the 1080ti; the trident Zs are for this system.

the 1800x for not too costly streaming and video editing power, with the 250gb ssd and the 1050ti in order to have no problems in case of graphical-intensive tasks on that pc(I could probably choose a less expensive ones easily obviously); the flare Xs are for this system.

Both CPUs cooled by the Noctua air coolers(maybe the 1800x could get away with cheaper coolers), one x300 4tb HD each; one for games, the other for videos and other files.
That PSU should be enough to power both systems

I don't know how if that case is good enough, and I don't know if it would need extra fans
its a fun tought experiment but I don't think its worth it, what do you guys think?

PopsiclesInMyCellar · November 26, 2017

9 minutes ago, Halazar said:

Thats what I also was thinking; one VERY good machine > one good machine+one mediocre machine

But the suggestion of @brob about using one of those cases that can host 2 systems at once inside them is, to be honest... exciting but at the same time, still complicated; if the CPU is not good enough on the second system, how will I be able to stream + record? I need at least 8 cores, or a good gpu to use nvenc.

I tried to do a build with that dual-system case in mind;

Reveal hidden contents

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel - Core i7-8700K 3.7GHz 6-Core Processor (€422.55 @ Amazon Italia)
CPU Cooler: Noctua - NH-D15 82.5 CFM CPU Cooler (€89.89 @ Amazon Italia)
CPU Cooler: Noctua - NH-D15 82.5 CFM CPU Cooler (€89.89 @ Amazon Italia)
Motherboard: Gigabyte - Z370 AORUS Gaming 7 (rev. 1.0) ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (€217.00)
Memory: G.Skill - Trident Z 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 Memory (€203.99 @ Amazon Italia)
Memory: G.Skill - Flare X 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-2400 Memory (€196.19 @ Amazon Italia)
Storage: Samsung - 960 EVO 250GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive (€128.37 @ Amazon Italia)
Storage: Samsung - 960 EVO 500GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive (€231.00)
Storage: Toshiba - X300 4TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (€156.80 @ Amazon Italia)
Storage: Toshiba - X300 4TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (€156.80 @ Amazon Italia)
Video Card: Asus - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB STRIX GAMING Video Card (€898.00 @ Amazon Italia)
Case: Thermaltake - Core W200 ATX Full Tower Case (€579.99 @ Amazon Italia)
Power Supply: SeaSonic - PRIME Gold 1200W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply (€244.60 @ Amazon Italia)
Optical Drive: Lite-On - iHAS124-14 DVD/CD Writer (€16.18 @ Amazon Italia)
Operating System: Microsoft - Windows 10 Home OEM 64-bit (€97.90 @ Amazon Italia)
Other: Elgato Game Capture HD60 Pro, stream and record in 1080p60, superior low latency technology, H.264 hardware encoding, PCIe (€194.92 @ Amazon Italia)
Other: MSI Computer Video Card (GTX 1050 TI 4GT OC) (€160.50 @ Amazon Italia)
Other: AMD YD180XBCAEWOF Ryzen 7 1800X Processor (€407.48 @ Amazon Italia)
Other: Gigabyte ga-ax370-gaming-k7 AMD X370 Socket AM4 ATX Motherboard (€217.62 @ Amazon Italia)
Total: €4709.67
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-11-26 01:49 CET+0100

I know its grossly overbudget and there could be alot of cuts but this is just the idea;
The 8700k for top gaming performance, with the 500gb ssd and the 1080ti; the trident Zs are for this system.

the 1800x for not too costly streaming and video editing power, with the 250gb ssd and the 1050ti in order to have no problems in case of graphical-intensive tasks on that pc(I could probably choose a less expensive ones easily obviously); the flare Xs are for this system.

Both CPUs cooled by the Noctua air coolers(maybe the 1800x could get away with cheaper coolers), one x300 4tb HD each; one for games, the other for videos and other files.
That PSU should be enough to power both systems

I don't know how if that case is good enough, and I don't know if it would need extra fans
its a fun tought experiment but I don't think its worth it, what do you guys think?

It is grossly over budget, and, as you said, I think it is just a fun thought experiment and not very practical.

I am looking at three builds now. My initial one, an amped-up Intel build, and an amped-up AMD build.

Build 1

Spoiler

PCPartPicker part list: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/9Lvh4C
Price breakdown by merchant: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/9Lvh4C/by_merchant/

CPU: Intel - Core i7-8700K 3.7GHz 6-Core Processor ($489.99 @ Memory Express)
CPU Cooler: NZXT - Kraken X62 Rev 2 98.2 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($179.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Motherboard: Asus - ROG STRIX Z370-E GAMING ATX LGA1151 Motherboard ($239.99 @ Memory Express)
Memory: G.Skill - Ripjaws V Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($399.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Storage: Samsung - 850 EVO-Series 1TB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($349.99 @ Memory Express)
Storage: Toshiba - X300 5TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($149.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Video Card: Asus - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB STRIX GAMING Video Card ($1019.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Case: be quiet! - Dark Base Pro 900 w/Window (Black) ATX Full Tower Case ($254.15 @ Newegg Canada Marketplace)
Power Supply: SeaSonic - PRIME Titanium 650W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply ($199.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Operating System: Microsoft - Windows 10 Home OEM 64-bit ($109.95 @ Vuugo)
Total: $3394.02
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-11-25 20:03 EST-0500

Build 2

Spoiler

PCPartPicker part list: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/wVrnZ8
Price breakdown by merchant: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/wVrnZ8/by_merchant/

CPU: Intel - Core i9-7900X 3.3GHz 10-Core Processor ($1205.25 @ shopRBC)
CPU Cooler: NZXT - Kraken X62 Rev 2 98.2 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($179.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Motherboard: Asus - STRIX X299-E GAMING ATX LGA2066 Motherboard ($419.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Memory: G.Skill - Ripjaws V Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($399.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Storage: Samsung - 850 EVO-Series 1TB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($349.99 @ Memory Express)
Storage: Toshiba - X300 5TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($149.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Video Card: Asus - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB STRIX GAMING Video Card ($1019.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Case: be quiet! - Dark Base Pro 900 w/Window (Black) ATX Full Tower Case ($254.15 @ Newegg Canada Marketplace)
Power Supply: SeaSonic - PRIME Titanium 650W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply ($199.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Operating System: Microsoft - Windows 10 Home OEM 64-bit ($109.95 @ Vuugo)
Total: $4289.28
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-11-25 20:04 EST-0500

Build 3

Spoiler

PCPartPicker part list: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/XRsB8K
Price breakdown by merchant: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/XRsB8K/by_merchant/

CPU: AMD - Threadripper 1950X 3.4GHz 16-Core Processor ($1039.99 @ Amazon Canada)
CPU Cooler: NZXT - Kraken X62 Rev 2 98.2 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($179.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Motherboard: Asus - PRIME X399-A EATX TR4 Motherboard ($419.99 @ PC Canada)
Memory: G.Skill - Ripjaws V Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($399.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Storage: Samsung - 850 EVO-Series 1TB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($349.99 @ Memory Express)
Storage: Toshiba - X300 5TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($149.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Video Card: Asus - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB STRIX GAMING Video Card ($1019.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Case: be quiet! - Dark Base Pro 900 w/Window (Black) ATX Full Tower Case ($254.15 @ Newegg Canada Marketplace)
Power Supply: SeaSonic - PRIME Titanium 650W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply ($199.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Operating System: Microsoft - Windows 10 Home OEM 64-bit ($109.95 @ Vuugo)
Total: $4124.02
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-11-25 20:04 EST-0500

Halazar · November 26, 2017

23 minutes ago, PopsiclesInMyCellar said:

It is grossly over budget, and, as you said, I think it is just a fun thought experiment and not very practical.

I am looking at three builds now. My initial one, an amped-up Intel build, and an amped-up AMD build.

Build 1

Hide contents

PCPartPicker part list: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/9Lvh4C
Price breakdown by merchant: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/9Lvh4C/by_merchant/

CPU: Intel - Core i7-8700K 3.7GHz 6-Core Processor ($489.99 @ Memory Express)
CPU Cooler: NZXT - Kraken X62 Rev 2 98.2 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($179.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Motherboard: Asus - ROG STRIX Z370-E GAMING ATX LGA1151 Motherboard ($239.99 @ Memory Express)
Memory: G.Skill - Ripjaws V Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($399.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Storage: Samsung - 850 EVO-Series 1TB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($349.99 @ Memory Express)
Storage: Toshiba - X300 5TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($149.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Video Card: Asus - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB STRIX GAMING Video Card ($1019.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Case: be quiet! - Dark Base Pro 900 w/Window (Black) ATX Full Tower Case ($254.15 @ Newegg Canada Marketplace)
Power Supply: SeaSonic - PRIME Titanium 650W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply ($199.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Operating System: Microsoft - Windows 10 Home OEM 64-bit ($109.95 @ Vuugo)
Total: $3394.02
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-11-25 20:03 EST-0500

Build 2

Hide contents

PCPartPicker part list: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/wVrnZ8
Price breakdown by merchant: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/wVrnZ8/by_merchant/

CPU: Intel - Core i9-7900X 3.3GHz 10-Core Processor ($1205.25 @ shopRBC)
CPU Cooler: NZXT - Kraken X62 Rev 2 98.2 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($179.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Motherboard: Asus - STRIX X299-E GAMING ATX LGA2066 Motherboard ($419.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Memory: G.Skill - Ripjaws V Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($399.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Storage: Samsung - 850 EVO-Series 1TB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($349.99 @ Memory Express)
Storage: Toshiba - X300 5TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($149.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Video Card: Asus - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB STRIX GAMING Video Card ($1019.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Case: be quiet! - Dark Base Pro 900 w/Window (Black) ATX Full Tower Case ($254.15 @ Newegg Canada Marketplace)
Power Supply: SeaSonic - PRIME Titanium 650W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply ($199.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Operating System: Microsoft - Windows 10 Home OEM 64-bit ($109.95 @ Vuugo)
Total: $4289.28
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-11-25 20:04 EST-0500

Build 3

Hide contents

PCPartPicker part list: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/XRsB8K
Price breakdown by merchant: https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/XRsB8K/by_merchant/

CPU: AMD - Threadripper 1950X 3.4GHz 16-Core Processor ($1039.99 @ Amazon Canada)
CPU Cooler: NZXT - Kraken X62 Rev 2 98.2 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($179.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Motherboard: Asus - PRIME X399-A EATX TR4 Motherboard ($419.99 @ PC Canada)
Memory: G.Skill - Ripjaws V Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($399.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Storage: Samsung - 850 EVO-Series 1TB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($349.99 @ Memory Express)
Storage: Toshiba - X300 5TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($149.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Video Card: Asus - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB STRIX GAMING Video Card ($1019.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Case: be quiet! - Dark Base Pro 900 w/Window (Black) ATX Full Tower Case ($254.15 @ Newegg Canada Marketplace)
Power Supply: SeaSonic - PRIME Titanium 650W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply ($199.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Operating System: Microsoft - Windows 10 Home OEM 64-bit ($109.95 @ Vuugo)
Total: $4124.02
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-11-25 20:04 EST-0500

1) Why OEM windows?
2) Do you think the be quiet! - Dark Base Pro 900 is the best case?
3) The best motherboards for their money are the ones I used in my builds both for the 7900x and the 1950x; no useless things like wi-fi, and best or second best VRM. The only downside is in the 1950x motherboard it only has 4 ram slot, and the next best for its price is the Taichi one, but it doesn't have quite as good VRM, and the best mobo of that socket is too costly, like 600$.

4) Why the 850 evo instead of 960? You prefer size over speeds?
5)I don't like that ram, I usually go for Z series, and also Threadripper needs specific RAMs to operate better.
6) I wouldnt go for TITANIUM rating on the psu; gold is more than enough usually and you save alot of money
7) the NZXT cooler is said to have a pump that fails often. The EVGA is the best one for 7900x, and the 1950x has only one liquid cooler specifically made for it, the Enermax TR4; I chose the 360mm one for my build.

Those are just my observations tho

And I'm in your same boat, I don't know which one to take.

To make things worse; the 7900x is more performant in games+streaming only its true, but 1) if you don't delid it its a waste, you lose like 20°c just because Intel sucks and puts toothpaste intead of proper thermal conducting paste, 2) the 7900x has less PCIe lanes for future upgrades, 3) the 1950x will get better in time has games adapt and start taking advantage of more cores avaiable, 4) multi-tasking is not as easy on the 7900x as it is on the 1950x, etc.

I'm soo torn

Also I wanna hear what @brob has to say on the dual-system build. Maybe we can get Linux to do a video on stuff like this, it would be cool to watch

brob · November 26, 2017

@Halazar

I like the case, but it is quite large. Two separate psu are required, one for each independent system.

The outer fan of the NH-D15 cpu cooler overhangs the 3rd and 4th memory slot. This hides the nice looking Trident Z modules and becomes problematic should one wish to add more Trident Z modules. (The fan has to be removed or moved up about 12mm.) I would suggest going with Corsair LPX memory kits if keeping the NH-D15. An alternative would be a cooler like the Cryorig R1 Universal that does not interfere with memory.

If a capture/streaming card like the HD60 Pro is used, I'm not sure I understand the need for a second system. The card handles capture and encoding so most of the work is off loaded from the gpu and cpu. Coupled with fast NVMe storage, system overhead is minimal.

Halazar · November 26, 2017

1 minute ago, brob said:

@Halazar

I like the case, but it is quite large. Two separate psu are required, one for each independent system.

The outer fan of the NH-D15 cpu cooler overhangs the 3rd and 4th memory slot. This hides the nice looking Trident Z modules and becomes problematic should one wish to add more Trident Z modules. (The fan has to be removed or moved up about 12mm.) I would suggest going with Corsair LPX memory kits if keeping the NH-D15. An alternative would be a cooler like the Cryorig R1 Universal that does not interfere with memory.

If a capture/streaming card like the HD60 Pro is used, I'm not sure I understand the need for a second system. The card handles capture and encoding so most of the work is off loaded from the gpu and cpu. Coupled with fast NVMe storage, system overhead is minimal.

Are you sure the elgato hd60 does hardware encoding? I was sure it only did capture. Because if it does, I would love to throw that puppy in the 7900x config and run that, or maybe even the 8700k one

brob · November 26, 2017

15 minutes ago, Halazar said:

Are you sure the elgato hd60 does hardware encoding? I was sure it only did capture. Because if it does, I would love to throw that puppy in the 7900x config and run that, or maybe even the 8700k one

According to the card comparison table at https://www.elgato.com/en/gaming/game-capture-hd60-pro the HD60 Pro has H.264 encoding. One of the drawings shows an H.264 chip.

Of course the HD60 Pro is not the only card out there. So now you have a whole new avenue of exploration .

Halazar · November 26, 2017

5 minutes ago, brob said:

According to the card comparison table at https://www.elgato.com/en/gaming/game-capture-hd60-pro the HD60 Pro has H.264 encoding. One of the drawings shows an H.264 chip.

It apparently doesn't record up to 1080p60 as opposed to the 4K60 PRO tho, which doesn't encode tho. Mh. I wonder if the quality is better than OBS at slow preset. How would it work inside the same system instead of a dedicated streaming machine? I've never read of somebody using the hd60pro not in a separate streaming machine.

brob · November 26, 2017

3 minutes ago, Halazar said:

It apparently doesn't record up to 1080p60 as opposed to the 4K60 PRO tho, which doesn't encode tho. Mh. I wonder if the quality is better than OBS at slow preset. How would it work inside the same system instead of a dedicated streaming machine? I've never read of somebody using the hd60pro not in a separate streaming machine.

A couple of different ways. The most flexible is to have the gpu output to two ports, an HDMI to the HD60 Pro, and to another port for the monitor. http://ltroyalshrimp.com/guides/how-to-use-a-144hz-monitor-and-the-elgato-hd60-pro-at-the-same-time/ outlines how. The other is to run through the HD60 Pro as described in https://help.elgato.com/customer/en/portal/articles/2124297-capturing-video-from-a-pc-using-elgato-game-capture-hd60-pro.

I don't think there is a consumer capture card that does 4K encoding. But it is probably just a matter of time before something appears.

Halazar · November 26, 2017

2 minutes ago, brob said:

A couple of different ways. The most flexible is to have the gpu output to two ports, an HDMI to the HD60 Pro, and to another port for the monitor. http://ltroyalshrimp.com/guides/how-to-use-a-144hz-monitor-and-the-elgato-hd60-pro-at-the-same-time/ outlines how. The other is to run through the HD60 Pro as described in https://help.elgato.com/customer/en/portal/articles/2124297-capturing-video-from-a-pc-using-elgato-game-capture-hd60-pro.

I don't think there is a consumer capture card that does 4K encoding. But it is probably just a matter of time before something appears.

mmmh, check the comments on this video

Spoiler

:"So conclusion is it worth buying this for a single pc setup I want to start streaming at 1080p 60fps but I don't like the huge impact OBS has but I think if I use this with their software the encoder should make it better at least till I can get a second pc setup?

Mystified Sky for streaming on a single pc setup, this is basically pointless. This is because this has its own encoder and suvh, but streaming requires re-encoding to compress to a streamable output. So no. Only for recording."

Apparently the encoding process isn't worth buying the Elgato since I will still need to re-encode?

brob · November 26, 2017

12 minutes ago, Halazar said:

...

Hide contents

:"So conclusion is it worth buying this for a single pc setup I want to start streaming at 1080p 60fps but I don't like the huge impact OBS has but I think if I use this with their software the encoder should make it better at least till I can get a second pc setup?

Mystified Sky for streaming on a single pc setup, this is basically pointless. This is because this has its own encoder and suvh, but streaming requires re-encoding to compress to a streamable output. So no. Only for recording."

Apparently the encoding process isn't worth buying the Elgato since I will still need to re-encode?

You will have to dig into the manual and knowledge base to satisfy all your questions. The HD60 Pro web page claims that live streaming is possible at the same time as 1080p60 recording.

Re-encoding is required if one needs a format other than H.264. But this would only be an issue if one were doing live streaming in a different format.

Halazar · November 26, 2017

3 minutes ago, brob said:

You will have to dig into the manual and knowledge base to satisfy all your questions. The HD60 Pro web page claims that live streaming is possible at the same time as 1080p60 recording.

Re-encoding is required if one needs a format other than H.264. But this would only be an issue if one were doing live streaming in a different format.

I'm trying to find information about people streaming with this capture card in a single system configuration. Maybe I should make a post here.

brob · November 26, 2017

Just now, Halazar said:

I'm trying to find information about people streaming with this capture card in a single system configuration. Maybe I should make a post here.

It's a new card. As in 2 - 3 months old.

Halazar · November 26, 2017

1 minute ago, brob said:

It's a new card. As in 2 - 3 months old.

Yeah same issues with the CPUs, not much information around. How is a paranoid person supposed to live without enough information? It freaks me out

brob · November 26, 2017

1 minute ago, Halazar said:

Yeah same issues with the CPUs, not much information around. How is a paranoid person supposed to live without enough information? It freaks me out

Is there such a thing as "enough information"?

The best one can do is read all the reviews one can find, both formal and informal.

Halazar · November 26, 2017

10 minutes ago, brob said:

Is there such a thing as "enough information"?

The best one can do is read all the reviews one can find, both formal and informal.

I've found this post

and it looks like its just not possible

brob · November 26, 2017

13 hours ago, Halazar said:

I've found this post

and it looks like its just not possible

There is no problem using the HD60 Pro as an OBS capture device. There seems to be some demand for an obs interface that could take the HD60 Pro encoded stream, so it would not surprise me to see that down the road.

AverMedia has the LGHD Lite with H.264 encoding. I believe obs can use the encoded stream from the card. The card i 1080p30. The LGP2 is a USB 3.1 external device that is 1080p60 with H.264 encoder. Presumably obs could use encoded streams from it.

Unless one is married to using obs for live streaming, I don't see why this is an issue.

Halazar · November 26, 2017

2 minutes ago, brob said:

There is no problem using the HD60 Pro as an OBS capture device. There seems to be some demand for an obs interface that could take the HD60 Pro encoded stream, so it would not surprise me to see that down the road.

AverMedia has the LGHD Lite with H.264 encoding. I believe obs can use the encoded stream from the card. The card i 1080p30. The LGP2 is a USB 3.1 external device that is 1080p60 with H.264 encoder. Presumably obs could use encoded streams from it.

Unless one is married to using obs for live streaming, I don't see why this is an issue.

Because OBS is the best software to manage a stream.
Also, I did not understand a single thing you just said, but if you go in the Elgato forums, plenty of posts are there that say using the HD60pro & other similar cards on the same machine is useless.
Unless you know a specific card that does that job?

brob · November 26, 2017

3 minutes ago, Halazar said:

Because OBS is the best software to manage a stream.
Also, I did not understand a single thing you just said, but if you go in the Elgato forums, plenty of posts are there that say using the HD60pro & other similar cards on the same machine is useless.
Unless you know a specific card that does that job?

Would you classify yourself an advanced , intermediate, basic, or entry level streamer?

Halazar · November 26, 2017

1 minute ago, brob said:

Would you classify yourself an advanced , intermediate, basic, or entry level streamer?

I was a basic one when I left off but I want to have the quality of an advanced one; is the only way to go forward with all the competition there is!

brob · November 26, 2017

8 minutes ago, Halazar said:

I was a basic one when I left off but I want to have the quality of an advanced one; is the only way to go forward with all the competition there is!

Why don't you start with a very good gaming system quite capable of streaming and recording. I'm thinking an i7-8700K. Such a system is quite capable of providing good quality results.

At some point should you decide that you need more build a second box with a capture card to move the signal from the gaming machine to the new streaming/recording box.

Halazar · November 26, 2017

Just now, brob said:

Why don't you start with a very good gaming system quite capable of streaming and recording. I'm thinking an i7-8700K. Such a system is quite capable of providing a good quality results.

At some point should you decide that you need more build a second box and with a capture card to move the signal from the gaming machine to the new streaming/recording box.

Because its not good enough. I don't know how many times I repeated this, but nowadays every streamer streams with a "good enough" quality and I would like to have more than that. If I wanted the 8700k/streaming box combo, I already have it prepared, but its just that I feel more comfortable with a single pc.

And, I'm not gonna compromise. The 8700k alone is just not enough for the quality I aim for.

This is the dual-box setup btw.

Gaming pc

Spoiler

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel - Core i7-8700K 3.7GHz 6-Core Processor (€422.55 @ Amazon Italia)
CPU Cooler: EVGA - CLC 280 113.5 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler (€135.06 @ Amazon Italia)
Motherboard: Gigabyte - Z370 AORUS Gaming 7 (rev. 1.0) ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (€217.00)
Memory: G.Skill - Trident Z 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 Memory (€203.99 @ Amazon Italia)
Storage: Samsung - 960 EVO 500GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive (€231.00)
Storage: Toshiba - X300 4TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (€156.80 @ Amazon Italia)
Video Card: Asus - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB STRIX GAMING Video Card (€898.00 @ Amazon Italia)
Case: Corsair - 750D ATX Full Tower Case (€145.62 @ Amazon Italia)
Power Supply: SeaSonic - 760W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply (€178.99 @ Amazon Italia)
Optical Drive: Lite-On - iHAS124-14 DVD/CD Writer (€16.18 @ Amazon Italia)
Total: €2605.19
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-11-26 19:57 CET+0100

Streaming pc

Spoiler

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

I'm even afraid that the streaming box being that not-powerful wouldn't be enough to record videos at high quality (only 6 cores) so I was thinking of maybe using a 1700 but its double the price. Or maybe I can do videos using NVENC on the gaming pc.
But again, the dual pc setup is complicated. I would have to understand how to setup the audio, if I need a mixer /splitters or not, etc.

brob · November 26, 2017

1 minute ago, Halazar said:

Because its not good enough. I don't know how many times I repeated this, but nowadays every streamer streams with a "good enough" quality and I would like to have more than that. If I wanted the 8700k/streaming box combo, I already have it prepared, but its just that I feel more comfortable with a single pc.

And, I'm not gonna compromise. The 8700k alone is just not enough for the quality I aim for.

...

I really don't understand what you mean. What exactly is meant by "quality".

17 minutes ago, Halazar said:

...
Because its not good enough. I don't know how many times I repeated this, but nowadays every streamer streams with a "good enough" quality and I would like to have more than that. If I wanted the 8700k/streaming box combo, I already have it prepared, but its just that I feel more comfortable with a single pc.

And, I'm not gonna compromise. The 8700k alone is just not enough for the quality I aim for.

I'm even afraid that the streaming box being that not-powerful wouldn't be enough to record videos at high quality (only 6 cores) so I was thinking of maybe using a 1700 but its double the price. Or maybe I can do videos using NVENC on the gaming pc.
But again, the dual pc setup is complicated. I would have to understand how to setup the audio, if I need a mixer /splitters or not, etc.

Recording is relatively trivial. What consumes cpu is encoding.

I believe obs uses X264 for encoding. Anandtech has two X264 cpu benchmarks, https://www.anandtech.com/bench/CPU/1585.

Halazar · November 26, 2017

13 minutes ago, brob said:

I really don't understand what you mean. What exactly is meant by "quality".

Recording is relatively trivial. What consumes cpu is encoding.

I believe obs uses X264 for encoding. Anandtech has two X264 cpu benchmarks, https://www.anandtech.com/bench/CPU/1585.

Again, "trivial"; at qhat quality you think I want to record?
And what do you mean by "what is meant by quality?"
I mean 1080p 60p, Slow preset with no stuttering or dropped frames(or as little as possible) while also playing games at high quality. Everybody has 720p60p at Fast preset nowadays. I want to do way better.

And the difference is day and night. I watch alot of twitch streams, and I can immediately tell when somebody is using Fast, Medium, Slow; if the bitrate is enough or not, etc.

The video quality just shows it

brob · November 26, 2017

1 hour ago, Halazar said:

Again, "trivial"; at qhat quality you think I want to record?
And what do you mean by "what is meant by quality?"
I mean 1080p 60p, Slow preset with no stuttering or dropped frames(or as little as possible) while also playing games at high quality. Everybody has 720p60p at Fast preset nowadays. I want to do way better.

And the difference is day and night. I watch alot of twitch streams, and I can immediately tell when somebody is using Fast, Medium, Slow; if the bitrate is enough or not, etc.

The video quality just shows it

Presumably you have an internet connection that will support 1080p60.

Given what you are trying to achieve, a dual system is the best candidate. But I suspect you will want something more than an R5-1600 as the cpu of the streaming system.

You had asked earlier about audio with this type of setup. Have you seen https://help.twitch.tv/customer/portal/articles/1988680-broadcasting-with-two-computers?

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4000€+ gaming and streaming pc system theorycrafting(long post and thread)

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